acheron_xl
Member
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Magic: The Gathering |OT3| Enchantment Under the Siege
- Thread starter The Technomancer
- Start date
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keeblerdrow
Member
My LGS is going to be at least over 50% red aggro tonight its been build and winning against all our mid range and tempo brews for the last 2 months. What's a proven deck I could walk in with tonight to at least slap around the aggro that shows up?
My desire for straight hate here wants me to play RB with 4 drown in sorrow and 4 anger of the gods, then finish with desecration demon. I can whip together almost anything but I want to know the most sure fire hate for rabble red and boss slightly at the moment.
Edit: completely untested deck time.
4 drown in sorrow
4 anger of the gods
4 mizzium mortars
4 bile blight
4 stoke the flames
4 thoughtseize
2 rakdos's return
2 duress
4 rabble master
4 desecration demon
2 mutavault
4 temple
4 shockland
9 Swamp
5 mountain
SB undecided.
That'll show em.
My desire for straight hate here wants me to play RB with 4 drown in sorrow and 4 anger of the gods, then finish with desecration demon. I can whip together almost anything but I want to know the most sure fire hate for rabble red and boss slightly at the moment.
Edit: completely untested deck time.
4 drown in sorrow
4 anger of the gods
4 mizzium mortars
4 bile blight
4 stoke the flames
4 thoughtseize
2 rakdos's return
2 duress
4 rabble master
4 desecration demon
2 mutavault
4 temple
4 shockland
9 Swamp
5 mountain
SB undecided.
That'll show em.
divisionbyzorro
Member
Getting rid of the "Banned as Commander" category is asinine, IMO. Then banning Rofellos and unbanning Metalworker is similarly stupid. Actually basically nothing about that change makes sense.
ThLunarian
Member
They're consistent if taken together. Metalworker can't be a commander. If you're getting rid of the 'Banned as Commander' list, and you want Rofellos banned because of how good it is as a commander, then you have to ban it entirely.
I'm going Mardu over Jeskai for Sealed next weekend. I love Monastery Swiftspear for Constructed but the Prowess mechanic won't have any Limited support in Jeskai colors. No Shock in Constructed either, so it looks like our go-to enablers are Titan's Strength, Lightning Strike - and if I'm particularly desperate to activate Prowess, Spark Jolt.
Given that Commander is a casual format, having a banned list at all is stupid.
Yeah. Banning a card because it's broken is fine, but banning a card because "2 lists are confusing", when they really aren't, is dumb
Hope they change this back
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Lucky me those are my two favorite color combinations in the set. I'm still not sure which to go though. I was leaning Temur, but having seen the whole set Abzan looks like it gets some fun toys
Hi GAFering.
I've been slowly reinserting myself into the game (very casually) and last week I went to a local game shop just to sort of tinker around. I only played a handful of games, but while there I learned that FNM is free! So, I decided I'd head back this week (tonight) to actually play in the tournament.
I know I'm going to get my ass handed to me as I'm playing with a slightly modified Infernal Intervention intro deck.
Just wondering if there's any decorum I need to follow? I know I'm not going to understand most of what's going on and I'll let folks know they might have to explain how they're destroying me, but just curious if there's somethings I should know before heading in?
I've been slowly reinserting myself into the game (very casually) and last week I went to a local game shop just to sort of tinker around. I only played a handful of games, but while there I learned that FNM is free! So, I decided I'd head back this week (tonight) to actually play in the tournament.
I know I'm going to get my ass handed to me as I'm playing with a slightly modified Infernal Intervention intro deck.
Just wondering if there's any decorum I need to follow? I know I'm not going to understand most of what's going on and I'll let folks know they might have to explain how they're destroying me, but just curious if there's somethings I should know before heading in?
Use your second main phase (after combat.)
keeblerdrow
Member
Just let people know you're new, ask questions, and be polite. Follow that and you're bound to get decent help if your lgs isn't a pit of dirtbags.
The beginning of the turn is Untap- Upkeep- Draw. If you draw a card, I'm assuming that you do not plan on paying your upkeep costs.
That kind of hardlining doesn't really apply at FNM.
divisionbyzorro
Member
Correct. And if someone pulls that on you, you should feel completely free to call a judge, explain what happened, and he will (almost certainly) let you have your upkeep effects.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Seems like standard burn is dead, no?
I would raise a racket at my store if the judge let them off after they saw the card they drew and this was in play. It's a legitimate decision that would totally be influenced by the card they now know they are drawing.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
The whole set should have been kung-fu themed.
Just announce it then. It's your trigger anyway.
Depends on the effect. If it is a thing that isnt' a "may" it'll get put on the stack at FNM assuming it was remembered within a reasonable timeframe.
Yeah, positive effects are auto-lose, negatives almost always stick you with the bill.
divisionbyzorro
Member
At FNM, the judge is going to talk to the guy and make a decision as to whether or not he things the player is gaming the system. For a new player he's almost always going to give him a takeback. Interestingly enough, the new player isn't going to have the guts to call a judge in most cases; the non-dickish thing for you, the experienced player to do, is just to call a judge and let them sort it out.
In this particular example, it's more complicated because you actually own the trigger. If he just jumps to his draw step and doesn't give you a chance to announce the trigger, you have to actually call a judge to resolve the situation. If you are playing with Soul Tithe at FNM, you should always say "Go, on your upkeep, Soul Tithe trigger."
But let's take something like Echo as an example. If I jump to my draw step with a fresh Avalanche Riders in play, even at competitive REL that's just a missed trigger. Failing to pay doesn't mean you get to make me sac the creature - it means I missed the trigger. Call the judge and have him sort it out.
Also, just call the judge. Seriously.
EDIT: To clarify, when my upkeep comes, if I notice my Echo trigger, I should either pay or put the creature in the yard. If I do neither and draw a card, I've missed the trigger entirely. I don't know how a judge would "fix" the situation, but I do know that you need a judge - you don't just get to jump in and say "you didn't pay, you have to sac now."
These days they've actually been omitting the "may" on most stuff where there isn't actually a choice. I think it is mostly to remove some click on MTGO. So these days at FNM you'll get your Assemble the Legion dudes along with your losing a life from Herald of Torment when you call a judge after you've drawn a card.
Agreed. I'm a huge commander nut and I feel it misses the spirit of the format to have a banlist. Yes, there are asshole cards, but many of those asshole cards are unbanned and banning a card for thousands of people based on whether you subjectively thing it's assholish gets you nowhere. Let people decide which cards are banned in their own games.
It doesn't help that the banlist for Commander is ludicrous.
Obviously, 1vs1 commander is a different story from group games.
Actually with stuff like Echo the judge would have you sac it. Since the trigger has a default choice of not paying it just assumes you chose not to. This is why missing paying for a Pact is incredibly bad for you.
Edit: So I suppose I was wrong since BigKRev's initial post specifically said "upkeep costs" but whatever. FNM still isn't the place for competitive angle shooting nonsense. Especially against new players playing a modified intro deck.
I feel really bad that this conversation that started with "I'm new at FNM!" thread became scary REL trigger talk. It really isn't this bad ever and people are usually nice, especially if you let them know you're new.
divisionbyzorro
Member
*shrug* And that's why I'm not a judge. I knew what happens with Pacts because of their reputation, but I didn't realize it was the "unless" in the trigger clause. All the more reason to repeat that if you're confused about something, don't just trust your opponent - raise your hand and yell "Judge!"
At FNM, I will call a judge even for things that I'm 100% confident on if I think they're crazy or if the interaction seems like something a new player would thing I was trying to cheat them on. As an example, I once called a judge and asked him if I could regenerate my Ancient Silverback in response to a Turn to Frog and have it live through the combat step, even though I knew I could, because I thought my opponent might not understand what was going to happen.
To the new player - go and have fun! But before the games start, figure out who the judge is, let him know that you may have a bunch of questions throughout the night, and he'll let you know how to easily get a hold of him at any time.
acheron_xl
Member
100% of my EDH games are against MTGO randoms, so there's really no chance to set any house rules. In that case a banlist is perfectly reasonable.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I'm trying to figure out a decent Abzan deck that plays with the counters. The only thing I'm certain of is that I feel like I should definitely have Ajani running around somewhere.
Phalanx Leader?
SigmasonicX
Member
This was spoiled earlier, but I haven't commented on this until now. Same with some other ones I'm noting. This seems like it could be really good.
Surprised to see Kirins returning.
This seems like a good card. The flavor is a bit odd, though; my guys are being assaulted by sandstorms, and thus they are better at guarding?
This also seems good in limited. I am a bit surprised to see protection at common after the only M15 protection card was at rare; I figured they were phasing it out.
Rebuke didn't seem out-of-flavor, so I'm surprised they would choose not to just reprint that.
Odd to have this and the black morph deathtouch 1-drop in the same set.
This seems good in limited.
This is pretty powerful in limited.
Use this guy to bring back the above guy. Pretty good.
Hey, a Lammasu! Not worth its mana cost, but it will still do some good in limited.
This should be pretty good in limited.
This is pretty good, especially since any creature can get the hexproof effect.
I knew there had to be a morph defender in this set!
This is common? I'm a bit surprised.
Surprisingly, this effect appears not to have appeared as a sorcery before. Totally Lost is 5 mana as an instant, so to get to an appropriate sorcery cost, I suppose you just have to exile 2 cards to bring this down to 4 mana.
I thought the art would be for a dodge spell, but it's actually a Vulcan Neck Pinch effect. This seems good.
So, I guess Taigam is going to be an important character. This seems really good; mostly, you'll be putting 4 cards in the graveyard and just leaving the best at the top.
I was going to say it was odd that they didn't reprint Inspiration, but this one does not target.
A blue elk that lives in a swamp? How odd.
This is something I didn't expect: a raid effect where you actually are punished for not triggering it.
The effect is powerful, but this is probably too expensive, even with delve.
Amusing how this and March of the Returned have similar names.
This mix of effects is a bit odd in monoblack.
Tarkir vampires are creepy.
Odd how Magic actually has more than one zombie crocodile. This seems decent.
This effect is kind of weird.
Wow, zombie elephant! Wow, huge butt! This is actually one of the few big butt creatures that actually had its power + toughness be equal to its mana cost.
This is pretty good.
Blech. Anyway, I can see this creature getting pretty big, but only sometimes.
I guess they liked Lash of the Whip so much that they gave it a generic one-word name, which is a hot commodity.
And there's our morph first strike!
This seems good in limited, especially as a Lava Axe that can target creatures.
For some reason, it always seems like making boulders fall uses up more mana than it should. Still, this is decent enough in limited.
I like this card.
0/5 in red without any other red effects? OK...
This is a neat effect.
I like this card. It should be pretty good in limited.
Well I suppose that happens when you set it on fire. For the effect and rarity, I would have liked at least higher power.
Not Smelt? OK then... I suppose this is because so many of the artifacts you see will be mana fixers.
After it was revealed that Temur ogres are white and fuzzy, I was worried we wouldn't get any yetis, yet here it is!
I like this effect.
I thought Wild Guess was decent enough, but I'm happy to see a less color-restrictive version!
This is a nice reprint.
A red 2/2 for 2 with haste at common!
A more appropriate power for grizzly bears!
This is pretty good in limited.
This seems pretty good.
I think this is actually a decent life gain card. In limited, of course.
This is another nice reprint, and it doesn't have those creepy-looking plants!
This is an interesting card, and at common too!
I like these effects.
Grisly Salvage gains one mana and becomes a sorcery by losing black. Still not bad.
Another "look at target face-down creature" effect? At least this is on a non-Tarkir bear.
Another powerful outlast creature. It really seems like they should have played up the sliver aspect of the mechanic in the early spoilers more.
This is a good limited card.
Another named Sultai character! How odd. This is OK.
I like the art. The effect seems decent.
Oh, another mantis. Well, the other one didn't actually have the insect creature type. This is OK.
This is pretty decent, especially with the reduced randomness from similar effects. Also, I misread this at first as "Master of the Way", so I was confused by it not being a creature.
This is pretty good, especially on a common.
This seems pretty decent.
This seems like a decent mill effect, especially when it includes lands, though it would have been better if it could target yourself.
Hmm...
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Doubling Season!
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I was thinking something like using the Falconer, Anafenza, and the High Sentinels, and then maybe mixing in Ajani(s) and Elspeth.
I'm just not sure what to play early game? Sylvan Caryatid? Nyx-Fleece Ram? Fleecemane Lion?
I think it might be too conditional on having things to actually activate heroic. I think getting the counters out isn't too hard - Abzan Charm, Ajanis, Anafenza, Abzan Ascendency, etc. are probably better and most of those either have alternate modes or alternate upsides.
The creatures I'm looking at are like:
Soldier of the Pantheon - I like him because I think he has a relevant protection for this standard block - the problem is that you can't actually target him with a lot of stuff like Ajani, MOH or Abzan Charm.
Fleecemane Lion - Fleecemane is just "good" if you can play him, but its a maybe card. The monstrous does in fact give him counters and flying if you have the Falcon guy out.
Sylvan Caryatid - Mana fixing?
Abzan Falconer - Might be nutso with the cards that give multiple cards counters
Anafenza, the Foremost - Just value + counters
High Sentinels of Arashin - Dude can get huge fast, might even come down huge?
Ajani Steadfast - Counters on all your guys or lifelink, easy mana requirements
Ajani, Mentor of Heroes - Sort of a maybe card, but you can dig for creatures, Elspeth or get a ton of counters on all your guys
Elspeth, Sun’s Champion - Another maybe card - I'm not sure what she adds beyond "Elspeth is a good card"
I'm just not sure what to play early game? Sylvan Caryatid? Nyx-Fleece Ram? Fleecemane Lion?
I think it might be too conditional on having things to actually activate heroic. I think getting the counters out isn't too hard - Abzan Charm, Ajanis, Anafenza, Abzan Ascendency, etc. are probably better and most of those either have alternate modes or alternate upsides.
The creatures I'm looking at are like:
Soldier of the Pantheon - I like him because I think he has a relevant protection for this standard block - the problem is that you can't actually target him with a lot of stuff like Ajani, MOH or Abzan Charm.
Fleecemane Lion - Fleecemane is just "good" if you can play him, but its a maybe card. The monstrous does in fact give him counters and flying if you have the Falcon guy out.
Sylvan Caryatid - Mana fixing?
Abzan Falconer - Might be nutso with the cards that give multiple cards counters
Anafenza, the Foremost - Just value + counters
High Sentinels of Arashin - Dude can get huge fast, might even come down huge?
Ajani Steadfast - Counters on all your guys or lifelink, easy mana requirements
Ajani, Mentor of Heroes - Sort of a maybe card, but you can dig for creatures, Elspeth or get a ton of counters on all your guys
Elspeth, Sun’s Champion - Another maybe card - I'm not sure what she adds beyond "Elspeth is a good card"
Right now my head says Temur and my heart wants Mardu. Temur seems like a natural fit for sealed having a looser deckbuilding theme with big dudes+getting value off of big dudes, but I want to be the guy who opens the nut Mardu deck and runs everyone off the table.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Yeah, damn Temur seems like it might be more consistent in Sealed. Abzan would be absolutely nuts if you get the support for it, but its getting that support...
divisionbyzorro
Member
I get the feeling that in sealed you're going to play what your fixing lets you play.
keeblerdrow
Member
Welp. Now I have to avoid this thread on my phone until the next page or my next billing cycle.
I guess they didn't want cheap burn in a set where they wanted creature combat and morphs to thrive. Nice to see Arc Lightning back tho.
U/R yet again gets the short end of the stick . All noncreature spells, all garbage in constructed. Yet again proof the design team have no clue what to do with U/R's design space.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Yeah, all of the U/R cards they do are stapled-cards (e.g. staple a blue and red card together).
If U/R is a thing its going to have to be U/W/R and I think the star U/R card would be Keranos. But I'm not a great deckbuilder.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
U/R is interesting. If I had to guess, they screw up Blue enough already that making anything really pushed in U/R worries them
I can agree with that. Mind, I still intend to try it. I want to make Abzan Aggro a thing that works.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I think its doable running like Soldier of the Pantheon, Bloodsoaked Champion, Fleecemane, Rakshasa Deathdealer, Anafenza, and then a bunch of spells to buff em up?
divisionbyzorro
Member
You say that now; I get the feeling that you'll be thinking differently when you go to blocks and realize that anything blows you out.
How to play Standard on the cheap starting day 1-ish for the price of a few boxes:
Sarkhan - picked up 2 @ 15 on Amazon
Surrak - Good but overpriced, wait for cooldown
Impersonator- see Surrak
Sorin - ASS, decent in Junk/Mardu as a roleplayer, hold off till he craters
Anafenza- Good, I picked up a set for 19
Sidisi - Might be good, but is going to be cheap, if she finds a home buy her then before a spike happens
See the unwritten- Meh
Narset-Meh Hooded
Hydra- Meh
Empty the pits- Buy two after it craters
Ugin's Nexus - Meh
Ashcloud Phoenix - Meh
Zurgo- Bought a set at 7, still cratering, probably worth picking up 3 at 1.50
Pearl Lake- meh
Fetches- WAIT They're allready 11-12 on Amazon for non-Us, Delta at 15-16, Strand at 14-15. Will keep going down.
Ascendancies- Grab a set of each for 2-3 each.
Butcher of the Horder- I picked up at 4.25 on Ebay, pick up for 5 or less now. its good
Bloodsoaked champion- good pickup for under 5 i think, thats where GCrawler was
Savage Knuckleblade, grabbed for 3.25 each somehow, 4 or less seems good
Rattleclaw Mystic- I grabbed for 2.75 each, probably 3 or less time to strike
Utter End- DO NOT GET THE ENEMY 2 COLOR UN-Clan-Marked Rares until after Intro decklists are released.
Siege Rhino- Wait- Polukranos beats him up right now, pick up later
Mantis Rider - picked up at 2 each
Mindswipe - meh
End Hostilities - Grabbed for under 2 each
Grim Haruspex - meh, pick up later.
Rakasha Deathdealer- meh
Crackling Doom- grabbed a set for 3, pay under a buck for these imo
Crater's Claws - meh
Ghostfire Blade- grabbed a set for 2.50 total, grab this- Eldrazi are coming.
Deflecting Palm - see Utter End
Sagu Mauler- See Utter End
uncommons- grab cheap sets of the good ones like tris and charms
Sarkhan - picked up 2 @ 15 on Amazon
Surrak - Good but overpriced, wait for cooldown
Impersonator- see Surrak
Sorin - ASS, decent in Junk/Mardu as a roleplayer, hold off till he craters
Anafenza- Good, I picked up a set for 19
Sidisi - Might be good, but is going to be cheap, if she finds a home buy her then before a spike happens
See the unwritten- Meh
Narset-Meh Hooded
Hydra- Meh
Empty the pits- Buy two after it craters
Ugin's Nexus - Meh
Ashcloud Phoenix - Meh
Zurgo- Bought a set at 7, still cratering, probably worth picking up 3 at 1.50
Pearl Lake- meh
Fetches- WAIT They're allready 11-12 on Amazon for non-Us, Delta at 15-16, Strand at 14-15. Will keep going down.
Ascendancies- Grab a set of each for 2-3 each.
Butcher of the Horder- I picked up at 4.25 on Ebay, pick up for 5 or less now. its good
Bloodsoaked champion- good pickup for under 5 i think, thats where GCrawler was
Savage Knuckleblade, grabbed for 3.25 each somehow, 4 or less seems good
Rattleclaw Mystic- I grabbed for 2.75 each, probably 3 or less time to strike
Utter End- DO NOT GET THE ENEMY 2 COLOR UN-Clan-Marked Rares until after Intro decklists are released.
Siege Rhino- Wait- Polukranos beats him up right now, pick up later
Mantis Rider - picked up at 2 each
Mindswipe - meh
End Hostilities - Grabbed for under 2 each
Grim Haruspex - meh, pick up later.
Rakasha Deathdealer- meh
Crackling Doom- grabbed a set for 3, pay under a buck for these imo
Crater's Claws - meh
Ghostfire Blade- grabbed a set for 2.50 total, grab this- Eldrazi are coming.
Deflecting Palm - see Utter End
Sagu Mauler- See Utter End
uncommons- grab cheap sets of the good ones like tris and charms
Just shouting it for fun?
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
When I posted that someone was asking for cards that go well with Abzan
Then when I hit submit it ended up on the bottom of SigmaSonic's long post
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