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[aidan]

Other than being disappointed (but not surprised) that it won't include pre-standard cards for a long time (if ever), I'm very happy with what they showed off. I think they're doing a lot of things right, and their messaging indicates that they *get it*.

Fingers crossed for a beta invite.

 

[SigmasonicX]

Arena looks pretty good. I'm not sure why anyone is surprised that they're keeping MTGO around for now. Even if the plan is to phase it out over time, they wouldn't want to scare people away from spending money on it in the meantime.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Arena looks pretty good. I'm not sure why anyone is surprised that they're keeping MTGO around for now. Even if the plan is to phase it out over time, they wouldn't want to scare people away from spending money on it in the meantime.

Like I've said for years since this Next thing came out, they're not going to just shelve MTGO unless they're confident in the replacement. If this takes off it could happen. If it doesn't they'll just run MTGO like always.

 

[Ashodin]

You guys have to realize that there are a FUCKTON of disgruntled Hearthstone players out there right now. Looking at the subreddit, the topics are usually just bitching about how one class is more OP than the others (yes, Blizzard brought their WoW mentality of "one class feels more OP than the others, let's bitch" over), the developer doesn't know what they're doing in regards to balance, etc.

These players are looking for a better or new game to jump in, and they've always heard MTG was the "best" card game. So with Arena, they will get in at the base level on a "new" card game and bolster the ranks.

 

[Ri'Orius]

Just announced you can reorder the cards in your hand.

Yeah, but does it reorder them on your opponent's side as well? Meaning it keeps the "follow the cards" mechanic but just makes it even more bullshit?

Plus, I feel like enough players won't manually reorder cards that it might still be worthwhile to keep track. Or rather, I'll feel bad for not bothering to keep track. Again, it's the sort of minuscule difference that nobody really cares about eliminating it, but it still bothers me.

Cards tapping not all the way is feedback from players that tapped cards looked "weird" digitally.

With the aspect ratio they're using I'm not surprised. Turning a 4x3(ish) thing 90 degrees would look very different than the 2x3 we're used to.

 

[shrapnelmagnet]

fuck no

It turns into Always Watching

My guess is Kjeldoran Outpost, token gen

 

[Ashodin]

Oh interesting, you can sign up for closed beta at the Ixalan prerelease. And you'll get priority if you do.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Maybe the blue one turns into Tolarian Academy!

 

[divisionbyzorro]

They should give us MTGO beta testers priority lol

 

[Good Job Bob]

Yeah, but does it reorder them on your opponent's side as well? Meaning it keeps the "follow the cards" mechanic but just makes it even more bullshit?

Plus, I feel like enough players won't manually reorder cards that it might still be worthwhile to keep track. Or rather, I'll feel bad for not bothering to keep track. Again, it's the sort of minuscule difference that nobody really cares about eliminating it, but it still bothers me.

Yes they mentioned that you will be able to see your opponents reordering their cards around.

 

[Ashodin]

Maybe the blue one turns into Tolarian Academy!

It could. Treasures are artifacts.

 

[Haly]

The feature was probably designed to lure Kibler away from that sweet HS dosh.

 

[bigkrev]

You guys have to realize that there are a FUCKTON of disgruntled Hearthstone players out there right now. Looking at the subreddit, the topics are usually just bitching about how one class is more OP than the others (yes, Blizzard brought their WoW mentality of "one class feels more OP than the others, let's bitch" over), the developer doesn't know what they're doing in regards to balance, etc.

These players are looking for a better or new game to jump in, and they've always heard MTG was the "best" card game. So with Arena, they will get in at the base level on a "new" card game and bolster the ranks.

And most Standard formats only have 3-5 viable tier1 decks. Magic isn't going to fix the stale meta issue Hearthstone has

 

[Ashodin]

not bad

 

[Firemind]

You guys have to realize that there are a FUCKTON of disgruntled Hearthstone players out there right now. Looking at the subreddit, the topics are usually just bitching about how one class is more OP than the others (yes, Blizzard brought their WoW mentality of "one class feels more OP than the others, let's bitch" over), the developer doesn't know what they're doing in regards to balance, etc.

These players are looking for a better or new game to jump in, and they've always heard MTG was the "best" card game. So with Arena, they will get in at the base level on a "new" card game and bolster the ranks.

Blizard doesn't know anything about balance. Their philosophy is to design more broken shit so everyone will forget about the old broken shit and the cycle begins anew.

 

[Ashodin]

And most Standard formats only have 3-5 viable tier1 decks. Magic isn't going to fix the stale meta issue Hearthstone has

What? Standard right now has every week someone coming up with another deck to beat the previous week's deck. The only one with staying power right now is Ramunap Red

Mardu Freakin' Vehicles won last week's GP.

 

[thefil]

I am tentatively happy with what they showed. A F2P model with a Standard-size card pool sounds great for me, and I like the compromise they came up with for snappiness vs stops/"full control" mode.

The only big question is how limited works. I play sealed/draft primarily and MTGO is too expensive for me to play regularly since I don't do well enough to go infinite.

 

[The Technomancer]

Blizard doesn't know anything about balance. Their philosophy is to design more broken shit so everyone will forget about the old broken shit and the cycle begins anew.

To be fair trading card game balance is also fucking hard

 

[ultron87]

You guys have to realize that there are a FUCKTON of disgruntled Hearthstone players out there right now. Looking at the subreddit, the topics are usually just bitching about how one class is more OP than the others (yes, Blizzard brought their WoW mentality of "one class feels more OP than the others, let's bitch" over), the developer doesn't know what they're doing in regards to balance, etc.

These players are looking for a better or new game to jump in, and they've always heard MTG was the "best" card game. So with Arena, they will get in at the base level on a "new" card game and bolster the ranks.

I went back to Hearthstone over last weekend and I already want to die every time someone plays a Jade Golem.

 

[Justin]

Mardu Freakin' Vehicles won last week's GP.

Dont forget UB Control won the Turin GP last week as well

 

[FreedomFrisbee]

It's really surprising to me how stubbornly head-in-the-sand MTGO proponents are about this. Saffron Olive tweeted multiple complaints while the stream was occurring, said complaints were then addressed on stream, and then he still refuses to believe anyone would play Arena over MTGO. Arena is very clearly being setup to eat MTGO from the inside out.

 

[Angry Grimace]

It's really surprising to me how stubbornly head-in-the-sand MTGO proponents are about this. Saffron Olive tweeted multiple complaints while the stream was occurring, said complaints were then addressed on stream, and then he still refuses to believe anyone would play Arena over MTGO. Arena is very clearly being setup to eat MTGO from the inside out.

I don't think it has a ghost of a chance to actually do that. It's not set up to do so.

 

[Ashodin]

http://www.ign.com/articles/2017/09...a-hands-on-recreating-the-tabletop-experience

IGN article with hands on

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

people are gonna be flabbergasted how quickly mtgo will lose importance if arena takes off

 

[Firemind]

It's really surprising to me how stubbornly head-in-the-sand MTGO proponents are about this. Saffron Olive tweeted multiple complaints while the stream was occurring, said complaints were then addressed on stream, and then he still refuses to believe anyone would play Arena over MTGO. Arena is very clearly being setup to eat MTGO from the inside out.

it's f2p so it's remarkably different from just that aspect.

i wonder how they will deal with drafting...

 

[Justin]

It's really surprising to me how stubbornly head-in-the-sand MTGO proponents are about this. Saffron Olive tweeted multiple complaints while the stream was occurring, said complaints were then addressed on stream, and then he still refuses to believe anyone would play Arena over MTGO. Arena is very clearly being setup to eat MTGO from the inside out.

I was lolin that he had a couple of angry tweets about it not having a stack or stops then when they showed it did he was upsed it had TOO MANY stops.

 

[El Topo]

To be fair trading card game balance is also fucking hard

I wonder what scientific analysis there exists for these kind of things. Surely some mathematician with too much free time has sat down to tackle this thing, not to solve it, but at least to gain some insight into it.

people are gonna be flabbergasted how quickly mtgo will lose importance if arena takes off

If.

 

[Ashodin]

people are gonna be flabbergasted how quickly mtgo will lose importance if arena takes off

I'm excited for it because only I like schadenfreude and high-and-mighty people getting the rugs pulled out from under them

 

[The Technomancer]

I don't think it has a ghost of a chance to actually do that. It's not set up to do so.

I think this is accurate, but in a way that's not complimentary to MTGO. My general impression from a decade+ of talking about Magic online (not Magic Online) is that mostly people play MTGO because its the only accessible way to play Vintage formats, or that they use it as a brew testing scene

I'm not sure how much of the current MTGO playerbase does it for fun exactly, in the way that Magic is more broadly fun in a "lets play a game over lunch!" sort of way.. Arena looks like its absolutely the product to finally fucking provide that
Especially in recent years MTGO almost feels like a utility

 

[Santiako]

people are gonna be flabbergasted how quickly mtgo will lose importance if arena takes off

Yeah, no reason to stream mtgo if you can stream arena.

 

[aidan]

I wonder what scientific analysis there exists for these kind of things. Surely some mathematician with too much free time has sat down to tackle this thing, not to solve it, but at least to gain some insight into it.

I mean, MTG was literally created and designed by a mathematician.

 

[Justin]

From the IGN article for the guy worried about moving cards around in your hand

Matches start with, of course, your deck of cards on one end of the playing field, and the opposing player’s on the other, with real-time animations to show you when they’re looking at a specific card, or if they’re moving things around in their deck. You can’t see their actual cards, but this is intended to give you a sense of their deliberation so it really feels like two players teaming up against each other, rather than two characters with avatars.

 

[FreedomFrisbee]

I don't think it has a ghost of a chance to actually do that. It's not set up to do so.

They were very clear that they were looking at more formats, old sets, connecting Arena to the physical game, making it matter competitively, and growing it over time. It is really already set up to subsume any digital demand for standard. As time goes on it will become easier to have modern. The only thing that is relatively safe is Vintage and Legacy on MTGO.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

Can I unlock something that makes my hand constantly shuffle when it's not my turn?

 

[HK-47]

Yeah, no reason to stream mtgo if you can stream arena.

Unless you want to play anything Arena doesn't support

 

[aidan]

Can I unlock something that makes my hand constantly shuffle when it's not my turn?

Kibler DLC.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Unless you want to play anything Arena doesn't support

the most popular streams tend to be draft already. Numot is almost exclusively a drafter and gaby, lsv and others do mostly drafts as well.

 

[Santiako]

Unless you want to play anything Arena doesn't support

Obviously.

 

[El Topo]

I mean, MTG was literally created and designed by a mathematician.

I was talking about the underlying mathematical theory and scientific analysis though. As a mathematician that has no knowledge whatsoever in that field I would love to know what kind of work has been put into this.
Since you brought up Garfield:"Balance is an art, not a science." (Interesting older article actually.)

 

[HK-47]

the most popular streams tend to be draft already. Numot is almost exclusively a drafter and gaby, lsv and others do mostly drafts as well.

Cube and modern are also quite big.

 

[Wamb0wneD]

This looks better than I expected. Really looking forward to try this.

 

[Ashodin]

the most popular streams tend to be draft already. Numot is almost exclusively a drafter and gaby, lsv and others do mostly drafts as well.

drafts are easier to watch because it's usually only one or two sets that people have to know about. When it's the chaos drafts and older drafts, it can get crazier, but I bet this is the reason why.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

I'd bet that they'll add support for the 500 or so cards they need to make Legacy and/or Vintage Cube work.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

drafts are easier to watch because it's usually only one or two sets that people have to know about. When it's the chaos drafts and older drafts, it can get crazier, but I bet this is the reason why.

I think it's easier for chat to feel included, it's hard to play along someone in your head if they are piloting a deck you don't know much about even if you know the cards.

Also much more engaging if you disagree about picks in draft.

 

[Tunoku]

Can I unlock something that makes my hand constantly shuffle when it's not my turn?

You have to buy a Rockstar energy drink at a participating retailer and punch in the code.

 

[Ashodin]

I think it's easier for chat to feel included, it's hard to play along someone in your head if they are piloting a deck you don't know much about even if you know the cards.

Also much more engaging if you disagree about picks in draft.

I expect a lot more "MISSED LETHAL" comments in chat

 

[Yeef]

It's an interesting design decision that the opponent can seem to see where your cursor is. In the IGN video, while the person playing is doing their thing, you can see which card in hand the opponent is mousing over as well as when he was looking through his graveyard. It does leave the door open to some of the bluffing you can do in the paper game.

 

[aidan]

I'd bet that they'll add support for the 500 or so cards they need to make Legacy and/or Vintage Cube work.

Adding cube drafts seems like a good way to give players access to "old" magic, without having to import 15k+ cards into the system.

I think it's easier for chat to feel included, it's hard to play along someone in your head if they are piloting a deck you don't know much about even if you know the cards.

Also much more engaging if you disagree about picks in draft.

Yeah. Being "involved" in the deckbuilding aspect if a huge point of investment for people watching a stream. I won't watch someone if I missed that portion of the draft.

 

[Ashodin]

Apparently HASCON goers can get hands on demo with MTG Arena while there.

 

[aidan]

I feel like we've sort of glossed over the fact that Gaea's Cradle is coming to Standard.