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[acheron_xl]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";164023039]Ayn Rand?[/QUOTE]

It really did sound like Maro was just reading a description of Rand when he was talking about black in the B/W podcast.

 

[charlequin]

But Crovax was one of the good guys before Sorin was.

Until some randos screwed up the storyline and made him start twirling his mustache. :/

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";163937494]Since we were on the subject of the color pie, I thought I'd bring up the chart I made for how I like to look at it. It's pretty useful to me when designing fake cards to think of the colors like this, in a really vague, conceptual way.


Obviously my idea of where Rakdos should be is... a bit different from how Wizards handles it.
[/QUOTE]

I dunno:

[IMG]http://magiccards.info/scans/en/avr/86.jpg

 

[kirblar]

The issue of "overdesigning for Commander" is a real one, and they actually had meetings about it about 8 months to a year ago. They started playing in space that was really better left untouched.

 

[charlequin]

The issue of "overdesigning for Commander" is a real one, and they actually had meetings about it about 8 months to a year ago. They started playing in space that was really better left untouched.

This is what happens to them every single time they design for a new format. The first time they tried to actively design for Vintage we got Chalice of the Void and Trinisphere. With Commander they overdid it both with generals in the Commander product (half of the new ones in C13 are absurd) and with "casual" cards in regular expansions (like the Primordial cycle that people rightfully hated.) C14 is such a huge step up, though.

Where is that info about the meeting from? I feel like I missed that day of Blogatog.

 

[kirblar]

This is what happens to them every single time they design for a new format. The first time they tried to actively design for Vintage we got Chalice of the Void and Trinisphere. With Commander they overdid it both with generals in the Commander product (half of the new ones in C13 are absurd) and with "casual" cards in regular expansions (like the Primordial cycle that people rightfully hated.) C14 is such a huge step up, though.

Where is that info about the meeting from? I feel like I missed that day of Blogatog.

Was either Twitter or Blogatog, yeah.

 

[WanderingWind]

Funny, because we were saying that a couple threads ago and there was a lot of argument that over whether it was actually happening. I still think that with the commander products being successful, they can just go ahead and ignore the format altogether when designing standard sets.

 

[Rafy]

Ok people, new MTG player here! I have finally given up on Yu-Gi-Oh since the changes are too much for me to keep up and I am making the switch to MTG.
I am glad to start now since they are changing their blocks system and having 2 larger ones per year(instead of the smaller 4 there are now) starting either in July with Origins or in October with the other one.

I have watched all the videos from the Tolarian Communicty College YT channel regarding what to spend and not spend money on, as well as, how to start and what first purchases to make.

Later today I am going to my local store to pick up 2 sample decks (black,blue) to start practicing. Thankfully my neighbor is an MTG veteran and I can play with him until I get the hang of it and can start attending FNM meet-ups.

My goal is to have an ok deck by the time Origins is going on pre-release and have learned how to play and build decks in an acceptable fashion.

I also have the demo for MTG 2014 installed on my PC for it's tutorial.

I want to start building a mono black or blue-black deck that I can upgrade with more expansive cards over time. When it comes to mono black I found this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C4m5WiXQQkU
but I am still looking for a blue-black budget one that I can upgrade as time goes on to make it a killer deck.

The reason I chose Black is because I LOVE the artwork but if it's too weak let me know now so I avoid a bad investment.

Beyond this, is there anything else I can do? Advice and tips are extremely appreciated.

 

[ElyrionX]

Funny, because we were saying that a couple threads ago and there was a lot of argument that over whether it was actually happening. I still think that with the commander products being successful, they can just go ahead and ignore the format altogether when designing standard sets.

Sure but Commander products only happen once a year and are largely reprints.

Given that standard sets are going to be filled with plenty of worthless and underpowered jank at all rarities, I don't see why they can't dedicate some resources to filling some of those slots with cards specifically designed for EDH.

 

[acheron_xl]

They've been overdesigning for commander since M11 at least.

 

[OnPoint]

Until some randos screwed up the storyline and made him start twirling his mustache. :/

I've always been curious about this. Do you have a link to more info on what happened by any chance?

 

[Sequence Six]

I've always been curious about this. Do you have a link to more info on what happened by any chance?

The only thing I've found on it simply says that the original storyline was different--Crovax becomes a vampire but doesn't turn evil, and Mirri doesn't die during the Stronghold arc at all--but not why things changed. Maro was taken off the story team after Mirage block and by the time we got to Exodus we were leaving the original script.

So we could've had a vampire protagonist all the way back then. Instead we got whatever mess Crovax turned into.

edit: http://archive.wizards.com/Magic/magazine/article.aspx?x=mtgcom/daily/mr308

all that's said here is that things were originally different. Not much more has been revealed.

 

[Firemind]

Basically, he became obsessed with an angel. She didn't reciprocate (pls respond) and then he destroyed some artifact that bound her which accidentally cursed him. He then later killed her which made him even more crazy. Then he became the new evincar of Rath.

Not sure what they changed from the original storyline tbh.

 

[bigkrev]

Ok people, new MTG player here! I have finally given up on Yu-Gi-Oh since the changes are too much for me to keep up and I am making the switch to MTG.
I am glad to start now since they are changing their blocks system and having 2 larger ones per year(instead of the smaller 4 there are now) starting either in July with Origins or in October with the other one.

I have watched all the videos from the Tolarian Communicty College YT channel regarding what to spend and not spend money on, as well as, how to start and what first purchases to make.

Later today I am going to my local store to pick up 2 sample decks (black,blue) to start practicing. Thankfully my neighbor is an MTG veteran and I can play with him until I get the hang of it and can start attending FNM meet-ups.

My goal is to have an ok deck by the time Origins is going on pre-release and have learned how to play and build decks in an acceptable fashion.

I also have the demo for MTG 2014 installed on my PC for it's tutorial.

I want to start building a mono black or blue-black deck that I can upgrade with more expansive cards over time. When it comes to mono black I found this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C4m5WiXQQkU
but I am still looking for a blue-black budget one that I can upgrade as time goes on to make it a killer deck.

The reason I chose Black is because I LOVE the artwork but if it's too weak let me know now so I avoid a bad investment.

Beyond this, is there anything else I can do? Advice and tips are extremely appreciated.

So, as you are coming from another CCG, do you know what level of competitiveness you are aiming for? Do you want to win at the Kitchen Table, a weekly store tournament, or larger events like SCGOpens, PTQs, or Grand Prix? This is what should govern how you start spending your money.

 

[OnPoint]

The only thing I've found on it simply says that the original storyline was different--Crovax becomes a vampire but doesn't turn evil, and Mirri doesn't die during the Stronghold arc at all--but not why things changed. Maro was taken off the story team after Mirage block and by the time we got to Exodus we were leaving the original script.

So we could've had a vampire protagonist all the way back then. Instead we got whatever mess Crovax turned into.

edit: http://archive.wizards.com/Magic/magazine/article.aspx?x=mtgcom/daily/mr308

all that's said here is that things were originally different. Not much more has been revealed.

Damn. I always thought Crovax's descent didn't make much sense. I also hated how they warped Ertai. Not because I liked that smug dick, but because it all felt so haphazard and forced.

Not that Ertai was ever cool...

 

[kirblar]

Funny, because we were saying that a couple threads ago and there was a lot of argument that over whether it was actually happening. I still think that with the commander products being successful, they can just go ahead and ignore the format altogether when designing standard sets.

Maro's basically said as such. There will be multiplayer-friendly cards as always, but they could give a shit if a legend's a good commander. (See: Dragonlord Kologhan.)

There's just no reason to waste time/resources on it and target stuff specifically for that market- they'll play the cards they want anyway, and they have a specific product already on the market for specialty cards.

 

[SigmasonicX]

Another important difference between what was planned for the Weatherlight Saga and what happened is that Urza was always involved, but originally, he would have only been part of the backstory and wouldn't have taken an active role in the present. Also, Volrath would have been the main villain for much longer (not sure if all throughout), which makes sense since he's Gerrard's brother and all that.

Beyond this, is there anything else I can do? Advice and tips are extremely appreciated.

I definitely recommend playing through that game demo you have to learn the rules.

Concerning your deck, do you want one that you can play in tournaments or just one to play with friends? Right now, black/blue is one of the more popular decks in Standard (tournament format using the last couple of sets).

 

[Firemind]

Start drafting at your local store. I don't think yugioh has drafting and it's basically the best thing ever. (Unless it's Homelands and Fallen Empires.)

 

[Angry Grimace]

I can't say I was there for any of it other than quitting around Weatherlight, but the entire Weatherlight saga seems like hot garbage.

Like worse than Jace moaning and groaning over whatever lady he's romancing on Plane X.

 

[WanderingWind]

On a positive note, Kenji is hosting parts of the MOCS championship and the amount of people that jumped in with the Numot hype was fun to watch. The dude is the people's champ.

 

[acheron_xl]

Kinda surreal seeing someone that used to whip my ass at my LGS 15 years ago in a MOCS feature match.

 

[The Technomancer]

autumnstrix asked: What do you think Elspeth would do if she was alive in Hell's Kitchen in exactly Matt Murdock's position? Would she back away from the situation since she doesn't want to break the law, or become a vigilante. How about Gideon?

I think Elspeth would have trouble in a situation like Hell’s Kitchen. She would stop crime when she sees it but she wouldn’t torture people to get information. Gideon would be a vigilante but he already has a Red leaning. When he went to Ravnica, he hooked up with Boros.

R/W Gideon upcoming confirmed

 

[Jhriad]

R/W Gideon upcoming confirmed

His stupid hand whip thing now comes with flames!

 

[Angry Grimace]

R/W Gideon upcoming confirmed

His stupid hand whip thing now comes with flames!

His love interest in Chandra, R/W was kind of a given I think, and she'd probably be pleased about fire

 

[Rafy]

Another important difference between what was planned for the Weatherlight Saga and what happened is that Urza was always involved, but originally, he would have only been part of the backstory and wouldn't have taken an active role in the present. Also, Volrath would have been the main villain for much longer (not sure if all throughout), which makes sense since he's Gerrard's brother and all that.



I definitely recommend playing through that game demo you have to learn the rules.

Concerning your deck, do you want one that you can play in tournaments or just one to play with friends? Right now, black/blue is one of the more popular decks in Standard (tournament format using the last couple of sets).

So, as you are coming from another CCG, do you know what level of competitiveness you are aiming for? Do you want to win at the Kitchen Table, a weekly store tournament, or larger events like SCGOpens, PTQs, or Grand Prix? This is what should govern how you start spending your money.

I have no ambition to play in national or regional competitions, just at my local store, pre-releases and with my friends.

 

[SigmasonicX]

I have no ambition to play in national or regional competitions, just at my local store, pre-releases and with my friends.

For playing in tournaments in your store, you should know about the following two formats:

Standard - A format where only cards from the last several sets are legal. A rotation of what's legal occurs every time a new block (group of sets on the same world) starts. Currently, the legal sets are Theros block (Theros, Born of the Gods, Journey into Nyx), Magic Core 2015, and Khans of Tarkir block (Khans of Tarkir, Fate Reforged, Dragons of Tarkir). The release of Magic Origins will not cause a rotation, but the release of Battle for Zendikar will cause Theros block and Magic Core 2015 to leave. Commonly used rare cards can get pretty expensive, especially lands, but you can generally build a budget deck fairly easily that can do well in stores. As I mentioned before, blue/black is a popular deck in Standard right now.

Modern - A format where all cards from Magic 8th Edition on are legal, besides those on a ban list. These cards can be recognized by having the modern card frame (older cards look different, one was posted above), though some cards not legal in Modern have been printed in the modern card frame. This is more expensive than Standard, but you won't have to constantly modify your deck with new cards.

There is also Legacy, with legal cards from the beginning of Magic on with a ban list, but that's very expensive and also not played in many stores.

Pre-releases are limited formats, meaning you are given cards to try to make decks out of.

For playing with friends, all rules go out the window, so just do whatever.

 

[Firemind]

Last but not least, EDH is the wild wild west of Magic.

 

[Royal_Flush]

Quick question from a casual player: Do prices of lands drop significantly once they rotate out of standard? (aka. should I wait a few months before buying Theros-Scrylands?)

 

[kirblar]

Quick question from a casual player: Do prices of lands drop significantly once they rotate out of standard? (aka. should I wait a few months before buying Theros-Scrylands?)

Yes, very much so.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Quick question from a casual player: Do prices of lands drop significantly once they rotate out of standard? (aka. should I wait a few months before buying Theros-Scrylands?)

Those will cost like .50 or less when they rotate out. They're not used anywhere other than Standard.

 

[The Technomancer]

Quick question from a casual player: Do prices of lands drop significantly once they rotate out of standard? (aka. should I wait a few months before buying Theros-Scrylands?)

Depends on the lands. The Theros scrylands are only played in Standard so they'll drop like a rock. But the Khans fetchlands are staples in many formats, so they'll retain their price pretty well

 

[Angry Grimace]

Depends on the lands. The Theros scrylands are only played in Standard so they'll drop like a rock. But the Khans fetchlands are staples in many formats, so they'll retain their price pretty well

I think shocks have started climbing back up, actually.

I miss shocks *sigh* Best standard fixing around.

 

[Matriox]

I couldn't comfortably play Grixis Dragons so I played Rb Dragons instead.
http://decks.deckedbuilder.com/d/71095

Anger is pretty good against sidisi+Raptor.dec lol. 2-0 so far with 2 more games to go. Dashing Kolaghan into 2 additional Dragons is pretty sick though!

Edit: round 3 against a friend of mine playing Abzan Megamorph, pretty much ideal matchup, got it 2-0.

 

[Jhriad]

Quick question from a casual player: Do prices of lands drop significantly once they rotate out of standard? (aka. should I wait a few months before buying Theros-Scrylands?)

The Temples will drop once they rotate out as they don't see use anywhere else. If you're looking for the Khans fetches though I'd probably get in now. They hit peak supply a few weeks back so you've already seen the lowest those will probably go.

 

[Etrian Oddity]

The Temples will drop once they rotate out as they don't see use anywhere else. If you're looking for the Khans fetches though I'd probably get in now. They hit peak supply a few weeks back so you've already seen the lowest those will probably go.

Windswept Heath just keeps climbing in price. @_@

 

[GoutPatrol]

The Temples will drop once they rotate out as they don't see use anywhere else. If you're looking for the Khans fetches though I'd probably get in now. They hit peak supply a few weeks back so you've already seen the lowest those will probably go.

I thought some temples were being played in Jeskai control for Modern. And no matter what land, rare lands will all eventually start climbing up in price after the initial post-standard fall. Look at the Innistrad or Scars lands and see. They all end up 3-5 dollars at least.

 

[charlequin]

I've always been curious about this. Do you have a link to more info on what happened by any chance?

We don't have a lot of info because it's one of those things that no one's allowed to talk about because it'd make the company look bad, but basically the Weatherlight Saga was originally plotted out by Rosewater and Michael Ryan, but during Exodus they got kicked off and replaced by some randos.

For all the crap Rosewater got for the whole Weatherlight Saga thing, the part he was in charge of read like a workmanlike but passable fantasy novel, while basically everything after read like some untalented teenager's horrible self-insertion fanfic, so.

Another important difference between what was planned for the Weatherlight Saga and what happened is that Urza was always involved, but originally, he would have only been part of the backstory and wouldn't have taken an active role in the present. Also, Volrath would have been the main villain for much longer (not sure if all throughout), which makes sense since he's Gerrard's brother and all that.

It's easy to predict what most of the story was like because Rosewater's as into structure in storytelling as he is in set design. The early sets and the supporting story material in stuff like the Duelist laid it all out pretty clearly: there were a bunch of specific artifacts that they'd hunt down around the multiverse, Gerard and Volrath were the Star Wars-style brothers on opposite sides who would meet in the grand finale, and the story would be about how by accepting his role as a hero Gerard would assemble the Legacy, save the world, and live happily ever after.

Instead we got a bunch of hot garbage where the setup villains get replaced with ZOMG KEWLER ones, all the attention is on a Mary Sue Urza who gets to be the hero despite constantly murdering his allies and being a dick to everyone, the world gets completely ruined in the process of "saving" it, and the characters die all the time for absolutely no reason. Nothing people complain about these days is nearly as terrible.

 

[Toxi]

Instead we got a bunch of hot garbage where the setup villains get replaced with ZOMG KEWLER ones, all the attention is on a Mary Sue Urza who gets to be the hero despite constantly murdering his allies and being a dick to everyone, the world gets completely ruined in the process of "saving" it, and the characters die all the time for absolutely no reason. Nothing people complain about these days is nearly as terrible.

On the plus side, we got The Brothers' War and Planeswalker out of the Urza focus.

But he really should have dropped out of the story after the flashback. And the Weatherlight "saga" really was a complete mess, especially in how they tried to portray the story in the cards by illustrating the same characters again and again and again.

 

[Yeef]

R/W Gideon upcoming confirmed

Yeah; when Desperate Stand was first spoiled, I figured it meant we'd get a RW Gideon eventually. I think we're also likely to get a RW Nahiri, a BR Tibalt and a GW Nissa.

 

[Matriox]

Ended up drawing for last round with the two of us being the only undefeated. Kolaghan's Command is pretty sweet, but every time I used it was to deal 2 to a morph or something and get a Dragon back to the hand. The artifact hate will be good if I see a whip, but I'm not entirely sold on the discard. Never came up with my opponent only having 1 or 2 cards in hand, should I be ripping a card when they have 4+ or just shock them in the face?

 

[manipulate]

I thought Volrath was a p cool design honestly

 

[Angry Grimace]

Well I'm dumb and signed up for MM15 sealed. I suppose the 30 cent entry fee on top of the packs isn't a bad deal.

 

[charlequin]

I think we're also likely to get a RW Nahiri

Red-white? Wouldn't have been my guess. I guess none of the white pairs are super under-represented now.

 

[The Technomancer]

Maybe Nahiri goes blue or something. Except we're probably getting Tezz again this block

 

[Yeef]

I think we'll get a red white Nahiri for two reasons; red is typically the color of stone magic, so it makes sense. In that last Uncharted realms it felt as though they tried to emphasize the red part of her character. It felt like the story was primarily about her losing her red (passionate) side, then having it reawaken.

And for those first few centuries, she had lived—really lived—among her own people, the kor. She had cooed at babies and wept at funerals, laughed around tables piled with good food, and fell in love…twice.

But her students learned and moved on. Her lovers aged and died. Birth followed birth, over and over, and one funeral followed another, and eventually she couldn't remember why it mattered…any of it.

every movement a prick of pain in Nahiri's flesh—a sensation she had not experienced in ages. She observed the feeling curiously, noticing the annoyance it stirred in her mind. She considered discarding those feelings... But she was feeling pain, and annoyance, and with them came desire

Fury boiled up in her, directed as much at herself as at whoever had done this.

Fury—another feeling she had forgotten. It felt good.

She would go and find him, wake him up if she needed to, remind him of her and Zendikar and the friendship they had once shared, remind him what it was to live, to feel, to care.

 

[y2dvd]

Ended up drawing for last round with the two of us being the only undefeated. Kolaghan's Command is pretty sweet, but every time I used it was to deal 2 to a morph or something and get a Dragon back to the hand. The artifact hate will be good if I see a whip, but I'm not entirely sold on the discard. Never came up with my opponent only having 1 or 2 cards in hand, should I be ripping a card when they have 4+ or just shock them in the face?

You wait until you have Soulfire in play, then you keep discarding their hand while buying back the command! Lock them out of cards on their draw step!

 

["God's Beard!"]

I like how Nahiri is running around the planes to try and save Sorin from his own personality, while Sorin is off trying his best to not even think about her. He tried to impress upon Ugin that there was bad blood or something, but as soon as Nahiri wakes up she's all like, "where's my bb?"

"Hit it and quit it" - Sorin Markov

 

[Firemind]

But he really should have dropped out of the story after the flashback. And the Weatherlight "saga" really was a complete mess, especially in how they tried to portray the story in the cards by illustrating the same characters again and again and again.

I like how they incorporate story events into the cards.

It's not all that different than what we have right now frankly. We should have more Deicides and Crux of Fates than random magic cards.

I thought Volrath was a p cool design honestly

da bess

 

[Maledict]

Listening to Maro's podcasts, and I do think he really struggles around black - and rightfully so.

Wizards desperately try to portray black as not being all about evil - but it is. There's no point going on about how black isn't evil when every card is some face sucking vampire, zombie, abomination or otherwise evil thing killing and butchering for power, glory or fun. You can't complain about black being considered evil and white good when that's how the entire game portrays them - and the one time they tried to reverse this trope it just didn't work at all.

Black characters can be interesting, they can be fun, they can even accomplish good things by accident - but they aren't "good", by their nature. When they become "good", they shift out of black! Maro talks about how Han solo in Star Wars was a black character - which is true, to a point. That point being when he risks his life to assault the deathstar and save Luke, which is white through and through. Black only becomes good when it shifts out of black - which is fine as a storytelling tool, but can't be used to claim black isn't all selfish and evil.

EDIT: Also, complete side topic. He needs to stop talking about tales where he is the lone hero battling against the rest of R&D to prove something work and is great, and how he finally overcomes this to save the game. Again. It's a bit tiresome and really creates the image that Mark is Magic.

 

[Xis]

Maybe Nahiri goes blue or something. Except we're probably getting Tezz again this block

I imagine we'll see Kiora in this block as well; her whole deal is gathering giant sea monsters to bring back to 'battle for Zendikar'.

 

[kirblar]

EDIT: Also, complete side topic. He needs to stop talking about tales where he is the lone hero battling against the rest of R&D to prove something work and is great, and how he finally overcomes this to save the game. Again. It's a bit tiresome and really creates the image that Mark is Magic.

Especially when he's the guy who sticks Tribute in a set.