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"Hello Again" Apple holding mac-centric media event October 27th 10am PST

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E

eyeball_kid

Member
Blackhead said:
Eh don't forget that USBC/Thunderbolt3 can be daisy-chained. Four ports (well two with the fastest/largest bandwidth) is a lot more than you think.

To summarize: go with a hub if cost is a concern and/or the MBP is a companion device. Go with (daisy-chained) cables if the MBP is your desktop replacement and you'll be buying new accessories (like external harddrives) anyway.
Click to expand...

I haven't daisy-chained since the SCSI days. What type of limitations are there? I assume there's diminishing bandwidth per-drive if you're chaining multiple and accessing more than one.
 
Z

Zaph

Member
giga said:
Anyone know why the usb-c connector on this usb-a to usb-c cable is so large? I'm guessing because it supports 3.1 gen 2?

http://www.apple.com/shop/product/H...b&fs=f=13_mbp_thdblt3_late2016&fh=4595%2B4803
Click to expand...

Yeah, there's a fair bit of hardware inside USB-C cables:

pyJBkqa.png
 
B

Blackhead

Redarse
eyeball_kid said:
I haven't daisy-chained since the SCSI days. What type of limitations are there? I assume there's diminishing bandwidth per-drive if you're chaining multiple and accessing more than one.
Click to expand...

actually hold that thought. Looks like I'm wrong on daisy chaining?:
Thunderbolt allows daisy chaining — plugging one peripheral into the next — though DisplayPort monitors have to be at the end of such a chain. Though I can’t find a definitive answer, it appears that you cannot daisy chain USB devices connected via USB-C, although you can simulate daisy chaining with the addition of USB-C–connected hubs. Power, which is effectively a different kind of protocol in USB-C, can be passed through.
Click to expand...
You can daisy chain Thunderbolt external harddrives and other professional equipment but for more generic usb-c devices you'll have to stick a hub somewhere in the chain? It's all so complicated right now, we'll have to wait a bit and test what works with what
 
E

eyeball_kid

Member
Blackhead said:
actually hold that thought. Looks like I'm wrong on daisy chaining?:

You can daisy chain Thunderbolt external harddrives and other professional equipment but for more generic usb-c devices you'll have to stick a hub somewhere in the chain? It's all so complicated right now, we'll have to wait a bit and test what works with what
Click to expand...

TidBits! I forgot they were still around. That's actually a great overview of USB-C, thanks.

I think the biggest problem right now is the lack of comprehensive Thunderbolt 3 hubs/docks. Most I've seen only offer a few ports. Death by a thousand hubs. The bigger ones like the Belkin are "coming soon".
 
J

JonathanNemo

Member
eyeball_kid said:
TidBits! I forgot they were still around. That's actually a great overview of USB-C, thanks.
Click to expand...

A tangent, but the Engsts are still some of the friendliest and most straightforward people I know in the industry, not just tech journalism. I'm happy that they're still able to keep TidBITS going as a day job.

One of these days I'll kick over a bigger donation their way.
 
C

chronos4590

Member
can't wait to hear touch bar impressions especially the 15 inch one

Im enjoying my new 13 inch no touch bar so far, its not perfect but its got a lot of what I personally was looking for regardless. Just wish it was at least 200 cheaper and a little bit more powerful for graphics though (not like I'm using this for gaming anyway) but oh well.
 
N

Nitsuj23

Member
Zaph said:
I was thinking of getting the Dell 5k for a while but wanted a USB-C port.

The LG would be perfect, but I'm not buying a professional monitor with only 1 uplink port.



Regardless of the PS4 Pro, you would be limited to 4k by the HDMI converter.
Click to expand...

Sorry for the noob question, but what exactly is an uplink port? I tried Googling but got a bunch of stuff on routers and Cisco switches...

Sounds like it could be useful if you own a laptop and PC sharing a monitor?

Thanks in advance!
 
Z

Zeyphersan

Banned
Nitsuj23 said:
Sorry for the noob question, but what exactly is an uplink port? I tried Googling but got a bunch of stuff on routers and Cisco switches...

Sounds like it could be useful if you own a laptop and PC sharing a monitor?

Thanks in advance!
Click to expand...

Only one input. The LG 5K display ONLY runs off a Thunderbolt port. No DisplayPort, no HDMI, nothing else. I don't even think it'll work on USB-C, it needs Thunderbolt for the bandwidth
 
H

Hellix

Member
Rant:

FedEx tracking still showing my new MBP stuck in Memphis, TN as "International Shipment Release" for the past 5 days, but I got a call this morning saying that it was delivered. Guess it got lost or stolen. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Now I gotta wait till FedEx investigates before Apple can send me a replacement. Fuck FedEx.
 
Z

Zeyphersan

Banned
Drew a very very crude drawing of my dream desk setup

IK7Zg8t.jpg


Just being able to pop onto the desk, plug in one cable and have all my stuff (some of which I was planning on saving for a dedicated gaming computer) would be perfect. Power, GPU, monitor, peripherals, all of it.

The pieces of that dream are slowly coming together, with the expensive dock from OWC. Just need a reliable external GPU enclosure and I'll honestly be in heaven.
 
H

hateradio

The Most Dangerous Yes Man
Zeyphersan said:
Drew a very very crude drawing of my dream desk setup

<FANCY IMAGE>

Just being able to pop onto the desk, plug in one cable and have all my stuff (some of which I was planning on saving for a dedicated gaming computer) would be perfect. Power, GPU, monitor, peripherals, all of it.

The pieces of that dream are slowly coming together, with the expensive dock from OWC. Just need a reliable external GPU enclosure and I'll honestly be in heaven.
Click to expand...
Don't you have to connect the GPU to the monitor, not the dock?
 
C

Crazymoogle

Member
Zeyphersan said:
Only one input. The LG 5K display ONLY runs off a Thunderbolt port. No DisplayPort, no HDMI, nothing else. I don't even think it'll work on USB-C, it needs Thunderbolt for the bandwidth
Click to expand...

USBC is just the plug. It's using Thunderbolt, you're right, because 5K needs more bandwidth than DisplayPort 1.2 is going to give. But Thunderbolt3 uses the USB-C plug so on the Pro it's whichever one of the ports you want.

That's the confusing thing going forward - with so many things using the same plug, understanding what does what can be a challenge.
 
Z

Zeyphersan

Banned
Crazymoogle said:
USBC is just the plug. It's using Thunderbolt, you're right, because 5K needs more bandwidth than DisplayPort 1.2 is going to give. But Thunderbolt3 uses the USB-C plug so on the Pro it's whichever one of the ports you want.

That's the confusing thing going forward - with so many things using the same plug, understanding what does what can be a challenge.
Click to expand...

Right, I meant it won't work off a normal USB-C like on the MacBook 12. That's why I called out that distinction

icespide said:
learn to draw Zeyphersan
Click to expand...

The funny thing is I bought an iPad Pro to teach myself how to draw and that never happened
 
S

SGRX

Member
Meicyn said:
My credit card was just charged for my 15" MBP order. Guess they should be shipping out sometime today.
Click to expand...

Same, received notification that the charge had posted to my card last night. Hopefully this means people will start receiving shipment confirmations within the next day or two.
 
G

Guess Who

Banned
Crazymoogle said:
USBC is just the plug. It's using Thunderbolt, you're right, because 5K needs more bandwidth than DisplayPort 1.2 is going to give. But Thunderbolt3 uses the USB-C plug so on the Pro it's whichever one of the ports you want.

That's the confusing thing going forward - with so many things using the same plug, understanding what does what can be a challenge.
Click to expand...

My fear with the LG 5K display is that even future USB-C machines may not work well with it, because in the future USB-C will support DisplayPort 1.4, which can handle single-stream 5K output, but Thunderbolt 3 and the 5K display use a somewhat hacky means to achieve 5K by doing multi-stream DisplayPort 1.2 output over a single cable.
 
E

eyeball_kid

Member
Guess Who said:
My fear with the LG 5K display is that even future USB-C machines may not work well with it, because in the future USB-C will support DisplayPort 1.4, which can handle single-stream 5K output, but Thunderbolt 3 and the 5K display use a somewhat hacky means to achieve 5K by doing multi-stream DisplayPort 1.2 output over a single cable.
Click to expand...

I assume this would mean having to buy a new MBP to get DP 1.4 support?
 
G

Guess Who

Banned
eyeball_kid said:
I assume this would mean having to buy a new MBP to get DP 1.4 support?
Click to expand...

Yup. I expect the LG 5K display will be compatible with future Mac products, because they'll probably all have Thunderbolt, but I could foresee a future where other notebooks that support "5K displays over USB-C" don't work with it because they implement DisplayPort 1.4 but not Thunderbolt.
 
M

maharg

idspispopd
Intel is going to be pushing TB3 hard. I doubt there's a realistic future where it isn't pretty much standard in type-c enabled PCs as well. Just might take a while to get there while OEMs get on board. In the end, though, Intel probably makes the chipset that drives that port.
 
E

eyeball_kid

Member
Guess Who said:
Yup. I expect the LG 5K display will be compatible with future Mac products, because they'll probably all have Thunderbolt, but I could foresee a future where other notebooks that support "5K displays over USB-C" don't work with it because they implement DisplayPort 1.4 but not Thunderbolt.
Click to expand...

Hm, well hopefully that doesn't happen too soon, otherwise it could hurt the resale value of the 2016 if it can't support future displays.
 
M

Mr. Wonderful

Member
Guess Who said:
My fear with the LG 5K display is that even future USB-C machines may not work well with it, because in the future USB-C will support DisplayPort 1.4, which can handle single-stream 5K output, but Thunderbolt 3 and the 5K display use a somewhat hacky means to achieve 5K by doing multi-stream DisplayPort 1.2 output over a single cable.
Click to expand...

Whenever the heck we get DisplayPort 1.4. Even then, I'm sure it'll be missing some crucial new copy protection technology or something.
 
NOLA_Gaffer

NOLA_Gaffer

Banned
So help me out here, NeoGAF. I've got a 2010 iMac that I'd like to replace with one of Apple's notebooks. The iMac has a 1TB HDD which allowed me to stretch my legs in regards to storage, and that's my big sticking point in regards to moving to a notebook - all of the internal storage options are damn tiny.

However, by deleting a bunch of nonsense and shuttle stuff I want to keep onto an external drive, I've managed to get my 900GB of data down to around 350GB, comfortably fitting onto a 512GB SSD. I'll keep carving bits here and there out but I don't think I'll be able to get down below 300GB, so a 512GB drive option is the only real must in picking out a notebook.

I'm weighing my options between Apple's current offerings and their refurbished offerings, and it's looking like these are my choices for hardware sporting at least a 512GB SSD:

Refurb 13" Macbook Air:
  • 1.6Ghz Intel Core i5
  • 8GB RAM
  • 512GB SSD
  • $1189

New 13" Macbook Air:
  • 1.6Ghz Intel Core i5
  • 8GB RAM
  • 512GB SSD
  • $1399

Refurb 13" Macbook Pro:
  • 2.9Ghz Intel Core i5
  • 8GB RAM
  • 512GB SSD
  • $1439

New 12" Macbook:
  • 1.2Ghz Intel Core m5
  • 8GB RAM
  • 512GB SSD
  • $1599

Refurb 13" Macbook Pro:
  • 2.9Ghz Intel Core i5
    [*]16GB RAM
  • 512GB SSD
  • $1609

New 13" Macbook Pro
  • 2.7Ghz Intel Core i5
  • 8GB RAM
  • 512GB SSD
  • $1699

New 13" Macbook Pro
  • 2.0Ghz Intel Core i5
  • 8GB RAM
  • 512GB SSD
  • $1699

$1600+ is frankly a bit more than I was hoping to spend, but I went ahead and listed them for posterity.

I'm really liking the look of the Refurbished Macbook Air for $1189, but I'd love a second opinion on the matter.
 
C

Crazymoogle

Member
The Air is a great laptop. Great keyboard, trackpad, sculpt, performance. Superb Battery life. Just a screen that is stone age by modern standards at 1440x900. It's the only non-retina product they sell. It's the iPad 2 of the laptop line. Hell, the screen looks good, it's just low res.

The MB 12" is a shockingly great form factor, but perf is not great compared to your other options, and you'll have to get used to the keyboard.

Out of those listed, and if price is really important to you, the Air is a good device for a few years while they sort out the issues on the Pro and MB lines. You'll just have to accept the screen.
 
NOLA_Gaffer

NOLA_Gaffer

Banned
Crazymoogle said:
The Air is a great laptop. Great keyboard, trackpad, sculpt, performance. Superb Battery life. Just a screen that is stone age by modern standards at 1440x900. It's the only non-retina product they sell. It's the iPad 2 of the laptop line. Hell, the screen looks good, it's just low res.

The MB 12" is a shockingly great form factor, but perf is not great compared to your other options, and you'll have to get used to the keyboard.

Out of those listed, and if price is really important to you, the Air is a good device for a few years while they sort out the issues on the Pro and MB lines. You'll just have to accept the screen.
Click to expand...

Thanks. I'll drop in at Best Buy one day and take a peek at the Macbook Air screen in person and see how it looks.
 
H

hateradio

The Most Dangerous Yes Man
V

VPhys

Member
SourBear said:
Welp.

Using USB-3 at the same time as WiFi is broken on the new MBP!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYVjIjBMx6o


Apparently they are using inadequate shielding to protect WiFi signal from USB-3 noise.
It doesn't happen with all USB devices.
Click to expand...



Well holy shit. I just got my MBP and can CONFIRM this is the case. As soon as I plug in a USB hard drive the wi-fi stops working,.




Is Apple going to recall these????


I can't fucking believe this.


edit: Just did some more testing. This does not affect the 12" macbook at all, just the 13" retina pro. Also, USB sticks seem to be ok, hard drives kill the wi-fi immediately even when no files are being transferred, and EVEN if you have ejected the disk. You have to physically disconnect for the wi-fi to begin working again.
 
S

secretanchitman

Member
hateradio said:
Out of curiosity I decided to try this on a late 2013 13" rMBP (2.6GHz i5-4288U).

  • VLC couldn't play the video, it just had a black screen.
  • MPlayerX played the video, but hung.
  • Kodi played the video with frame drops.
Click to expand...

Going to try it out on my late 2013 15" (2.6Ghz quad-core i7-4960HQ, 16GB, 750m 2GB).

I got the same results as you pretty much, except when I clicked on different parts of the video on VLC, I was shown a static image with a second or two of video but never actually played (minus audio which worked fine).
 
E

eyeball_kid

Member
Enzom21 said:
http://www.01net.com/mediaplayer/vi...-macbook-pro-une-vraie-innovation-883699.html
Video of the touchbar Macbook pro in the wild.
Click to expand...

Nice find. It seemed like there was some lag on the text editor between pressing a Touch Bar button and it activating on the screen, but perhaps that's just that particular app.

VPhys said:
Well holy shit. I just got my MBP and can CONFIRM this is the case. As soon as I plug in a USB hard drive the wi-fi stops working,.

edit: Just did some more testing. This does not affect the 12" macbook at all, just the 13" retina pro. Also, USB sticks seem to be ok, hard drives kill the wi-fi immediately even when no files are being transferred, and EVEN if you have ejected the disk. You have to physically disconnect for the wi-fi to begin working again.
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure this is a cable problem, not a HD problem. What kind of cable are you using to connect the HD to the MBP?
 
Z

Zeyphersan

Banned
VPhys said:
Well holy shit. I just got my MBP and can CONFIRM this is the case. As soon as I plug in a USB hard drive the wi-fi stops working,.




Is Apple going to recall these????


I can't fucking believe this.


edit: Just did some more testing. This does not affect the 12" macbook at all, just the 13" retina pro. Also, USB sticks seem to be ok, hard drives kill the wi-fi immediately even when no files are being transferred, and EVEN if you have ejected the disk. You have to physically disconnect for the wi-fi to begin working again.
Click to expand...

I refuse to believe this is true because A) in the video it was hard to replicate and B) that would have been found in even the most basic of basic tests years ago
 
H

hateradio

The Most Dangerous Yes Man
secretanchitman said:
Going to try it out on my late 2013 15" (2.6Ghz quad-core i7-4960HQ, 16GB, 750m 2GB).

I got the same results as you pretty much, except when I clicked on different parts of the video on VLC, I was shown a static image with a second or two of video but never actually played (minus audio which worked fine).
Click to expand...
I would have thought that the 750m would have helped. :/

In Windows (bootcamp) I tried using PotPlayer, but as soon as the video started, my lappy tappy got super hot. The video also started to stutter. &#128518;


I think there's something wrong with VLC, because on my PC (6700K/970) it also doesn't play that video correctly.

PotPlayer and MPC HC are fine.
 
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