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[LaserBuddha]

But you are leaning hard on drawing 4 cards in your 60.


And if you're delving effectively, Tasigur is amazing. I've activated him 11 times since release and have yet to get anything that wasn't worth it. As long as you curate your graveyard with delve, you don't get dead cards back unless they're flipped on the mill. The argument against Tasigur for you is that you have to bring in a second color.

Good point about being careful with delve. With Tasigur, I'm liking the Torrent Elemental. I bet Soulflayer could play off of Torrent Elemental, and I wouldn't even have to worry about a blue mana.

If you have cards you never want to get back in your graveyard, after delving 5, why are you playing those cards

If you have stuff you don't want back you're playing too many bad cards.

Until my cards arrive, I've only played with a shit deck made up mostly of booster pack contents.

I don't think the deck would even remotely have a possibility of working as mono-black, though.

It would be a big help for me to know what blue cards you see as essential to this deck.

For these kinds of decks, you want to think of every card you include in terms of which others it synergizes with. Dark Deal/Waste Not is a cool interaction, but it doesn't win you the game on the spot, so you need cards that work well with just Dark Deal, work well with just Waste Not, and don't particularly care about either but work well with each other so that regardless of which draws you get your deck is doing something that's generating value. Delve is a workable approach (add some on-color delve cards to make use of the cards you're having to discard yourself, then add things that synergize with Delve like Torrent Elemental) as is a reanimator sub-theme (since both graveyards should be full of stuff to bring back.)

I suppose discard spells are what works with waste not, and delve spells are what works with dark deal then? Or am I missing something else?

 

[Wichu]

Help me brew a thing, GAF.

Manifest your enchantments so they can be targeted by Skybind, use Skybind to flip them face up and trigger Skybind again. Repeat until win.

Cards I'm considering:
Skybind (obviously)
Eidolon of Blossoms (draw engine)
Doomwake Giant (kill stuff engine)
Lightform/Cloudform (manifest and trigger constellation)
Whisperwood Elemental (repeatable manifest, boardwipe protection)
Mastery of the Unseen (repeatable manifest and occasional lifegain)
Thassa, God of the Sea (scry)
Heliod, God of the Sun (repeatable constellation trigger)
Ephara, God of the Polis (card draw)
Courser of Kruphix (generally good, helps with manifest)
Elvish Mystic/Sylvan Caryatid (ramp)
Verdant Haven/Market Festival (ramp that is enchantments)

Bant splashing black for Doomwake Giant? It seems too strong not to consider, but the other cards I want to play are all white/blue/green.

 

[keeblerdrow]

Dark Deal works in two ways. First, it's combo with Waste Not and Delve spells. Second, it's major hand disruption. It takes their plan that they kept and throws it out the window. The problem with the deck is that if you don't have Waste Not, then you have just thrown your plans out the window as well. So you need to have a robust set of follow ups to draw into. And all your disruption is sorcery speed. So your opponent gets to start emptying their hand to stillborn your further discards.

I still don't know how the deck deals with a control deck without Torrent Elemental plus tons of delve in the deck.

 

[ThLunarian]

Woo hoo go Ali! Charlotte NC represent! Frontier Siege FTW

 

[Angry Grimace]

Help me brew a thing, GAF.

Manifest your enchantments so they can be targeted by Skybind, use Skybind to flip them face up and trigger Skybind again. Repeat until win.

Cards I'm considering:
Skybind (obviously)
Eidolon of Blossoms (draw engine)
Doomwake Giant (kill stuff engine)
Lightform/Cloudform (manifest and trigger constellation)
Whisperwood Elemental (repeatable manifest, boardwipe protection)
Mastery of the Unseen (repeatable manifest and occasional lifegain)
Thassa, God of the Sea (scry)
Heliod, God of the Sun (repeatable constellation trigger)
Ephara, God of the Polis (card draw)
Courser of Kruphix (generally good, helps with manifest)
Elvish Mystic/Sylvan Caryatid (ramp)
Verdant Haven/Market Festival (ramp that is enchantments)

Bant splashing black for Doomwake Giant? It seems too strong not to consider, but the other cards I want to play are all white/blue/green.

N/M I just forgot how Skybind works.

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

Outside of Mentor, Soulfire and Ujin, does anyone else think FR is pretty tame compared to some of the few sets before it?

 

[ThLunarian]

Soulfire is not that great. Tasigur is amazing, Frontier Siege is exceeding expectations (based on SCG), Crux of Fate is very good. I don't think it's a bad set of cards at all

 

[keeblerdrow]

As I'm playing with the cards more, I disagree. There are a lot of cards that have great synergy in the set. I'm looking to pick up playsets of Shaman of the Great Hunt, Wisperwood Elemental, Brutal Hordechief, Frontier Siege, and Torrent Elemental in addition to my already-gotten playsets of Warden of the First Tree, Alesha, and Tasigur. I think the synergistic power of this set could be, if not through the roof, smashing into the ceiling. Even outside of the 3 $20+ cards.

 

[inthrall]

I gave my walls deck from a few days back a go, and it performed amazingly versus whip and control lists, a 50/50 matchup vs jeskai tokens, but could not get an even footing vs uw heroic which put a bit of a damper on the list.

Perhaps I need to add some singing bell strikes to deal with the early threats, or some more removal? Hard to say. Might just cut the treasure cruises for them, or some more monastery sieges

 

[Angry Grimace]

Soulfire is not that great. Tasigur is amazing, Frontier Siege is exceeding expectations (based on SCG), Crux of Fate is very good. I don't think it's a bad set of cards at all

People just keep saying Soulfire isn't good but it totally is. Anger of the Gods gain 15 is fun and very relevant.

I think its better than Seeker of the Way. Of course it is 20 times more expensive.

 

[Wichu]

I gave my walls deck from a few days back a go, and it performed amazingly versus whip and control lists, a 50/50 matchup vs jeskai tokens, but could not get an even footing vs uw heroic which put a bit of a damper on the list.

Perhaps I need to add some singing bell strikes to deal with the early threats, or some more removal? Hard to say. Might just cut the treasure cruises for them, or some more monastery sieges

Guess it's time to put my playset of Siege Dragons to use

 

[LaserBuddha]

Dark Deal works in two ways. First, it's combo with Waste Not and Delve spells. Second, it's major hand disruption. It takes their plan that they kept and throws it out the window. The problem with the deck is that if you don't have Waste Not, then you have just thrown your plans out the window as well. So you need to have a robust set of follow ups to draw into. And all your disruption is sorcery speed. So your opponent gets to start emptying their hand to stillborn your further discards.

I still don't know how the deck deals with a control deck without Torrent Elemental plus tons of delve in the deck.

Is being able to cast torrent elemental from exile really that important? I would think Soulflayer + Chromanticore would be nice too.

So if I have say 4 Soulflayers, 3 Chromanticores, and 2 Tasigurs, should i then just fill the rest with control cards or throw in some small creatures that synergize? For delve cards I assume you are looking for more card draw like Treasure Cruise and Dig through Time, mixed in with some of what I originally listed like Thoughtseize and Bile Blight.

Im wary of having too much delve though, and I don't know if that means I should avoid the delve creatures in favor of the delve sorceries, or vice versa.

 

[charlequin]

I suppose discard spells are what works with waste not, and delve spells are what works with dark deal then? Or am I missing something else?

Basically. That's just an example, there's probably other ways to build around this that I'm not thinking of.

I think its better than Seeker of the Way. Of course it is 20 times more expensive.

It also calls for a slightly different deck. I don't think it'll always be a strict upgrade swapping Seeker for Grand Master, but there have got to be decks where the latter is way better.

Is being able to cast torrent elemental from exile really that important?

It gives you more inevitability than anything else available in those colors and further reduces the downside of your resource strategy. Delve makes Dark Deal's downside much less bad since the cards you discard turn into mana; Torrent Elemental makes Delve's downside much less bad since cards you exile turn into a creature.

 

["God's Beard!"]

And that, ladies and gentlemen, is why I run three Tasigurs in the main lol

 

[kirblar]

If you need Ugin, buy two now. He's not going to get any cheaper in the short-medium term. (Kiora didn't drop much and she's worse.) I just grabbed two at 26 each.

 

[keeblerdrow]

I have 0 and want 2 ugins. Ugh.

Didn't see the semis or finals yet and will when I get home. But I ran a PPTQ this weekend with 3 Tasigurs in the main of an abzan aggro shell and he is solid. Should be a format staple for certain strategies for a while unless there's some very specific hate for him.

 

[Firemind]

I want a foil and an alt art.

 

[kirblar]

I have 0 and want 2 ugins. Ugh.

Didn't see the semis or finals yet and will when I get home. But I ran a PPTQ this weekend with 3 Tasigurs in the main of an abzan aggro shell and he is solid. Should be a format staple for certain strategies for a while unless there's some very specific hate for him.

Sultai Control is 1-1 in the finals against R/W Aggro w/ 2x Ugin in the main and 2x Tasigur in the board.

 

[kirblar]

Gerard's deck is completely ridiculous.http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=79100

 

[Lucario]

I want a foil and an alt art.

Me too The alt-art is just going to keep going up, though.

Also, congrats to Gerard Fabiano!

 

[divisionbyzorro]

Gerard's deck is completely ridiculous.http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=79100

Interpret the Signs??!!

How did that Temur deck do?

 

[Lucario]

Interpret the Signs??!!

He wanted that 'draw 8' off ugin. Can't blame him

 

[kirblar]

Interpret the Signs??!!

It's shown up as a 1x in control decks over the past few months, actually. Just a way to basically end the game on the spot.

 

[charlequin]

Gerard's deck is completely ridiculous.http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=79100

That planeswalker setup is kind of weird, right?

Interpret the Signs??!!

13 cards in the deck that'll draw 4+ cards, 22 that'll draw 3+.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

It's shown up as a 1x in control decks over the past few months, actually. Just a way to basically end the game on the spot.

It makes a lot of sense as a sideboard card, but it feels like it would be so dead in a lot of matchups.

 

[kirblar]

It makes a lot of sense as a sideboard card, but it feels like it would be so dead in a lot of matchups.

Gameplan is "trade 1 for 1 a few rounds, then drop a bomb." Counts as one of those bombs.

 

["God's Beard!"]

If you need Ugin, buy two now. He's not going to get any cheaper in the short-medium term. (Kiora didn't drop much and she's worse.) I just grabbed two at 26 each.

I cracked six of the packs from the box i bought with this week's prize credit and got an Ugin and a Tasigur :3

Probably gonna save the rest to practice sealed with my team for GP San Jose.

Anybody else going?

 

[Firemind]

They can't all be Sphinx's Revelations.

Me too The alt-art is just going to keep going up, though.

Also, congrats to Gerard Fabiano!

Maaaaan, if speculators are hoarding them right now I will be so pissed.

 

[f0rk]

4x Tarmogoyf
4x Tasigur, the Golden Fang
3x Snapcaster Mage
1x Vendilion Clique
2x Bitterblossom

3x Abrupt Decay
3x Cryptic Command
1x Darkblast
1x Dismember
2x Murderous Cut
4x Remand
2x Spell Snare
4x Thought Scour
4x Serum Visions

2x Breeding Pool
2x Creeping Tar Pit
2x Forest
3x Island
4x Misty Rainforest
1x Overgrown Tomb
4x Polluted Delta
1x Swamp
1x Verdant Catacombs
2x Watery Grave

What am I missing? 4 Tasigur and Thought Scour might be too many, could switch 1 of each out for some other cards to close the game like Batterskull.
Sideboard options kinda suck.

 

["God's Beard!"]

No lilianas or hand disruption?

 

[Angry Grimace]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";149107592]I cracked six of the packs from the box i bought with this week's prize credit and got an Ugin and a Tasigur :3

Probably gonna save the rest to practice sealed with my team for GP San Jose.

Anybody else going?[/QUOTE]

Gods Beard even wins at pack opening apparently.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Basically. That's just an example, there's probably other ways to build around this that I'm not thinking of.



It also calls for a slightly different deck. I don't think it'll always be a strict upgrade swapping Seeker for Grand Master, but there have got to be decks where the latter is way better.


It gives you more inevitability than anything else available in those colors and further reduces the downside of your resource strategy. Delve makes Dark Deal's downside much less bad since the cards you discard turn into mana; Torrent Elemental makes Delve's downside much less bad since cards you exile turn into a creature.

I think Soul Fire is generically better than Seeker though. The only thing it doesn't do is have Prowess. Most of the time it's not relevant beyond swinging in for 3 early in the game. And Soul Fire is a much better top deck when you have more mana available.

 

["God's Beard!"]

Gods Beard even wins at pack opening apparently.

Nah i suck, i was just happy to get an ugin. Usually I dont even get packs when I win because I don't believe in my luck. But I bought the box to practice with my team. And it's not that crazy, since between tournaments and winnings I've opened about 50 packs and only gotten one ugin, one mentor and two fetchlands. I had to trade for cloudforms, lol

 

[Giant Panda]

So I tried out a B/W warriors deck at FNM, and it was okay. I curved out for 1 Sorin, 1 brutal hordechief, and 2 raider's spoils, and if I got those out I did well, but without them my warriors ran into some major issues.

Would going full Mardu for Alesha, Crackling Doom, and Ascendancy be worth it? I'm trying to avoid it if I can because I don't want to spend the money getting all the fancy lands if I don't have to, but I'm willing to if it were a major upgrade.

 

[f0rk]

Not sure if Liliana is worth it for the mana or if 3 mana is too much when I'm trying to play Remand etc, approaching the point where I should just be playing Junk instead. I'm probably wrong and a couple are OK.

Even if room is found for discard I'm not sure if it helps with anything the deck isn't already good at when we have counters, Abrupt Decay and black removal. The deck is also already quite painful without adding Thoughtseize on top (maybe I've made the mana poorly though), and discard is often the worst to get back with Tasigur.

Main issue I can see is reach to close the game out if we don't draw Tar Pits (or they have bolts) and sometimes just dying to aggro decks.

 

["God's Beard!"]

Speaking of getting things back with Tasigur, Sylvan Caryatid is the goddamn devil. Go away! Stop shuffling to the top of my library

 

[keeblerdrow]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";149110772]Speaking of getting things back with Tasigur, Sylvan Caryatid is the goddamn devil. Go away! Stop shuffling to the top of my library [/QUOTE]

Stop running Caryatid, then.

When brewing decks with Tasigur, I've imposed a limit of 4 cards in the 60 that I would not want to draw with him.


The deck I want to put together for the girlfriend:

4 Elvish Mystic
4 Caryatid
4 Courser
4 Whisperwood Elemental
4 Shaman of the Great Hunt
4 Stormbreath Dragon
2 Frontier Siege
2 Sarkhan
2 Yasova
1 Xenagos, God of Revels
1 Atarka
2 Nissa
3 Crater's Claws
23 LANDS (haven't figured out the numbers yet)

It's just an honest swing-in deck. Just the kind she likes. If it were a deck for me, I'd add black for removal and Brutal Hordechief.

 

["God's Beard!"]

But turn three Sidisi

 

[keeblerdrow]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";149112485]But turn three Sidisi [/QUOTE]

You need to choose between which will give you a faster start, Mystic or Caryatid. I choose Mystic because I usually have literally nothing else to do on turn 1 and sometimes I have better things to do on turn 2. Caryatid is a powerful card and a favorite, but i'm starting to evaluate whether I want a 8 dead cards for Tasigur and 12 full cards dedicated to mana generation. The format is slow enough that ramp can perhaps be slightly slower.

I'll be putting together a Sidisi deck this week as I get my cards together.

 

[Angry Grimace]

You need to choose between which will give you a faster start, Mystic or Caryatid. I choose Mystic because I usually have literally nothing else to do on turn 1 and sometimes I have better things to do on turn 2. Caryatid is a powerful card and a favorite, but i'm starting to evaluate whether I want a 8 dead cards for Tasigur and 12 full cards dedicated to mana generation. The format is slow enough that ramp can perhaps be slightly slower.

I'll be putting together a Sidisi deck this week as I get my cards together.

Almost every deck drops a tapland turn one. You don't really need to have a play turn one. Barring doing something really fast, Caraytid is just better.

 

[SigmasonicX]

How did that Temur deck do?

The Temur Ascendency combo deck got run over by monk tokens, unfortunately. Hopefully others will try their hands at this deck.

 

[phazedplasma]

Anyone got the monks token list?

 

[ElyrionX]

So apparently people are trying to jam Tasigur into all kinds of Modern decks lol wtf

 

[divisionbyzorro]

So apparently people are trying to jam Tasigur into all kinds of Modern decks lol wtf

I guess he's kinda like Tarmogoyf. Actually, he probably trumps 'Goyf in a lot of matches.

 

[Lucario]

So apparently people are trying to jam Tasigur into all kinds of Modern decks lol wtf

I wouldn't be surprised to see him in legacy, too.

 

["God's Beard!"]

What do you guys think of cutting the two doomwakes for a third cut and a silumgar?

 

[Etrian Oddity]

I've gotta say that I find the whole Tarkir block sort of unappealing. Not that there's anything wrong with it, but I feel like I should have gotten back into Magic in Scars of Mirrodin, or Theros.

 

[blindrocket]

Tasigur spiked hard. He was five bucks earlier today.

 

[kirblar]

I told you.

Don't listen to Marshall.

 

["God's Beard!"]

Tasigur spiked hard. He was five bucks earlier today.

Holy shit