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[OnPoint]

How cool would it be if they reprinted JTMS in Oath Gate Bonanza and unbanned it in Modern at the same time? It would prevent them from needing to design YET another Jace and would be cool if they printed the same card in the second set of a Zendikar block again.

Spoiler

I know it will never happen but that story hinted at it a little

That said, I think the next Jace will use illusions somehow. Would be cool if it somehow flipped over along with 2 or 3 other similarly backed cards and your opponent had to guess which was which to attack it or something like that. No idea how you would actually do it, honestly. Just an idea that might be cool.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

Psh. Jace is just a slightly better Merfolk Looter. Nissa is just a slightly better Borderland Ranger. I don't get what all the hype is. /s

 

[A Serious Man]

Jace will be a blue staple for as long as he's in Standard. He's good, cheap and can fit into just about anything.

 

[charlequin]

Logically you'd go with slowlands if the Scars lands were fastlands.

except these aren't at all the opposite of the fastlands

My buddy goes off on Wil Wheaton at PAX.

I honestly think the idea of having a twitch-streamed preview show from PAX is a good one, but the execution was awful between the hosting choices and the lack of sensible content to make the thing actually flow remotely smoothly.

Maybe they should hire Randy Buehler back and let him do it, he does a better job of planning twitch content than anyone currently at WotC seems to.

 

[Angry Grimace]

How cool would it be if they reprinted JTMS in Oath Gate Bonanza and unbanned it in Modern at the same time? It would prevent them from needing to design YET another Jace and would be cool if they printed the same card in the second set of a Zendikar block again.

Spoiler

I know it will never happen but that story hinted at it a little

That said, I think the next Jace will use illusions somehow. Would be cool if it somehow flipped over along with 2 or 3 other similarly backed cards and your opponent had to guess which was which to attack it or something like that. No idea how you would actually do it, honestly. Just an idea that might be cool.

I could buy JTMS being legal in Modern by the time MM3 rolls around. What I couldn't buy is them ever printing JTMS in Standard.

except these aren't at all the opposite of the fastlands

Its reasonably close, but you're clearly on a mission to shoot down every name isn't tangolands.

 

[kirblar]

It's definitely a great idea- but so many bizarre decisions were being made. Hosts that are only tangentially connected to MTG. (Reddit's enthusiastic Day9 suggestion makes SO much more sense) Spoiling all the cards on twitter beforehand so there's no energy in the audience when they're revealed.

Renton seems like an incredibly insular place re: culture right now - LGSes I've been in are full of normal people being weekend warriors, not GEEK CULTURE people.

 

[Angry Grimace]

It's definitely a great idea- but so many bizarre decisions were being made. Hosts that are only tangentially connected to MTG. (Reddit's enthusiastic Day9 suggestion makes SO much more sense) Spoiling all the cards on twitter beforehand so there's no energy in the audience when they're revealed.

Renton seems like an incredibly insular place re: culture right now - LGSes I've been in are full of normal people being weekend warriors, not GEEK CULTURE people.

They're trying to expand MTG's audience to the general geek population.

I don't get embarrassed by any activity I do (because I'm too old to get embarassed by whatever dumb shit I like) but watching the MTG conference with my friends was pretty bad because they just couldn't get over the way MaRo talks.

 

[kirblar]

I don't think this "general geek population" exists- it's like the FGC- it's a collection of smaller groups with hugely disparate interests which get collected together, not a unified group.

It's like they saw Big Bang Theory and decided that emulating that rancid garbage pile was a good idea.

 

[Angry Grimace]

I don't think this "general geek population" exists- it's like the FGC- it's a collection of smaller groups with hugely disparate interests which get collected together, not a unified group.

It's like they saw Big Bang Theory and decided that emulating that rancid garbage pile was a good idea.

You're likely correct that it doesn't but I think that's where they're going with it.

The biggest problem with assuming a Comic Con Culture exists is that most people have no frame of reference as to what people our age were like 10 or 20 years ago. I'm 32 now and every single person I hang out with is into stuff that would have been considered geeky when I was 18, but that isn't necessarily meaningful.

 

[The Technomancer]

I don't think this "general geek population" exists- it's like the FGC- it's a collection of smaller groups with hugely disparate interests which get collected together, not a unified group.

It's like they saw Big Bang Theory and decided that emulating that rancid garbage pile was a good idea.

I sort of think it does exist, and its what's emerged in the last 10 years or so. Loot Crate is selling to somebody

 

[kirblar]

You're likely correct that it doesn't but I think that's where they're going with it.

The biggest problem with assuming a Comic Con Culture exists is that most people have no frame of reference as to what people our age were like 10 or 20 years ago. I'm 32 now and every single person I hang out with is into stuff that would have been considered geeky when I was 18, but that isn't necessarily meaningful.

Yeah, lots of this stuff went mainstream, and I think de-stigmatization is absolutely huge. Focusing on the "I'm such a geekily geeky geek! Look at how geeeky I am!" is using identity in a way that I don't think is a positive because it becomes exclusionary to those who don't identify that way. MTG's great at using things like Colors/Guilds/Clans on that axis once people invest a little in large part because there's a spectrum of identities there.

When you see Blizzard panels talk about their game, they don't have to pretend they're anything other than what they are -they and the audience are people who love Blizzard games, regardless of whatever else they are.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Yeah, lots of this stuff went mainstream, and I think de-stigmatization is absolutely huge. Focusing on the "I'm such a geekily geeky geek! Look at how geeeky I am!" is using identity in a way that I don't think is a positive because it becomes exclusionary to those who don't identify that way. MTG's great at using things like Colors/Guilds/Clans on that axis once people invest a little in large part because there's a spectrum of identities there.

When you see Blizzard panels talk about their game, they don't have to pretend they're anything other than what they are -they and the audience are people who love Blizzard games, regardless of whatever else they are.

I think the idea that if you are into Sci-Fi, you're probably also into fantasy, MTG, D&D and comic books is outmoded. For the most part, the people going to see Iron Man movies are not these imaginary Big Bang Theory people. Its part of why I hate that fucking show.

 

[Firemind]

Can't we just have goblins and elves and merfolk and vampires fight each other over trivial stuff? I'm getting kind of tired of these world shattering events. Innistrad was the last set where nothing extraordinary happened. Until Avacyn broke out that is.

 

[Jhriad]

I sort of think it does exist, and its what's emerged in the last 10 years or so. Loot Crate is selling to somebody

Do people actually buy those for themselves or do they receive them as gifts from their family? My friend's sister bought him a subscription and he basically just tosses the whole thing in the garbage as soon as it comes in.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Can't we just have goblins and elves and merfolk and vampires fight each other over trivial stuff? I'm getting kind of tired of these world shattering events. Innistrad was the last set where nothing extraordinary happened. Until Avacyn broke out that is.

Nothing was actually happening in either reality of Tarkir though. The entire "plot" was contained in Fate Reforged and it had no real relevance to any of the characters beyond Ugin existing. I fully expect Return to Tarkir (it will happen) to be timey-wimey Chrono Cross shit where the Khans timeline somehow reemerges into the Dragons one and the full powered clans fight the full powered dragons one.

Jace is probably gonna go to Tarkir soon enough, I imagine since the story art shows him talking to Ugin, and Ugin probably didn't just randomly go to Zendikar. How does one get to a plane that they've never even been to, anyways?

 

[SigmasonicX]

Jace is probably gonna go to Tarkir soon enough, I imagine since the story art shows him talking to Ugin, and Ugin probably didn't just randomly go to Zendikar. How does one get to a plane that they've never even been to, anyways?

Uh, why wouldn't Ugin go to Zendikar as soon as he learned the Eldrazi were released? In fact, he even said he was going to Zendikar in the story where he awoke.

As for planeswalking to a new plane, I believe that's actually the default mode for planeswalking, and going to someplace you've already been requires focusing on that place.

 

[alternade]

Nothing was actually happening in either reality of Tarkir though. The entire "plot" was contained in Fate Reforged and it had no real relevance to any of the characters beyond Ugin existing. I fully expect Return to Tarkir (it will happen) to be timey-wimey Chrono Cross shit where the Khans timeline somehow reemerges into the Dragons one and the full powered clans fight the full powered dragons one.

Jace is probably gonna go to Tarkir soon enough, I imagine since the story art shows him talking to Ugin, and Ugin probably didn't just randomly go to Zendikar. How does one get to a plane that they've never even been to, anyways?

UGH Can we please get a different mono blue walker? Jace is boring me to tears with being shoehorned into every plot. I can only imagine when we return to Dominaria that he will be related to Urza.

 

[Firemind]

Zurgo went from khan to lifting kolaghan's bootstraps. That's enough for me. ;____;

 

[kirblar]

Nothing was actually happening in either reality of Tarkir though. The entire "plot" was contained in Fate Reforged and it had no real relevance to any of the characters beyond Ugin existing. I fully expect Return to Tarkir (it will happen) to be timey-wimey Chrono Cross shit where the Khans timeline somehow reemerges into the Dragons one and the full powered clans fight the full powered dragons one.

Jace is probably gonna go to Tarkir soon enough, I imagine since the story art shows him talking to Ugin, and Ugin probably didn't just randomly go to Zendikar. How does one get to a plane that they've never even been to, anyways?

If you want to go full Origins Mary Sue, introduce Anti-Sarkhan.

Anti-Sarkhan starts Jeskai (pre-shift- this give him familiarity w/ OG Narset.) Goes full Ender and roasts a few bullies to a crisp "kind of" on accident. (Proooobably not willing to do this, but the idea is nice.) Flees due to lack of ability to cover up what happened. (Thanks, mind magic!) Joins up with the Mardu. Becomes happy there. (You could make Anti-Sarkhan gay to follow up on the history with Alesha.) Is aware of who Sarkhan is. Eventually challenges Zurgo for leadership in battle to the death. (Anti-Sarkhan not opposed to solving problems with murder.) Fails spectacularly, planeshifts before he dies. Hopefully someplace really wacky.

Stays there, and hops around multiverse for a while. Fate Reforged happens. Eventually meets up with Narset, discovers something is very wrong.. Discoveres what happened. Goes back to see family neer existed, Mardu gone, Zurgo tiny. Becomes determined to overthrow dragons, re-establish clans, and kill Sarkhan the traitor.

 

[hort]

Nothing was actually happening in either reality of Tarkir though. The entire "plot" was contained in Fate Reforged and it had no real relevance to any of the characters beyond Ugin existing. I fully expect Return to Tarkir (it will happen) to be timey-wimey Chrono Cross shit where the Khans timeline somehow reemerges into the Dragons one and the full powered clans fight the full powered dragons one.

Thats some Fringe level timeline bullshit right there.

"You were supposed to erase the clans from existence Septunginber, but there seems to be traces of them bleeding into this reality"

Spoiler

I love Fringe and this would be awesome to see.

 

[kirblar]

Thats some Fringe level timeline bullshit right there.

"You were supposed to erase the clans from existence Septunginber, but there seems to be traces of them bleeding into this reality"

Spoiler

I love Fringe and this would be awesome to see.

Fringe S4 suuuuuuuuuucked and is an example of something NEVER to do in fiction with established characters. Full rebooting the entire cast was so bad.

 

[OnPoint]

Fringe S4 suuuuuuuuuucked and is an example of something NEVER to do in fiction with established characters. Full rebooting the entire cast was so bad.

Agreed in full. S4 killed the series for me, even though I finished it.

If you want to go full Origins Mary Sue, introduce Anti-Sarkhan.

Anti-Sarkhan starts Jeskai (pre-shift- this give him familiarity w/ OG Narset.) Goes full Ender and roasts a few bullies to a crisp "kind of" on accident. (Proooobably not willing to do this, but the idea is nice.) Flees due to lack of ability to cover up what happened. (Thanks, mind magic!) Joins up with the Mardu. Becomes happy there. (You could make Anti-Sarkhan gay to follow up on the history with Alesha.) Is aware of who Sarkhan is. Eventually challenges Zurgo for leadership in battle to the death. (Anti-Sarkhan not opposed to solving problems with murder.) Fails spectacularly, planeshifts before he dies. Hopefully someplace really wacky.

Stays there, and hops around multiverse for a while. Fate Reforged happens. Eventually meets up with Narset, discovers something is very wrong.. Discoveres what happened. Goes back to see family neer existed, Mardu gone, Zurgo tiny. Becomes determined to overthrow dragons, re-establish clans, and kill Sarkhan the traitor.

Wouldn't work due to 1000s of years between Fate and present day, no? Wouldn't this theoretical PW be long dead?

 

[kirblar]

Sarkhan's trip to the past happened in the present day, so that person just had to PW away before Sarkhan went back.. This assumes a "If you were off-world, you didn't get erased" rule here.

 

[Angry Grimace]

The "spoiler guy" claims this is a real card:

Oblivion Processor
Cost 1B? 2B?
Enchantment [Rare]
Devoid
At the beginning of each opponent's upkeep, exile the top card of that player's library.
1, Put a card from exile an opponent owns into its owners graveyard: put a 1/1 Eldrazi scion token onto the battlefield with "sacrifice this creature, add 1 to your mana pool."

I'm calling bullshit.

 

[kirblar]

That card seems..... really awful? It's totally in flavor given Black's history with things like Breeding Pit.

 

[Haly]

It looks good to me...

Well... hmmm.

 

[Angry Grimace]

That card seems..... really awful? It's totally in flavor given Black's history with things like Breeding Pit.

I have no idea how you gather than infinite ramp/tokens/chump blockers for 1B or even 2B and 1 colorless mana per turn is somehow bad. The ceiling on a card like that is way higher than that too.

Again, I doubt its real until proven otherwise. I mean, they weren't willing to let that one "if you lose life get a 1/1" exist at anything less than 3W. This card has the same exact cost except the tokens are demonstrably better and you can get a lot more than 1 of them.

 

[kirblar]

I have no idea how you gather than infinite ramp/tokens/chump blockers for 1B or even 2B and 1 colorless mana per turn is somehow bad.

It's not infinite, it's 1 per turn for (1) unless you have other sources of library exile. It also costs (1) for each additional one.

 

[Haly]

I assume it refers to cards it exiles so at most it's 1 per turn.

But it's not like Bitterblossom or anything. You're paying mana for these and filling up your opponent's graveyard at the same time. If there's are reanimation mechanics welp.

 

[OnPoint]

Sarkhan's trip to the past happened in the present day, so that person just had to PW away before Sarkhan went back.. This assumes a "If you were off-world, you didn't get erased" rule here.

Oh, I think I misread it? The character you're proposing was from Sarkhan's time (present day) not Fate Reforged right? My bad.

 

[Matriox]

The "spoiler guy" claims this is a real card:

Oblivion Processor
Cost 1B? 2B?
Enchantment [Rare]
Devoid
At the beginning of each opponent's upkeep, exile the top card of that player's library.
1, Put a card from exile an opponent owns into its owners graveyard: put a 1/1 Eldrazi scion token onto the battlefield with "sacrifice this creature, add 1 to your mana pool."

I'm calling bullshit.

Combo with abzan Anafenza and a scion token for infinite lols.

 

[Yeef]

All of these problems could be solved if literally any of these planeswalkers learned how to cast Oblivion Ring.

They already did that; then 6000 years later someone cast disenchant, now they've got a mess on their hands.

 

[Angry Grimace]

It's not infinite, it's 1 per turn for (1) unless you have other sources of library exile. It also costs (1) for each additional one.

No, I'm saying it just continuously produces them every turn the way Bitterblossom does, not that it gives you arbitrary amounts per turn.

I assume it refers to cards it exiles so at most it's 1 per turn.

But it's not like Bitterblossom or anything. You're paying mana for these and filling up your opponent's graveyard at the same time. If there's are reanimation mechanics welp.

If the card was real, there's absolutely no chance it will do that. We've already been shown that the Processor cards/Oblivion Sower don't care about what exiled the cards in exile - they are not going to introduce one random Eldrazi/devoid card that requires you to care what exiled it. Not to mention, working that way has no real point- it could just have an upkeep trigger to produce Scions if it did, and not bother with the mill.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

Fringe S4 suuuuuuuuuucked and is an example of something NEVER to do in fiction with established characters. Full rebooting the entire cast was so bad.

What made it worse was their half-assed attempt to undo it by magically making Olivia "remember" things that didn't happen to her.

3 > 2 > 5 > 1 > 4.

Still a great show though.

 

[OnPoint]

I still think it's kinda funny that Maro is OK with this version of Exile playgrounding. But it's honestly interesting dev space so I'm down to see what comes of it.

What made it worse was their half-assed attempt to undo it by magically making Olivia "remember" things that didn't happen to her.

3 > 2 > 5 > 1 > 4.

Still a great show though.

For me it's

1=2>3>5>4

5 should probably equal 3 in all honesty but I had such a foul taste in my mouth after 4 that I almost didn't care anymore by that point.

 

[A Serious Man]

It's not bad. It's an outlet for all the exiled cards your Eldrazi will be generating with Ingest and you can have multiple copies running. Being able to drop a 1/1 into play at any time is pretty useful and it gives you something to dump your untapped mana into during your opponents end step.

 

[SigmasonicX]

I plan on watching Fringe, so should I skip season 4?

 

[kirblar]

I assume it refers to cards it exiles so at most it's 1 per turn.

But it's not like Bitterblossom or anything. You're paying mana for these and filling up your opponent's graveyard at the same time. If there's are reanimation mechanics welp.

The exiled pool is a group pool, it's the Eldrazi's resource in this set.

I plan on watching Fringe, so should I skip season 4?

First 3 are great, and then it just tries a bunch of high-concept stuff that doesn't work well in practice for 4/5.

I still think it's kinda funny that Maro is OK with this version of Exile playgrounding. But it's honestly interesting dev space so I'm down to see what comes of it.

You can't abuse this since you're screwing with your opponents' exiled cards.

No, I'm saying it just continuously produces them every turn the way Bitterblossom does, not that it gives you arbitrary amounts per turn.

But this a) costs mana and b) produces ground 1/1s.

Its not that good.

 

[OnPoint]

I plan on watching Fringe, so should I skip season 4?

I almost feel like you can't, though if you did you would need the end of 3 explained somehow when starting 5.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

I plan on watching Fringe, so should I skip season 4?

You have to watch it. It's not that the writing is bad (it continues to be top notch), but they take the plot in a direction that literally made me angry. If you skip it, you'll be left with a season 3 cliffhanger that will never be resolved.

Alternately, watch 1-3, read a wiki for season 4, watch S4E19, then watch season 5.

First 3 are great, and then it just tries a bunch of high-concept stuff that doesn't work well in practice for 4/5.

I actually really like season 5, despite being basically a different show altogether.

 

[Yeef]

That enchantment was "spoiled" a few days ago, but it's either fake or has been misremembered. If you have Anafenza 1.0 (or Rest in Peace or Leyline of the Void) it allows you to do some pretty silly things, even in Standard. Either it costs more or there's some other restrictions to the ability.

 

[hort]

I plan on watching Fringe, so should I skip season 4?

As someone watching the show for the first time and in the middle of season 4, it seems fine but isn't the same as what you grew to love in season 1-3, although there is still a decent amount to like in it.


edit: also, the story in it seems preeeety important and not something you could skip.

 

[Angry Grimace]

But this a) costs mana and b) produces ground 1/1s.

Its not that good.

Except on this theoretical card Scions sac for exactly what they cost to cast and can be created at instant speed and in higher numbers than say, Bitterblossom.

 

[SigmasonicX]

Just realized, we should probably start coming up with titles for the OT. I'll ask now and on Saturday.

From the PAX discussion, one idea I liked from someone else was:
Magic: Battle for Zendikar |OT| Ingesting your wallet until it's devoid

My suggestion is:
Magic: Battle for Zendikar |OT| Grim portent of post-Obama America

 

[Matriox]

I feel like Tango and Cash is relevant of some sort. lol.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

I feel like Tango and Cash is relevant of some sort. lol.

Oh man. BFZ is printing both Tangolands and Cashlands at the same time. :lol

 

[Firemind]

Magic: Battle for Zendikar |OT| Ulamog: "Look, ma, no hands!"

 

[Angry Grimace]

Magic: Battle for Zendikar |OT| Releases October 2, 2015

 

[Core Zero]

I feel like Tango and Cash is relevant of some sort. lol.

Magic: Battle for Zendikar |OT| Tango and Cash Make Landfall

 

[Angry Grimace]

I like how you guys are so committed to trying to stick tangolands that you're willing to title the thread after them even though the name has yet to actually stick, potentially confusing everyone.