Disney propaganda. They grew up in the same pride. Lions are polygamous, and Mufasa was head of that pride. Siblings!
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
I think the New Disney Animation Renaissance might have topped the previous one
- Thread starter EdReedFan20
- Start date
- Status
Disney propaganda. They grew up in the same pride. Lions are polygamous, and Mufasa was head of that pride. Siblings!
Disney propaganda. They grew up in the same pride. Lions are polygamous, and Mufasa was head of that pride. Siblings!
And animals can't talk either, what's your point? she's not his sister. If you want to tell Disney they got something wrong, that's totally fine.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Tangled is my favourite movie of my adulthood but comparing the ones in the OP the new era doesn't come particularly close. Lots of nostalgia bias tho.
You must really hate movies
Thats a rather sad thing to say. I guess Disney Princesses only?
GeorgioCostanzaX
Gold Member
Princess and the Frog did decently well but nowhere near Zootopia levels. Plus you have a man who pioneered 3D animation at the helm who was literally fired laughed out of and fired from Disney at one point for suggesting 3D was the way forward: it's his damn baby.
Very much this. Particularly the first two. Nothing really has come close since. Also miss 2d animation.
Still, I enjoyed Zootopia, Princess and the Frog, and Tangled quite a lot. Frozen and Wreck to a lessor extent.
Brutalitops
Banned
If I was to take these 20 movies and make a Top 10 sampling both eras, none of the current era would even make the Top 5 of that list.
In fact the highest I would place any modern movie in said Top 10 list would be 9th place.
1 - The Lion King
2 - Mulan
3 - Aladdin
4 - Pocahontas
5 - Beauty and the Beast
6 - The Hunchback of Notre Dame
7 - Tarzan
8 - The Little Mermaid
9 - Zootopia
10 - Tangled
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Why would that be sad and no absolutely my favourite movie ever since I turned 18. Which was ~6 years ago.
The Dutch Slayer
Member
Fully agree I love both eras but this last run say from 2009 is amazing.
Tangled is a masterpiece and Frozen and Zoo are just so perfect and look so amazing
Tangled is a masterpiece and Frozen and Zoo are just so perfect and look so amazing
Law of the Jungle
ThePrequelsSuck
Banned
Why do people hate Atlantis? It's a good movie.
manzoman96
Member
I don't hate it, but I find it very forgettable. I've seen it multiple times and barely remember anything from it.
Shadow Hog
Member
Replying specifically about the last movie in that last sentence: yes, actually. I mean, it's a Michael Giacchino joint, he tends to have very noticeable leitmotifs in his films. I confess Zootopia didn't leave quite as much of an impression on me on my first viewing as Up, Star Trek or Inside Out did, but rewatches and listening to the soundtrack repeatedly, I can absolutely identify at least four leitmotifs throughout the whole thing:
- One that comes up when dreams and ambitions come up, particularly when they're being crushed (eg: "Not A Real Cop" or "The Nick of Time") or given another chance (the tail end of this spoiler-name track).
- One that's either Nick's leitmotif or a "hustle" theme, a jazzy track with lots of unconventional instruments mixed in, present here in "Walk and Stalk". (This one is particularly catchy.)
- One that I think is supposed to be Judy's leitmotif - most of its uses aren't on the CD release for some reason, but it's present in "Foxy Fakeout" and the beginning of "Jumbo Pop Hustle" (before it transitions to the film's first instance of the aforementioned "hustle" leitmotif).
- Lastly, one that comes up when detective work's being done - present at the start of "Case of the Manchas", about 2:02 in "The Naturalist", sort of present in "Weasel Shakedown", and the bassline around here in "Hopps Goes (After) the Weasel" has it too.
Really, I feel like Zootopia's soundtrack's biggest weakness is that "Try Everything" doesn't really do it for me, to say nothing of it not having a patch on anything Howard Ashman worked on (or Tim Rice, I suppose, after Ashman passed away mid-Aladdin) - but then, I don't know if it being a musical would've really worked in the film's favor (and it'd probably have undermined that Frozen joke Chief Bogo made during his dressing-down of Judy).
At any rate, "Walk and Stalk" gets stuck in my head periodically, so there's that.
I have to say that while I have a preference for the 90s Renaissance films, the shit-talking about CGI as a proper medium for animation is played the fuck out.
For one, Disney himself was a fidelity man. He believed and invested in technological innovation and progressivism for the sake of the best image quality. He didn't use 2D because of artistic vision and nostalgia, and if anything hated the films that eschewed inking for the Xerox process because it looked cheaper to him, even though I'd argue the process preserved the animators' work the best. If he had the choice of modern CGI at the height of his career I have no doubt he would've taken it in a heartbeat.
Second, 2D animation isn't more expensive to produce than CGI films on the feature circuit. Look at the budgets for Princess and the Frog and Winnie the Pooh; they're peanuts compared to Tangled and Frozen, to say nothing of films like Zootopia and Moana. CGI is more specialized which requires bigger and more educated crews and far more R&D and tech support, while any bozo with a work ethic can technically make a traditional film with basic Toon Boom and Photoshop knowledge. It's not more expensive; they switched to CGI because it's simply the technological standard. It's like pining for black and white films because that's how it originally was.
Subsequently, it's also not a lazy process to produce these films. CGI has a naturally higher threshold for believability, which involves a deeper understanding of realism and motion. Eye darts are just one example; they're largely absent from 2D because it's just result in distracting wobbling. Without it in 3D, you get characters that stare soullessy. There's more details of human motion and behavior that have to be accounted for, and on top of that they still have to have the exaggeration and charm of old Disney animation. That's no easy feat at all.
Again, I love traditional animation. It's my go to for inspiration, and it's resulted in wonderful memories and films for me. But can we please cut back on the Luddism? It's 2016 already.
For one, Disney himself was a fidelity man. He believed and invested in technological innovation and progressivism for the sake of the best image quality. He didn't use 2D because of artistic vision and nostalgia, and if anything hated the films that eschewed inking for the Xerox process because it looked cheaper to him, even though I'd argue the process preserved the animators' work the best. If he had the choice of modern CGI at the height of his career I have no doubt he would've taken it in a heartbeat.
Second, 2D animation isn't more expensive to produce than CGI films on the feature circuit. Look at the budgets for Princess and the Frog and Winnie the Pooh; they're peanuts compared to Tangled and Frozen, to say nothing of films like Zootopia and Moana. CGI is more specialized which requires bigger and more educated crews and far more R&D and tech support, while any bozo with a work ethic can technically make a traditional film with basic Toon Boom and Photoshop knowledge. It's not more expensive; they switched to CGI because it's simply the technological standard. It's like pining for black and white films because that's how it originally was.
Subsequently, it's also not a lazy process to produce these films. CGI has a naturally higher threshold for believability, which involves a deeper understanding of realism and motion. Eye darts are just one example; they're largely absent from 2D because it's just result in distracting wobbling. Without it in 3D, you get characters that stare soullessy. There's more details of human motion and behavior that have to be accounted for, and on top of that they still have to have the exaggeration and charm of old Disney animation. That's no easy feat at all.
Again, I love traditional animation. It's my go to for inspiration, and it's resulted in wonderful memories and films for me. But can we please cut back on the Luddism? It's 2016 already.
It's a legit good movie and it's both gorgeous and full of fun, romance, and personality.
It gives me strong "Princess Bride" vibes.
The funny animal sidekick formula is tiresome,the look is technically impressive but absolutely unimaginative.
Same year saw the releases of Despicable Me, Toy Story 3, Secret of Kells and How to Train Your Dragon.
I think its fair to say that it doesn't hold a candle against these movies.
So you've seen Zootopia but didn't recognize the insane detail and labor in its visuals? The expressions and liveliness of the characters easily matches the best of Disney's 2D work, maybe even exceeds.
Fantasia is still the most impressive Disney film, but nothing 2D in Disney's 90s output came close to that. Or after.
I can't choose between the two eras but to be fair I've only seen Tangled, Frozen and half of Wreck It Ralph on an airplane of the current crop of movies. But I'm incredibly excited to give Wreck it Ralph another go next week and to finally see Zootopia.
That said, for some reason I remembered Bolt as a DreamWorks film but see it's Disney and that's one animation I really loved from the get go.
Do we know of any of Disney's upcoming features besides Wreck It Ralph 2 and Frozen 2?
That said, for some reason I remembered Bolt as a DreamWorks film but see it's Disney and that's one animation I really loved from the get go.
Do we know of any of Disney's upcoming features besides Wreck It Ralph 2 and Frozen 2?
SpacePirate Ridley
Member
And saw moana on a preview today I went.
Its pretty good, but I think I prefer Zootopia and Wreck it Ralph.
Maui was the best character of the movie.
The thing is, people saying the music from this movie is at the level of second golden age movies, that got my hyped up.... nope, just no.
Its Frozen 2.0 in that department. Theres some good things there (best song and more artistic one at scene was the one that Maui sings). The rest is pretty forgettable, theres even one that ones to be the Let it go of this movie, same animations of determined movements while singing with moana and everything, and just no.
Im really hating music now its about character feelings mostly instead of telling a part of the story with the song and trying to describe what is going to happen with a plan, or a character.
Thats probably why I like Maui's song so much, becuase it was a presentation of tis character to move the story along.
They also make a few jokes about using disney tropes during the movie, and while the first land, the next ones turn repetitive and fail.
Its pretty good, but I think I prefer Zootopia and Wreck it Ralph.
Maui was the best character of the movie.
The thing is, people saying the music from this movie is at the level of second golden age movies, that got my hyped up.... nope, just no.
Its Frozen 2.0 in that department. Theres some good things there (best song and more artistic one at scene was the one that Maui sings). The rest is pretty forgettable, theres even one that ones to be the Let it go of this movie, same animations of determined movements while singing with moana and everything, and just no.
Im really hating music now its about character feelings mostly instead of telling a part of the story with the song and trying to describe what is going to happen with a plan, or a character.
Thats probably why I like Maui's song so much, becuase it was a presentation of tis character to move the story along.
They also make a few jokes about using disney tropes during the movie, and while the first land, the next ones turn repetitive and fail.
FinaruDensetsu
Member
I love the current Disney Animation. They put Pixar to shame now (Inside Out was amazing though).
I just wish they'd give us a traditional animation movie once in a while in between the CG ones though.
I just wish they'd give us a traditional animation movie once in a while in between the CG ones though.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Sadly it's because of the perception of people thinking that because one is drawn the other is done in computers (which itself is a hilarious fallacy) they think one is "lazier".
I forgot which gaffer was it but he made a gif on how people think CGI are made, in that it's a literal "one button instant animation".
I don't hate it, but the movie is kinda... unremarkable.
There is more than Disney and Disney.
I prefer most of those over Tangled, but that's because they scratch a different itch. My wife, for instance, prefers Tangled over all those films you mentioned. She adores the romance, the humor, the characters, the visuals, the music... and I can't argue with her on many of those. Toy Story 3 isn't about romance, but my wife is a romantic.
She walked down the aisle to "Now I See the Light". So, yeah, she'd pick Tangled over all those films in a heartbeat.
I am curious about the next "Best Animated Picture" Oscar... because Moana and Zootopia are both some god-tier animated films by the same studio in the same year. It almost sucks that they'll be up against each other as they'd each on their own claim it if they released in different years.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Zootopia has a high chance of being snubbed especially with how Oscars operate. Hell I think KFP3 deserves it more because it's a goddamn gorgeous film that closes the story well, but yeah those two are gonna be snubbed.
Closes the story? KFP has at least 2-3 more films planned.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
I know, but the Po arc is closed from what I read.
True. I do hope Zootopia wins, though. Story and theme-wise, it probably took more risks than any other animated film this year.
robotzombie
Member
A goofy movie got robbed
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
To the people watching and enjoying BH6, I suggest watching henshin hero series. They deal with the scope of what BH6 is doing but in better pacing and with better (for most of the time) characters.
but sadly as I said, it's probably Moana gonna take it. Not shitting on the film, but that's just how Oscar works. "My daughter watched it" reasoning tier.
From what I heard it's not a disney canon movie?
but sadly as I said, it's probably Moana gonna take it. Not shitting on the film, but that's just how Oscar works. "My daughter watched it" reasoning tier.
From what I heard it's not a disney canon movie?
Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku!
Member
I always thought the original Disney Renaissance period was just Little Mermaid - Lion King. The mid-late 90s movies really aren't as strong as that run.
I don't know. I like Tangled a lot. Wreck it Ralph and Zootopia are also quite good, but Aladdin, Mulan, and Hercules are all as good or better.
This is all very qualitative though so it's up in the air. I wouldn't say this Renaissance is better than the other, but it certainly is one based on the consistency of quality.
This is all very qualitative though so it's up in the air. I wouldn't say this Renaissance is better than the other, but it certainly is one based on the consistency of quality.
Inferno313
Banned
Mulan is fantastic, and Tarzan and Hercules are very good, if not as great as the previous films.
Hunchback is meh though.
superdeluxe
Member
Where does Lilo and Stich fall into this?
Outside of the Renaissance (like the Emperor's New Groove) but still considered very good.
Huh? Its gonna be Zootopia, Moana or Dory. Disney, Disney or Disney.
You should have watched more than Disney movies.
I dont know... I thin Kubo and the Two Strings has a good chance as well.
Due to lack of commercial success and not being able to afford a campaign like Disney can have easily, I very much doubt it.
A preference out of affinity for the romantic genre is perfectly fine, but says nothing about quality.
forget rankings for now
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79DijItQXMM
is so fucking disney it baffles me that it came out so recently. the combo of song and visuals feel straight out of Hercules or Aladin
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79DijItQXMM
is so fucking disney it baffles me that it came out so recently. the combo of song and visuals feel straight out of Hercules or Aladin
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Ah no others? Strange.
In any case you bring up Dory, so it's either Moana or Dory judging by how the board does it.
Disney relying on their Disney formula is baffling?
Due to Disney's bully tactics and the Academy's legendary incompetence in the animated sector, I remain sceptic for now.
Audible Phonetics
Member
Emperors New Groove being slept on. smh
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
And villain music! I even made a thread about it because it just hit me, hahaha!
- Status