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Magic: The Gathering |OT3| Enchantment Under the Siege

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T

Toxi

Banned
Jesus, the more I think about Soulfire Grand Master, the better it seems. It's extremely versatile in the benefits it provides. Everything but control (hell, maybe even control) gains something from it. Its mana cost and the hybrid for it's activated ability make it fairly splashable.

Even discounting the survivability and card advantage it provides, it's a life linking bear for 2; that's pretty efficient and means you aren't risking a below-the-curve creature when you include it or a high mana investment if it's removed.

This is probably a card that will be used long after it has left standard, because buyback Lifelink Lightning Bolt is nuts.
 
T

Toxi

Banned
LOL @ some people online saying Soulfire Grandmaster is bad because it dies to removal. It's 2 mana. That's like complaining how Dark Confidant dies to removal.

OnPoint said:
Probably why most of them these days have "exile this spell" on it nowadays.
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Yeah, I'm almost certain they were thinking about that when they made the delve Time Walk.
 
M

Matriox

Member
ChannelFireball_Palace-Siege_20141230.jpg


Wish it did something Etb but could be a slow roll win con for control.
 
T

Toxi

Banned
I'm liking that enchantment.
Cosmo Clock 21 said:
"dies to removal" is basically the godwin's law of creature card evaluation.
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Actual quote from MtGS
I'm astonished to see how many people believe that Soulfire Grand Master is a future cash rare. She's good, no doubt, but come on, how many creatures with powerful effects do we have even in the actual Standard format that are only worth some bucks? Just look at Sidisi, Brood Tyrant, and she wins the game by herself much sooner than this one.

Giving lifelink to spells is almost irrelevant out of a burn strategy, and in this case she will surely be dead the very moment she touches the battlefield, before you have the chance to cast all your relevant burn spells; and if we go out of Standard, playing her on turn 2 is just giving a timewalk to the opponent, since you're losing an entire turn without throwing damage to the opponent. I see her very useful in a control strategy, though, thanks to that buyback ability, but even this is useful only in Standard. Modern has Snapcaster Mage to use again good spells, and we don't need to be a genious to understand that he's more surprising and Snappy + Bolt/Helix/Mana Leak/Remand etc. costs less than spell + Grandmaster's buyback.

Unfortunately, if the hype goes up so high without even having had the possibility to test this card, her price will skyrocket without any real reason, just like the king of nothingness, unplayed for an entire season and only barely played right now...
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D

divisionbyzorro

Member
Comparing price to KTK is absurd. KTK gets drafted in triplicate and for longer. FRF will get drafted a pittance compared to KTK. Constructed-playable rares from FRF will fetch a fairly high price tag.
 
T

ThLunarian

Member
A lot of that quote is on point actually. I wouldn't say that playing it turn 2 is a Time Walk, but it's easily answerable and doesn't run away with the game like Rabblemaster does.

Who cares that your burn spells gain life? Only straight burn decks and balls-out aggro do. Burn decks can get rid of it efficiently, so really only the stompy decks will care.

The activated ability is good, but its way too mana intensive to put you ahead in the game. If you have time to start buying back your stuff AND the opponent can't get rid of a 2/2, then yeah it helps. That's why I feel it's just a win-more card.
 
O

OnPoint

Member
I think a Boros Burn/Aggro deck would love that card.

4x Soulfire Grandmaster
4x Eidelon of the Great Revel
4x Anger of the Gods
4x Lightning Strike
4x Magma Jet
4x Stoke the Flames
4x Hordling Outburst
4x Goblin Rablemaster
2x Chandra Pyromaster
1x Sarkhan KTK

Eh? Eh?

I know, I get that Anger + Tokens = nonbo, but at the same time, Anger + Tokens + Grandmaster = lots o life to gain
 
T

Toxi

Banned
ThLunarian said:
A lot of that quote is on point actually. I wouldn't say that playing it turn 2 is a Time Walk, but it's easily answerable and doesn't run away with the game like Rabblemaster does.
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Rabblemaster and it serve completely different purposes.

ThLunarian said:
Who cares that your burn spells gain life? Only straight burn decks and balls-out aggro do. Burn decks can get rid of it efficiently, so really only the stompy decks will care.
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This shows a misconception about how burn works. If your 2 mana creature forces a burn deck to immediately remove it, that's a very good thing. Burn is a deck based on limited resources. If they're using burn to attack your cheap creatures on turn 2, they're not using it to burn you.

Also, gaining life is fine against anything that's not control or combo. Narrow life gain is bad against anything but fast decks, but Grand Master isn't narrow; she's an on-curve creature with amazing late-game utility.

ThLunarian said:
The activated ability is good, but its way too mana intensive to put you ahead in the game. If you have time to start buying back your stuff AND the opponent can't get rid of a 2/2, then yeah it helps. That's why I feel it's just a win-more card.
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The activated ability gives you more gas in the late game because you can reuse your spells while you're topdecking lands. Again, think of what this card does with Lightning Bolt.

The only deck where I feel Soulfire Grand Master dying to removal is actually a serious issue is burn, because one of burn's draws is that removal spells are dead weight against it. I can see this being a sideboard for burn, but not main deck.
 
W

WanderingWind

Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
ThLunarian said:
Who cares that your burn spells gain life?
Click to expand...

Every single burn player who has ever played burn in the history of the entire game. Besides them, nobody. The one glaring weakness burn has had is that you run out of life quick when you have no blockers. This fixes this. Twice, even. It turns Bolts into Helixes for 1 mana. It turns Helix into a 9 point life swing. It's in colors burn has support for with Boros Charm and Helix.

Short of just "Deal 20 damage to an opponent" this is about as awesome as it gets for two mana in a deck archetype that already exists. Now, in standard, that's a bit more of a squeeze, but there is a zero percent chance this doesn't see standard play. Especially if there is at least one good, playable direct burn spell for 2 mana or less. Even as it stands, I'm definitely going to try it out in place of Student in Jeskai. I'll have to play around with it though.
 
K

kirblar

Member
Upon second thought, Shamanic Revelation is

a) One hell of a trolly name

b) Might be very good

If you have 3 dudes out, and 1 is 4 power, its Sphinx's Revelation for 5 at Sorcery speed.
 
H

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
Does MtGS ever have crow-eating threads? I feel like with the way the board reacts to new cards, that they'd have crow buffets after every set.
 
H

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
They could just eat it raw, like crow sashimi.
 
T

Toxi

Banned
WanderingWind said:
Every single burn player who has ever played burn in the history of the entire game. Besides them, nobody. The one glaring weakness burn has had is that you run out of life quick when you have no blockers. This fixes this. Twice, ever. It turns Bolts into Helixes for 1 mana. It turns Helix into a 9 point life swing. It's in colors burn has support for with Boros Charm and Helix.
Click to expand...
The main issue I see with multicolor burn is that you give up Back to Basics and Wasteland immunity. I guess it's not an issue in modern though.
 
W

WanderingWind

Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Toxi said:
The main issue I see with multicolor burn is that you give up Back to Basics and Wasteland immunity. Fine in Modern, dangerous in Legacy.
Click to expand...

I don't really track too much with Legacy, so I normally speak about modern and standard. Don't know shit about commander either. I just slap a bunch of angels in one deck, vampires in another and battle.
 
O

OnPoint

Member
Toxi said:
The main issue I see with multicolor burn is that you give up Back to Basics and Wasteland immunity. I guess it's not an issue in modern though.
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Well wait. If you played Price of Progress with Soulfire Grand Master out, wouldn't it negate your own life loss, while gaining you whatever your opponent took? That seems preeeeeeetty good.
 
F

Firemind

Member
I thought we were moving away from efficient 4-of bears as mythics. It has a rad ability but still.

divisionbyzorro said:
This was what I submitted. The biggest problem in the deck was a lack of card draw outside of the draw-sevens; there just weren't any card draw spells showing up in the draft, and my inability to push through my deck fast enough hurt me. I had to play some marginal (bad) cards to make playables; I wasn't expecting to 3-0 or anything, but I know the deck would have been able to win at least one round if it hadn't gotten quite so unlucky.
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You're also missing tutors. I find tutors can make up for a lack of card draw since Yawgmoth's Will is the best card draw spell you can have as storm. My storm decks with the best results were ones that also had an alternate win condition, like Tinker or Upheaval. Now you have Oath of Druids which is pretty sweet since it always seems to go around late.
 
D

divisionbyzorro

Member
Firemind said:
You're also missing tutors. I find tutors can make up for a lack of card draw since Yawgmoth's Will is the best card draw spell you can have as storm. My storm decks with the best results were ones that also had an alternate win condition, like Tinker or Upheaval. Now you have Oath of Druids which is pretty sweet since it always seems to go around late.
Click to expand...

Trust me, if tutors were there, I would have taken them. Fair point on the alt-win-con; I wasn't really looking for that during the draft, and if I go this route again I'll keep that in mind. Storm is such a risk from top to bottom; you need so many things to go right in the draft and in the pairings to make it work. But it was sweet to go off; I'm just really disappointed that it didn't get there. I felt like I got really unlucky to run into a Time Vault deck in round one that also had the cards to blank Brain Freeze, and doubly unlucky to run into mono-red round two. Round three I was so close in games two and three after getting there game one; it was such a heartbreak.

Oh well. There's still plenty of cube to play. Maybe I can just open Upheaval again, or Time Vault, or something sick and straightforward ;).
 
W

Wichu

Member
Finally got around to making a new avatar, vaguely in time for FRF hype. Ugin is (quite literally) a pale imitation of the true dragon planeswalker :p
 
F

Firemind

Member
W828oWD.png
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Um, yeah. I didn't even first pick griselbrand and emrakul; they just got passed to me! Too bad I had to leave Tinker and Leviathan in the sideboard. Not enough artifacts. ;-;

Wichu said:
Finally got around to making a new avatar, vaguely in time for FRF hype. Ugin is (quite literally) a pale imitation of the true dragon planeswalker :p
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:fistbump

edit: quickest wins ever. me: show and tell emrakul/griselbrand. my opponent: land. force of will still in hand for whatever answer they might have. shit I feel dirty playing a legacy deck.
 
G

"God's Beard!"

Member
Firemind said:
Um, yeah. I didn't even first pick griselbrand and emrakul; they just got passed to me! Too bad I had to leave Tinker and Leviathan in the sideboard. Not enough artifacts. ;-;



:fistbump

edit: quickest wins ever. me: show and tell emrakul/griselbrand. my opponent: land. force of will still in hand for whatever answer they might have. shit I feel dirty playing a legacy deck.
Click to expand...
Dat mesmeric fiend/brain maggot damnation combo
 
D

divisionbyzorro

Member
That deck looks sick. Damn I love Holiday Cube. Hopefully I'll get a chance to draft it a few more times before it disappears. I'll probably resist the urge to do storm again; as much as I want to try to jump back in and do it right, I don't have enough time to really churn through it this time, and I want to get back to winning. ;)
 
F

Firemind

Member
Final round, one-nil up, play Show and Tell, put Griselbrand into play, opponent puts Kiki-Jiki into play. awwwww shiiiiiiiii

Thankfully I had FoW ready to go for any shenanigans. Last turn of the game:

awfFg0h.jpg
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I love holiday cube.
 
M

MjFrancis

Member
Firemind said:
I thought we were moving away from efficient 4-of bears as mythics. It has a rad ability but still.
Click to expand...
I remember hearing that at one point but I never believed it for a moment. It's that kind of shit that reminds me that Constructed is a tabletop game with ridiculously expensive pieces that's only tolerated because it's a really fun game. As of right now I don't know how I am getting a playset of Soulfire Grand Masters but I am sure as shit not going to pay $80 for a set when the only constructed I play is FNM. I'll finish my playset when the hype dies down and I've already drafted, traded for or won shop credit for one or two.
 
G

"God's Beard!"

Member
Can you trade Phantom points? Id trade my 8 for 4 tix if anyone wants. I figured id use up my packs at least before quitting modo but having to buy tix every time I chain an 8-4 is really annoying.
 
C

Crocodile

Member
Haly said:
Does MtGS ever have crow-eating threads? I feel like with the way the board reacts to new cards, that they'd have crow buffets after every set.
Click to expand...

To be fair it goes both ways - they are prone to both shit on everything or exalt X as the next coming of ______ when its actually crap. Evaluating cards in general is hard, even for pros, but posters over there have no problem loudly exclaiming their opinions with faulty arguments :p

rexor0717 said:
lmao
I really hate that forum.
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The Cube section is great and is the only part where I actually read the posts. Commander section seems fine from the few times I've popped my head in there too.

Vangu Vegro said:
I, for one, think cards that should never have been printed in the first place should never be reprinted, and that unhealthy, unbalanced tournament formats that weren't supposed to exist in the first place should not be given support they don't deserve.
To me, the Reserved List isn't a problem, but part of the solution to a problem (the other parts being the banning of all out-of-print staples in paper Vintage/Legacy and/or making those formats digital-only).
And I wish Wizards had the cojones to solve actual problems rather than make half-assed attempts at non-solutions to non-problems.
I'm not a card shop nor am I affiliated with one of them, nor have I been a collector for years. Still, I fully and unequivocally support the Reserved List to the degree that if it never existed, I'd be first among those wanting for it to be created.
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I honestly can't make heads or tales of this post. Seems like a "stop liking what I don't like" type of post to me to be honest :/

Arksy said:
Temporal trespass looks fucking amazing. Sorry for the size, can't reformat on my phone. :(
Click to expand...

Unsure how good the card is right now but WOW is the art amazing.
 
G

"God's Beard!"

Member
Playing Holiday Cube and I curve out Thoughtseize, Gerard's Verdict, Sin Collector stripping my opponents whole hand basically. He plays a smokestack with no pressure on me and I drop Sorin prompting a concession LOL
 
T

Toxi

Banned
kirblar said:
That's not a 4x constructed bear. Too niche and mana-intensive.
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It feel it's not really niche. It is an on-curve creature that works well with cheap spells and burn spells. It's not something you build around, unless you need some sort of justification for running Lightning Bolt. The activated ability is for the late game, where useful cards are a more valuable resource for many decks than mana. At its very worst, it's a 2/2 lifelinking Grizzly Bear, so there's little risk involved in including it if you have space.

You keep mentioning Sidisi. Sidisi is a three color legendary Hill Giant from a pure stat perspective, and isn't particularly impressive without support. She is not easy to splash and you can't just slap her in a list with generic good cards. She's a good card, but she's hardly safe. Grand Master in contrast is very safe and flexible, and it is that quality that I feel people underestimate. It provides survivability against faster decks, a long-game for low-curve decks, and a decent body with no real investment.
 
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