BreezyLimbo
Banned
Guys next champion has a creepy mask
if they pull him off I might reinstall
if they pull him off I might reinstall
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League of Legends |OT10| Botlane Was A Mistake, It's Nothing But Thresh
- Thread starter Dobkeratops
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random thought - is it unlikely that we'll see an ad poke support since they'll scale comparatively well with items, even just by auto-attacking? Afaik any support that does some damage currently is also ap
heh you pretty much need a tank team to beat a heavy poke team in arams, and that's only if you survive until late game somehow
Ghost is Bad
Banned
Nah, AD poke just isn't very good unless you have huge range and a lot of armor pen which is problematic on limited budgets.
Orochinagis
Member
LAN servers are lagging hard right now
a little more variety can't hurt, I guess. A ninja marksman would be neat too, even if they wouldn't play much different from the current ad carries anyhow
Ghost is Bad
Banned
we already have kennen tho
In terms of support design, it's not critical that they not scale well with items so much as that they have abilities that are powerful without scaling. There are several supports that can become pretty strong if you solo lane them. That's not a problem since they just don't get gold as a support and so their scaling won't come into play.
When supports have bad scaling on abilities it's not to make them more appropriate for support, it's to limit their effectiveness in solo lanes. Probably because they have some ability that they just don't want coming out of mid/top.
When supports have bad scaling on abilities it's not to make them more appropriate for support, it's to limit their effectiveness in solo lanes. Probably because they have some ability that they just don't want coming out of mid/top.
variety for variety's sake isn't good and it's potentially pretty bad since it muddies up the game with no real benefit
for example, say you want an ad support. what would this champion do that an ap champion couldn't?
Wolf Akela
Member
Just play support Jayce. Slow, knockback, armor/mr shred, max hp% damage and free Shurelya? Very OP :^)
Ghost is Bad
Banned
then run oom after 1 spell rotation :^)
Ghost is Bad
Banned
wrong thread noob
Ghost is Bad
Banned
nah best champ design is khazix rite
Yeah, remember 50% damage reduction with ult? So balanced.
There has been an AD support in the game. His name was Jarvan the unbalanced.
auto attack!
well, and different itemization. There isn't much of a difference between ap and ad champions other than that
Dreams-Visions
Member
ah yes. the rare Garen S+.
I don't like having to carry that hard. I need a back massage.
Terbinator
Member
This is basically Thresh.
if they're about autos why would you play them as support rather than adc? i feel for them to be guaranteed to be played as support they should probably have bad base attack speed but then you basically have an ad version of lulu? or something? also champions like sona and thresh do a lot with their autos and even nami and janna can self cast spells to imrpove their autos and harass that way
also i think there's a big misunderstanding with scaling with ap regarding itemization here. supports might scale with ap, but they most definitely don't build ap, they build support items like mikaels, locket, zekes, frozen heart, righteous glory (actually haven't seen one of these in like forever).
those are support items, not ap items and if your champion scaled off ad and had to support either they'd be a bullshit support like brand or they just would build just the same as the other supports, tanky support or magey support, but in both cases support items
close enough to ahri that as thread princess and captain noot's first mate i consider it on-topic :>
Dreams-Visions
Member
No, sorry. That title belongs to Jayce. Your everything man.
Yeah, it's great.so, undertale's pretty good
Hmm, I'm wondering about Orianna because from what I've played I've always had a very solid start with her in lane because the ball is really solid harass and she last hits pretty well, too, but I feel like her toolset really starts to fall behind in the team-fights and I Iag behind a lot there. I got some kills in, but all she can really do it seems is cross people up constantly with her Q and one, and maybe a second W, and even late-game that doesn't feel very impactful aside from her ultimate, which is kind of hard to figure out the best time for.
Overloaded kit.
imo really well designed champions: thresh, ori, tf, lissandra, nami, jinx, braum, sion, bard, sivir
i kinda want to say draven but i'm not 100% sure how i feel about the winning trades through stats aspect of his q, even tho there's actual skill involved since u gotta catch the axes and whatnot
yeah maybe draven too
that's exactly the wrong, opposite opinion about ori haha
she's actually fairly weak early game (tho if played well she can rekk face against pretty much everyone) and gets a lot better as the game progresses, specially in teamfigths thanks to her combination of dps through qw combos, utility spam with w and e, zone control with ball positioning and massive aoe with ult
i kinda want to say draven but i'm not 100% sure how i feel about the winning trades through stats aspect of his q, even tho there's actual skill involved since u gotta catch the axes and whatnot
yeah maybe draven too
that's exactly the wrong, opposite opinion about ori haha
she's actually fairly weak early game (tho if played well she can rekk face against pretty much everyone) and gets a lot better as the game progresses, specially in teamfigths thanks to her combination of dps through qw combos, utility spam with w and e, zone control with ball positioning and massive aoe with ult
Ghost is Bad
Banned
all utility is op late game
Also from that Riot thread: they considered an ultimate for Olaf that would literally be Ragnarok and, if unchecked for a lengthy period of time, would just kill everybody and end the game. They also considered a Fiora ult that would be essentially "1v1 me bro" and teleport you and your enemy into another dimension to fight to the death. Both of these are terrible but hilarious ideas.
Ghost is Bad
Banned
ragnarok sounds shit but the fiora thing is basically a weaker LC ult.
Dreams-Visions
Member
Now that I think about it, his hammer form W needs a rework. It's dumb and largely useless. A champ should have no objectively useless skills. That one objectively is.
Ghost is Bad
Banned
waveclear :^)
Dreams-Visions
Member
Guess I've still got a lot to learn with her then, lol. Just talking my experience so far!
yeah np
her ult is devastating if used correctly, it can singlehandledly win a teamfight
Peanut Butter
Member
Phreak's post doesn't make any sense. They're eyebrows are raised because people got better at the game/figured out how to use his skill correctly? If a targeted Bola strike is OP as well as people figuring out how to use a skillshot correctly, what else is there to do?
Scrolling through Reddit, the only thing I saw that makes sense would be to add a global sound to alert folks when Rengar uses his ult. Sure, Riot can reduce numbers or w/e, but I guarantee that people who call for another Rengar rework got 100-0'ed in 2 seconds by an Akali, LeBlanc, Zed, Talon, Ahri, Xin, Jax, Kat, or any snowballed champion in one or more of their recent matches. Why are people acting like insane damage is Rengar exclusive all of a sudden?
smh.
Stone Ocean
Member
Best part of times like this is seeing people squirming trying to justify their bullshit champions.
2 seconds is enough time to fight back and all other assassins have to take risks in order to actually get in. Rengar one shots you before you can even react because that joke of an indicator only appears when he's basically in leap range.
100-0 burst out of true long range stealth is not a thing that can exist in this game period specially with heavily nerfed vision. Either kitty can't one shot someone or he's fully visible all the time, pick one.
2 seconds is enough time to fight back and all other assassins have to take risks in order to actually get in. Rengar one shots you before you can even react because that joke of an indicator only appears when he's basically in leap range.
100-0 burst out of true long range stealth is not a thing that can exist in this game period specially with heavily nerfed vision. Either kitty can't one shot someone or he's fully visible all the time, pick one.
Stone Ocean
Member
Also the whole point of the Rengar rework was to make it so he couldn't easily one shot people. It's why things like triple Q got removed, same for targeted bola.
If he can do that after players got used to his new kit then they failed. That's what the Phreak post is about.
If he can do that after players got used to his new kit then they failed. That's what the Phreak post is about.
Probably because of these cute Koreans getting destroyed by rengo:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JpnBzM18EKE
I think the only issue I've had with fed Rengos is just the total freedom they have and in lower elos (like myself) there is never nearly enough vision to see where he is going to come from. When playing ADC you end up having to just sit by towers waiting for waves and hope that Rengar isn't so fed he can tower dive and get out before anyone can react. Where as with Zed, Talon and co in most cases you know when they are missing and when to play safe where as Rengar's usually out of no where.
I don't think he is too much of an issue but there isn't much counter play in lower elo soloQ games when you play ADC
I've had more issues with Rengar than other fed assassins just due to the Jungle playstyle of Rengar and the sneak attacks. Not all that much more than LB 100-0 you in less than a second though.I haven't played league in a while but popped on last night for an ARAM to try the Japanese VO and its pretty good! Just need to get the announcer pack working. It also had me playing my second game ever with Ori which was pretty tricky but she does scary amounts of dmg if you hit her combo! I struggled keeping up with where the ball was but the wombos with Sejuani going in was great
Peanut Butter
Member
I'm not really squirming trying to justify Rengar, and I even said that tweaking his damage output and giving the enemy better signals to deal with him is fine.
I just wish that people would stop acting like he's the only BS champion in the game when it comes to surprise 100-0ing. Sure, Rengar has stealth, but without his ult or 5 stacks, he can't really do anything worthwhile unless he's near a bush.
Yeah, I linked that in here not that long ago. It's pretty funny.
Stone Ocean
Member
His ult being on CD is only a weakness if the Rengar is bad. Good Rengars will not waste that thing and late game by the time whatever you killed respawns your ult is already back up. Other assassins being able to do their job doesn't justify his kit, specially because you can see them coming, you can CC them mid air, longer time to kill means things like Zhonya's and QSS are far better, and so on.
And with skillshot bola let's not pretend getting 5 stacks is more than an inconvenience.
And with skillshot bola let's not pretend getting 5 stacks is more than an inconvenience.
Peanut Butter
Member
Yeah, that's a fair point.
There isn't even a lot of counter play for rengar in higher elo games either. Ever watch nightblue play him? The only time someone gets away is if he messes up. There's no way around it. Esp once he has his necklace stacked and is level 16, the indicator will barely even pop by the time he is pouncing on the target to one shot them. And with his normal build, that ult is up again in about 30 seconds. There just nothing that can be done. He wins games by creating 5v4 or even 4v4 situations when the enemy loses their most important dps.
Peanut Butter
Member
So if you guys were in charge of Rengar changes, what would you fix?
besides permanently disabling him.
I think he would be tricky to balance. For me a lot of the issue are with the ult so if it was something that slowed (unless in bushes) him so you had more time to react to the sound/notification. As well as having the pings on the map every second so you get a rough idea what route he is taking or the new red trinket glow effect showing his silhouette with a 1 second lag behind it or something.
That is just my personal issue as I find it almost impossible to avoid getting jumped on where as with other assasins I usually have a rough idea when I might 100-0'd
That is just my personal issue as I find it almost impossible to avoid getting jumped on where as with other assasins I usually have a rough idea when I might 100-0'd
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