Renna Hazel
Member
Well yeah, there are plenty of TPS out there, but I don't feel any of them play like RE4. We'll have to simply disagree about RE6, I found that to be a huge step backwards.
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I think Action Resident Evil is still on the cards due to it's worldwide appeal
- Thread starter Jawmuncher
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Well yeah, there are plenty of TPS out there, but I don't feel any of them play like RE4. We'll have to simply disagree about RE6, I found that to be a huge step backwards.
How is it a huge step backwards when it's RE4 combat with a ton more options and refinements?
You can play RE6 like RE4 if you want. Just play it super basic without all the cool stuff and it will play like RE4.
(Talking about the combat system here.)
Renna Hazel
Member
The aiming system in RE6 is different and doesn't use the laser system that RE4 and RE5 did. It controls like a typical TPS in that regard and that's a big part of what made RE4 so unique. The unique aiming system and the way the enemies reacted to it gave the game a great feel. This is the core gameplay mechanic of RE4 and it felt like a huge step back in RE6. Turning the little dot on didn't replicate the laser. Melee system is also completely changed, in my opinion it's worse.
I can also say that there is no way you can play the game like RE4, especially the Chris segments. There is a different between a game built around being a cover shooter and a game like RE4. Sure you could choose not to take cover, but the game is built around that, and you'll like die.
I like RE6, but it just felt like a typical action game while RE4 and 5 felt like something really unique. I'll take a sequel to either, but I'd much prefer they go back to the RE4 style.
Agreed. Resident Evil 4 is to this day the series pinnacle for me.
Except RE6 does have laser sight aiming just like RE4, it's in the options.
RE6 has plenty of different ways to play, if you don't like Chris's campaign then you have 3 others to choose from. I replayed Leon's this week and pretty much didn't bother with cover at all.
RE6's melee system destroys RE4's, this shouldn't even be up for debate.
You can prefer RE4's campaign if you like but when it comes to actual combat RE6 is on a complete different level (not just compared to 4 but most TPS in general).
Renna Hazel
Member
RE6 does not have RE4's laser sight aiming. I pointed that out in the post you quoted.
the melee system in RE4 (and 5, since it's superior here) took more skill to execute properly and also tied into the aiming mechanic for a more cohesive gameplay experience. I personally felt it was better. Just having more options doesn't always make for a tighter gameplay experience.
To me, the feel of a game matters a lot. If you think RE6 has the same aiming system as RE4, then we simply judge games differently. Having a red dot isn't what made RE4's aiming system unique.
Fancy Clown
Member
RE6 and RE4's combat aim for different results. Limiting movement or options doesn't mean that the combat in 4 is demonstrably worse imo. RE6's combat is built more on mobility, counters, and chaining melee whereas RE4 (and 5) are about the tension of positioning and risk/reward of letting enemies surround you in order to have a better chance to stun them and score a quick melee to get more breathing room. There's obviously some similarities there, but the core affect of each is different so I don't think it's fair to say RE6 builds directly from RE4 when it changes the feeling of combat so fundamentally.
Dude, you can turn on RE4 style laser sight aiming under options in RE6.
Nope, it's super basic compared to 6 and that's it.
I get that people like to place RE4 on this really high pedestal but be realistic here, combat wise it can't hold a candle to 6 (not many games can).
Jawmuncher
Member
I think he means the Laser Based Aimijg gameplay is different. RE4 has a weight to its aiming mechanics and such while RE6 does not (This why it's not an issue to play with crosshairs if you want)
Charlouie Jonesman
Banned
Here are the facts:
Mechanically, RE6 has much better combat than RE4.
RE4 has much more polished and less glitchy combat though.
Mechanically, RE6 has much better combat than RE4.
RE4 has much more polished and less glitchy combat though.
Renna Hazel
Member
ugh. I've said this twice already, turning on the red dot (RE6 laser sight) is NOT RE4 aiming. It doesn't change the mechanics of the game. It changes the visual design of the aiming. If you think the only different between the aiming or RE4 and RE6 is the visual design, you are factually incorrect. You CANNOT use the aiming system of RE4 in RE6.
RE6 aiming is mechanically the same regardless of the visual options you choose to go with. again, feel of the game is important to me.
I wont keep arguing about other things, as that is just a matter of opinion. you prefer one thing and I prefer another.
Exactly. It's two different gameplay systems. He seems to think turning on the laser sight in RE6 turns on a completely different gameplay engine. It doesn't, it's just a visual design. It's not the same mechanically as RE4 and 5. Every game with a laser sight doesn't play the same as RE4....
Still doesn't change the fact that RE4 combat would be a huge step backwards for the series compared to 6.
It would be like going from MGSV combat to MGS4.
To say that he wants RE4 style weight to the laser sight is fine. To say that the RE4 combat system is overall superior to 6 and and the next action RE should go back to it is just wrong.
Renna Hazel
Member
No, to say that RE4 has the same aiming system as RE6 is just plain wrong. As in, it's factually incorrect. Saying RE4 has superior gameplay mechanics to RE6 is my opinion. You are allowed to disagree but at the same time...you can't even tell the difference in the aiming system between the two games. So yeah.
also I want them to go back to RE5, since that improved on RE4's gameplay system. RE6 was it's own thing.
Berserking Guts
Member
Can I have both?
Inspector Q
Member
The only thing I kind of wish would happen if we do get a new action RE (I hope we do!) is that they make the co-op completely optional. So if I am playing solo I don't have to be stuck playing with an AI partner.
If I recall, if you played RE6's Ada campaign solo, she wouldn't have an AI partner at all. But if you played it co-op they would add a playable soldier character for the second player to use.
I would love a system like that so the people who wanted to play the campaign with a friend can still do so and those like me who want a completely solo experience don't have to be shackled to an AI partner character.
I like the way the old RE games handled partner characters. They would only be with you for short spurts during the campaign. So for example, if you were playing RE1 as Jill, there would be short sequences where you had Barry with you and it actually felt refreshing. He would own pretty much all the enemies, especially the Hunters, with his Colt Python. Then all of a sudden he would leave and his absence would really be felt as you were suddenly left alone to deal with all the Hunters yourself.
So those short partner sections helped to relieve some of the tension during the long campaign. But then you have RE 5 and 6 where you always have a gun toting partner at your side throughout the whole campaign and you are just destroying everything. No real tension at all. I think the one section in RE5 that was really well done was the swamp with those Crocs who would one shot you. That was a great section, but other than that the game was a big disappointment for me.
So yeah, sorry about the co-op rant. I know a lot of people enjoy that stuff, but I would definitely love if it was optional. It's the main reason I vastly prefer the RE4 campaign to 5 and 6.
Either way, I definitely want to see another action RE sooner rather than later. Co-op or no co-op. I'll take what I can get at this point.
If I recall, if you played RE6's Ada campaign solo, she wouldn't have an AI partner at all. But if you played it co-op they would add a playable soldier character for the second player to use.
I would love a system like that so the people who wanted to play the campaign with a friend can still do so and those like me who want a completely solo experience don't have to be shackled to an AI partner character.
I like the way the old RE games handled partner characters. They would only be with you for short spurts during the campaign. So for example, if you were playing RE1 as Jill, there would be short sequences where you had Barry with you and it actually felt refreshing. He would own pretty much all the enemies, especially the Hunters, with his Colt Python. Then all of a sudden he would leave and his absence would really be felt as you were suddenly left alone to deal with all the Hunters yourself.
So those short partner sections helped to relieve some of the tension during the long campaign. But then you have RE 5 and 6 where you always have a gun toting partner at your side throughout the whole campaign and you are just destroying everything. No real tension at all. I think the one section in RE5 that was really well done was the swamp with those Crocs who would one shot you. That was a great section, but other than that the game was a big disappointment for me.
So yeah, sorry about the co-op rant. I know a lot of people enjoy that stuff, but I would definitely love if it was optional. It's the main reason I vastly prefer the RE4 campaign to 5 and 6.
Either way, I definitely want to see another action RE sooner rather than later. Co-op or no co-op. I'll take what I can get at this point.
Renna Hazel
Member
This 100%
I love playing co-op, but when I tried to replay RE5 solo, Sheva (or Chris) become a nightmare. It's even worse if you get that trust achievement since Capcom thought it would be a good idea to show trust by having the character constantly run in front of you and smile. RE6 does this much better as the AI partner is out of the way almost all the time.
Gunslinger
Member
Yeah I think RE6 is one of the worst game ever made. Game was just bad....
bobbychalkers
Member
RE6 had amazing combat with bad layouts and scenarios. I'd be down if they just refined it.
RecRoulette
Member
How much worldwide appeal did Umbrella Corps have?
Except it does give you access to the same aiming system, the difference is in the weight. Which I didn't disagree with.
But hey, go on acting like people didn't feel like RE5's combat wasn't changed enough from 4. People wanted the combat to move forward, they didn't want more of the same. It felt dated. That is why a lot of people who hate on RE6 still admit that it has great combat.
Renna Hazel
Member
No, it doesn't. It changes the visual presentation of the aiming system in RE6, it never changes the mechanics. You claimed it did (and you still seem to be claiming that). So you ARE disagreeing. The options in RE6 never change the mechanics of the aiming system. It simply replaces a crosshair with a colored dot. I played with the 'laser sight' on the entire game, and it's NOT the same as RE4. Go turn the game on right now, turn the laser sight on and off and tell me if there is any difference between the two mechanically. There isn't.
I'm also not speaking for other people, I'm speaking for myself. I have no place to present the opinions of others. You personally asked for my opinion so that's what I gave you. I never mentioned what other people felt about RE4, 5, 6 or anything else.
I never enjoyed the combat in re 6. It just feels janky and glitchy. Poor hit reactions and death animations on enemies makes the combat feel so unsatisfying even if you technicaly have more options than previous games. The way some enemies just disintegrate into thin air without even falling over just feels incredibly dull.
Re 4 and 5 really nailed the feel of the combat, shooting enemies just felt good.
How a game feels to play is a incredibly important aspect that sadly is often overlooked.
Re 4 and 5 really nailed the feel of the combat, shooting enemies just felt good.
How a game feels to play is a incredibly important aspect that sadly is often overlooked.
The hell are you even arguing?
I said that it can be changed to the laser sight because it sounded from your posts that you might not know that there is an option to do that. That's it. I didn't say it changed the aiming system mechanically.
Renna Hazel
Member
Yep. This is one of the most important aspects of a video game. For some it's visuals but for others it's how a game feels while playing it that makes it's special.
Charlouie Jonesman
Banned
The big differences in combat with RE6 isn't really the aiming, which does feel different...maybe just because you can now aim and move simultaniously...but no, it's how you do melee set-ups.
RE4 and 5 go entirely for locational hit damage which results in different stuns and different melee prompts. It also requires you to take your time and think before you shoot.
RE6 still somewhat uses different hit zone stuns but they're heavily de-emphazized and less effective. And since you get the strongest melee attack prompt after sliding into an already stunned enemy, it doesn't really matter where you hit them. You can just use quickshot from the get-go.
RE4 and 5 go entirely for locational hit damage which results in different stuns and different melee prompts. It also requires you to take your time and think before you shoot.
RE6 still somewhat uses different hit zone stuns but they're heavily de-emphazized and less effective. And since you get the strongest melee attack prompt after sliding into an already stunned enemy, it doesn't really matter where you hit them. You can just use quickshot from the get-go.
Berserking Guts
Member
I will happily take RE4 over the other two. I prefer the slower more methodical approach to combat in RE4. The controls and enemy behavior compliment each other well and I have more memorable encounters in a single section of RE4 then anything in 6.
Renna Hazel
Member
I said, in the post you quoted that I prefer the aiming system of RE4. I ever said in that post that you CAN turn on the laser in RE6 but it's mechanically different. You replied with this.
I've been arguing that it doesn't have aiming just like RE4....which is what you said it did. Like, it's right there in your quote. To claim you never said this is silly.
I made it very clear that I prefer the aiming mechanics in RE4, and you kept saying RE6 has the same thing in the options menu. If you meant something else...fine. But that's what I'm arguing.
So we now agree that RE4 and RE6 have different aiming systems now?
Just stop, I already told you that I thought you meant visually.
Of course RE6's core aiming mechanic will stay the same regardless of what visual style you choose. The damn game has a skill that let's you turn off the aiming reticle altogether in exchange for more powerful shots. It has to stay consistent.
DangerMouse
Member
Looking forward to seeing this movie.
So that hallway becomes like the Matrix lobby, that's pretty great. 
Honestly, I liked RE6 in that it had real fun co-op, the gameplay was relatively tight and you could dodge and had plenty of options for dodging.
They should keep RE6's style going as a side-series. Keep it as Leon's gameplay style in a side series for him, keep the main numbered series for RE7 style survival horror, Revelations for the RE5 style and maybe bring back Outbreak for an online game. We're already getting REmake 2, so that's the classic style sorted. Plenty of options for everyone that way, but probably too many for Capcom to develop cheaply so likely not going to happen sadly.
They should keep RE6's style going as a side-series. Keep it as Leon's gameplay style in a side series for him, keep the main numbered series for RE7 style survival horror, Revelations for the RE5 style and maybe bring back Outbreak for an online game. We're already getting REmake 2, so that's the classic style sorted. Plenty of options for everyone that way, but probably too many for Capcom to develop cheaply so likely not going to happen sadly.
Renna Hazel
Member
Then you should have stopped a long time ago. I very clearly stated in almost every post I've made about this that the mechanics are what I was talking about. I've also said the same thing you just did maybe 3 times and you kept arguing with me. It also proves you can't play RE6 the same way as RE4 (which you stated).
But since that's cleared up, that should answer your original question as to why I prefer RE4/5's gameplay mechanics. It feels better and the aiming system (and melee system) in RE4/5 is better. Hit detection and enemy response is also much better in RE4/5. Hope that answers your question this time.
With so many different styles, Capcom really should just incorporate some of this stuff into another IP. It's going to be pretty confusing for more casual fans to know which RE games they'll like and which ones they wont.
Jawmuncher
Member
A esports focused MP title made by a team of new recuits on Unity that no one asked for. How well do you think it did? That game had more issues than just falling into the action camp.
I'm curious to see where Capcom goes with the series. RE7 was well received by fans and critics but RE6 sold more. Would be nice if they could blend action and horror well again. Interested to see how the Not A Hero DLC pans out for RE7. I'm expecting that to be more action focused. When is that supposed to be out?
We have no date for Not a Hero after it got delayed. I really hope they add a lot more different enemies if it is more action focused. Re 7 just don't have enough enemy variations for a action game.
Everything you mentioned are the details that you prefer about specific elements.
I'm talking about the combat system as a whole. That is what's special about RE6, all the mechanics that are at play. You can prefer the aiming, you can prefer the hit detection but that's just details.
When I said that you can played 6 similar to 4 I meant in terms of the mechanics. Don't dodge roll. Don't shoot while moving. Don't parry. Don't shoot while on the ground. Mechanics is what I'm referring to.
Fancy Clown
Member
But the whole game is designed around the mechanics...so even if you restricted yourself in that manner RE6 still doesn't play like RE4.
Yes?
The game is designed around the new combat system but if you prefer not having all those options and want to play without those new mechanics then you can.
Renna Hazel
Member
Sorry but I'm confused as to what you mean by "just details". I'm not entirely sure why being able to roll is a gameplay mechanic yet aiming and hit detection are not? I'm not trying to be combative here, I'd just need you to explain the distinction to me before I could re-answer your question.
Berserking Guts
Member
I take it you don't believe in minimalism or design by subtraction then.
I like RE6 too, but I will laugh in the face of anyone who tries to convince me that it's an evolution or a "big step forward" from RE4.
Here's my original post:
I'm referring to the features of the combat system.
Like in RE4 you can aim for specific body parts to initiate melee. This is something that wasn't in classic RE. In RE6 you can combat while being on the ground, something that isn't in RE4.
CannonFodder52
Member
RE6 didn't click with me. But I thoroughly enjoyed RE4/5, I'd love another game in that style.
1,2 and 3 are still best tho.
1,2 and 3 are still best tho.
Renna Hazel
Member
Well yeah you can do more stuff in RE6. I just find RE4/5 to be mechanically superior games. They feel better to play and the systems that are in place make for a better gameplay experience. I think aiming and hit detection are incredibly important aspects of a shooting game.
I never said RE4 had more mechanics, but it does have better mechanics. As I previously stated, the way a game feels to play is far more important than the amount of moves your character can do. You clearly disagree with me. To each their own.
Fancy Clown
Member
Yeah but that's not fun....When people say they prefer RE4's combat it's because the experience is built around those mechanics. Intentionally gimping yourself in a game that wasn't built around those limitations doesn't make the combat suddenly the same experience.
For what it's worth guys, I agree with Renna Hazel. RE4 and 5 have a combat system very much distinct from RE6, and it is most definitely not without it's merits, nor is it made obsolete by RE6, IMO. In 4 and 5, there's more weight to everything, from aiming to movement and even the impact of your melee attacks. Moreover, enemies are somewhat more reactive to being shot than they are in 6, which is something that was slightly toned down in 6 to complement the added mobility that game offers. There is still weight to 6, and enemies do react to being hit, but pretty much everything feels fundamentally different, and much faster paced in 6.
Also, I personally love not being able to move and shoot in 4 and 5. I love having to plant my feet in the ground and aim at enemies with a small, wobbly laser sight and desperately line up a good at the last second. After that, the tables are turned and I can launch a guy clear across the room with a haymaker, or uppercut them into the air and fill up up with a curb stomp. So tense, satisfying, and fun as hell!
Also, I personally love not being able to move and shoot in 4 and 5. I love having to plant my feet in the ground and aim at enemies with a small, wobbly laser sight and desperately line up a good at the last second. After that, the tables are turned and I can launch a guy clear across the room with a haymaker, or uppercut them into the air and fill up up with a curb stomp. So tense, satisfying, and fun as hell!
+1
Funny you should mention that because one of the complaint's people have about RE6 is that the campaign doesn't do enough to force you to take advantage of the game's combat mechanics
In the end though it does make it more accessible, you can play it in many ways and still succeed. If you want you can ignore melee and treat it like a regular TPS shooter, or if you prefer full on melee then you can play Jake etc. Between the combat system itself and the character specifics there is a lot you can do to tailor the game to how you prefer to play.
