KILLZONE 2 - The |OT|
- Thread starter BruceLeeRoy
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Rapping Granny
Banned
Lince, you are seriously over reacting here, you make it sound like we're playing Socom Confrentation.
Lince said:
Dedicated server was most likely Sony call, I'm sure if GG had the option of using them they would have. But consider they probably had to go over budget due to Jack fuck up at E3 (2005?) Sony had to cut some cost. But either way a rendering engine is still the single most important investment ever, you can use that engine across several games and save millions of dollars in development cost. Sorry but focusing on the engine was the best call when you look at the big picture. Features can be patched and GG seems to be very good at supporting there product. You seem overly upset for no good reason as if KZ2 killed your puppy.
I'm just reacting, I like KZ2 mp a lot, even when I have to go through 6-7 unbalanced / rocket launcher party / lag fest games until I find something decent.
I think I've been spoiled by Warhawk and Resistance 2 online, that's all, I didn't expect KZ2 retail build to be this bad, even if "this bad" is acceptable to most people here, maybe it's time to easy down before I got banned for pointing out KZ2 flaws so frequently which I understand is a tad annoying for the average Joe here that always reply with "lag? framerate drops? check your PS3 dude" one-liners.
peace
I think I've been spoiled by Warhawk and Resistance 2 online, that's all, I didn't expect KZ2 retail build to be this bad, even if "this bad" is acceptable to most people here, maybe it's time to easy down before I got banned for pointing out KZ2 flaws so frequently which I understand is a tad annoying for the average Joe here that always reply with "lag? framerate drops? check your PS3 dude" one-liners.
peace
Lince said:I'm just reacting, I like KZ2 mp a lot, even when I have to go through 6-7 unbalanced / rocket launcher party / lag fest games until I find something decent.
I think I've been spoiled by Warhawk and Resistance 2 online, that's all, I didn't expect KZ2 retail build to be this bad, even if "this bad" is acceptable to most people here, maybe it's time to easy down before I got banned for pointing out KZ2 flaws so frequently which I understand is a tad annoying for the average Joe here that always reply with "lag? framerate drops? check your PS3 dude" one-liners.
peace
Why on earth would you still play if you thought it was so bad and others so superior? Doesn't make sense to me.
Lince said:I'm just reacting, I like KZ2 mp a lot, even when I have to go through 6-7 unbalanced / rocket launcher party / lag fest games until I find something decent.
I think I've been spoiled by Warhawk and Resistance 2 online, that's all, I didn't expect KZ2 retail build to be this bad, even if "this bad" is acceptable to most people here, maybe it's time to easy down before I got banned for pointing out KZ2 flaws so frequently which I understand is a tad annoying for the average Joe here that always reply with "lag? framerate drops? check your PS3 dude" one-liners.
peace
Are you playing against people in your region? I don't get crazy lag unless we do a GAFA versus GAFE match. Most matches are pretty lag free, except for 1 or two people that seem to have bad connections and warp all over the place. And you're playing the wrong types of games. If rockets are in a game, FF needs to be on. I generally leave games if it's a rocket launcher fest with no FF on. Usually I only join the ones that say no rockets or FF on.
I do agree with you that you need to be able to see more of the match options before you join. I just think that you're giving them a bit too much crap for it. Yeah there are issues, but the actual online gameplay is amazing and addictive.
andycapps said:
Problem is you never know. Even if you filter games by your region, there is no guarantee you wont find people from other regions in it. Tournaments and clan challenges are "worldwide" as well, so you can end up playing a 5000VP match against players from the other side of the world.
Net code/infrastructure doesn't handle worldwide games well, despite there being no limitations whatsoever.
He does have a point. A comprehensive party system is a good feature, and KZ2 would be easier to have a great time with if it had one, and that's not even touching some of the more frequent complaints about class balance.
When talking about extra features for a game there's a whole spectrum between "do not need at all" and "crucial, must-have otherwise the whole thing is shit". A party system is just one thing that falls somewhere into that grey area. Its absence doesn't devalue the game, but its presence would still be welcome.
Now, is the game fun without it? Yes, oh yes it is.
When talking about extra features for a game there's a whole spectrum between "do not need at all" and "crucial, must-have otherwise the whole thing is shit". A party system is just one thing that falls somewhere into that grey area. Its absence doesn't devalue the game, but its presence would still be welcome.
Now, is the game fun without it? Yes, oh yes it is.
last reply since most people isn't getting my point, you are just replying without reading first.
I've played more than 250 hours with people in my region, my country and even my city, lag is always random and solely based on host connection. I've stated several times that my concern is the use of peer-to-peer instead of dedicated hosting and compared KZ2 net code to that of Warhawk or Resistance 2, that's all.
again, you're replying without reading my posts, I've already said it takes time to find a balanced game without rocket launcher noobs and minimal lag. I do try to join "assault off" "no rockets" games as soon as I find them.
what have I done? enjoy the game people, I was looking for some discussion about multiplayer flaws and lag issues, no point here so just ignore me ffs.
andycapps said:
I've played more than 250 hours with people in my region, my country and even my city, lag is always random and solely based on host connection. I've stated several times that my concern is the use of peer-to-peer instead of dedicated hosting and compared KZ2 net code to that of Warhawk or Resistance 2, that's all.
andycapps said:
again, you're replying without reading my posts, I've already said it takes time to find a balanced game without rocket launcher noobs and minimal lag. I do try to join "assault off" "no rockets" games as soon as I find them.
what have I done? enjoy the game people, I was looking for some discussion about multiplayer flaws and lag issues, no point here so just ignore me ffs.
test_account
XP-39C²
Is it just me or are less and less people using the rocket launcher while playing now, compared to how it was several of weeks ago? To me it feels that there are less rocket spammers now than before at least.
And it is a pity to hear that some people are experience lag while playing Killzone 2 :\ I have hardly experienced lag while playing Killzone 2 online. It have happend some times, but it is rarely. It is not something that i have really bothered me at least. I only play in the "EU region" (which is where i live).
(EDIT: I havnt played any tournament/clan matches either by the way. Maybe there are a higher possibility of lag when playing some tournament/clan matches?)
Not that it changes the gameplay experience for me though, but an interesting read for me anyway to see how things are working
And it is a pity to hear that some people are experience lag while playing Killzone 2 :\ I have hardly experienced lag while playing Killzone 2 online. It have happend some times, but it is rarely. It is not something that i have really bothered me at least. I only play in the "EU region" (which is where i live).
(EDIT: I havnt played any tournament/clan matches either by the way. Maybe there are a higher possibility of lag when playing some tournament/clan matches?)
Interesting read, thanks for posting thisLince said:
Not that it changes the gameplay experience for me though, but an interesting read for me anyway to see how things are working When you get that message about the game host, the game doesnt disconnect. Wouldnt it be doing that if it was true P2P?Lince said:
test_account said:
^^ this is why I thought there was something else going on in between my PS3 and 'your' PS3. Cause I can pull my network cord out and the game will go on for the other players, somehow...but I dont know how?(there is no way it can find a new host THAT fast)
A guy on KZ forums traced his network while playing and it said there was a server in virginia that all info was going through or something like that...I'll see if I can find it.
test_account
XP-39C²
Ye, i thought there were some "host leaving protection" (or what i shall call it) at leastGodofWine said:
Maybe it possible to have some protection like this even with true P2P though, but i dont have too much knowledge about how P2P works, so i had to ask 
tfur
Member
I believe the game host is the ps3 that gathers all stat information. This stat information is then sent to a dedicated server.
I would really like to know the network architecture, as it really works well for me. I seldom get lag. I also have been building my own linux firewall/routers since the quake 1 days, so I really never have a problem anyhow. Most of the consumer grade routers are trash in comparison.
Warhawk probably has the tightest net code this generation. I can play on dedicated servers on the other side of the planet with no lag. It also took some time for Warhawk to get this tuned as well.
If KZ2 is truly p2p, I do no see a reason why Sony cannot run a few dedicated ps3's like is done in Warhawk.
I would really like to know the network architecture, as it really works well for me. I seldom get lag. I also have been building my own linux firewall/routers since the quake 1 days, so I really never have a problem anyhow. Most of the consumer grade routers are trash in comparison.
Warhawk probably has the tightest net code this generation. I can play on dedicated servers on the other side of the planet with no lag. It also took some time for Warhawk to get this tuned as well.
If KZ2 is truly p2p, I do no see a reason why Sony cannot run a few dedicated ps3's like is done in Warhawk.
BruceLeeRoy
Banned
Now that I have beaten the campaign again on Elite I have to say GG did a excellent job with the SP. Every level except probably Corinth Crossing is exciting and fresh with the game really picking up steam once you hit the desert. Excellent pacing makes it by far the best fps campaign I have played since Halo CE. What a phenomenal franchise this is going to be.
test_account
XP-39C²
I come to think of something. When i played Killzone 2 before, i once (or maybe more than once, unfortunately i dont remember) got the "Game Host is not available" message, and right after that i got disconnected from the game, at least from what i can remember.tfur said:
I think that this was before the 1.20 patch. Could it be that something was fixed/improved in the 1.20 patch, or was it just a coincidence that i got disconnected at the same time as i got the "Game Host is not available" message?
Ye, the single player part in Killzone 2 was pretty cool, i think so tooBruceLeeRoy said:
I am looking forward to see how the single player part (and the multi player part) in Killzone 3 will be test_account
XP-39C²
Maybe, but right after the original host leaves and/or get disconnected, the game still seems to contunie. Who or what is managing the game right after the original host leaves and/or get disconnected?icechai said:
Or is it possible to have the game to move the host right over to another player like 0.1 second (which maybe still could cause some lag befor a new host is found) after the original host leaves?
EDIT: I reformulated my post alittle.
KZObsessed
Member
I usually only get noticeable (for me anyway) lag during clan games. There's an occasional game on a US server which is a warp fest so I leave, and the GAFe vs GAFA games are always quite laggy, more so for certain people but I usually play EU servers and smaller games (6-16) so I have no problems.
It's the clan games which are the biggest problem as you can't leave to find another server for obvious reasons. You can play against 2 other guys who just wont die or die 3 seconds after they should so they kill you before they die or will walk right through 3 C4s unscathed. And that's just if you're lucky and don't get people who warp and just appear behind you. We had one 2v2 with 2 Portuguese people who would teleport behind you when you were shooting them. you could even see it on the battle replay, can't believe we actually won that one :lol
About 50% of the time the clans games are fine tho, it's just if you're unlucky and get some laggers during a 3-5k Valor Tournament it's gonna piss you off and is unacceptable to me.
It's the clan games which are the biggest problem as you can't leave to find another server for obvious reasons. You can play against 2 other guys who just wont die or die 3 seconds after they should so they kill you before they die or will walk right through 3 C4s unscathed. And that's just if you're lucky and don't get people who warp and just appear behind you. We had one 2v2 with 2 Portuguese people who would teleport behind you when you were shooting them. you could even see it on the battle replay, can't believe we actually won that one :lol
About 50% of the time the clans games are fine tho, it's just if you're unlucky and get some laggers during a 3-5k Valor Tournament it's gonna piss you off and is unacceptable to me.
Lince said:read before quoting please, it was right there at the beginning
it takes a bit to find a good game with acceptable lag, but when I find it I'm instantly glued for hours.
Like most other people, I don't have any consistent lag issues. The lack of a party system or any way to see more information about the setting of a server before joining are inexcusable omissions, but I've already covered that a few times. I have no hope that GG will fix unfortunately.
Keep fighting the good fight Lince.
At this point, I think it's pretty clear people still posting in this thread are not trying to troll the game when pointing out flaws. I like this game just as much as the next guy, but I will not turn a blind eye to its shortcomings. I think there's definitely place for having discussions about the issues for as long as GG doesn't take any actions towards them.
At this point, I think it's pretty clear people still posting in this thread are not trying to troll the game when pointing out flaws. I like this game just as much as the next guy, but I will not turn a blind eye to its shortcomings. I think there's definitely place for having discussions about the issues for as long as GG doesn't take any actions towards them.
Calling all GAFe clan members. You've been drafted for duty, please report to your local online thread for details:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=15474881&postcount=2173
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=15474881&postcount=2173
7:30PM GMT = 8:30PM BST (UK) = 9:30PM CEST (Berlin, Amsterdam, Paris, Barcelona)Cagen said:
gregor7777
Banned
Yes, it is possible to move from one host to another in P2P. Every game handles it differently.
Well, Tempy's mentioned that they shrugged off the suggestions he brought up to them. And there's the old interview where they basically downplayed the entire spawn grenade fiasco and said that it works as intended.JudgeN said:
You could "assume" either side of the argument to be true, as there's evidence for both.
Nizz
Member
I'm still trucking through the game on Elite. Big difference compared to playing it on Trooper. This game is kicking my ass!BruceLeeRoy said:
I'm at the refinery where you have to jump into one of those big cylinders on the conveyor belt. Soon as I jump in one of those things and round the corner, I get taken out. I'm using the
lightning gun
zap
But they still manage to get me.
And wow how the rocket launcher is hated! I used a rocket launcher for only the second time ever online. Just as the match was ending, me and someone from the other team ended up face to face. I fire the rocket and I take him out just as he takes me out, and all I hear is "you f***ing god damn f****t !" :lol I'm also trying to get that M4. My god, that thing is almost like a sniper rifle. I joined a pistols only match but the problem was that the pistols some people had were the M4's.
I guess I'll have to create a room where it's pistols only, no M4's.
I still have seven matches left to win to unlock that baby...
fps fanatic said:I'm still trucking through the game on Elite. Big difference compared to playing it on Trooper. This game is kicking my ass!
I'm at the refinery where you have to jump into one of those big cylinders on the conveyor belt. Soon as I jump in one of those things and round the corner, I get taken out. I'm using theand I try tolightning gunas many Helghast as I can before I have to reload the weapon.zap
But they still manage to get me.
I'm also trying to get that M4. My god, that thing is almost like a sniper rifle. I joined a pistols only match but the problem was that the pistols some people had were the M4's.
I guess I'll have to create a room where it's pistols only, no M4's.
I still have seven matches left to win to unlock that baby...
just be an assault and go pistol in regular matches, boost around ppl or sprint up next to them before they see you
Also that refinery level kicked my ass a bit too, you just got to do what you're doing but use it sparringly and reload. You can do it!!!
CrushDance
Banned
SHOTS FIRED. Anyway I agree with Lince, the game is great but Guerilla really dropped the ball with being active in the community and a ton of little things, especially the website not working for over 3 weeks after release. They've been steadily losing players.
CrushDance said:
I think the whole bot debacle is a clear indication of how little thought went into the whole online thing. I mean, how can you not see that coming?
But that's just the tip of the iceberg. The P2P infrastructure (I was honestly surprised when I discovered it's not server based - I was giving it for granted for such a big release), the lack of a party system, the stupid Tournament search system (or lack thereof), the abnormally high players cap (32 is too much on ANY map), the spawn grenade thing... lots of things that keep this game from achieving true awesomeness.
If they don't fix most of this crap quickly (like within a week or two) bad things will happen.
TTP said:
No party system continues to boggle my mind. Spawn grenade problem is fixed by moving the S&D objectives apart (but the spawn grenade idea itself is pretty good). The # of players "problem" is completely within your control to fix, though. You never have to play 32 players if you don't want to (i prefer 16).
CrushDance
Banned
Clan battles were supposed to be fun but they're more of a hassle to setup and the top clans have ridiculous valor. Nevermind that Guerilla never punished them either, all I'm doing is getting my platinum. Forget about MP and play InFamous.TTP said:
commish said:
Spawn grenade problem is one of implementation not idea. We have discussed this so much I wont repeat myself, but it definitely needs work.
The # of players problem affects the whole game perception to newcomers. They jump into 32 players matches expecting the game to be playable. Sadly, it isn't. Also, GG is stupid enough to create official 32 players tournaments on small maps. So there you see how naive they are about the whole online thing.
commish said:
I was playing it early this afternoon when KZ2 servers were down and there's still lots of 32p games to be found, smooth, lag-free, pure awesomeness. Even with air, ground and infantry classes you never feel you've got a cheap kill, everything is perfect.
and thank you guys for supporting my "overreacting"... it's just that I love Killzone 2 multiplayer so much and at the same time I hate the aforementioned issues with such a passion... this could have been the best mp game ever lasting for years to come.
As it is now people are getting bored of finding ways to play with friends in balanced games just to find that particular game they managed to join the same faction is a rocket launcher party or a lag fest, not to mention most players are pissed at the spawn grenade invincibility thing and the subsequent clusterfucks in S&D, online cheating and glitching, no search/filters in tournament list... everything is flawed, from gameplay to network infrastructure. If the next patch doesn't fix at least a couple of the major issues I will move on to the next thing...
new maps for rockets clusterfuck? yeah, I already played GLQuake 17 years ago.
test_account
XP-39C²
Ah ok, cool, thanks for the info!gregor7777 said:
It seems to have worked pretty good after my experience, but i havnt really seen that much of the "game host is not available" message though. But i am glad that i hardly have experienced much lag in Killzone 2 at least, almost every game i play in Killzone 2 seems to be running good, at least after my experience
Rapping Granny
Banned
Alright another patch.
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