-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Left 4 Dead 2 |OT| The South Rises Again
- Thread starter ClovingWestbrook
- Start date
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
Too true.OmegaDragon said:
drkOne
Member
I don't really know what's worse DotA community wasn't newbie-friendly at all, and it could get very frustrating in the beginning. But there's a chance that you can win a game mostly alone on DotA.HK-47 said:
With L4D I find that no matter how good you are, there's always a chance you'll end up with griefers who will ruin the game. And if a single player decides to grief, out of 8 players, the game is usually ruined.
WALL OF TEXT BEGINdrkOne said:
For what it's worth, I try to be fair and apologize when I'm oversensitive, annoying or if I mess up during a game. I am absolutely willing to admit I'm not very good at the l4d games, and I prefer to play very casually instead of super competitively. Long ago, I think I even had a few games where I called out the timing for my team's attacks and we did well. It's fun to do that and do well, but it's stressful and too much like work for me, so I tend to just try to be decent and not take it too seriously unless my team specifically asks for me to try to be competitive. If someone doesn't want to play with me playing casually I can respect that.
I believe I specifically admitted I had acted stupidly to RocketDarkness a few pages ago, and I apologized and added him back as a friend. I'm not claiming I don't annoy people, but I try to be a decent teammate and a reasonable person, even if you are all random internet people I could be an asshole to.
So in general, with the normal GAF people (especially if it's not on vert's team) in l4d1/l4d2 usually goes pretty well in my limited experience. There was the one time that PillowKnight absolutely flipped out, left the game, deleted me, and was saying something about how I'm a person who act like I care, but I really don't, or something.
It actually really bothered me because it wasn't true, and I hadn't meant to upset him. Otherwise, the games are usually polite, and Stallion/vert usually just keep the "eat a dick" voicechat comments directed at each other more than at me. Of course, I don't think I ever got allowed in the Mumble VIP room so who knows, they may be awesome guys in there. :lol My main issue with vert is him refusing to stop commenting on my Steam profile, leaving the aforementioned "you sick fuck you have sex with your parents" comment there, then wondering why I deleted him as a friend, and then him actually suggesting that -I- am more creepy, for typing like six words into Google and posting the result to give him a hard time. I also thought his "stallion is a fucking faggot" message of the day was offensive on his l4d1 server, so I avoided playing on it.
My main issue with Stallion is him being sometimes really rude on the forums (i.e. "fuck your opinion" etc.) and deleting me for whatever reason recently when I didn't even realize there was a problem. We used to talk about graphics cards and LEGO games, so who knows. Some other people have said "no one" enjoys playing with me, but I can't really see that being accurate. Ah wells.
So there's my input -- they can be obnoxious out of the games, but in game I have not had too many problems with them directly other than occasionally when the teams seem unbalanced, which is not really a big annoyance for me. So that's my part trying to be fair and open and not unreasonably scare people away from the server, if anyone is worried about that.
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
Dear god.
Hey guys, we are playing tonight right?
Hey guys, we are playing tonight right?
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
I'm from Connecticut, it's how we roll. We don't take shit.HK-47 said:
RocketDarkness
Member
Everyone in the VIP room is certified awesome.Blizzard said:
Blizzard said:Just in case you're not joking, I will ask for the third time how a 15-second Google search is more creepy than claiming something like "you sick fuck you have sex with your parents" on someone's profile.
Blizzard, you should stop lying.
Before
AFTER
Maybe because the one time we let you in, you decided to post a picture of our private convo on gaf? Maybe, just maybe that was the reason we don't want you in there anymore.
RocketDarkness said:
We <3 you too RD!
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
So baller.Nabs said:
Did you not post a third comment after I deleted the second one?vertopci said:
If not, then I apologize for misquoting you, and I certainly remembered it wrong.
I still suggest that the sexual comment about my parents was inappropriate especially since my younger brother can see my profile, and hardly less creepy than me doing a 15-second Google search to give you a hard time about your post. And you did it after I asked you, politely, I believe, to stop leaving comments on my profile. Your original comment is still there to this day -- I haven't deleted it.Wait, what "private" conversation were you having in the Mumble text chat that I posted?
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
Idk man, I remember us looking forward to the point you would begin to rage a number of times. We got pretty good at predicting when it would happen.Branduil said:
Really all of them were. They aren't available publicly on the internet so they are private.Wait, what "private" conversation were you having in the Mumble text chat that I posted?
Jeff Stephen
Member
This happens quite often if you join up a group who is dead set on being a Tank regardless of how ineffective they are as SI.Aaron said:
L4D1/2 versus pub games do have the worst communities in any online game I've played. There are people that don't want to cooperate with teammates and then there are the people that take it too seriously. I'm ashamed to say I know this firsthand, I have two friends that constantly kick people in pub games for every mistake. I find it annoying and take no part in the voting but it's always two positive votes anyway.
Nice point, that's a motive that didn't even occur to me.Jeff Stephen said:
I once had two pub people join when I was playing against friends (who were stomping on vs survival). I warned the pubs that the other team had been working together, but they were very...confident in their abilities. I was almost hoping their bravado was true, but it didn't work out as well as they hoped and we lost anyway. :lol
Sqrt_minus_one
Member
Oh OK I thought it was just me who had noticed this attitude of kick first ask questions later.
@Vazel: Then counter it and keep the dude there, kicking for non-consequential reasons is just silly.
For some odd reason French people take this game very seriously, just bear that in mind. :lol
@Vazel: Then counter it and keep the dude there, kicking for non-consequential reasons is just silly.
For some odd reason French people take this game very seriously, just bear that in mind. :lol
speculawyer
Member
Anyone play campaign & mutations? Or is it all just Versus?
drkOne
Member
Yes, that totally makes sense since you don't even know my scrim team... And I didn't even take you seriously that night.Branduil said:
If you wanna tell the whole story though... You were on mine and vert's team, proceeded to rage as you did every game you played with us, started griefing, we lost... In the end you started talking shit about how scrim experience didn't make us win the game.
And Brand, the matches you didn't rage, it was because you were on a stacked team and winning. Be honest about it, vert even insisted on having you on his so you wouldn't rage...
I try my best!HK-47 said:
And Blizzard, I'm cool with you. I was just pointing out that, as I think you'd agree, people aren't always bitching at you while playing... It's mostly outside of the game.
I pointed out that thing of you finding that old post from vert, but it's nothing to be taken seriously...
morningbus
Serious Sam is a wicked gahbidge series for chowdaheads.
Oh man, I just started up my computer why is it on this thread?
Oh.
OHH.
Look, I was going to let it go the first few times, Blizzard, but this is easily the third or fourth time you've brought up the "eat a dick" shit in this thread. Do you have a problem with me or something? I'm the only person that said or says "eat a dick" and, seriously, the only other time you would have heard vert or Stallion say that is in response to me. So what the fuck is up? I know you're not saying my name directly, but you're implying that my actions and my way of talking with people is rude, uninviting, juvenile, and disrespectful. In a way, it is even worse that you're ascribing it to vert or Stallion and trying to paint them negatively.
And it is so fucking easy to do, too. It is so easy to hate on or direct hate towards vert and Stallion because their online personae can be somewhat abrasive. It is so much easier to dismiss them than play a game or two with them and find that they're actually pretty damn nice guys who've made every newcomer to the group feel welcome. Does everyone mesh with a group of 10+ people? No, of course not. Do we take every effort to try and include people? Yes, we do. That's the end of it.
How many people have come in here after playing a game with us and said "Oh my gods, those guys are assholes!" (I see you waving your hand furiously, Branduil. There are other issues at play there). Yet there are a bunch of people turned away and sometimes turned against two of the nicest people in our group because you see fit to pollute every page with your tired bullshit.
Look Blizzard, I've tried being as nice as possible to you in the past and up until now we've not had any problems. But honestly, and I mean this sincerely, I think it is time for you to look at yourself a little bit. I subscribe to the same ethos you claim to live by (i.e. be as nice to people as possible, try not to intentionally offend anyone, etc.), and I have to ask, how many people come into this thread talking about the problems they've had with me?
There comes a time, Blizzard, when you have to look at the situation you are in and examine if you are the cause of it. There are at least five people in this thread who you've turned off in someway and they're not all in our group or even play L4D with any regularity.
So, instead of coming in here and trying to turn new players against us, how about you chill back and let them form an opinion for themselves.
I apologize in advance for even setting foot in this stupid highschool-level drama, but I'm tired of reading it.
Nabs said:
Oh.
MoFuzz said:
OHH.
Blizzard said:
Look, I was going to let it go the first few times, Blizzard, but this is easily the third or fourth time you've brought up the "eat a dick" shit in this thread. Do you have a problem with me or something? I'm the only person that said or says "eat a dick" and, seriously, the only other time you would have heard vert or Stallion say that is in response to me. So what the fuck is up? I know you're not saying my name directly, but you're implying that my actions and my way of talking with people is rude, uninviting, juvenile, and disrespectful. In a way, it is even worse that you're ascribing it to vert or Stallion and trying to paint them negatively.
And it is so fucking easy to do, too. It is so easy to hate on or direct hate towards vert and Stallion because their online personae can be somewhat abrasive. It is so much easier to dismiss them than play a game or two with them and find that they're actually pretty damn nice guys who've made every newcomer to the group feel welcome. Does everyone mesh with a group of 10+ people? No, of course not. Do we take every effort to try and include people? Yes, we do. That's the end of it.
How many people have come in here after playing a game with us and said "Oh my gods, those guys are assholes!" (I see you waving your hand furiously, Branduil. There are other issues at play there). Yet there are a bunch of people turned away and sometimes turned against two of the nicest people in our group because you see fit to pollute every page with your tired bullshit.
Look Blizzard, I've tried being as nice as possible to you in the past and up until now we've not had any problems. But honestly, and I mean this sincerely, I think it is time for you to look at yourself a little bit. I subscribe to the same ethos you claim to live by (i.e. be as nice to people as possible, try not to intentionally offend anyone, etc.), and I have to ask, how many people come into this thread talking about the problems they've had with me?
There comes a time, Blizzard, when you have to look at the situation you are in and examine if you are the cause of it. There are at least five people in this thread who you've turned off in someway and they're not all in our group or even play L4D with any regularity.
So, instead of coming in here and trying to turn new players against us, how about you chill back and let them form an opinion for themselves.
I apologize in advance for even setting foot in this stupid highschool-level drama, but I'm tired of reading it.
starchild excalibur
Member
vazel said:
I only have a couple of friends who I play with (360), but luckily no one really acts like much of a prick. I mostly play public games with randoms, but the only times I initiate a kick is if someone's griefing. It sucks to lose, but as long as someone looks like they're actually trying then I can't really fault 'em for how they perform.
What I do hate though are people that absolutely refuse to heal. I usually only heal myself and others when they're/I'm in the red and sometimes I'll still heal another person lower in the red even if I am, too. The expectation is reciprocity, but a few times I'm amazed at people who will have painkillers, health packs and be in the green and seem completely disinterested in healing teammates in the red. I still won't vote to kick 'em for it, but it's a quick way to guarantee I'll never heal you unless I absolutely need to.
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
Hey, GG tonight guys there was some well played shit.
Did you play Lead and Gold? If so, then I confused your voice with them. I don't know that I've ever had an experience with you other than you being a nice guy who likes tea.morningbus said:
The only time I really remember them saying it was in Lead and Gold, and I thought it was between vert and stallion. I don't even remember you being there, but as has already been pointed out, my memory is apparently really bad. If you were saying it, then I apologize for misrepresenting them.I just brought it up because it sounds a bit juvenile/obnoxious, and that, combined with the sexual comments on my profile (please tell me that's not juvenile?) and the "fucking faggot" language on vert's server, I think it's fair to say that vert can be a bit immature or offensive at times. I thought it was him and stallion though, but I guess I get your voices all confused.
I have played many games with them! And as I have been trying to point out, they are not typically obnoxious ingame in my experience. At least you admit they can be somewhat abrasive.
Okay, seriously? I honestly have talked and played with MANY people around here and I hardly think that's fair.
Then by all means, I wish they would identify themselves and what their problem is. I personally sent a PM to vertopci earlier today apologizing to him for misquoting him, assuming that he truly didn't put a third comment on my profile after the two he posted earlier. I still maintain that those comments of his were at least a little bit weird and inappropriate.
I don't know why Pillow got so upset, as I said. I'm not sure about Stallion either unless he was offended by me suggesting that he was being unnecessarily rude in the screenshot threads.
So basically, if anyone has a problem with me, please PM me on Steam, or PM me on here, or whatever. I won't post your message on the board if you're scared about privacy. I try to treat people fairly and not annoy them unless they're being total jerks. So, if you have anything to disprove what I've posted, or if you have any specific reason I upset you, by all means post it, tell me, or whatever you prefer. If it's true then I'll certainly admit it and do better if I can.
morningbus
Serious Sam is a wicked gahbidge series for chowdaheads.
1) I don't care if you thought it was Stallion or vert, you classified it as a bad, immature thing someone does. You're talking trash about me. Call me out for it or apologize for mischaracterizing me, the things I say, and how I treat other people.Blizzard said:I just brought it up because it sounds a bit juvenile/obnoxious, and that, combined with the sexual comments on my profile (please tell me that's not juvenile?) and the "fucking faggot" language on vert's server, I think it's fair to say that vert can be a bit immature or offensive at times. I thought it was him and stallion though, but I guess I get your voices all confused.
2) I don't typically use the same language as the kind used in that specific MOTD, but I understand context. He was joking around with Stallion and had originally intended it to be there for a short period of time as an intentionally offensive, off-color remark. It may not be the way you joke around with your friends, and I respect that, but if someone removed all the context to everything I said to my friends, I'd probably look like the world's biggest douche, too.
Yes, you've played games with them. Let other people play those kind of games too and let them decided for themselves. Should I follow you around and post a disclaimer after every one of your posts saying that you have some weird obsessive behaviors that put you in direct conflict with other people?
Well, put up or shut up then. Provide a list of people that have played with vert and Stallion that have come to the conclusion that they are terrible people. I'm not talking about the people that have gotten into disagreements over the role of modifications to the core gameplay or what specifically constitutes "fun." I'm talking about the people that have expressed interest in playing L4D Versus, played a game, and have assumed the position that they are bad people. (God dammit Branduil, I see you over there, put down your hand already).Okay, seriously? I honestly have talked and played with MANY people around here and I hardly think that's fair.
You didn't answer if you played Lead and Gold...did you? If not, then yes, I think it was an immature and kind of annoying thing to say repeatedly, but as I have pointed out, it wasn't directed at me. I harldy see how it's "talking trash" to classify such language as a wee bit immature, wouldn't you say?morningbus said:
I'm pretty sure I posted the MOTD in its full context, unless you suggest that MOTD's should come with backstories. Also, wasn't it the MOTD for a week or more? No, I don't joke around by calling people faggots, and I don't consider it acceptable. I consider it offensive and juvenile.
I just explained that I have apologized directly to at least two people when I messed up. I also just posted an open offer for anyone to point out what behavior I have that conflicts with them. They are welcome to contact me privately or publically, as they prefer. If there's anything I've said that's not completely true then anyone is welcome to disprove it as vert did.
What does this have to do with whether they are two of the nicest people in "your group"? You admit they can be abrasive. People in this thread, and probably even the screenshot thread, admitted that Stallion can be abrasive/hostile. I didn't say that they were terrible people, and I still play with them when I have an opportunity and try to be polite to them!
In particular, you, Panda, midnight, and Nabs have probably been nicer in my experience than stallion or vert, or at least more polite in general (?). Those four may well be nicer than me! I just said it seemed odd to suggest those two are some of the very nicest unless you're all horrible and I just don't know it. :lol
*edit* If you would like to get on Steam or send me a PM, I would be happy to discuss your concerns with you rather than derail the thread further. I don't mind discussing it in public, but I'm sure it gets quite old for everyone.
morningbus
Serious Sam is a wicked gahbidge series for chowdaheads.
Blizzard said:
Yes, I play Lead and Gold. Other people might have been saying "eat a dick," too. I don't know. The main problem you have is that you 1) described this experience as a regular occurrence, 2) used that specific experience as basis for a smear, and 3) usually neglect to mention that this communication happens on a private mumble server. Now here is the kicker: 1) it isn't a regular occurrence (if it even mattered), 2) you used that specific smear against people who weren't even the main perpetrators as some kind of corroborating evidence to how terrible they can be, and 3) it is a private mumble server that vert owns.
And no, I don't consider the silly things people sometime say as "immature." I consider the knee-jerk reactions and consistent victim-playing far more immature, bothersome, and tiring.
It was an MOTD for a week mainly because of your reaction to it. Look, I understand hating that word. Hell, seeing you type it right now offends my sensibilities, too. But this gets at the heart of the problem, your skin is too thin for a group of people that barely directed any kind of typical, backroom ribbing at you. You got tired of our immature antics? Fine, then stop playing with us. Did we get tired of your antics? Yes, we did, and we pretty much stopped playing with you.
And that would be fine if you left it there. But you constantly drag it into this thread and others. Why don't we invite you to games, or into certain rooms of the mumble server? Because you have a history of taking screencaps and posting them on Gaf either looking for pity or to make someone look bad. Did we ever call you out for that and some of the obvious GAF terms-of-service violations you committed? No, because we wanted to be done and we didn't want to mess up this thread with irrelevant crap.
As I'm sure you know, being apologetic doesn't excuse the behavior and I've yet to see any significant progress against it. So is it okay if I follow you around plastering that disclaimer on every page you post on?
Thanks for the compliment. I try to be as polite and nice as possible while still having fun. Vert and Stallion have always been incredibly nice to me; vert even lets me play on his private L4D server and use his private Mumble room! He has never even asked me to chip in for the 100 or more hours of entertainment he has facilitated.
However, you're backpedaling and conceding that you don't have a list of people that vert and Stallion have offended and alienated through playing Versus L4D. What you probably have is a list of people that disagree with vert and Stallion on one thing or another and have not spent any serious amount of time talking to them, or, potentially, a list of people that have formed opinions totally based on the drama sometimes brought into this thread.
Damn it Brand, I see you! PUT YOUR HAND DOWN.Branduil said:
This is fair enough. I'm pretty sure it was rather common for the Lead and Gold games we played. If you are afraid people will think that sort of voicechat goes on in Left 4 Dead GAF games, no, I haven't experienced it there.morningbus said:
Which reaction of mine was a knee-jerk one? It seems a bit obvious to me that the line in question is immature -- I suppose we will have to let it stand there. I'm sure I can be immature too, but I'd like to think I'm trying to improve it if anyone points it out.
What antics did I do? I left a server for one game because it had the term "fucking faggot". I seem to recall even explaining that the message was the particular reason I left. I seem to recall someone raging at me after I left that I was never welcome anymore. Are you honestly defending "faggot" as fine, especially if you admit they kept it up because I reacted to it?
Are you honestly saying "fucking faggot" is "typical backroom ribbing" for the group?
The only real "looking for pity" screenshot that I can think of was the ones where I posted the one with me locked out of the mumble chatroom, with text scribbled on it to be silly. If that bothered you, doesn't that mean you have a bit of thin skin too?
I'm the master of over-sensitivity, and I didn't think those screenshots were serious or calling for pity.As for making someone look bad, what did I post besides the MOTD one? If that's the one, again, are you defending "faggot" as something appropriate, or are you suggesting you wanted people to not know about it?
Exactly which behavior are you referring to that has not changed, to whom? You are certainly welcome to follow me around and post whatever you like.
No, I was saying that what you said was irrelevant because it did not apply to what I originally stated. What you originally responded to was this:
"two of the nicest people in our group" -> "Okay, seriously? I honestly have talked and played with MANY people around here and I hardly think that's fair.
"What does this mean? It means I suggested those two were not two of the nicest people in the group in my opinion. I say they can be abrasive and others are nicer. You admitted they can be abrasive. I'm pretty sure at least some people have admitted they can be abrasive/hostile.
That was exactly what I said, and your response was about something different. I did not say anything about a list of people that they had offended in L4D. I did not say anything about them being terrible PEOPLE. You brought those up suggestions completely, as far as I can tell.
Since this is a very serious accusation, so I've saved it for last. Exactly which obvious terms-of-service violations have I committed?
Going through the TOS, I will try to list anything that might apply to me.
I did not knowingly misquote vert. He made inappropriate/weird comments, and no one has disagreed with that fact. He may even have made a third comment and not posted a screenshot, though that is presumably not the case (he has not responded yet). You may consider my posts here "abusive" or "harassing", but I have tried to present them as fair, going to great lengths to describe the whole situation, and offer them up to anyone else to disagree about. I have apologized and tried to make amends where I messed up. I am trying to be very polite to you and others in this thread. I have tried to clarify exactly what I have experienced on the server if you are worried about people being scared away.
Now, since you brought it up, I am pretty sure some other people in this thread have used profanity/obscenity, or put things in a more abusive way than I have. Do you not agree? In particular, though they did not post the things directly in this forum (with good reason), do you not consider the sexually oriented posts by vertopci on my profile in inappropriate, especially after I had asked him to stop posting there? Do you not agree that "faggot" is a sexual slur, and you shouldn't defend its being used, or kept up because someone reacts to it?
I will continue through the TOS in the next post.
I have taken great efforts to describe how whatever I say is substantiated by fact, or correct it if it is not completely accurate.
Moreover, I have already offered to discuss any issues you or other players may have in private, via PM or Steam chat. I have offered not to derail the thread further, and I would be happy to do so. You have chosen to accuse me of Terms of Service violations in a public forum, however, so I feel somewhat compelled to respond here.
Not applicable.
Yes, I have stated opinions about other user's actions and behavior. Surely, however, you can also admit that you and MANY other people have also stated opinions on other user's actions and behavior, even on these last few pages.
So, were there any that I missed? You have made the accusation that I committed "obvious" terms of service violations, enough of them that you could merely point out "some" but chose not to. Please list exactly which ones I violated, and how.
Stallion Free said:
congrats. so what?
i was just stating my view that many of the regulars that post in this topic come across as a bunch of assholes and that it certainly has the potential to scare off someone who might be interested in joining you guys. and judging by the last page of bullshit i still think im right.
but as long as you have a full game who give a shit right?
drkOne
Member
As I've said once, and I'm going to say it again It's really easy to pick the stuff from the forums, unknowing of the background behind those stories, and look at us as assholes.Daigoro said:
I already tried to explain some of the background behind such things
Blizzard will always try to act like a victim as if his behavior isn't the one that causes people to act rude towards him.
And Brand decided to come to GAF raise some drama Not give anyone the context, and act like a victim too.
And, we're only trying to get more gaffers to play with us because everyone here seems to be complaining about pub games When new people come here and reveal some interest, we welcome them to our games, because we aren't elitist asshole.
If they're scared, whatever, I just find it stupid to be pointing out things when they have absolutely no clue of what happened before.
As you've said, as long as we can get a full game, we shouldn't give a shit Thing is, we care enough to try to get new people to play with other gaffers instead of having to put up with the pub community this game has.
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
As long as we don't have to play with you, we are happy.Daigoro said:
Also, for being an abrasive asshole, I still manage to get an impressive number of people to play co-op games with me and people actually want me on their team in L4D. OMG.
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
NOOOOOOO. Come on, I have 3 different RE5 co-op partners, I'm 2pro at sleeping around :loldrkOne said:
Anyways, Blizzard, I think you keep missing the point that you are probably the problem here, not us. I mean your two favorite targets to pick are Vert and myself, us being the two big assholes of the group. But the group needs neither of us. They don't need Vert's server (there are plenty of other servers with the same config) and they don't need Vert's mumble server (it's easy to set up a private one or just borrow another), but they still invite him to play every single game the group plays. The group doesn't really need me around for anything either, but I also get invited to participate in any and every game. How often do you get these invites? If we are really two huge assholes, why is the group inviting us everytime and not you?
.....
morningbus
Serious Sam is a wicked gahbidge series for chowdaheads.
This is going to be my last reply on the subject, as this has dragged on long enough.
If it doesn't happen in L4D games, it doesn't belong in here. And I am still offended that you would use my actions to attempt to paint vert and Stallion negatively.
Knee-jerk as in quick to judgment, like the idea that someone must hate you if they don't immediately reply to you in a Steam chat. I understand that you're claiming you're trying to improve in this regard. Fine, but I'll believe it when I see it.
I'm sure other people have their own feelings here, but I was particularly bothered by your apologizing for every mistake and then asking for permission to do anything. Just play the game. If you do something big, accept the praise; if something backfires, accept the rub.
I never suggested that anyone directed anything derogatory about your race, gender, or sexual orientation towards you. You're conflating the issue. You adopted a system of constant apologies and constant hand-holding in the face of some light-hearted scolding for going too soon, or making some other trivial mistake. That is having too thin of a skin.
Next time you post my personal information from a place unrelated to GAF, I'd like you to get my permission beforehand. I understand nothing sensitive was revealed in that specific screencap, but what if I used my real name for my mumble screen name? Or what if the chatlog contained links to revealing information. It is common courtesy to check with the people you are exposing to the internet, especially people who frequent the same forum and thread as you.
Your intent with posting the mumble chat isn't totally evident. To me, it seemed like you were trying to portray Nabs as some kind of bully.
You got into some tiff with Volyc for almost the exact same thing as what happened with Rocket Darkness. That was like, a month and half to two months ago. If a character flaw can be repaired within that span of time, then vert and his MOTD is irrelevant because that was like, five months ago. He is a changed man, now!
And no, I will not follow you from thread to thread bad mouthing you because 1) it would make it difficult for you to make new relationships and 2) would be in breach of forum conduct.
I blame your lack of specifics for any confusion on my part. Your statement that you've "played with many people around here" seemed to suggest you were targeting the broader GAF group and not our specific versus group.
Regardless, while your opinion is your own and you have your right to it no matter what, it does not trump my experience with the vert and Stallion, which is considerably larger and considerably more in-depth than yours. Unless you want to somehow count my experience and opinion as misinformed or less informed than your own, you'll have to agree that your experience is at best isolated and, at worst, intentionally misleading.
Then what is your goal in painting vert as immature? Or, worse, a homophobe? Or suggesting that he is overly and overtly mean or intimidating? Why do you post things from outside of GAF about other GAF members on GAF? Why do you attribute things a group of people did to just two members, who may have not even initiated or taken part in those activities?
If they aren't terrible people, I'd hate to see what you do to real assholes.
I'd have no problem with that being posted on my Steam wall. It wasn't terribly explicit and wouldn't be out of place on a Late Night talk show on network television (the gold standard for within-bounds-but-attempting-edge humor). However, that is just me and it is obviously more offensive to you, so you were within your right to delete the comment. No question there. How many times did vert post it to your wall? Does he still post on your wall? I'm sorry, but the evidence after-the-fact paints a different picture and you have a history of getting the details wrong.
As for the use of "faggot," I'm not sure what you want me to say exactly. I think in some situations it is okay? Am I a bad person now? I love the stand-up of Louis C.K., and he says it a lot. I love the Kids in the Hall and they work the word into at least one sketch per episode. You're saying it a lot in this very thread.
It's a terrible slur that homophobes use to degrade and ridicule gay people. No question. That doesn't mean that every use of the word is in an effort to degrade or ridicule gay people. If I thought for any moment that vert or anyone else was using the word to attempt to insult or demean a gay person, I'd break all ties with them immediately. I take the insinuation of bigotry of any kind very seriously, and while I have time for people from all walks and stations in life, I have no time for homophobia, racism, sexism, or discrimination.
Your consistent mischaracterizations of vert and Stallion haven't been explained away to my satisfaction (as you can only get so many details wrong until you're intentionally changing events to meet your own needs). But we'll have to agree to disagree on that.
Other than that, the other elements of the terms of service don't apply to you. However, you have broken GAF codes of conduct (which may or may not be explicitly outlined) by posting private material about other Gaffers on GAF without provocation (vert gets a pass because he was providing context you had otherwise misremembered). You've also made an effort to continually hound people in this thread and others.
You also got random people in the Team Fortress 2 thread talking shit about vert, a person they've never met. But that isn't necessarily a broken code of conduct, that's just obnoxious.
However, I'm not asking for you to be banned or anything, because they can otherwise be honest, if somewhat rude, mistakes. If we were lesser people we would be bringing up your failings at the drop of a hat in an effort to get you banned - but we don't.
Instead, I'm just asking you to relax and leave us alone. With that, I'm done.
I apologize profusely for what others in this thread have had to read.
Blizzard said:
If it doesn't happen in L4D games, it doesn't belong in here. And I am still offended that you would use my actions to attempt to paint vert and Stallion negatively.
Blizzard said:
Knee-jerk as in quick to judgment, like the idea that someone must hate you if they don't immediately reply to you in a Steam chat. I understand that you're claiming you're trying to improve in this regard. Fine, but I'll believe it when I see it.
I'm sure other people have their own feelings here, but I was particularly bothered by your apologizing for every mistake and then asking for permission to do anything. Just play the game. If you do something big, accept the praise; if something backfires, accept the rub.
Are you honestly saying "fucking faggot" is "typical backroom ribbing" for the group?
I never suggested that anyone directed anything derogatory about your race, gender, or sexual orientation towards you. You're conflating the issue. You adopted a system of constant apologies and constant hand-holding in the face of some light-hearted scolding for going too soon, or making some other trivial mistake. That is having too thin of a skin.
The only real "looking for pity" screenshot that I can think of was the ones where I posted the one with me locked out of the mumble chatroom, with text scribbled on it to be silly. If that bothered you, doesn't that mean you have a bit of thin skin too?
Next time you post my personal information from a place unrelated to GAF, I'd like you to get my permission beforehand. I understand nothing sensitive was revealed in that specific screencap, but what if I used my real name for my mumble screen name? Or what if the chatlog contained links to revealing information. It is common courtesy to check with the people you are exposing to the internet, especially people who frequent the same forum and thread as you.
Your intent with posting the mumble chat isn't totally evident. To me, it seemed like you were trying to portray Nabs as some kind of bully.
You got into some tiff with Volyc for almost the exact same thing as what happened with Rocket Darkness. That was like, a month and half to two months ago. If a character flaw can be repaired within that span of time, then vert and his MOTD is irrelevant because that was like, five months ago. He is a changed man, now!
And no, I will not follow you from thread to thread bad mouthing you because 1) it would make it difficult for you to make new relationships and 2) would be in breach of forum conduct.
No, I was saying that what you said was irrelevant because it did not apply to what I originally stated. What you originally responded to was this:
"two of the nicest people in our group" -> "Okay, seriously? I honestly have talked and played with MANY people around here and I hardly think that's fair.
What does this mean? It means I suggested those two were not two of the nicest people in the group in my opinion.
I blame your lack of specifics for any confusion on my part. Your statement that you've "played with many people around here" seemed to suggest you were targeting the broader GAF group and not our specific versus group.
Regardless, while your opinion is your own and you have your right to it no matter what, it does not trump my experience with the vert and Stallion, which is considerably larger and considerably more in-depth than yours. Unless you want to somehow count my experience and opinion as misinformed or less informed than your own, you'll have to agree that your experience is at best isolated and, at worst, intentionally misleading.
Then what is your goal in painting vert as immature? Or, worse, a homophobe? Or suggesting that he is overly and overtly mean or intimidating? Why do you post things from outside of GAF about other GAF members on GAF? Why do you attribute things a group of people did to just two members, who may have not even initiated or taken part in those activities?
If they aren't terrible people, I'd hate to see what you do to real assholes.
I'd have no problem with that being posted on my Steam wall. It wasn't terribly explicit and wouldn't be out of place on a Late Night talk show on network television (the gold standard for within-bounds-but-attempting-edge humor). However, that is just me and it is obviously more offensive to you, so you were within your right to delete the comment. No question there. How many times did vert post it to your wall? Does he still post on your wall? I'm sorry, but the evidence after-the-fact paints a different picture and you have a history of getting the details wrong.
As for the use of "faggot," I'm not sure what you want me to say exactly. I think in some situations it is okay? Am I a bad person now? I love the stand-up of Louis C.K., and he says it a lot. I love the Kids in the Hall and they work the word into at least one sketch per episode. You're saying it a lot in this very thread.
It's a terrible slur that homophobes use to degrade and ridicule gay people. No question. That doesn't mean that every use of the word is in an effort to degrade or ridicule gay people. If I thought for any moment that vert or anyone else was using the word to attempt to insult or demean a gay person, I'd break all ties with them immediately. I take the insinuation of bigotry of any kind very seriously, and while I have time for people from all walks and stations in life, I have no time for homophobia, racism, sexism, or discrimination.
Your consistent mischaracterizations of vert and Stallion haven't been explained away to my satisfaction (as you can only get so many details wrong until you're intentionally changing events to meet your own needs). But we'll have to agree to disagree on that.
Other than that, the other elements of the terms of service don't apply to you. However, you have broken GAF codes of conduct (which may or may not be explicitly outlined) by posting private material about other Gaffers on GAF without provocation (vert gets a pass because he was providing context you had otherwise misremembered). You've also made an effort to continually hound people in this thread and others.
You also got random people in the Team Fortress 2 thread talking shit about vert, a person they've never met. But that isn't necessarily a broken code of conduct, that's just obnoxious.
However, I'm not asking for you to be banned or anything, because they can otherwise be honest, if somewhat rude, mistakes. If we were lesser people we would be bringing up your failings at the drop of a hat in an effort to get you banned - but we don't.
Instead, I'm just asking you to relax and leave us alone. With that, I'm done.
I apologize profusely for what others in this thread have had to read.