EmCeeGramr
Member
No, because they hadn't even met her yet.
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JoJo's Bizarre Adventure: Diamond is Unbreakable OT What a Beautiful Duwang
- Thread starter Tizoc
- Start date
I was reminded earlier, but thanks. And as stated earlier, Yukako may have tipped Kira off on Aya in the manga during the Cinderella story.
As an aside, it was funny that here Josuke used the Crazy Diamond trick on his hand to track down Kira like so many people wanted him to use on the button of the jacket. (You could argue it would be harder to track a button than a hand but even still I'd argue tracking a hand is hard in itself)
I forgot about this but yeah that still bothers me. How did Hazama or Akira know all they did about Jotaro? There should be no easily accessible and public record of the events of Part III. Just from cultural osmosis I knew Kira was the main villain of Part IV but I didn't know too much more than that. Given how the early segments of Part IV played out, I had thought Keichi, Hazama and Akira were all part of like a hierarchical organization that share information they received from above. As just a group of generally isolated stand users, a lot of their actions and motivations (at least for the last two) don't make a lot of sense. Maybe things will change when I finish Part IV but I feel a lot of plot threads introduced near the start or middle of the season just kind of went nowhere.
There's no reason to come to Aya unless you know what her Stand does because no regular plastic surgeon is going to be able to completely rework your face in a matter of minutes while you are under pursuit.
But that's the thing - he knows so little about all those people and all those things but he knows all about Aya and Yukako? That doesn't make much sense.
Huh. I recall a lot of manga readers applauded that swap but maybe doing so actually hurt the narrative slightly?
I forgot about this but yeah that still bothers me. How did Hazama or Akira know all they did about Jotaro? There should be no easily accessible and public record of the events of Part III. Just from cultural osmosis I knew Kira was the main villain of Part IV but I didn't know too much more than that. Given how the early segments of Part IV played out, I had thought Keichi, Hazama and Akira were all part of like a hierarchical organization that share information they received from above. As just a group of generally isolated stand users, a lot of their actions and motivations (at least for the last two) don't make a lot of sense. Maybe things will change when I finish Part IV but I feel a lot of plot threads introduced near the start or middle of the season just kind of went nowhere.
There's no reason to come to Aya unless you know what her Stand does because no regular plastic surgeon is going to be able to completely rework your face in a matter of minutes while you are under pursuit.
But that's the thing - he knows so little about all those people and all those things but he knows all about Aya and Yukako? That doesn't make much sense.
Huh. I recall a lot of manga readers applauded that swap but maybe doing so actually hurt the narrative slightly?
Mr. Smiley
Member
wew
Imperial Bishop
Banned
hosannainexcelsis
Member
If you're the type of person to sit around and try to piece together a reconstruction of everything the author doesn't show us in a story, Jojo is not the work for you.
EmCeeGramr
Member
I'm pretty sure it was Keicho who told them.
It was several days between Shigechi's death and going to the tailor, it's totally possible Kira was spying on some of the characters and even visited Cinderella in that time.
Garmonbozia
Member
Man, it felt good seeing those 2 punks humiliating Kira.
Imperial Bishop
Banned
The thing with Aya is pretty shaky. If Kira was that determined to stalk and spy on everyone, he would have been found out a lot sooner since most of them don't use their stands all the time.
Or.......or I can continue to enjoy a show and celebrate what it does well and criticize what I think it does poorly. I'd call these more unforced errors - they don't at all ruin the show but minor plotholes and contrivances that don't need to exist don't need to be excused.
Was it ever explained how he knew and I forgot? I don't think it ever was. I dunno, I'm just kind of disappointed at how completely unrelated the plot-line that connected those three is totally separate from the Kira plotline. I'm sure we haven't heard the last of the arrow but just dumping it aside for so long seems weird. I also feel like Hazama was a character that didn't need to exist at all and literally all Akira has done and seems likely ever to do was kill Keicho. I was expecting hype shit for the Red Hot Chilli Pepper plotline and it ended in a fucking dud!
I really can't make sense of it.
Mr. Smiley
Member
Hazamada is literally the reason why the Rohan arc happens, what?
-Whoops misread the quote
Here's a quote from an article doing a sort of "profile" of Araki (I'd link it but it covers some events from future parts) and I feel is relevant to the discussion at hand.
In this case, Araki wanted Kira to get away despite having been beaten wholeheartedly, and the only way to do that successfully (while also keeping him as an antagonist) was to have him use Aya's Stand to switch identities with someone and have the group start over from 0 again.
And it works wonderfully, because Kira's introduction -> Kira just wants a Quiet Life -> Sheer Heart Attack and his escape play out so quickly, even with the original order as present in the manga.
It leaves the reader/viewer unsatisfied and very drawn into the story, because they feel the same feelings as the characters upon his escape as well.
In this case, Araki wanted Kira to get away despite having been beaten wholeheartedly, and the only way to do that successfully (while also keeping him as an antagonist) was to have him use Aya's Stand to switch identities with someone and have the group start over from 0 again.
And it works wonderfully, because Kira's introduction -> Kira just wants a Quiet Life -> Sheer Heart Attack and his escape play out so quickly, even with the original order as present in the manga.
It leaves the reader/viewer unsatisfied and very drawn into the story, because they feel the same feelings as the characters upon his escape as well.
Snakethesniper
Member
I hope Act 3 is more than "gravity". I mean, it's cool, but seems also a step down from Act 2. It was cooler!
hosannainexcelsis
Member
I just think that trying to hold up the fine points of Jojo to detailed logical analysis is completely missing the point. I don't think Araki (or the anime adaptation) stopping to make sure every aspect is carefully explained and the plot is tightly connected in every individual episode would improve the work at all. It works on a much looser level of character back and forth, and individual personalities clashing off each other. I think if you're after meticulously constructed logical stories you'd be better served by looking at a Golden Age mystery author such as John Dickson Carr. And really, with all the plot holes in Jojo as a series, Kira knowing facts about Josuke and his crew is just about the least significant loose end.
Amen to that. The English VA is gonna have a tough act to follow.
BinaryPork2737
Unconfirmed Member
He only knows about them and that they're close to the other Stand users. Love Deluxe isn't brought up, so he likely has no idea what Yukako's Stand is or what it does. The only thing that he knows about Yukako is that she's involved with Koichi and has been to the salon. He doesn't even know for sure that the two are Stand users until he meets Koichi, which is why he goes "oh, Yukako and that one woman are what you guys call Stand users, too, right?". Kira probably put two and two together and figured out that her Stand power involved something similar to plastic surgery due to her advertisements.
Not really. I think the time frame between Shigechi's death and SHA are the same in the anime and manga. The only thing that would be different is that Aya wouldn't appear in the group meet up, so anime viewers would have to assume that Koichi tells her about fatty's death off-screen like manga readers had to do. Putting the Cinderella episode before Killer Queen's introduction makes Kira's arc flow better and doesn't leave viewers with a sense of mood whiplash when the episode following a kid's death is all about love.
I don't think he would have been found out so soon while spying on the group. The guy is a serial killer that has evaded the police for like 15 years. He's had tons of practice with stalking people.
Totally did not see the ending coming despite being spoiled on, and somewhat confused by, Kira's makeover. While it's a great ending, it also explains why Cinderella's arc was so bad.
Aside from the badly drawn shots I hated how almost-dead Jotaro stands up just in time to be a badass. Otherwise the episode was great (the socks, oh god the socks).
Aside from the badly drawn shots I hated how almost-dead Jotaro stands up just in time to be a badass. Otherwise the episode was great (the socks, oh god the socks).
Same, but I'm not getting my hopes up.
Sibersk Esto
Banned
anime time
How does DIO go on a 2 minute long monologue, and only 5 seconds have passed in the frozen time?
MetroidPrimeRib
Banned
Act 3 is lamer then Act 2. Thankfully Koichi doesn't loose access to Act 2 or Act 1. Act 2 is one of the most interesting Stands in the series, its ability is so good.
I don't really see any plot holes here lol. He knows about Josuke and where he goes to school. He can track them for a few days. (In the manga Cinderella is after Shigechi's death too so that's how he knows about Aya) He's not going to know about Jotaro because Jotaro isn't in school with Josuke. It's a bit contrived but only barely and who cares. I guess we could just end the part here to make some possible minor plot holes disappear.
Talking is a free action.
You could have easily rewritten it to not need Hazamada (whereas Aya or someone like her is clearly required if you want Kira to both have his identity reveal but still be able to hide in Morioh). Like Koichi already knew of Rohan and was a fan. Just change the manner in which he runs into Rohan and you're good to go. So far (maybe he has big role later), Hazamada has contributed very little to the overall narrative.
Eh I'm sure some people consider it a feature, I'd consider it a bug :/
I mean if your argument is "don't complain about this becuse Jojo has done worse" well......I've almost certainly complained about those things too. For example it pissed me off that people just started flying in the final battle of Part III, especially compared to how it was done in the OVA. The bit with DIO's coffin also annoys me (and so on). Like "I can't believe how crazy this manga is" and "dotting all your I's" aren't mutually exclusive. Oda and One Piece seem to not have an issue with this.
MillionStabs
Banned
*Koichi gets severed beat down upon*
*Punched through the chest*
*Bleeds out for several minutes*
"Josuke, Koichi isn't breathing, but he's alive!"
*Punched through the chest*
*Bleeds out for several minutes*
"Josuke, Koichi isn't breathing, but he's alive!"
Killer Queen
Banned
"You sure?"
"Yeah man, he's missing both lungs, 2/3rds of his ribcage and part of his heart but like, don't even worry about it. He's good"
That's my head canon too, but how did Keicho know. Nearly no one even knew Dio could stop time, no one was there to witness their fight and Jotaro himself said he never used the power since the fight.
He probably told Polnareff and Pol Pol told half the world. Or Speedwagon Foundation knew for research purposes and it leaked.
hosannainexcelsis
Member
That's not my argument. It's more that, if this stuff bothers you so much, I'm surprised you're still watching. I certainly can't comment on the world building of One Piece, since I've experienced so little of it, but in general I find "explanation" to be a bad thing in a narrative. I dislike the treatment of Nen in Hunter X Hunter, for instance. It tends to be worthless fluff that bogs down the storytelling.
In this particular situation, I find Kira's knowledge completely plausible and even on the logical "dot all your i's" level can't sympathize with any of your concerns.
Imperial Bishop
Banned
I don't know. I'd assume that they wouldn't let themselves be followed around like that so easily, but then I realized that not all of them are as meticulous and as aware of their surroundings as Jotaro and Josuke.
Act 1 and 2 were the best because they looked like Cell.
MetroidPrimeRib
Banned
Wouldn't be surprised if there was a Japanese onomatopoeia for "the sound of time stopping"
SENPAIatLARGE
Banned
No, but if the games are indicative of anything, he can write
ORAORAORA and you get rushed punched if you touch it.
What about "WUUUUUUB!!!!!"?
Wait, do Hazamada, Keicho and Otoioshi ever mention Star Platinum's time stop?
I can't recall it. Keicho must have known through his father about DIO's demise and the Joestars, coming to the conclusion that Jotaro killed him and so he wanted our beloved marine biologist out of the way because he was too scared about confronting such a level of threat. He then told the others about it.
I can't recall it. Keicho must have known through his father about DIO's demise and the Joestars, coming to the conclusion that Jotaro killed him and so he wanted our beloved marine biologist out of the way because he was too scared about confronting such a level of threat. He then told the others about it.
EmCeeGramr
Member
Crocodile once we get to the parts where coherently explaining the rules of certain Stands becomes difficult because they seem to do whatever, Araki starts changing main character's appearances or even genders after their introduction with no explanation, or we get to a mystery where major plot threads are seemingly dropped without any reason and things start outright contradicting past clues you're going to lose your shit.
Unspeakable Evil
Member
Bah too late for this Joke.
But anyways gotta love how Kira refuses to take the L here.
"Just when they think they got the answers, I change the questions"
Imperial Bishop
Banned
MetroidPrimeRib
Banned
#protectourshorties
#stopimpalinglittlepeople
#stopimpalinglittlepeople
Blackquill
Member
great, i really don't like the second one
Immaculate
Banned
i would imagine if josuke was around in stardust crusaders, characters from part 3 wouldve survived too
The symbolism in it was perfect for the arc's we've had but now they know who the killer is it's run it's course.
I'd prefer a different ED though.