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["God's Beard!"]

Finally starting to wrap my head around some of the Limited interactions the new set brings, especially two of my favorite cards and their synergies:

+

Value town!

I was browsing the spoiler and, wow, I noticed Veronique Meignaud is back to creating Magic art again. Return to Zendikar hype!

A bunch of my friends and I hung out with her once and watched her draw while we chatted at a bar. She said she didn't like working for magic for creative reasons, but I'm glad she got over it. Love her art, she's the only artist I use for basics in my decks.

 

[Vangu Vegro]

Kev Walker too! I never realized he did art in the past couple of years. I've been a fan of his works since Tempest.

Seems weird considering the amount of cards he's done in recent blocks: 11 in Theros, 18 in RTR, 11 in INN, and that's not even counting the core sets!
But I agree, he's great.

 

[EYEL1NER]

I played a four-person game of Magic tonight, everyone against each other. It was my first experience with more than two people and I have to say that I don't know how I felt about it. I guess I started off having fun but two of us were getting horrible draws and a third was playing MtG for the first time and learning from us which led the fourth person to become super-powerful. I forget which clan of intro deck he was playing but it was the one that is based around giving a different buff for every +1/+1 counter on a creature (which led to him having a ton of creatures with first strike, deathtouch, and flying for a good part of the match). I played the Mardu intro deck, another guy the event deck, and another played the Sultai deck. By the time I got anything going on my side, one guy built up such a strong field that I couldn't attack him in force and had to settle on working in the other two while he chipped away at me. One guy finally folded because it was getting late and he needed sleep which led to my demise.

Maybe next time thing will go better in my favor and I'll feel a bit differently about the variant I guess.

 

[Wichu]

I played a four-person game of Magic tonight, everyone against each other. It was my first experience with more than two people and I have to say that I don't know how I felt about it. I guess I started off having fun but two of us were getting horrible draws and a third was playing MtG for the first time and learning from us which led the fourth person to become super-powerful. I forget which clan of intro deck he was playing but it was the one that is based around giving a different buff for every +1/+1 counter on a creature (which led to him having a ton of creatures with first strike, deathtouch, and flying for a good part of the match). I played the Mardu intro deck, another guy the event deck, and another played the Sultai deck. By the time I got anything going on my side, one guy built up such a strong field that I couldn't attack him in force and had to settle on working in the other two while he chipped away at me. One guy finally folded because it was getting late and he needed sleep which led to my demise.

Maybe next time thing will go better in my favor and I'll feel a bit differently about the variant I guess.

I tend to find anyone who becomes a threat early on gets ganged up on - the focus of the table should be the guy who's taking over the game.

Intro Packs aren't designed for multiplayer - if you get the chance, try playing the Commander 2014 decks against each other. That's where the real fun is.

 

[manipulate]

Quick question - after the release of FRF, what does the drafting format become? KTK/KTK/FRF? And then after the third set in the block, is it going to be KTK/FRF/Newset?

 

[f0rk]

Quick question - after the release of FRF, what does the drafting format become? KTK/KTK/FRF? And then after the third set in the block, is it going to be KTK/FRF/Newset?

The new set will be drafted new/new/FRF

I'm not sure if FRF is first or last but it's 1 pack only

 

[manipulate]

Huh, so FRF gets opened less than the other two sets. How about that.

 

[ironmang]

Is there a list of seeded pack potential contents anywhere? Wondering what rares/mythics can show up in each different seeded booster.

 

[Matriox]

Is there a list of seeded pack potential contents anywhere? Wondering what rares/mythics can show up in each different seeded booster.

I could be wrong, but I don't think we knew all of the potential promos until people opened the seeded packs at midnight prereleases. Based on Ktk you can make some assumptions about what youll see as the rare but the only ones you can really bet on are the new clan legendaries. Otherwise it will be an assortment of commons and uncommons within the clan colors as its been before.

 

[Matriox]

Accidental Double Post.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

I'm finally going to be playing in my first paper Magic event since moving back to the US from Australia - I'm signed up for the FRF prerelease. Here's hoping the store I picked is good; there aren't a lot of choices if you live in the outskirts of Houston!

 

[Firemind]

Seems weird considering the amount of cards he's done in recent blocks: 11 in Theros, 18 in RTR, 11 in INN, and that's not even counting the core sets!
But I agree, he's great.

I suppose it's because Kev's art is more subdued in terms of colours, but his art style is definitely recognizable! More please!

 

[SigmasonicX]

I played a four-person game of Magic tonight, everyone against each other. It was my first experience with more than two people and I have to say that I don't know how I felt about it. I guess I started off having fun but two of us were getting horrible draws and a third was playing MtG for the first time and learning from us which led the fourth person to become super-powerful. I forget which clan of intro deck he was playing but it was the one that is based around giving a different buff for every +1/+1 counter on a creature (which led to him having a ton of creatures with first strike, deathtouch, and flying for a good part of the match). I played the Mardu intro deck, another guy the event deck, and another played the Sultai deck. By the time I got anything going on my side, one guy built up such a strong field that I couldn't attack him in force and had to settle on working in the other two while he chipped away at me. One guy finally folded because it was getting late and he needed sleep which led to my demise.

Maybe next time thing will go better in my favor and I'll feel a bit differently about the variant I guess.

As mentioned, typically what happens is that everyone gangs up on the guy who gets ahead, so I'm surprised that didn't happen with your game. Anyway, multiplayer can either be a lot of fun or really grueling, but the former happens more often if there are a fair number of weird and/or powerful effects that completely change the board state, which you typically just don't get in intro packs.

As for manipulate's question about drafting, Fate Reforged will be drafted Fate/Khans/Khans. Typically, a third large set will be drafted by itself, and a small third set will be drafted with the other two, but this block is special, in that Dragons of Tarkir will actually be drafted Dragons/Dragons/Fate--this aspect was actually the starting point of this block's design.

 

["God's Beard!"]

That's a pity. Her art and use of colours are so vibrant! I would pay a lot of dough if she's commissioned to do new full art basics in Zendikar Returns. Do it, Wizards!

If you ever watched her work, you'd understand why she doesn't like working from a set of guidelines. Very stream-of-consciousness.

Some people like myself think of guidelines like a sort of puzzle that make drawing more fun. but for Veronique it's definitely a prison. I can't make sense of half her thought process watching her draw, it's great.

 

[Wichu]

Is it just me, or does Jeskai look really sweet for the prerelease? U/W are the only colours in FRF with common fliers (alongside red if you count Lava Axe dragon), with green only having the single 5/2 reach - although every colour gets an uncommon Dragon, U/W have even more (and better) uncommon fliers. I suspect a flying-based aggro deck backed by removal for opponents' fliers could really tear things up.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

Is it just me, or does Jeskai look really sweet for the prerelease? U/W are the only colours in FRF with common fliers (alongside red if you count Lava Axe dragon), with green only having the single 5/2 reach - although every colour gets an uncommon Dragon, U/W have even more (and better) uncommon fliers. I suspect a flying-based aggro deck backed by removal for opponents' fliers could really tear things up.

I chose Sultai, because I like all of their rares and it gives me a shot at Torrent Elemental.

 

[Matriox]

Temur, Sultai, Jeskai - I believe is my order for this prerelease. Sultai and Temur are around the same level for me, I just really like UG colors for limited, I'd prefer ferocious over Delve so I dont hit too many delve cards that I just cant use all of them

 

[SigmasonicX]

From this article, I never thought about this combo:

+

+

And holy shit, I never actually thought about how insane any repeated manifest card is with Trail of Mystery; it makes me annoyed that the article writer suggested replacing the latter with Courser of Kruphix.

EDIT: I plan on going Mardu for this prerelease, because I like dash.

 

[red13th]

From this article, I never thought about this combo:

+

+

And holy shit, I never actually thought about how insane any repeated manifest card is with Trail of Mystery; it makes me annoyed that the article writer suggested replacing the latter with Courser of Kruphix.

EDIT: I plan on going Mardu for this prerelease, because I like dash.

that combo is hilarious

 

[bigkrev]

From this article, I never thought about this combo:

+

+

And holy shit, I never actually thought about how insane any repeated manifest card is with Trail of Mystery; it makes me annoyed that the article writer suggested replacing the latter with Courser of Kruphix.

EDIT: I plan on going Mardu for this prerelease, because I like dash.

While that looks like a casual only combo, It didn't stop me from picking up 4 Sage of Hours for a dollar each just a minute ago. What's the worst that could happen?

If nothing else, it's a funny 60 card casual combo.

 

[OnPoint]

While that looks like a casual only combo, It didn't stop me from picking up 4 Sage of Hours for a dollar each just a minute ago. What's the worst that could happen?

If nothing else, it's a funny 60 card casual combo.

Green ramp with See the Unwritten + blue splash = potentially really fun.

 

[Haly]

I guess the optimal (lol) way to play that combo is to have Primadox on the field for a turn. And then 9 mana to cast the other two pieces on the following turn to start the loop.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

While filling out the LRCast community ratings spreadsheet, I just realized how one of the cards in this set violates the color pie in one of those subversive ways that Maro gets annoyed by:

This card is basically just this card:

It has a mild restriction (what types of cards you can get), but also has some mild upside (cards in the yard for delve, plus some selection).

 

[SigmasonicX]

While filling out the LRCast community ratings spreadsheet, I just realized how one of the cards in this set violates the color pie in one of those subversive ways that Maro gets annoyed by:

This card is basically just this card:

It has a mild restriction (what types of cards you can get), but also has some mild upside (cards in the yard for delve, plus some selection).

Green has Lead the Stampede, Commune with the Gods, Scout the Borders, etc. And it has graveyard recursion. This is perfectly fine.

 

[Firemind]

Green gets a better Inspiration? READY THE PITCHFORKS.

Spoiler

shouldn't have been an instant at least.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

Green has Lead the Stampede, Commune with the Gods, Scout the Borders, etc. And it has graveyard recursion. This is perfectly fine.

Green gets a better Inspiration? READY THE PITCHFORKS.

Spoiler

shouldn't have been an instant at least.

I never said it wasn't a fine card to print, I'm just saying that it's interesting. Especially the fact that it's instant (as Firemind points out). It's fairly common for green to get sorcery-speed cantrips that selectively fill the graveyard, but getting actual card advantage out of them is a little out of the ordinary.

I just think it's interesting how similar this is to the example that Maro likes to give of a card that you can't print, no matter how much it technically makes sense:

Blue Murder 1UU
Instant
Put target creature on top of its owner's library.
Each player puts the top card of their library into their graveyard.

Both of these things are things that blue can do, but you can never print this card. Obviously the difference here is that letting green draw a couple of cards isn't a big deal, but letting blue kill a creature would be, but mechanically you're jumping through the same hoops to "break" the color pie.

 

[kirblar]

It's blue. Of course you can print that card.

Spoiler

This is sarcasm.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

It's blue. Of course you can print that card.

Spoiler

This is sarcasm.

Spoiler

It amuses me that you have to clarify that point.

 

["God's Beard!"]

Sudden Reclamation is Standard-playable.


Also, I was watching Caleb Durward play against a bogles player and it infuriated me how badly built regular-ass bogles is as a deck. His opponent also kept a 6-card hand with no creatures and brought in Torpor Orb against junk so I dunno.

But seriously, fuck basics and fuck Kor Spirit Dancer. These are not things bogles wants to be doing.

 

[kirblar]

It's really bad compared to Grim Discovery.

 

["God's Beard!"]

It's really bad compared to Grim Discovery.

Well, it's also an enabler which is nice.

Also, don't kill tasigur in response to his activation, kids!

 

[divisionbyzorro]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";147273209]Sudden Reclamation is Standard-playable.


Also, I was watching Caleb Durward play against a bogles player and it infuriated me how badly built regular-ass bogles is as a deck. His opponent also kept a 6-card hand with no creatures and brought in Torpor Orb against junk so I dunno.

But seriously, fuck basics and fuck Kor Spirit Dancer. These are not things bogles wants to be doing.[/QUOTE]

Reid Duke would have won the World Championship last year with the deck that you're trashing if he hadn't gotten supremely unlucky, for what it's worth.

 

["God's Beard!"]

Reid Duke would have won the World Championship last year with the deck that you're trashing if he hadn't gotten supremely unlucky, for what it's worth.

And reid duke is a fantastic constructed player. The deck itself has more holes than a swiss cheese specialty shop. We can do better.

 

[Firemind]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";147280871]And reid duke is a fantastic constructed player. The deck itself has more holes than a swiss cheese specialty shop. We can do better.[/QUOTE]

Isn't that basically the description of Bogles? lol

 

[y2dvd]

When is prerelease?

 

[ultron87]

This Saturday and Sunday. (And midnight stuff on Friday)

 

[SigmasonicX]

Do we have any clue what the reveal rules for manifest are yet? If a manifest card is returned to your hand, do you have to reveal it to your opponent?

 

[Firemind]

Do we have any clue what the reveal rules for manifest are yet? If a manifest card is returned to your hand, do you have to reveal it to your opponent?

I'd hope so, since they're still morphs. Otherwise, keeping track of morphs and manifested morphs is going to do my head in.

 

[SigmasonicX]

I'd hope so, since they're still morphs. Otherwise, keeping track of morphs and manifested morphs is going to do my head in.

Well, the point of revealing morphs is to prevent you from putting just anything face down. Manifestations, on the other hand, really can be just anything. There would be no point in revealing it.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

You still reveal, I'm pretty sure. And you have to keep track of what's a morph and what's a manifest.

 

[Llyrwenne]

Do we have any clue what the reveal rules for manifest are yet? If a manifest card is returned to your hand, do you have to reveal it to your opponent?

I would imagine that any face-down card leaving the battlefield is required to be revealed upon leaving, regardless of how it entered, was flipped or left, just to prevent cheating ( even 'accidental' cheating as a result of not properly keeping track of your morphs / manifests ). Perhaps if it is clearly a Manifested creature, it wouldn't be necessary as they can be anything.

I'd hope so, since they're still morphs. Otherwise, keeping track of morphs and manifested morphs is going to do my head in.

Embrace the tokens!

 

[Firemind]

You still reveal, I'm pretty sure. And you have to keep track of what's a morph and what's a manifest.

Yeah, I don't think that's going to happen very often at the prerelease. A face down card is a face down card. In my opinion, the onus is on your opponent to keep track of what's a morph and what's a manifest. I'll place them in chronological order, but if you're going to ask me if it's a morph or not, I'll say I don't know.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

Yeah, I don't think that's going to happen very often at the prerelease. A face down card is a face down card. In my opinion, the onus is on your opponent to keep track of what's a morph and what's a manifest. I'll place them in chronological order, but if you're going to ask me if it's a morph or not, I'll say I don't know.

You'd be very much in the wrong then.

 

[inthrall]

Yeah, I don't think that's going to happen very often at the prerelease. A face down card is a face down card. In my opinion, the onus is on your opponent to keep track of what's a morph and what's a manifest. I'll place them in chronological order, but if you're going to ask me if it's a morph or not, I'll say I don't know.

You know you can look under them at any time, and have to tell them the order they were played or get a warning right?

 

[charlequin]

Quick question - after the release of FRF, what does the drafting format become? KTK/KTK/FRF? And then after the third set in the block, is it going to be KTK/FRF/Newset?

The three draft formats for this block:

KTK / KTK / KTK

FRF / KTK / KTK

DTK / DTK / FRF

Huh, so FRF gets opened less than the other two sets. How about that.

In the past when they did blocks with two big sets the middle set didn't even get drafted with the second big set. FRF's actually gonna get opened the exact normal amount for a middle set.

I never said it wasn't a fine card to print, I'm just saying that it's interesting. Especially the fact that it's instant (as Firemind points out). It's fairly common for green to get sorcery-speed cantrips that selectively fill the graveyard, but getting actual card advantage out of them is a little out of the ordinary.

It's not that weird. Mulch and Beast Hunt are both in color for green. This is just a kinda weird variant of those effects. Green's supposed to get creature-related card advantage in general.

Do we have any clue what the reveal rules for manifest are yet?

Reveal when they leave the battlefield and at the end of the game, exactly the same as morphs.

I'll place them in chronological order, but if you're going to ask me if it's a morph or not, I'll say I don't know.

This will get you pretty severely penalized so, like, I wouldn't suggest actually doing it?

 

[Yeef]

Yeah, I don't think that's going to happen very often at the prerelease. A face down card is a face down card. In my opinion, the onus is on your opponent to keep track of what's a morph and what's a manifest. I'll place them in chronological order, but if you're going to ask me if it's a morph or not, I'll say I don't know.

This is the opposite of right.

It's actually your responsibility to keep track of which facedown permanent is which and it's free information, so lying about it is considered cheating, which will get you DQ'd.

707.6. If you control multiple face-down spells or face-down permanents, you must ensure at all times that your face-down spells and permanents can be easily differentiated from each other. This includes, but is not limited to, knowing the order spells were cast, the order that face-down permanents entered the battlefield, which creature attacked last turn, and any other differences between face-down spells or permanents. Common methods for distinguishing between face-down objects include using counters or dice to mark the different objects, or clearly placing those objects in order on the table.

 

[blindrocket]

Despite being an experienced Magic player, I haven't played Standard in a while and have never gone to a prerelease.

Which faction should I go with at the prerelease just to get constructed playable cards or cards with some above average value?

This is assuming greater odds are to be had at getting certain cards depending on which faction I choose unless I'm not understanding it correctly.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

When we rank the clans, we basically just mean which ones are more likely to give us limited bombs and/or a critical mass of quality uncommons.

 

[Yeef]

Despite being an experienced Magic player, I haven't played Standard in a while and have never gone to a prerelease.

Which faction should I go with at the prerelease just to get constructed playable cards or cards with some above average value?

This is assuming greater odds are to be had at getting certain cards depending on which faction I choose unless I'm not understanding it correctly.

Because no one knows what's in the seeded packs, it's hard to say.

If I had to wager, I'd guess the 8 possible rares in each clan's seeded pack look something like this:

• Clan hybrid mythic
• Legendary Dragon
• Clan Leader
• Main-Color Siege
• Ally-Color Siege
• Intro Pack Rare
• Clan Rare
• Non-Clan Rare

So, for example, Abzan list might look something like this:

• Warden of the First Tree
• Dromoka, the Eternal
• Daghatar the Adamant
• Citadel Siege
• Frontier Siege
• Dragonscale General
• Sandsteppe Mastadon
• Rally the Ancestors

In terms of what might see play in Standard, I think there's a number of cards in each clan, but your seeded pack will only be 1 of 6 (or fewer assuming you win some prize packs) that you open. You're better off picking the clan that you think will do better in the even, that way you win more prize packs.

 

[ultron87]

The clan you pick only changes one pack. So I wouldn't really worry about picking one just for the purpose opening cards for constructed. Just pick colors you like or one you think might give you a nice limited bomb.