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[Silexx]

Will this help gutter_trash's dream of permanent Liberal Party control of Canada?

Sadly, yes. And say this as someone who votes Liberal.

 

[thelatestmodel]

Of all the disputes roiling Canada these days, there’s one thing on which the mainstream media unanimously agree: Kevin O’Leary is appalling. He’s a Trump-lite bully with no political experience and no qualifications to lead a major political party.

Take off eh

 

[Silexx]

Andrew Coyne has turned up the snark to 11, right now and that's saying something.

 

[Stumpokapow]

O'Leary apparently sent this letter to his supporters:

Did he mail it from America, the country he lives in and has presumably already returned to?

 

[killer rin]

Thank fucking god. Now we just have to make sure Leitch doesn't win and we are set

How different is Quebec French from France French? Is it just a dialect thing or more like the difference between Mexican and Castilian Spanish?

From what I understand its basically like the difference between North American, British and Oceanic English. The exact same language with different slang.

 

[Madness]

I'm happy about this.

Have you seen his positions in contrast to that of Bernier or Leitch? Bernier can barely speak english and will have a hard time capturing the Western canada vote that Harper got due to his Alberta roots etc. Let's see what happens.

 

[TheStruggler]

Canada got it right!

 

[chrisPjelly]

"But french is haaaaard"

Vehemently disagree with his politics, but at least he dropped out with his humanity intact. I hope this means he won't be awkwardly "nice" on Shark Tank anymore.

 

[SwipeLeftHoney]

He was going to lose anyways. Saved himself the embarrassment and left early..

 

[HarryKS]

The lack of French killed him. To say he was born in the province as well.

 

[Fuzzy]

Did he mail it from America, the country he lives in and has presumably already returned to?

Returned? He emailed the letter to a Canadian address and had it mailed from there.

 

[yyzjohn]

He was never serious. He's just a blowhard attention whore.

I thought the same thing. I never believed he was concerned for the future of Canada and Canadians..he only cares about his own money, of which he has enough.

 

[Apathy]

"But french is haaaaard"

Vehemently disagree with his politics, but at least he dropped out with his humanity intact. I hope this means he won't be awkwardly "nice" on Shark Tank anymore.

For once, the French language gave us something good.

 

[firehawk12]

So I wasted 15 bucks and became a Conservative for nothing! lol

 

[Fuzzy]

So I wasted 15 bucks and became a Conservative for nothing! lol

That money was always wasted.

 

[gutter_trash]

Will this help gutter_trash's dream of permanent Liberal Party control of Canada?

actually, Max is the Conservative candidate that could give the Liberals the most trouble in 2019

O'Leary couldn't speak French and was hyper condescending to Atlantic Canada.

Max on the other hand will get full support from Quebec City's Right-Wing trash radio; he is not a Social-Conservative and would be the Conservative candidate to get the most gains in the Province of Quebec

as opposed to the other CPC candiadtes who can't speak a word of French and are more Social-Conservative

 

[Volimar]

In written form it's exactly the same language. Even in oral form we can perfectly understand each other with 0 issue except for slang and a few expressions.

Any french person who moves to quebec will be able to understand pretty much everything after a few months and vice versa.

Thanks for the replies. Sorry it was slightly off topic but the post about him not wanting to learn French reminded me of Rachelle Lefevre talking about learning French though she knew Quebec French, but I guess she was talking about the dialect.

 

[Bonen no Max'd]

So I wasted 15 bucks and became a Conservative for nothing! lol

Leitch is still in to vote against.

 

[firehawk12]

That money was always wasted.

#ChongStrong

Leitch is still in to vote against.

Sure, but she's a joke candidate.

 

[matthewwhatever]

So I wasted 15 bucks and became a Conservative for nothing! lol

Still plenty of CPC candidates to vote against! Kellie Leitch has been endorsed by multiple white supremacist groups. Maxine Bernier wants to bring back the gold standard. Brad Trost is opposed to the existence of pride parades (or, as he put it, "the whole gay thing"); Andrew Scheer is too, but he's a little less vocal about it. Rick Peterson wants to bring in a flat tax.

Really, there's still a huge number of people in that field worth voting against, even with O'Leary out.

EDIT: Don't discount Leitch. She has a surprising amount of second-ballot support, and you shouldn't underestimate the number of closeted racists.

actually, Max is the Conservative candidate that could give the Liberals the most trouble in 2019

O'Leary couldn't speak French and was hyper condescending to Atlantic Canada.

Max on the other hand will get full support from Quebec City's Right-Wing trash radio; he is not a Social-Conservative and would be the Conservative candidate to get the most gains in the Province of Quebec

as opposed to the other CPC candiadtes who can't speak a word of French and are more Social-Conservative

But Bernier is also going to be fighting farmers (since he wants to end supply management and cozy up to Trump), old people (since he's against the principle of CPP), anyone who wants public healthcare, people with any understanding of the economy (since he's a goldbug), women in general. Bernier may be their best option, but he's going to be a disaster of a candidate.

 

[firehawk12]

^
Isn't Bernier just going to eat up all the second ballot support and win by default now?

 

[gutter_trash]

^
Isn't Bernier just going to eat up all the second ballot support and win by default now?

I don't see O'leary supporters going anywhere else but Max. They are not motivated by Social Issues but by Free Market Capitlism

 

[matthewwhatever]

^
Isn't Bernier just going to eat up all the second ballot support and win by default now?

He's certainly in a much better position to do that, for sure. I wouldn't count out Erin O'Toole or Andrew Scheer entirely -- Bernier is kind of abrasive, plus he holds some genuinely insane positions, and that may turn some people to the less divisive candidates.

 

[the1npc]

What is the gold standard? I watch the video but it was hard to hear with all the people in it talking

 

[Dolobill]

Thank fuck, this is the best news I've heard so far this year.

 

[Mr. Giggles]

The lack of French killed him. To say he was born in the province as well.

This.

Dude is from west-mount in Montreal

 

[firehawk12]

What is the gold standard? I watch the video but it was hard to hear with all the people in it talking

The old way of thinking about currency, where money is backed by gold reserves instead of... well, I guess nothing.

I don't see O'leary supporters going anywhere else but Max. They are not motivated by Social Issues but by Free Market Capitlism

He's certainly in a much better position to do that, for sure. I wouldn't count out Erin O'Toole or Andrew Scheer entirely -- Bernier is kind of abrasive, plus he holds some genuinely insane positions, and that may turn some people to the less divisive candidates.

Well, I'll still put my token vote to Chong I guess, if nothing else. lol
Ready to burn my card fast though and just buy an NDP membership to cleanse the soul (and vote there).

 

[CazTGG]

So I wasted 15 bucks and became a Conservative for nothing! lol

Leitch is still in and she has a chance.

 

[matthewwhatever]

Well, I'll still put my token vote to Chong I guess, if nothing else. lol
Ready to burn my card fast though and just buy an NDP membership to cleanse the soul (and vote there).

I'd say vote Chong, Raitt, and O'Toole, at least. If you just vote Chong, your ballot stops mattering entirely, whereas if you throw in Raitt and O'Toole, you at least give support that'll last a few more rounds.

And speaking of polls, I posted this in Canadian PoliGAF as well, but the latest Mainstreet Poll is interesting (which is the only poll that pulls from actual CPC members, rather than the general population): O'Leary actually grew above 25% this week (the first time in awhile), while Bernier fell to third, behind Scheer. They speculate that O'Leary drew voters from Bernier, and that there's overlap in their voter pool -- but even if the voters move over from O'Leary to Bernier en masse, he's still well short of the necessary majority.

 

[Parch]

Of course he's a clown but I never really believed he ever had a serious chance of being Prime Minister. Paranoid liberals put too much emphasis on conservative Canadians being lunatics. Canada is not the United States. Canada is a lot more centrist than some people want to believe, but you just can't stop the hyperbole.

 

[Bluenoser]

He was never serious. He's just a blowhard attention whore.

So was Trump, but unfortunately his ego kept him in it.

 

[LookAtMeGo]

Of course he's a clown but I never really believed he ever had a serious chance of being Prime Minister. Paranoid liberals put too much emphasis on conservative Canadians being lunatics. Canada is not the United States. Canada is a lot more centrist than some people want to believe, but you just can't stop the hyperbole.

What aboot Harper?

 

[Apathy]

Of course he's a clown but I never really believed he ever had a serious chance of being Prime Minister. Paranoid liberals put too much emphasis on conservative Canadians being lunatics. Canada is not the United States. Canada is a lot more centrist than some people want to believe, but you just can't stop the hyperbole.

He was polling rather high, so fears of conservative stupidity weren't unfounded.

 

[Azzanadra]

Lol what?

I mean...

lol what. I was actually kind of rooting for him because Trudeau would eat him alive in a general. Guess I am voting Chong then for the leadership!

 

[Silexx]

What aboot Harper?

Harper was so centrist it hurts.

 

[Apathy]

Harper was so centrist it hurts.

I think Harper was just smart and didn't want to fight fights he knew that there was no way to win. He probably does believe in marriage being between a man and woman, that abortions shouldn't be legal and all that crap but he knows that the country moved past those issues. He did keep the backbenchers quiet and suppressed during his time.

 

[Silexx]

I think Harper was just smart and didn't want to fight fights he knew that there was no way to win. He probably does believe in marriage being between a man and woman, that abortions shouldn't be legal and all that crap but he knows that the country moved past those issues. He did keep the backbenchers quiet and suppressed during his time.

It's entirely possible, but that the end of the day, I'm can only judge based on his record in governance and his policies were squarely in the center. Some even defied all tenets of conservatism.

Mind you, this isn't to say that this was 'good' or even 'bad'. I don't ascribed any value judgment on his policies based solely on their ideological penchants.

 

[CazTGG]

Harper was so centrist it hurts.

Centrism involves believing marijuana is worse than tobacco and constantly demonizing Canada's Muslim community? His environmental policy was assuredly right-wing with its massive deregulation.

 

[firehawk12]

I'd say vote Chong, Raitt, and O'Toole, at least. If you just vote Chong, your ballot stops mattering entirely, whereas if you throw in Raitt and O'Toole, you at least give support that'll last a few more rounds.

And speaking of polls, I posted this in Canadian PoliGAF as well, but the latest Mainstreet Poll is interesting (which is the only poll that pulls from actual CPC members, rather than the general population): O'Leary actually grew above 25% this week (the first time in awhile), while Bernier fell to third, behind Scheer. They speculate that O'Leary drew voters from Bernier, and that there's overlap in their voter pool -- but even if the voters move over from O'Leary to Bernier en masse, he's still well short of the necessary majority.

Yeah, I mean, that's where I'm putting my votes but even then, all three don't really have a chance...

Centrism involves believing marijuana is worse than tobacco and constantly demonizing Canada's Muslim community? His environmental policy was assuredly right-wing with its massive deregulation.

I think it's more that he avoided any real social issues entirely. The abortion boogeyman is still a thing, but Harper went out of his way to make sure that it was only a pet project of a backbench MP and not party policy.

 

[gutter_trash]

LOL, Stephen Harper was the most Right Wing Prime Minister in modern history...
gets labeled "Centrist" LOL

Harper yeah did play it "safe"as PM and used restraint and muzzled his MPs, but in his heart never changed

 

[Silexx]

Centrism involves believing marijuana is worse than tobacco and constantly demonizing Canada's Muslim community? His environmental policy was assuredly right-wing with its massive deregulation.

And then you can factor in his interventionist economic policies and continued support of supply side management policies and his overall record veers back to the center. Also, I think you need to be careful as to not confused his environmental policies with his environmental rhetoric.

 

[matthewwhatever]

Centrism involves believing marijuana is worse than tobacco and constantly demonizing Canada's Muslim community? His environmental policy was assuredly right-wing with its massive deregulation.

Alternatively, you could look at it like this: he only did the worst of it after he won his majority, and when he tried to be more conservative, he lost the next election. The anti-Muslim garbage really only came up during the 2015 election. Prior to that, he and his party tried pretty desperately to grow their base beyond old white people. Just Google "Jason Kenney rock star" -- they may not have been successful at it, but they were actively courting ethnic groups, in the hopes of breaking the Liberal stranglehold over those voters. He clearly abandoned that strategy in 2015, but I'd say that before then, he was keeping his GOP-style conservatism relatively well-hidden to the number of voters he needed to be successful.

 

[Phrozenflame500]

So then Bernier's probably got this then. Going to be an interesting election.

 

[FonkyByNature]

Good news !!!

 

[Meier]

I'm sure he's seen the right wing backlash throughout Europe as of late and realized his rhetoric probably won't work. Smart to quit before he gets embarrassed.

 

[insonator]

Maxime Bernier's pitch to win his riding back in 2015 can be heard here (in French)

Even without understanding any French you know this is beyond baffling

 

[Silexx]

Alternatively, you could look at it like this: he only did the worst of it after he won his majority, and when he tried to be more conservative, he lost the next election. The anti-Muslim garbage really only came up during the 2015 election. Prior to that, he and his party tried pretty desperately to grow their base beyond old white people. Just Google "Jason Kenney rock star" -- they may not have been successful at it, but they were actively courting ethnic groups, in the hopes of breaking the Liberal stranglehold over those voters. He clearly abandoned that strategy in 2015, but I'd say that before then, he was keeping his GOP-style conservatism relatively well-hidden to the number of voters he needed to be successful.

I would argue that they were successful at it. A big reason they made such inroads in Ontario, especially in the GTA, was because they successfully courted voters in largely Sikh and Hindu communities.

Then came the 2015 election and the CPC started seeing their base being disenfranchised that they ramped up the dog whistle politics and they effectively threw away all progress made with immigrant voters.

 

[matthewwhatever]

I would argue that they were successful at it. A big reason they made such inroads in Ontario, especially in the GTA, was because they successfully courted voters in largely Sikh and Hindu communities.

Then came the 2015 election and the CPC started seeing their base being disenfranchised that they ramped up the dog whistle politics and they effectively threw away all progress made with immigrant voters.

Yep. If it didn't come across in what I wrote, this is exactly what I was trying to say.


Paul Wells has a pretty characteristic take on what O'Leary's departure means:

'Leary's departure clarifies some things about the choices ahead for Conservatives, but I want to pause and offer some gentle questions to those Conservatives who have already spent time working to make him the next Conservative leader and who now find themselves bereft: What were you thinking? Which of his policies did you think was the wisest for ensuring Canada's prosperity? What was he saying that would have struck you as clever or insightful if it had not come from a semi-professional TV jerk?

And, most delicate: Was there any sense in which you were supporting this guy, not because you thought he would be good for Canada, but because some other rubes could be made to buy him? Because in nearly a quarter-century covering federal politics, I'm still amazed every time I see that instinct at work. This is the PT Barnum school of political strategy, and I'm here to tell you, even in the year of Donald Trump, that it fails far more often than it succeeds.

Enough of the loudmouth quitter. Onward: Is Maxime Bernier now the heir-presumptive? Maybe. This would be a remarkable outcome: handing the party of Stephen Harper to a man who believes that, on the scale of what's possible and needed to restrict the role of government in the nation's life, Harper did nothing significant. If Harperism was about a partial rehabilitation of social conservatism on one hand, and a steely incrementalism on the other, Bernier rejects both hands. On social questions he's a libertarian. On economic questions he has no interest in moving slowly. His selection would be an expression of deep frustration with the Harper legacy, by people who spent a decade helping to build that legacy. It'd be a fun experiment, to say the least.

If not Max, then who? Andrew Scheer (medium-right) and Erin O'Toole (rightish) have been fighting for the mantle of Harperite continuity. Each of their campaigns is sure they see a path to victory. The rest of the field is a mix of quirky gambles (maybe Conservatives want a carbon tax! Maybe Kellie Leitch isn't a self-animated golem!), social conservative proof-of-concept candidacies, and tragically misfiring former ambassadors, whom I won't name but, you know, Is-Chray Alexander-way.

 

[insonator]

Also, Maxime Bernier is known to have forgotten some highly sensitive national security documents at his ex-lover Julie Couillard's place, back in 2008.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/bernier-quits-cabinet-post-over-security-breach-1.723124

 

[Volimar]

Also, Maxime Bernier is known to have forgotten some highly sensitive national security documents at his ex-lover Julie Couillard's place, back in 2008.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/bernier-quits-cabinet-post-over-security-breach-1.723124

But her emails!

Wait, wrong country.