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It All Began With... Kingdom Hearts Birth by Sleep |OT|
- Thread starter Jeels
- Start date
Fimbulvetr
Member
Rez said:
Yes.
It's a much better game.
Urban Scholar said:
Did you equip all her action commands. She has one where she teleports behind an opponent if you press square at the last second before an attack.
ShockingAlberto said:
Or block/counter and Twisted Hours.
TheChillyAcademic
Member
So just beat the game, with the secret ending and as per usual at the end of KH games, I have a shit ton of questions.
Hmmm.
Good Times.
1. It has been mentioned before that Xehanort retained no real memories from Terra or Master Xehanort. Why is it then that Xemnas remembers Aqua when he visits the Room of Sleep?
2. Interesting that the reason Xemnas puts an X into each of the nobodies names because of Master Xehanort's fascination with the X-Blade.
3. So before dying, Ventus puts his heart, so to speak, into Sora. Is this why Sora is the wielder of the Keyblade? And the power that Terra gave to Riku, was that darkness?
4. I didn't quite understand why, during the scene in Radiant Garden where Ansem the Wise is leading Zexion past Apprentice Xehanort and Braig, he turns around. I mean I guess in effect he is able to sense the darkness in Xehanort but its isn't as if this was ever a deterrent. He happily assisted the other Apprentices in betraying Ansem the Wise.
5. Do we know EXACTLY how Radiant Garden was destroyed? The destruction didn't kill The Apprentices, they choose control of the heartless and became nobodies by their own accord but I have to wonder at what point it went from Radiant Garden to Hollow Bastion in KH I to Hollow Bastion in KH II.
6. So Ventus is sleeping in The Room of Repose. Is he STILL there? Xemnas never found the room in Castle Oblivion though its hinted that he knew it was there....somewhere.
7. I'm assuming that when we see Ventus and Terra at The Land of Departure this is...what, heaven? Or is it, more likely, what Ven is dreaming of?
8. Interesting to note that Ansem The Wise isn't dead nor Aqua. When the keyblades saved her in the Realm of Darkness I wonder what brought them about.
9. Do they ever explain specifically what it is Axel and Saix plan to do when they go to Ansem's Castle?
10. I'm also assuming that when it says Reconnect: Kingdom Hearts at the end, its a reference to Coded?
2. Interesting that the reason Xemnas puts an X into each of the nobodies names because of Master Xehanort's fascination with the X-Blade.
3. So before dying, Ventus puts his heart, so to speak, into Sora. Is this why Sora is the wielder of the Keyblade? And the power that Terra gave to Riku, was that darkness?
4. I didn't quite understand why, during the scene in Radiant Garden where Ansem the Wise is leading Zexion past Apprentice Xehanort and Braig, he turns around. I mean I guess in effect he is able to sense the darkness in Xehanort but its isn't as if this was ever a deterrent. He happily assisted the other Apprentices in betraying Ansem the Wise.
5. Do we know EXACTLY how Radiant Garden was destroyed? The destruction didn't kill The Apprentices, they choose control of the heartless and became nobodies by their own accord but I have to wonder at what point it went from Radiant Garden to Hollow Bastion in KH I to Hollow Bastion in KH II.
6. So Ventus is sleeping in The Room of Repose. Is he STILL there? Xemnas never found the room in Castle Oblivion though its hinted that he knew it was there....somewhere.
7. I'm assuming that when we see Ventus and Terra at The Land of Departure this is...what, heaven? Or is it, more likely, what Ven is dreaming of?
8. Interesting to note that Ansem The Wise isn't dead nor Aqua. When the keyblades saved her in the Realm of Darkness I wonder what brought them about.
9. Do they ever explain specifically what it is Axel and Saix plan to do when they go to Ansem's Castle?
10. I'm also assuming that when it says Reconnect: Kingdom Hearts at the end, its a reference to Coded?
Hmmm.
Good Times.
TheChillyAcademic
Member
Oh and..
Who the HELL is the mysterious Figure?
DualShadow
Member
TheChillyAcademic said:
I thought I had seen the secret ending video but I don't recall 1 or 2?
For 3, thats what I assumed since
None of the other 3 gave him the power like Terra did to Riku, so i guess since Ven had the power it transferred to Sora?
6 and 7 i would like to know as well.
For 8 i thought they were
Ven and Terra's keyblades so I assume it was the power of friendship and all that stuff :lol that saved Aqua.
Kinda messy response sorry.
Fimbulvetr
Member
TheChillyAcademic said:
1) He remembered eventually, the end.
3) No, he gave Riku the ability to use a Keyblade, just like Aqua accidentally did to Kairi.
6) Yeah, Ven is still there.
3) No, he gave Riku the ability to use a Keyblade, just like Aqua accidentally did to Kairi.
6) Yeah, Ven is still there.
TheChillyAcademic said:
The only thing we know is that it involves
time travel.
Yes, one of the most convoluted stories in VG history is about to add time travel.
Yes, one of the most convoluted stories in VG history is about to add time travel.
Fimbulvetr
Member
MAtgS said:
Yeah, but now it's going to have major plot focus instead of just being part of a world.
Pureauthor
Member
After playing through CoM another time:
Nobodies being 'emotionless' is the biggest load of bullcrockery ever.
Nobodies being 'emotionless' is the biggest load of bullcrockery ever.
mugurumakensei
Member
Pureauthor said:
Well, it was kind of obvious with Kingdom Hearts 2. Axel clearly had emotions as he was very close to Roxas.
To be fair, Ansem does make an apology sort of to Roxas. I think Ansem realized by the end that Nobodies do have emotions. After all, they exist only because of the strength of their hearts when their original bodies were turned into heartless.
SpeedySwaf
Member
Hmm, the impression I got was that they act based upon how they remembered themselves. They don't "feel" something, so much as remembering how they'd act before.
There were also the scenes in 358/2 that happened after the events of CoM. I think Roxas was the only one really distressed about what happened: the others simply took it in stride, with the most emotion coming from Demyx, who was just annoyed because it meant more work for him.
There were also the scenes in 358/2 that happened after the events of CoM. I think Roxas was the only one really distressed about what happened: the others simply took it in stride, with the most emotion coming from Demyx, who was just annoyed because it meant more work for him.
mugurumakensei
Member
SpeedySwaf said:
They certainly felt fear and sadness as showcased by some of their deaths. Aside from Xemnas, I don't think any of them were truly emotionless. Some were cruel yes. However, you can still have emotions even if you're personality is abrasive to say the least. Moreover, for most of the members, I think being complete again was the larger more important goal. So, they took the losses in stride as they continued on with their plans.
TheChillyAcademic
Member
Pureauthor said:
The Organization Nobodies were special, specifically because they were able to retain their human form as well as their memories from life in Radiant Garden. Of course, not all of the Organization members are from Radiant Garden but I'm certain, sadly, we'll never know their true stories.
DualShadow said:
Well...
1. Its made reference in game and in the BBS Ultimania that Apprentice Xehanort wakes up without either Terra or Master Xehanort's memories. Supposedly he retains some of their personality traits (none of which include being able to wield a keyblade) as well as MX's intelligence.
Thinking about my own question now...when speaking to Zexion in Hollow Bastion (or is it The Castle that Never Was?) Xigbar mentions that Apprentice Xehonart and later Xemnas goes to the Room of Awakening from time to time and talks to himself. We all know now he's actually speaking (rhetorically or otherwise) to Aqua's armor and ME's keyblade. However its mentioned that when on the throne he is able to slowly regain the memories of both Terra and MX...interesting.
I also have to wonder where the hell Terra and MX are now that:
Apprentice Xehanort is dead
Xemnas is "dead"
Ansem is mostly dead.
There is no physical body for them to inhabit though I suppose they may be living deep within the heart of hearts.
Thinking about my own question now...when speaking to Zexion in Hollow Bastion (or is it The Castle that Never Was?) Xigbar mentions that Apprentice Xehonart and later Xemnas goes to the Room of Awakening from time to time and talks to himself. We all know now he's actually speaking (rhetorically or otherwise) to Aqua's armor and ME's keyblade. However its mentioned that when on the throne he is able to slowly regain the memories of both Terra and MX...interesting.
I also have to wonder where the hell Terra and MX are now that:
Apprentice Xehanort is dead
Xemnas is "dead"
Ansem is mostly dead.
There is no physical body for them to inhabit though I suppose they may be living deep within the heart of hearts.
Fimbulvetr said:
I have to wonder why Dark Riku looks so similar to Vanitas though.
TheChillyAcademic
Member
mugurumakensei said:
While I agree with most of what you said, I'd have to disagree to a certain extent. The Apprentices knew what they were doing when they explored darkness in their experiments as well as willingly gave their bodies up to become nobodies. While I know that they eventually wanted their bodies back, I don't think that was the overall goal, especially those Org. Members who had nothing to do with Ansem the Wise and Master Xehanort.
badcrumble
Member
I wonder if they'll end up bringing back the 'normal' versions of all of Organization XIII. Certainly I'd suspect
might return, at the very least. Obviously
and it's pretty clear that
. But what about the rest? I mean, for the love of god, never ever bring the human version of Demyx back, ever.
Braig and Lea
Xehanort is likely restored in some form since his Heartless and Nobody have both been destroyed, although it's possible in theory that he's been re-split into Terra and Master Xehanort already
Roxas probably isn't coming back so much as Ven's heart will be returned to his body
Fimbulvetr
Member
TheChillyAcademic said:
Pretty sure Nomura said that when both a nobody and heartless are "killed" eventually they will return as a whole being.
TheChillyAcademic said:
It's just armor.... and fanservice.
TheChillyAcademic
Member
badcrumble said:
Well...the Nobodies
are dead so...
Fimbulvetr said:
What? The body is destroyed and without a heart, so its a heartless. The Nobody is destroyed and there isn't anything left. If that was the case the Org. Members could just kill themselves to start to restore their beings.
Pureauthor
Member
No, Nomura said the specific order is that the Heartless must be destroyed so their Heart goes to Kingdom Hearts, and then the Nobody destroyed so whatever is leftover 'may' meet up on the way (read: everyone is coming back except the ones the fans don't like) and be reborn.
TheChillyAcademic
Member
Pureauthor said:
Has there been a case of this happening in the story outside of Kairi and Sora? So the Organization XIII members are going to be reborn? lol
Fimbulvetr
Member
TheChillyAcademic said:
Nobodies can't die because they technically were never alive in the first place. They just fade back between light and dark.
Pureauthor
Member
Short answer: Because HEART POWER dammit.
Fimbulvetr
Member
Pureauthor said:
Don't forget light, that's the most important thing.
mugurumakensei
Member
Fimbulvetr said:
And the darkness cause the light exists.
TheChillyAcademic
Member
Hmmmm.
Seems odd to me.
Seems odd to me.
mugurumakensei
Member
TheChillyAcademic said:
What's not odd about Kingdom Hearts? Besides Axel/Lea is definitely coming back. I wouldn't be suprised if Isa does too.
I just want Larxene back.
badcrumble
Member
Basically Nomura's giving himself an opening to further fanservice if need be. Birth By Sleep strongly suggests that he's getting more and more interested in populating the Kingdom Hearts games with a sort of semi-permanent Kingdom Hearts cast, and less and less interested in substituting for that with borrowed Final Fantasy characters.TheChillyAcademic said:
Well, regarding Braig,Peff said:
he may or may not be Master Xehanort's other 'backup plan,' but it sure as hell seems like Master Xehanort promised him that he'd make him a Keyblade wielder
TheChillyAcademic
Member
Well we know KH3 or whatever the hell variant Nomura decides to call it, will end The Xehonart Saga once and for all. While its all too clear that Axel will be back, I too would love to see some of the other members return as well.
EVEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
What, Braig's
EVEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Peff said:
What, Braig's
eyes? Its obvious he must be MX other contingency plan.
TheChillyAcademic
Member
Jeels said:
Ah the memories!
Well. My quest to work my way up to BBS is going well.
KH1 on expert is done, including the secret ending.
I'm on day #257 or so in 358/2 Days (proud).
And I'm about 5 worlds into Re: Chain of Memories, also on proud.
For the first time, I think I've got more KH behind me than ahead!
Surprisingly not burnt out yet!
KH1 on expert is done, including the secret ending.
I'm on day #257 or so in 358/2 Days (proud).
And I'm about 5 worlds into Re: Chain of Memories, also on proud.
For the first time, I think I've got more KH behind me than ahead!
Surprisingly not burnt out yet!
TheChillyAcademic
Member
Mejilan said:
Yeah...you aren't playing the Final Mix Versions of KH or KH II?
Hmmm. =/
TheChillyAcademic
Member
Mejilan said:
I would suggest MOST EMPHATICALLY, to going to a place like KH vids at some point and take a look at all of the scenes you'll have missed in Final Mix and FM +. Be sure and stay away from spoilers as well though.
And yes, the scenes have been sub'd.
So impressions.
-Definitely the best Kingdom Hearts game, period. The only reason KH1 would seem better to me would be because I were looking at it through nostalgia goggles, which is understandable considering how novel of a concept it was back then.
-The worlds are going by real quick, 8 hours in and already at Radiant Garden. I have to say though I'm not as disappointed with the pacing here like I was with KH2, which I always considered to have piss poor pacing compared to what I considered to be perfection in KH1. Maybe it's because I already know I'm only getting 1/3rd of the story.
-The command board is a great diversion. Makes me want a full fledged Itadaki Street to be published here.
-Slightly more difficult then I expected critical to be, so I am mostly happy on that front. Although I just realized I haven't been abusing my cure, so we'll see how that goes.
-The story is really really interesting to me, I don't know why. I feel like even the Disney worlds are somewhat starting to contribute again.
-Command board is a great idea. Game feels much less button mashy.
-Definitely the best Kingdom Hearts game, period. The only reason KH1 would seem better to me would be because I were looking at it through nostalgia goggles, which is understandable considering how novel of a concept it was back then.
-The worlds are going by real quick, 8 hours in and already at Radiant Garden. I have to say though I'm not as disappointed with the pacing here like I was with KH2, which I always considered to have piss poor pacing compared to what I considered to be perfection in KH1. Maybe it's because I already know I'm only getting 1/3rd of the story.
-The command board is a great diversion. Makes me want a full fledged Itadaki Street to be published here.
-Slightly more difficult then I expected critical to be, so I am mostly happy on that front. Although I just realized I haven't been abusing my cure, so we'll see how that goes.
-The story is really really interesting to me, I don't know why. I feel like even the Disney worlds are somewhat starting to contribute again.
-Command board is a great idea. Game feels much less button mashy.
TheChillyAcademic
Member
Mejilan said:
Whoa whoa whoa...
Are you playing COM or Re:COM?
I'd have to say that while I have enjoyed BBS, KH II FM+ is without a doubt the best title in series, followed VERY CLOSELY by Re:COM
Pureauthor
Member
TheChillyAcademic said:
Any game that uses KH2 as a base cannot be the best game in the KH series. The gameplay in KH2 was atrocious.
TheChillyAcademic
Member
Pureauthor said:
Incorrect.
While the battle system wasn't nearly as fluid as it is in BBS, BBS is about 23x easier than both Proud KH FM and KH II FM +. Especially if you compare BBS' MF to FM + Lingering Spirit.
However in the end, the narrative (once fixed and actually complete) in FM+ is what sealed the deal for me.
TheChillyAcademic
Member
Peff said:
FM+ had more Organization XIII
Pureauthor
Member
Difficulty is not a primary factor in deciding the quality of a game.
'S far as I'm concerned, both BbS and KH2 are about equal in difficulty (which is to say: they are not difficult). However boss fights in KH2 are far more tedious, and generally just less well designed. That's not even getting into the awfulness of worlds like Port Royal or Pride Lands.
While the MF is indeed a terrible boss fight (and it has nothing to do with it's 'difficulty') it's a single bonus boss, and anyway VLS is a far better fight than both MF and LS. It can't be used as a determinant of the overall quality of the game.
As for the narrative - spare me. I've been through all of the 'extended' plot points in KH2 and if anything it just makes the overarching plot that much dumber.
TheChillyAcademic
Member
Pureauthor said:
The quality of a game is absolutely down to opinion.
Do you know what I dislike about BBS? I hate the letter B. Its absolutely awful.
Do you know what I love about FM+? I love math and the + sign reminds me of a math problem.
Make sense?
Not in the least, but that's the point.
I simply enjoyed FM+ more, I'm not saying you have to or anyone has to. The fact of the matter is that whatever YOU may find to be pointless in the added narrative or battles are the same reasons I liked it so much. Opinions.
Oh and the Data Battles whoop VLS in terms of fun ANY DAY.
On that note, I'm not going to apologize over how much I'm enjoying Days! :lol
It's like everything that Crisis Chore tried to be and utterly failed at.
And as much as Re: CoM is mechanically better than the original CoM, it kind of loses a lot by not being portable.
It's like everything that Crisis Chore tried to be and utterly failed at.
And as much as Re: CoM is mechanically better than the original CoM, it kind of loses a lot by not being portable.
Fimbulvetr
Member
TheChillyAcademic said:
All FM+ did was add extra diversions, the main gameplay remained bad.
TheChillyAcademic said:
Fixed? You mean they removed the icecream keyhole?
Pureauthor
Member
Mejilan said:
The ultimate reason Re:CoM is better than CoM is because it has Lord of the Castle as the final boss music.
Also Bloo voices Marluxia.
TheChillyAcademic
Member
Mejilan said:
Yeah I enjoyed Days a lot more than I thought I would. I always felt the CO Organization Members were the more interesting ones however.