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[Horse Detective]

There are way more flaws with that fight than a zoomed, cropped, and looped GIF that highly exaggerates a single shot. Lazy gif posting doesn't really make for a solid argument, and in fact does the opposite.

Like, I agree with you, that fight really isn't good at all, I'm just saying to keep from doing it, because GAF does this constantly and its pretty self-invalidating, even if it's funny and people who agree may enjoy it.

That loop is the TL;DR response of everything being overly choreographed.

And whenever people bring this to light, the argument is, "Well Jedi operate on a higher level that your typical sword fight would demonstrate!"

 

[BinaryPork2737]

I've only seen the original three movies, but what the hell is this?

"You're so beautiful."
"No, it's only because I'm so in love."

That is horrific. Oh Star Wars, what happened?

You really missed out on some gems.

"You are asking me to be rational. That is something I know I cannot do. Believe me, I wish I could just wish away my feelings, but I can't."

"I will not give in to this."

(all said in the most robotic tones ever)

 

[George Oscar Bluth II]

Really?
I don't remember Han Solo being born a storm trooper and abandoning their ranks because he couldn't take it, along with ending the movie getting slashed in the back by Darth Vader
I don't remember Rey using the force to blow up Starkiller base
I don't remember Darth Vader trying to emulate his grandfather or remember him killing his own father and throwing him off a bridge
I don't remember Han and Luke stealing a ship to fight of pursuing Tie Fighters
I don't remember Luke and Han traveling through space only to be picked up by their enemies father that was smuggling aliens and caught up in some dirty dealings

And soooooooooo much more.
Fuck outta here with that paper thin argument

It seems that story beats and "originality" are all that matter in movies these days.

 

[hardcastlemccormick]

In my Star Wars hype last year I attempted to rewatch Episode 3 and I didn't even make it through the opening space battle.

Space battles are my favorite movie setpieces but it's like three minutes of R2-D2 fighting off buzz droids and mindless dialogue. It's so irredeemably bad.

The GCI looks great though.

 

[sphagnum]

I think if The Matrix didn't come out in 1999, people wouldn't have reacted as harshly to TPM. I remember a lot of arguments online and in school about how The Matrix had dethroned Star Wars and was going to be the new biggest franchise around.

 

[watership]

After the first two, I refused to see the third. Eventually I saw the red letter media review and sure enough the movie appeared to be just as bad as the first two which were horrific.

Red Letter Media review of a film before you saw it? That's a good way to hate it.

 

[Dryk]

Yeah, he's glorious in it. Pure cartoon villain and clearly having a whale of a time.

They do seem a somewhat inefficient way to take down ships in a world with laser cannons.

There are situations where they make sense. The opening of RotS is not one of them.

 

[Jawmuncher]

While we're at it, after rewatching it last year, The Phantom Menace is just incredibly mediocre as a film. I'm fairly certain its reputation as a terrible SW movie stems purely out of the gargantuan disappointment it was to people in 1999, which I wouldn't blame people for.

Yep. It gets the title for worst film just due to it being a let down of a return. But like it's been said in this thread, it's really not an outright horrible film on its own.

Attack of the clones on the other hand...

 

[cj_iwakura]

I'm just really glad the TFA honeymoon is over. Worst SW film by a mile. Well made, ruinous plot.

 

[Samuraicop]

Also, just gonna throw this out there, the whole "at least the prequels were original" argument falls apart really fast when you step back and look at all of the imagery and themes that the prequels straight up lift from the original trilogy.

Exactly like in one of the first scenes is Anakin just so happening to build C3PO and also later having R2D2 as if that wasn't just calling back to the OT

 

[Schlorgan]

I'm just really glad the TFA honeymoon is over. Worst SW film by a mile. Well made, ruinous plot.

Wat

 

[MMarston]

Attack of the clones on the other hand...

I'm just really glad the TFA honeymoon is over. Worst SW film by a mile. Well made, ruinous plot.

 

[CassidyIzABeast]

Better than TFA.

 

[Sephzilla]

I'm just really glad the TFA honeymoon is over. Worst SW film by a mile. Well made, ruinous plot.

Comments like these make me think a lot of people haven't watched Attack of the Clones in a long time. AOTC isn't just a bad Star Wars movie, it's a bad movie in general.

 

[Into the Light]

I'm just really glad the TFA honeymoon is over. Worst SW film by a mile. Well made, ruinous plot.

Lol.

No.

 

[RareFantasy64]

Because it's more original? TFA blows them away in terms of how well made it is.

I agree that TFA is a well-made movie. My criticisms of TFA have nothing to do with that side of it. Acting and dialogie in TFA feels a lot more natural than the prequels

I don't like the story TFA tells. I don't like what it did to the OT cast and wish they had set the movie to a time past the lives of Luke, Han and Leia

 

[Heroman]

I'm just really glad the TFA honeymoon is over. Worst SW film by a mile. Well made, ruinous plot.

Preach

 

[Horse Detective]

I'm just really glad the TFA honeymoon is over. Worst SW film by a mile. Well made, ruinous plot.

The majority of the internet disagrees with you, at least the demographic the producers give a shit about.

 

[Killer Queen]

It seems that story beats and "originality" are all that matter in movies these days.

Not sure if that's sarcasm but entertaining the idea that it's not. I won't deny that it intentionally shares some ideas from ANH, but even then it does a lot to subvert that (excluding Starkiller base) with the rest of it being fairly original.
It's easy to hand wave everything and say 'but it's literally just like ANH!' and if you feel that way you've either not watched ANH or TFA

 

[ViewtifulJC]

the defense rests, your honor

 

[Sheroking]

Yep. It gets the title for worst film just due to it being a let down of a return. But like it's been said in this thread, it's really not an outright horrible film on its own.

Attack of the clones on the other hand...

TPM is a pretty unbelievably awful film with like three pretty good scenes, and what you prioritize in your mind is how you're going to feel about the film.

Jake Lloyd is brutal. Liam Neeson is actually really bad. Ewan MacGregor gives his worst performance of the three. It has maybe the worst sense of humor in the modern history of film - and NOT just from Jar-Jar, who seems omnipresent. Remember the droids? Ughhhhh....

But if you've blocked the 80% of the film where all that takes place and focus on the Pod racing scene or Obi Wan/Neeson vs Maul, you might think it's offering more.

 

[Tom_Cody]

Absolutely

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hlecG3nYaLw

 

[MMarston]

One of these days, GAF needs to plan a collective Star Wars marathon.

Actually, no. Let's just all watch AOTC.

People need to remember how dogshit that was.

 

[Schlorgan]

Not sure if that's sarcasm but entertaining the idea that it's not. I won't deny that it intentionally shares some ideas from ANH, but even then it does a lot to subvert that (excluding Starkiller base) with the rest of it being fairly original.
It's easy to hand wave everything and say 'but it's literally just like ANH!' and if you feel that way you've either not watched ANH or TFA

It also shows that one thinks that ANH was in any way original. If we want to criticize TFA for lifting its plot from somewhere else, we should do the same for ANH.

 

[Samuraicop]

I'm just really glad the TFA honeymoon is over. Worst SW film by a mile. Well made, ruinous plot.

Good joke man love your humor

 

[Ralemont]

I think quoting bad dialogue is not a particularly good argument for why Revenge shouldn't be included with the original trilogy as good Star Wars movies, because the original trilogy has horrendous dialogue all around, except for some Han Solo lines (Lucas was okay at writing roguish dialogue. Also the only reason romance kinda works in the OT, because it plays off Han's charm. Imagine a Luke/anyone romance).

I'm just really glad the TFA honeymoon is over. Worst SW film by a mile. Well made, ruinous plot.

I guess it's been like a year now since I've seen it, and I still think only Empire is a better movie. It's ANH redone, sure, but redone better.

 

[Vanillalite]

The story premise fleshed out in both the EIII novelization by Matt Stover as well as the direct prequel novel by James Luceno paint a compelling picture.

The movie itself has issues though. Cheesy lines. Not enough explanation on how Palp played the long game on Ani. Not enough explanation on how Yoda finally admits the Jedi failed nor does it bring in how Qui had made great strides using the force.

It's also way over acted.

The base premise is really compelling in the two novels though.

 

[Koyuga]

It's certainly better than The Force Awakens, at the very least.

 

[RareFantasy64]

I think you misunderstood TFA, especially if you don't realize that Kylo Ren mistakenly idolizing Darth Vader is entirely the point.

That's true. I see what you are saying

 

[TheRedSnifit]

The prequels are some of the worst big-budget movies ever made. They make Suicide Squad look like Mad Max: Fury Road by comparison.

I am incapable of respecting the opinions of people who think the prequels are anything but trash and the worst SW films.

 

[opoth]

I'm just really glad the TFA honeymoon is over. Worst SW film by a mile. Well made, ruinous plot.

That's pretty much just a GAF thing, or maybe an internet forum thing. Don't know anyone personally who didn't greatly enjoy it. Best Star Wars since 1980.

With regard to ROTS, it's got it's cheese but I like it more than ROTJ. Both movies occupy an interesting position in their respective trilogies, ROTJ gets by on the good will of the first 2 films and ROTS gets beat on more because of the other 2 films in its trilogy.

 

[Ekai]

It's the most tolerable of the prequel movies but...good???????

 

[Corronchilejano]

It's the most entertaining of the prequels.

I wouldn't recommend it to anyone though.

 

[Timu]

I'm just really glad the TFA honeymoon is over. Worst SW film by a mile. Well made, ruinous plot.

Sorry, Attack of the Clones still exist.

I'm watching it now and it's torture!!!

 

[Not]

While we're at it, after rewatching it last year, The Phantom Menace is just incredibly mediocre as a film. I'm fairly certain its reputation as a terrible SW movie stems purely out of the gargantuan disappointment it was to people in 1999, which I wouldn't blame people for.

https://www.getyarn.io/yarn-clip/bcff3edd-be95-46ae-9bc4-09eb94217f33

 

[MetatronM]

Well the Auralnauts version of Episode III is pretty good, at least.

 

[RyougaSaotome]

They've been playing the prequels a bunch this week on TV and so I've had the...joy of seeing Sith multiple times in the background while I do other things.

If anything, I think it has aged even worse than I initially thought. Not only do the long dialogue sequences either walking down a CG hall or sitting in a room on a couch look worse than ever before, the overall cinematography in the film is garbage. When you take a step back from the colorful CG tryin to distract you, the film is shot like poo.

 

[Sheroking]

People who think that TFA is worse than any of the prequels are like people who thought Batman v Superman was worse than Batman & Robin.

I find you silly. Like, no real person could seriously hold such a wacky opinion... right? Surely you can both hate a thing and still see it as being better executed than something almost unparalleled in it's awfulness.

 

[farisr]

I've been of the opinion that it's better than Return Of the Jedi for a while now, meaning my rankings so far are:

V > IV > VII > III > VI >>> I >>> II

 

[hardcastlemccormick]

Really?
I don't remember Han Solo being born a storm trooper and abandoning their ranks because he couldn't take it, along with ending the movie getting slashed in the back by Darth Vader
I don't remember Rey using the force to blow up Starkiller base
I don't remember Darth Vader trying to emulate his grandfather or remember him killing his own father and throwing him off a bridge
I don't remember Han and Luke stealing a ship to fight of pursuing Tie Fighters
I don't remember Luke and Han traveling through space only to be picked up by their enemies father that was smuggling aliens and caught up in some dirty dealings

And soooooooooo much more.
Fuck outta here with that paper thin argument

Yep, the TFA haters can take a hike. Prequels are bad, OT trilogy is great and TFA is right there next to them.

 

[VeryGooster]

I'm saying this as someone who will voluntarily watch ROTS on repeat viewing: it's still not a good movie.

I love the Mustafar fight. I honestly prefer "Battle of the Heroes" to "Duel of the Fates." Hell I think most of the movie's action scenes are at least decent. I appreciate Ian McDiarmid having the goddamned time of his life in the movie. And if it weren't for the rest of the movie undermining it the literal building and introduction of Darth Vader is honestly chilling.

The rest of the movie is so dumb. Its attempts at politics is hollow. Horrible script even by Star Wars standards. The actual process of Anakin going to the Dark Side and Padmé's ensuing death is laughable as hell.

It's just the least worst prequel, really.

 

[Horse Detective]

I've been of the opinion that it's better than Return Of the Jedi for a while now, meaning my rankings so far are:

V > IV > VII > III > VI >>> I >>> II

Return of the Jedi has the coolest lightsaber duel of the entire series though.

 

[Ekai]

It's the most entertaining of the prequels.

I wouldn't recommend it to anyone though.

You probably didn't mean it but this post made me think of that RLM bit about it "being the darkest of the three."

Return of the Jedi has the coolest lightsaber duel of the entire series though.

Easily the most symbolic lightsaber duel that's for sure.
RotJ has always been one of my favorites of the series. : P

 

[Schlorgan]

You probably didn't mean it but this post made me think of that RLM bit about it "being the darkest of the three."

Who cares if it's dark?! My stool is dark!

 

[Bronx-Man]

The prequels are shit, Force Awakens is a mediocre remake, and Return of the Jedi drops the ball for the OT.

Face it people, this is a franchise with as many good movies as Captain America.

 

[Sheroking]

I've been of the opinion that it's better than Return Of the Jedi for a while now, meaning my rankings so far are:

V > IV > VII > III > VI >>> I >>> II

This is pretty close to how I feel. I'd probably say VI = III.

That being said, I'd say Empire is the only actually great film of the bunch, ANH is solid and the rest range from "bad" to "holy fucking shit".

 

[Davide]

The rest of the movie is so dumb. Horrible script even by Star Wars standards. The actual process of Anakin going to the Dark Side and Padmé's ensuring death is laughable as hell.
.

Lucas actually changed his entire motivation for turning to the dark side after shooting the entire movie (principal photography).

No joke.

 

[norm9]

Return of the Jedi has the coolest lightsaber duel of the entire series though.

And the best space battle.

TFA fans are just undercover Abrams fanboys.

 

[richiek]

I have to say, the theme of a democracy turning into a dictatorship was extremely timely back when ROTS was released during the Bush era and it seems even more timely now:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DgxZr6LLS34

 

[Heroman]

Return of the Jedi has the coolest lightsaber duel of the entire series though.