I'm not a big fan but this tells me he wrote or decided on what the the back story would be about after the original movie was a success and what direction 5 would go in.
Well Lucas did have many revisions, and several of them were very prequel-esque (a LOT of politic crap). However the first revisions did intend A New Hope to be the first film, and then Lucas just didn't know what the fuck he wanted to do. He still doesn't, apparently.
Mama Robotnik said:
No. Despite certain good things I have heard about them on occasion, I can't quite take them seriously due to their association with those three terrible movies. The story, dialogue, characters, actions and everything else about those prequels is so absurd, they actually taint associated products with their idiocy, at least to me.
No. Despite certain good things I have heard about them on occasion, I can't quite take them seriously due to their association with those three terrible movies. The story, dialogue, characters, actions and everything else about those prequels is so absurd, they actually taint associated products with their idiocy, at least to me.
It's one thing to dislike the prequels because they are bad movies, but it's another thing to completely associate everything related to it to be bad as well. That's not being a Star Wars fan, but having a symptom of anterograde amnesia.
Either way, the stuff associated with the Prequels doesn't have to be bad (and it isn't), since the universe introduced in the Prequel movies is deeper and more imaginative than the empty void of an universe alluded to in the Star Wars OT, despite the OT being much better movies.
The only redeeming thing about the prequels was Plinkett's incredibly entertaining reviews of them.
One of the best points he makes is how creatively bankrupt the prequels really are despite the incredible (at the time) visual spectacle.
Willy105 said:
Either way, the stuff associated with the Prequels doesn't have to be bad (and it isn't), since the universe introduced in the Prequel movies is deeper and more imaginative than the empty void of an universe alluded to in the Star Wars OT, despite the OT being much better movies.
What really makes Star Wars special, to give George Lucas some due credit after all, is the imaginative universe he created. The settings, the backstory, the technologies and creatures that inhabit the SW universe, the music, the overall atmosphere....it all comes together to make for a really engrossing cinematic experience if used right. It really is kind of unprecedented what he did in that sense, IMO. Also why there's so much potential for great videogames even if they have little or no relation to the movies....Jedi Knight, KOTOR, X-Wing vs TIE Fighter, etc. And the OT movies just did that much better than the prequels did. The prequels fucked it all up with boring pretentious stories and characters you can't give a shit and a half about. Those movies may tie some things together story-wise, but I feel they completely missed the mark on what made the original movies special, and I have a hard time saying they're worth watching because of that.
What really makes Star Wars special, to give George Lucas some due credit after all, is the imaginative universe he created. The settings, the backstory, the technologies and creatures that inhabit the SW universe, the music, the overall atmosphere....it all comes together to make for a really engrossing cinematic experience if used right. It really is kind of unprecedented what he did in that sense, IMO. Also why there's so much potential for great videogames even if they have little or no relation to the movies....Jedi Knight, KOTOR, X-Wing vs TIE Fighter, etc. And the OT movies just did that much better than the prequels did. The prequels fucked it all up with boring pretentious stories and characters you can't give a shit and a half about. Those movies may tie some things together story-wise, but I feel they completely missed the mark on what made the original movies special, and I have a hard time saying they're worth watching because of that.
I don't know, if you boil it down, it is just laser swords and magic/psychic powers. Add some rubber aliens, and everything else that is cool comes from designers, directors, composers, someone other than Lucas.
/cynical jerk
I really do think it is great in spite of him more than because of him though. I mean, he wiped out any credit he deserved for the creation of the SW universe with his midichlorian crap.
You can boil any movie down mundane elements like that. But like I said, it's how you use them, how it's put together. The OT movies were just much more successful at that.
Also, I'm aware that not everything in the movies came from the mind of George Lucas, but let's get real, he created Star Wars. And correct me if I'm wrong as I'm no Star Wars behind-the-scenes buff, but I'm sure he also had a hand in putting together the team that made the movies.
You can boil any movie down mundane elements like that. But like I said, it's how you use them, how it's put together. The OT movies were just much more successful at that.
Also, I'm aware that not everything in the movies came from the mind of George Lucas, but let's get real, he created Star Wars. And correct me if I'm wrong as I'm no Star Wars behind-the-scenes buff, but I'm sure he also had a hand in putting together the team that made the movies.
EU is just as expansive as anything that can come from the prequels. I think I give it a slight edge because they did introduce new concept (powers and whatnot) there were not directly pulled from the OT.
How weird this thread would come about, I've actually just started watching the movies myself. I saw bits and pieces when I was a little kid, but it was 15-17 years ago, so I wouldn't remember even if I saw the whole movies. Just finished Empire Strikes Back.
The extra CG characters Lucas has thrown into random parts of the background are fucking atrocious, though. And you would think if they're adding and trying to "fix" shit, they could at least fix the herky-jerky stop-motions when things like doors lift open or close, it's so awful and ancient. Either do it right, or leave it the fuck alone, Lucas.
Also, why is Luke's pod pink in the first movie? And the binary-sun set? I recall it being off-white in the VHS...lots of weird changes everywhere, it's pretty disturbing. And Vader's lightsaber is pink now instead of the crimson red it was on the VHS tapes - double wtf?
Oddly enough, I did see Episode I and II in the theaters, and I recall them being utterly awful, so I never watched Episode III. But I guess I'll have to give them all a shot again. I must say I am shocked at what a staggering difference in quality Indiana Jones and Star Wars films have - Spielberg must surely have kept Lucas' shit in check back then...though there was no excuse for the ending of Crystal Skull. :|
Reposting this again, here's an interesting viewing order that tries to keep certain story reveals more of a surprise than if you watched things in timeline order (1-6). Since the OP hasn't seen any of the films, spoilering a bunch of it.
1: Ep. 4, A New Hope - Introduces you to the story, concepts, and characters. The best way to start the mythos, no doubt. Lucas did good using this as a starting point.
2: Ep. 1, The Phantom Menace - Goes back to the things Obi Wan Kenobi was talking about.
You still think Luke's Father was a hero, and you see the similarities between them. The Jedi still seem wise, and the Sith evil, though it's apparent the Republic is on its last legs.
3: Ep. 2, Attack of the Clones - Further elaborates on the history.
By now, a few people should be picking up clues, especially visual clues with the Clone Trooper armor and Anakin's revenge upon the sandpeople. Mysteries are no good unless you have some chance of deducing the truth. Things begin to get dark at this point.
4: Ep. 5, The Empire Strikes Back -
To those with some deductive ability, Vader's interest in Luke is a further clue, especially "He's only a Boy. Obi Wan can no longer help him". Most newbies to the series haven't figured it out yet, though it's tugging in the back of their brains. When Vader finally tells him, probably 10 to 20 percent of the audience is going "I knew it!", but the rest are still going "Oh shit...". But after the revelation, it all makes sense. Otherwise, thee's still the possibility that Vader is simply lying to Luke. We're about to hit the low point with...
5: Ep. 3, Revenge of the Sith -
Now that we know that Vader is Luke's father, we want to know "what the hell happened to cause the change?". We now fully grasp Palpatine's deceptions, how he got an Empire, and the buttons he was helping to push to get Anakin to the Dark Side. But we also lose some sympathy for the Jedi, for by now, it's not that we realize they're inept, but that they are, in their own way, as arrogant as the Sith, but their arrogance blinds them. We get the sense that the Old Republic really wasn't worth saving, but that the coming Empire will be worse (Alderaan, anyone?). But most important...the Luke and Leia revelation is a SURPRISE this way...when it's revealed in 6, it was done in a totally cheesy way. This is a far better way to spring another "Oh crap!" on people. We also have sympathy for Anakin/Vader, as we understand he's not a monolithic evil villain; we understand his reasonings, where he went wrong, and that through it all, he was trying to do right by those he loved, and that he was being used (by both sides). But we also see just how twisted he became. The Emperor makes much more sense at this point as well...all questions about him are answered.
6: Ep. 6 Return of the Jedi -
The only remaining question at this point is now "Can Luke turn Vader back?". Also, we get more insight on the Jedi, especially the hippy-dippy "our own point of view" crap, that reveals that while why the old Jedi were more refined and powerful, Luke is a better man. He's more honest and straightforward, and is more in tune with the good side of the force, because he's not a moral relativist; and that's precisely what the old Jedi had become. They bent the rules whenever it suited them in the Clone Wars because, after all, they're the Jedi. In many ways, they had become as bad as the Sith. This is why they couldn't see the Sith coming, and it's why it's good the old Jedi Order was destroyed. Luke will rebuild it from the ground up, with a much more honest perspective. We also cheer when Vader is gone and Anakin is back; the prophecy if fulfilled. Anakin brings balance to the Force by killing the Emperor, and for the love of his son. It was a long, twisting, winding road, but it all makes sense now. The New Republic can start without the baggage of the corrupt Old Republic, and a new, BETTER Jedi can begin with Luke and Leia.
Watch the original versions of episodes IV, V, and VI. There are DVDs out there that are just transfers of the laserdisc versions. Stay away from anything labeled Special Edition, any sort of bonus content, anything updated or added. An easy way to tell early on: if Han didn't shoot first (first as in Greedo didn't shoot at all) you are doing it wrong.
Once that's out of the way, do whatever you want.
If you want more Star Wars read the Timothy Zahn book trilogy that kicked off a universe of crappy Star Wars novels, but stop there. Now that you know who Admiral Thrawn is, play some PC X-Wing and Tie Fighter, the latter will be so much better for it. You can watch some Clone Wars cartoons I guess if you really want.
Don't watch the prequels first. Otherwise, you will think Jar Jar Binks is the most vile creature in the galaxy and lord of all evil as opposed to Palpatine or Vader.
I would argue that ep. 1 was the best of the prequels. There were a few changes that could have been made that would have made it a decent start to the prequel. Episode 2 and 3, there's just no hope, it's all ruined.
Why would I endorse something in a gray legal area given where I work? Or are you just trying to goad me into getting the legal guys involved, which I'm really trying not to bother with?
I would argue that ep. 1 was the best of the prequels. There were a few changes that could have been made that would have made it a decent start to the prequel. Episode 2 and 3, there's just no hope, it's all ruined.
Why would I endorse something in a gray legal area given where I work? Or are you just trying to goad me into getting the legal guys involved, which I'm really trying not to bother with?
Why would I endorse something in a gray legal area given where I work? Or are you just trying to goad me into getting the legal guys involved, which I'm really trying not to bother with?
Reposting this again, here's an interesting viewing order that tries to keep certain story reveals more of a surprise than if you watched things in timeline order (1-6). Since the OP hasn't seen any of the films, spoilering a bunch of it.
1: Ep. 4, A New Hope - Introduces you to the story, concepts, and characters. The best way to start the mythos, no doubt. Lucas did good using this as a starting point.
2: Ep. 1, The Phantom Menace - Goes back to the things Obi Wan Kenobi was talking about.
You still think Luke's Father was a hero, and you see the similarities between them. The Jedi still seem wise, and the Sith evil, though it's apparent the Republic is on its last legs.
3: Ep. 2, Attack of the Clones - Further elaborates on the history.
By now, a few people should be picking up clues, especially visual clues with the Clone Trooper armor and Anakin's revenge upon the sandpeople. Mysteries are no good unless you have some chance of deducing the truth. Things begin to get dark at this point.
4: Ep. 5, The Empire Strikes Back -
To those with some deductive ability, Vader's interest in Luke is a further clue, especially "He's only a Boy. Obi Wan can no longer help him". Most newbies to the series haven't figured it out yet, though it's tugging in the back of their brains. When Vader finally tells him, probably 10 to 20 percent of the audience is going "I knew it!", but the rest are still going "Oh shit...". But after the revelation, it all makes sense. Otherwise, thee's still the possibility that Vader is simply lying to Luke. We're about to hit the low point with...
5: Ep. 3, Revenge of the Sith -
Now that we know that Vader is Luke's father, we want to know "what the hell happened to cause the change?". We now fully grasp Palpatine's deceptions, how he got an Empire, and the buttons he was helping to push to get Anakin to the Dark Side. But we also lose some sympathy for the Jedi, for by now, it's not that we realize they're inept, but that they are, in their own way, as arrogant as the Sith, but their arrogance blinds them. We get the sense that the Old Republic really wasn't worth saving, but that the coming Empire will be worse (Alderaan, anyone?). But most important...the Luke and Leia revelation is a SURPRISE this way...when it's revealed in 6, it was done in a totally cheesy way. This is a far better way to spring another "Oh crap!" on people. We also have sympathy for Anakin/Vader, as we understand he's not a monolithic evil villain; we understand his reasonings, where he went wrong, and that through it all, he was trying to do right by those he loved, and that he was being used (by both sides). But we also see just how twisted he became. The Emperor makes much more sense at this point as well...all questions about him are answered.
6: Ep. 6 Return of the Jedi -
The only remaining question at this point is now "Can Luke turn Vader back?". Also, we get more insight on the Jedi, especially the hippy-dippy "our own point of view" crap, that reveals that while why the old Jedi were more refined and powerful, Luke is a better man. He's more honest and straightforward, and is more in tune with the good side of the force, because he's not a moral relativist; and that's precisely what the old Jedi had become. They bent the rules whenever it suited them in the Clone Wars because, after all, they're the Jedi. In many ways, they had become as bad as the Sith. This is why they couldn't see the Sith coming, and it's why it's good the old Jedi Order was destroyed. Luke will rebuild it from the ground up, with a much more honest perspective. We also cheer when Vader is gone and Anakin is back; the prophecy if fulfilled. Anakin brings balance to the Force by killing the Emperor, and for the love of his son. It was a long, twisting, winding road, but it all makes sense now. The New Republic can start without the baggage of the corrupt Old Republic, and a new, BETTER Jedi can begin with Luke and Leia.
Yoda in episode 5 and seeing episode 1 and 2 first would ruin him.
Slapping on numbers doesn't change it's a prequel trilogy, which, by definition, assumes you know what happens in the future.
Assuming it's a good story, and assuming you watch them second, prequels are a pretty bad ass story telling method to use in a universe with a lot of events and mythology.
