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[squidyj]

Maiden + 2x fallen dudes (whatever that +1 hero power damage thing is) + that drake + 10 mana = 30 damage hero power = otk = bliz be

you're right if your opponent lets you run your 3 turn 4 card combo you can totally fuck them up! also the fact that they had no answer to anything you were doing means you were winning anyway.


that shaman tho. Turn 3 coin Totem Golem Totem Golem Totemic Might. I think even if you played a totem on turn 2 it would be dead because with all the shit you can do with totems peopelw ill view them as threats.

then turn 4 you do a lava shock and hero power, turn 5 thunder bluff valiant, turn 6 hero power and totemcarver, or fireguard destroyer if your totem golems got fucked up.

 

[Dahbomb]

I didn't watch the stream, Dahbomb says it works like that earlier in this thread which I think he's mistaken. Must find this video now.

Yeah that was my mistake.

The Mech Warper spawned from the Loot Hoarder. Mad Scientist just summons it, doesn't trigger the Effigy.

I got mistaken because I was trying to watch the stream on my phone while working out and there were a bunch of disconnects in the middle of the stream. Plus weird ass spectator bugs.

 

[zoukka]

So all our fears were true. Randomness... Randomness everywhere.

 

[Randomizer123454444]

Value is good, but it just really expensive for a draw effect. Maybe if Hunter got its own version of Preparation it would be viable.

With Ball of Spiders, Lock and Loaded, and Saraad all generating extra cards, something that allows you to turn cards directly into mana would really fit. Maybe a 0 mana spells that allows you to discard cards in your hand for 1 mana each. Basically turn Hunter into RNG Miracle Rogue.

Yeah, I agree. Too expensive for a spell that has no immediate effect.

===

In a completely different topic, I like the idea of "Inspire". There is a lot that can be done with it. Now let's see what kind of class cards they can come up with. As someone who plays mainly priest, I would be very happy if this "use hero power more" encouraged longer games

 

[Super Nothing]

you're right if your opponent lets you run your 3 turn 4 card combo you can totally fuck them up! also the fact that they had no answer to anything you were doing means you were winning anyway.


that shaman tho. Turn 3 coin Totem Golem Totem Golem Totemic Might. I think even if you played a totem on turn 2 it would be dead because with all the shit you can do with totems peopelw ill view them as threats.

then turn 4 you do a lava shock and hero power, turn 5 thunder bluff valiant, turn 6 hero power and totemcarver, or fireguard destroyer if your totem golems got fucked up.

Unless they add some more Overload cards that are just too good not to run, I still can't see running Lava Shock. It just doesn't do a whole lot. Would your scenario really be that much worse if turn 4 was just using hero power? The only difference is 2 damage at the cost of an extra card.

 

[Dahbomb]

Yeah the randomness is already too high and we haven't even seen that many cards.

*Mage secret that summons a random minion of the same cost when it dies.

*Legendary that gives you a random spell when you use hero power.

*Hunter spell that gives you random Hunter cards when you use spells.

*Shaman card that gives you random Totems (could swing really big because of that new 3/4 minion).

*Ball of Spiders summons 3 minions that give you 3 random minion (basically 3 times the randomness).


I am getting worried that this is going to be another GvG type thing where a bunch of strong cards are the random cards and there is just more randomness introduced into the game.

 

[johnsmith]

If you don't want randomness you should probably find another game to play. It's obvious it's here to stay and Blizzard considers it the game's core.

 

[Pooya]

Watched Trump/Firebat games, this was all rng garbage.

Hunters were bad enough now you can't predict how much damage they can do next turn.

Saraad card, well if you can set up that dream mage combo it's amazing but those cards won't stay alive for it to work.

I'm not sure why Trump left Firebat's Saraad alive for that long, big mistake. The other game, losing to explosive trap while he had healbots? amateur hour.

 

[Xanathus]

Watched Trump/Firebat games, this was all rng garbage.

Hunters were bad enough now you can't predict how much damage they can do next turn.

Saraad card, well if you can set up that dream mage combo it's amazing but those cards won't stay alive for it to work.

I'm not sure why Trump left Firebat's Saraad alive for that long, big mistake. The other game, losing to explosive trap while he had healbots? amateur hour.

You really shouldn't infer anything from those games, those decks were basically mid-tier arena decks. Slow mage with zero flamestrikes FailFish.

 

[Dahbomb]

If you don't want randomness you should probably find another game to play. It's obvious it's here to stay and Blizzard considers it the game's core.

I felt like they scaled back on the RNG a lot with BRM compared to GvG. It wasn't the main theme of the set.

GvG's main themes were Mechs and RNG. BRM's themes were dragons and cost reduction mechanics through board control.

Grand Tournament is doing a few things right. It's not focusing on just one tribe but rather there seems to be a broader scope to the tribal changes. The emphasis on hero powers and Inspire mechanic are cool. What's not cool are the huge RNG swing mechanics.

I am hoping that what they showed was a good portion of the RNG cards in he set. I don't want more Shredders, Dr Balanced, Implosions, Crackles please...

 

[zoukka]

If you don't want randomness you should probably find another game to play. It's obvious it's here to stay and Blizzard considers it the game's core.

True. I play Hearthstone without raging and griefing since I know the RNG factor is big. I save my real mental effort and anquish for Magic Online.

 

[Ashodin]

I for one welcome our totem overlords

 

[zoukka]

I for one welcome our totem overlords

If a 2-mana 3/4 can't bring Shaman back as at least mediocre class, then we all know it's inherently broken and dead for good.

 

[Dahbomb]

I have said it before that I like some level of RNG but not gross levels of RNG.

Like for example I like big breasts but I do not like double ZZ breast sizes.

 

[Szadek]

If a 2-mana 3/4 can't bring Shaman back as at least mediocre class, then we all know it's inherently broken and dead for good.

Well,it also depends on what cards the other classes get, but it's safe to say that Totem Golem will be played in shamans.

 

[BananasWithGuns]

I guess we'll have to see how bad it is. So far I think we have the best and worst type of RNG.

I feel like Tuskarr Totemic is generally the right way to do it. Limited pool of outcomes so if the card is played consistently then you'll know what to expect and can do your best to set yourself up to go against it even if your opponent gets the best outcome. Granted a 3/4 and a 3/2 for 3 mana is pretty ridiculous but in the grand scheme of things it isn't THAT much different than say, Mechwarper into Spider Tank.

Saraad is the absolute worst way to do it in my opinion. It's just 100% random and neither player can prepare for anything that comes out of it. Games can be outright decided based on what cards just happen to get put in your hand. It's pretty close to being the Unstable Portal of spells.

RNG is just part of card games, especially Hearthstone, but I definitely hope they lean more toward stuff like Totemic than Saraad for a majority of the RNG based cards.

 

[zoukka]

Saraad is the absolute worst way to do it in my opinion. It's just 100% random and neither player can prepare for anything that comes out of it. Games can be outright decided based on what cards just happen to get put in your hand. It's pretty close to being the Unstable Portal of spells.

Saraad is actually pretty balanced because it is so overcosted. I don't see it getting played that much.

 

[Xanathus]

Saraad is actually pretty balanced because it is so overcosted. I don't see it getting played that much.

Yep, my initial impression about a lot of these cards is that they're overcosted and low tempo and unlikely to see play on their own, but it doesn't matter until we know the rest of the cards.

 

[zoukka]

Unless they introduce restrictions to play rules or heavy control cards like Belcher/Healbot, the meta won't suddenly slow down to allow cards like Saraad to be played competitively.

 

[MetroidPrimeRib]

Anyone else think it's kind of odd they are basing a whole expansion off the Argent Tournament? A lot of people disliked the rep grind and the raid and dungeon were by far the weakest part of Wrath of the Lich King. Would have expected Darkmoon Faire instead.

 

[BananasWithGuns]

Saraad is actually pretty balanced because it is so overcosted. I don't see it getting played that much.

Yeah, I didn't necessarily mean that Saraad is unbalanced or anything. It's just the way that Blizzard approaches RNG with cards like that. I mean, if you compare a card that has maybe four or five different outcomes against something like Saraad that has hundreds there's just no way to really take into account and/or prepare for anything relating to the latter.

Saraad seems like a fine card from what we've seen, I just think the way Blizzard approached RNG with it isn't the best way to go about it in my opinion. And that's not just directed at Saraad specifically, just Blizzard's card design in general.

Essentially, I'd rather see card that, while random, still shows some form of consistency. That seems contradictory of course but hopefully that makes sense.

 

[zoukka]

Essentially, I'd rather see card that, while random, still shows some form of consistency. That seems contradictory of course but hopefully that makes sense.

Agreed.

 

[Forkball]

Tavern Brawl gets super easy once you lose enough where your MMR drops so low people don't even have legendary cards.

 

[AntiFacebook]

If someone had an unfinished arena run when blizzard gave a free arena run for GvG, did he get the free run when he finished his current run?

I wonder if coldarra drake will work for other classes. Steamweedle does not,but it has a less general effect on the hero power.

 

[Papercuts]

Fallen Hero is going to be so sick in arena. I can't wait to hero power some knife jugglers.

 

[zoukka]

I wonder if coldarra drake will work for other classes. Steamweedle does not,but it has a less general effect on the hero power.

It will work, those cards don't have specific wordings they just state "your hero power", so drake works on all heroes and Fallen Hero for Hunter and maybe it will increase Life Tap damage too I'm not sure since "take damage" might be a different mechanic from "deal damage".

 

[squidyj]

Unless they add some more Overload cards that are just too good not to run, I still can't see running Lava Shock. It just doesn't do a whole lot. Would your scenario really be that much worse if turn 4 was just using hero power? The only difference is 2 damage at the cost of an extra card.

I think the problem with some of the overload cards to date is so many of them are forms of removal and wind up getting held in hand until needed whereas golem and destroyer are minions you want to play on curve and I think that they open up better opportunities to make effective use of lava shock. hopefully there's more like them in the shaman cards to make lava shock a more worthwhile investment but when the expansion rolls out I'm already willing to give it a try.

Let me also add that in my specific scenario the turn 4 lavashock would be helpful dealing with a piloted shredder that spawns a 3/2 or less health minion (but since you'd have lava shock in hand it obviously wouldn't happen) or a 5 toughness minion.


Also, Tavern Brawl as mage.
Alexstraza and antonidas frost nova / ice block

 

[AntiFacebook]

It will work, those cards don't have specific wordings they just state "your hero power", so drake works on all heroes and Fallen Hero for Hunter and maybe it will increase Life Tap damage too I'm not sure since "take damage" might be a different mechanic from "deal damage".

Steamweedle doesn't have those either

 

[zoukka]

Steamweedle doesn't have those either

And does not have another hero power that would benefit from its ability. Just like Fallen Hero only has Mage and Hunter who have hero powers that deal damage.

I think the problem with some of the overload cards to date is so many of them are forms of removal and wind up getting held in hand until needed whereas golem and destroyer are minions you want to play on curve and I think that they open up better opportunities to make effective use of lava shock. hopefully there's more like them in the shaman cards to make lava shock a more worthwhile investment but when the expansion rolls out I'm already willing to give it a try.

Let me also add that in my specific scenario the turn 4 lavashock would be helpful dealing with a piloted shredder that spawns a 3/2 or less health minion (but since you'd have lava shock in hand it obviously wouldn't happen) or a 5 toughness minion.

Lava Shocks problem is that it is purely a tempo card yet it is actually negative tempo most of the time. 2 damage for 2 mana is horrible so you need to make a really swingy play with it for it to be good. Just like many other bad shaman cards it just requires way too much setup for way too little in return. Shaman needs a card that does something like this:

Minion
"This minon costs 1 less for each overload you currently have"

Or something along those lines.

 

[Kettch]

Fallen Hero is going to be so sick in arena. I can't wait to hero power some knife jugglers.

I'm not too upset about that card. Minibot already destroyed the viability of most 3/2s in arena, to where I always look for 2/3s instead. Plus it's a rare. Still another solid addition to mage though.

 

[BananasWithGuns]

Here's an official answer in regards to Fallen Hero.

https://twitter.com/CM_Whirthun/status/623991079881170944

Steady Shot would deal 3 damage to the opponent. Life Tap would deal 3 damage to the Warlock. Also works for Shadowform.

Not sure there's been one for Coldarra but I'd imagine it would work for all hero powers.

 

[Copenap]

Is the stream available in the twitch archive?

 

[Pooya]

From mage cards,

Effigy is perfectly playable and decent. Ideal openings would be mad scientist turn 2, which dies then turn 3 play a Shredder with coin, you want it to work on 4 drops or higher and Shredder is guaranteed to die. Very good value there and it's a possible play that can happen often. Many similar situations are possible, pretty good.

Fallen Hero, I think even this could get some use in constructed, being able to deal 2 damage you can kill annoying stuff like knife jugglers with. It's not terrible, it might take a removal even. About as good as sorcerer's apprentice early game, maybe even better at times, late game when you might not have spells or avoiding using spells early game saving you a frost bolt even? when 2 damage for 2 could remove a lot. I would want to have this card but not for synergy. It's better to have this for control mages than apprentice I think.

Coldarra Drake, well I don't think any one will use good hard earned dust to craft this epic. It's so slow to be usable. Can be good for arena.

GvG had 8 cards per class, so I hope we see 5 more for mage.


Neutral cards that have synergy with those two. No one will play maiden, it's really no value. Saraad is too slow and costly to give any value, at best you can get 1 spell from it which could be junk all of that for 7 mana. synergy here is too slow to be worthwhile. so far.

----

good to see some cheap legs though, wonder what they will do, they must have some big draw backs.

 

[Cindres]

Ressurect + faceless manipulator = 3 gruuls, mmmmmm this is a fun brawl.

Loving the look of the new cards so far, liking the synergy with the hero power, should add something new to the game. Definitely pre ordering the bundle next week.

 

[Papercuts]

I'm not too upset about that card. Minibot already destroyed the viability of most 3/2s in arena, to where I always look for 2/3s instead. Plus it's a rare. Still another solid addition to mage though.

Yeah, it's not some super crazy card for them but it's a nice addition.

Shielded minibot is the bane of my existence, however. Especially since they always manage to open with him.

 

[zoukka]

One mana legendary hype!

 

[phoenix296]

Played Feugen and Stalagg turn one. Opponent left 2nd turn.

 

[Pooya]

Can a card be a murloc and a pirate? lol

I have no idea who are those supposed to be, my warcraft knowledge is so outdated.

 

[zoukka]

Can a card be a murloc and a pirate? lol

I have no idea who are those supposed to be, my warcraft knowledge is so outdated.

The green guy doesn't look like a Murlock to me. More like a Croc or Iguana or something.

 

[phoenix296]

The green guy doesn't look like a Murlock to me. More like a Croc or Iguana or something.

Looks like a Saurok.

 

[Rapstah]

The lizard people aren't murlocs, they're from the Pandaria expansion. I think they're called sauroks?

The green mist people are basically undead pirates in WoW so I'd imagine those are pirate cards. No idea what the drawback could be on a 1 mana 2/4 legendary pirate though, not to mention two legendary pirates in one expansion is crazy.

At least this time we can assume the cards that flash by are real cards and not hero-only cards or single-player heroes with fake stats. I wonder if the 0 cost Warlock bug in spectator mode has anything to do with why they always tease cards with the Warlock colour theme, like it's their default colour or something.

 

[Pooya]

2/4 for 1 mana must be similar to zombie chow, this is undead pirate right? great anti aggro card, this one probably doesn't heal though. I'd like it if they take the idea of venture co merc, your minions cost 3 more. I take this over chow in a mage deck.

you play mana wyrm , coin then this.

 

[Cindres]

Chromagus, Faceless, another Chromagus = 3 Nefarians in hand, seriously this brawl is great fun. Probably second only to the spell one the other week.

 

[Rapstah]

Strifecro's take and Reynad's take on the new revealed cards. I liked theirs in particular, I'm sure all of the streamers have put up videos by now.

 

[FieryBalrog]

If it wasn't for Blade Flurry, it would be.

That's kinda meaningless because Blade Flurry already existed and most people (including me) still thought Tinker's Oil was a bad card when GvG cards were spoiled.

Evaluating a card is supposed to take into account cards that already exist because that's how card games work.

A lot of these cards will be misevaluated, that's probably inevitable. The rogue weapon looks like it should have been 2/3 to be a good card, but it's not trash tier and could see play in a really slow Rogue deck if the other rogue inspire cards are good (since without this card, activating inspire will often be awkward). Ball of Spiders seems quite playable in a slow Arena deck, and I think Arena will slow down in general since there will be a lot more incentive to use hero power to gain value (over tempo).

 

[Szadek]

Can a card be a murloc and a pirate? lol

I have no idea who are those supposed to be, my warcraft knowledge is so outdated.

In wow there was 1:

So far we haven't seen cards with 2 tags,but it's within the realms of possibility.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

you're right if your opponent lets you run your 3 turn 4 card combo you can totally fuck them up! also the fact that they had no answer to anything you were doing means you were winning anyway.

I thought it was obvious I was joking

 

[gutshot]

good to see some cheap legs though, wonder what they will do, they must have some big draw backs.

I don't think you can infer anything from that. The GvG trailer showed Shielded Mini-Bot, Goblin Auto-Barber and Arcane Nullifier as legendaries as well as a non-existing 2-mana 4/1 legendary card that used Darkbomb's art.

 

[Celegus]

Do you still get daily quests even if you don't log into the game? Gonna be out of town for a few days.

 

[Hektor]

Do you still get daily quests even if you don't log into the game? Gonna be out of town for a few days.

Yes