Have you gotten the Space Jump yet? You'll notice tons of invisible walls that bar you from sustaining a jump at a certain height or bar you from jumping over/on certain stuff. It actually gets pretty maddening at that point.
I noticed a few times, but nothing that was not understandable or terribly in the way, except for one powerup right next to Samus' ship
But it seems they went with style rather than function. It might look like you can climb on the pipes, but they're just decorations. I'd rather have decorative pipes that can't be jumped on than a flat ceiling.
Mario Galaxy 2 had a few of those also. So do most Valve games. Not every platform can be jumped onto, even if it seems you can.
So is there any way to miss out on 100% completion?
I'm assuming I'm near the end of the game, and I'm going back and collecting any items I might have missed...but is there any chance that I can't return to a specific area that had an item?
I noticed a few times, but nothing that was not understandable or terribly in the way, except for one powerup right next to Samus' ship
But it seems they went with style rather than function. It might look like you can climb on the pipes, but they're just decorations. I'd rather have decorative pipes that can't be jumped on than a flat ceiling.
Mario Galaxy 2 had a few of those also. So do most Valve games. Not every platform can be jumped onto, even if it seems you can.
This isn't like trying to jump on extremely tiny platforms (or geometry errors) to get to places that you clearly were not supposed to. Here, even something simple like space jumping constantly from a platform from one room to the other poses problems when you see an object that you by all means could land on or have more than enough height to travel over, but you get inexplicably forced from doing so due to some invisible force (or if you are jumping to high, you're forced to intentionally decrease altitude to go "under" the invisible wall). Hell, you can't even jump over some railings despite how you'll probably have to go to that lower area eventually.
Edit: I just encountered two missile tanks that I could have easily reached with a space jump, but got barred by an invisible wall (in no less than 10 minutes apart). Yeah...
Just finished at 63%. Overall, I agree with most of what Dabookerman posted, but this:
Dabookerman said:
-Awful control scheme. While it is fine when you're playing sideways, switching to first person mode is terrible. Why? Well I can only use rockets for one, and I like to use rockets on bosses. To switch to first person requires a bit of readjusting and aiming, and by the time I've done that, the boss has fucked off. Either make the game first person, or stick to 3rd person. Switching to first person should only be a button press. Hence why if they really had to implement the first person, they should have gone wiimote nunchuck. .
is just wrong. The bosses' attack patterns were obviously designed so that you can only use missiles against them at certain times, so if you tried using missiles at the wrong time and got hit you only have yourself to blame.
Overall it was a good game but it didn't feel like a Metroid game at all. In that regard I would say Other M : Metroid Series :: Wind Waker : Zelda Series.
So is there any way to miss out on 100% completion?
I'm assuming I'm near the end of the game, and I'm going back and collecting any items I might have missed...but is there any chance that I can't return to a specific area that had an item?
No, 100% is not missable in this game. You might not have access to all areas at the same time, but you will be able to get to all items in the end, although not quite before beating the final boss.
If that is the case, it's still a stupid design choice. If samus can fire beams in 3rd person mode, she should be able to do the same with rockets. The point is, I should not have to switch to FP mode. It's a hassle and a dumb gimmick.
No, 100% is not missable in this game. You might not have access to all areas at the same time, but you will be able to get to all items in the end, although not quite before beating the final boss.
Well that's certainly good to hear. I know right now there's an item I tried to get to after some hefty backtracking but couldn't. I'll just check back to later.
Took me long enough to realize this. Anyone else notice that early in the story, Ridley is
pretty much the rabbit from Monty Python?
. I think this fact alone really hits home that Team Ninja is just fucking with us and doesn't take the game seriously.
* You'll have to pardon me if this was already mentioned - google seems to suck at searching the forums.
----
Regarding invisible walls - the point that really hit home for me was when I started trying to bomb climb around a bit and they wouldn't let you go anywhere. Even places that you could get to by just jumping and using the power grip. It's bad enough that they won't let you sequence break a lot of obvious stuff, but they won't even let you dick around to get to the stuff you can get at the same time with other means.
---
My playthrough of the game pretty much had me spending the entire time wishing they had just kept it 2.5d and made it as close to super metroid as possible. They had a few great moments where things got close enough to wax nostalgic and it hit me pretty hard that they were scraping the edges of doing something amazing.
If it wasn't for the final
(Phantoon)
boss and a few very late game fights - maybe an area or two as well, I would've rated the game so low as to probably have gone out of my way to tell people how bad it was. This was maybe the first game I've ever preordered, and pretty much the last as well. I didn't even get the game early or on time - it shipped late and I hardly got more than a BS amazon credit (or something to that effect) that I don't even care about.
I think they've pretty much hit that significant tipping point in the Metroid franchise that could send it going down the Sonic cycle if they aren't careful. I see Other M as something akin to Deus Ex 2, CnC Generals, Tribes Vengeance, [much as I hate to say it, Savage 2 falls into this category], etc. -- that one where either it's terrible, or the quality is so questionably borderline/game is so remarkably different from what you expected that providing the franchise continues at all, future games in it are awful or looked at with overbearing levels of scrutiny.
I just posted it for my own personal lols. I do agree to an extent with Threi.
The real issue with Other M is the fact that it is a love or hate game. Simple as that. Of all the arguments posted in this thread (or in any thread this year) I think Other M is the most debated title in terms of everything. Several posters find the controls horrible, others think it's totally retro and cool. That's just one example btw and sure there is some mutual agreement here on GAF (especialy the story/dialogues parts) but as for the rest, I can't remember the last where GAF was so heavily divided about a game.
Took me long enough to realize this. Anyone else notice that early in the story, Ridley is
pretty much the rabbit from Monty Python?
. I think this fact alone really hits home that Team Ninja is just fucking with us and doesn't take the game seriously.
* You'll have to pardon me if this was already mentioned - google seems to suck at searching the forums.
----
Regarding invisible walls - the point that really hit home for me was when I started trying to bomb climb around a bit and they wouldn't let you go anywhere. Even places that you could get to by just jumping and using the power grip. It's bad enough that they won't let you sequence break a lot of obvious stuff, but they won't even let you dick around to get to the stuff you can get at the same time with other means.
---
My playthrough of the game pretty much had me spending the entire time wishing they had just kept it 2.5d and made it as close to super metroid as possible. They had a few great moments where things got close enough to wax nostalgic and it hit me pretty hard that they were scraping the edges of doing something amazing.
If it wasn't for the final
(Phantoon)
boss and a few very late game fights - maybe an area or two as well, I would've rated the game so low as to probably have gone out of my way to tell people how bad it was. This was maybe the first game I've ever preordered, and pretty much the last as well. I didn't even get the game early or on time - it shipped late and I hardly got more than a BS amazon credit (or something to that effect) that I don't even care about.
I think they've pretty much hit that significant tipping point in the Metroid franchise that could send it going down the Sonic cycle if they aren't careful. I see Other M as something akin to Deus Ex 2, CnC Generals, Tribes Vengeance, [much as I hate to say it, Savage 2 falls into this category], etc. -- that one where either it's terrible, or the quality is so questionably borderline/game is so remarkably different from what you expected that providing the franchise continues at all, future games in it are awful or looked at with overbearing levels of scrutiny.
i finally finished the game last night and jesus christ, what an awful fucking last bit of the game.
the pacing is horrible for, like, the first half of the game. other m is only great whenever the narrative finally decides to shut the hell up, which it does for quite a bit during the later half, until the terrible ending that is.
the optional boss shit is pretty cool, admittedly.
To clarify, it was good enough to be worth playing and a decent game, but I almost feel like they would've been better off calling it something other than a Metroid game. It was far below my expectations for Metroid, and if it had been worse I probably would've been incensed to go on a pointless bitching spree to vent my disappointment.
[edit]: I think the part that you got hung up on was the "scraping the edges of doing something amazing" part. I didn't meant that it was borderline or particularly close - I just meant that they had that glimmer of greatness that could've been heavily elaborated on to make another classic.
Regarding mentioning Sonic, I think the comparison makes sense considering that people are alternating between hype and disappointment with the recent games, wishing that Sega had just gone back to what worked rather than try something new/different. I feel similar about other franchises as well.
Took me long enough to realize this. Anyone else notice that early in the story, Ridley is
pretty much the rabbit from Monty Python?
. I think this fact alone really hits home that Team Ninja is just fucking with us and doesn't take the game seriously.
* You'll have to pardon me if this was already mentioned - google seems to suck at searching the forums.
----
Regarding invisible walls - the point that really hit home for me was when I started trying to bomb climb around a bit and they wouldn't let you go anywhere. Even places that you could get to by just jumping and using the power grip. It's bad enough that they won't let you sequence break a lot of obvious stuff, but they won't even let you dick around to get to the stuff you can get at the same time with other means.
---
My playthrough of the game pretty much had me spending the entire time wishing they had just kept it 2.5d and made it as close to super metroid as possible. They had a few great moments where things got close enough to wax nostalgic and it hit me pretty hard that they were scraping the edges of doing something amazing.
If it wasn't for the final
(Phantoon)
boss and a few very late game fights - maybe an area or two as well, I would've rated the game so low as to probably have gone out of my way to tell people how bad it was. This was maybe the first game I've ever preordered, and pretty much the last as well. I didn't even get the game early or on time - it shipped late and I hardly got more than a BS amazon credit (or something to that effect) that I don't even care about.
I think they've pretty much hit that significant tipping point in the Metroid franchise that could send it going down the Sonic cycle if they aren't careful. I see Other M as something akin to Deus Ex 2, CnC Generals, Tribes Vengeance, [much as I hate to say it, Savage 2 falls into this category], etc. -- that one where either it's terrible, or the quality is so questionably borderline/game is so remarkably different from what you expected that providing the franchise continues at all, future games in it are awful or looked at with overbearing levels of scrutiny.
I was moreso just making light of the reference. It was by no means the primary reason for my disappointment with the game (I actually found that to be one of the better revelations in the game). Although, I had thought that Team Ninja had some part in the story - so that makes me more worried if Nintendo tries to do another story-heavy Metroid game, and makes me wonder whether there's any chance of retconning the junk/what Other M adds to the official canon that could potentially sour future games.
As bad as it was, I don't even feel like the story was what killed it for me. Some of the problems that come to mind are:
- Can't bomb climb anywhere noteworthy, as far as I can tell.
- Limited amount of sequence breaking.
- Have to break into a convoluted FPS view to fire missiles.
- Scenarios where you have to sit in FPS view and look for something for no other reason than to use that mechanic to advance the story - oftentimes it was obscure as hell or a huge break in the action.
- Requiring the FPS view at all, honestly - I don't see what strong non-gimmick benefit or advantage you get from it.
- Extremely oversimplified walljumping (and to a point, the fact that they called it kick climbing).
- Extremely late
super missiles
(weapon reference, for the spoiler-free)
- Extremely late
power bombs
(weapon reference, again)
- Ridiculous mechanic of having to authorize the use of weaponry that you had equipped the entire time. You could argue that this is story-based, but if you boil it down to the base mechanics, it's basically just handing you gear without requiring any significant discovery or achievement beforehand.
- Extreme lack of discovery and exploration. A chunk of this was just that they show you item locations right off the bat, in a frequency far exceeding super metroid where they were extremely minimalistic about it and only just hinted that a room had an item in it at all.
- Lack of environment variety (the hologram areas that they did feature were so underdeveloped that I could not come to a satisfying suspension of disbelief and accept that they were trying to give you a breather from endless corridors).
- Lack of flexibility in how you approach exploration/boss fights.
- A couple of instant-death scenarios that were pretty cheap - including that late game 'use this weapon' scenario that I've already watched a few people spend what felt like half an hour on. (Justin.tv).
- Extreme over-reliance on the sense move mechanic - some of the battles essentially were based around just sense move/charge combos until the enemy was dead or you had to use missiles/lethal strike/overcharge them.
I don't understand the whole "you have to readjust for 1st person thing". The game enters slow motion, looking directly at what you where looking at, and with the press of the B button, it locks on it right away. It's so powerful, it's downright broken at times.
EDIT: I'm giving this game a 5 because I can't use the ship.
I actually just finished playing through Fusion again not 10 minutes ago, and
while there is indeed a giant larva-looking shell at the end, there are two smaller shells in the rooms leading up to it. The Metroid indeed went through all four phases, they just look like infant shells for some reason.
Metroid II only the original Metroids cast off their shells to become Alpha Metroids. After that each form casts off their previous form or changes into the next one.
Their shouldn't be several shells that large if it were only 1 Metroid, so there should have been several Metroids in Fusion that got out.
I realize the Nintendo Power comic isn't canon, it was rushed and and strays too much from the game especially at an important moment at the end and the dialogue can be silly. But several things first appeared in the comic like Samus being raised by the Chozo after space pirates attacked her colony on K-2L, Samus recieving Chozo blood (in later stories DNA), and the Chozo Old Bird.
Regarding mentioning Sonic, I think the comparison makes sense considering that people are alternating between hype and disappointment with the recent games, wishing that Sega had just gone back to what worked rather than try something new/different. I feel similar about other franchises as well.
Thanks for your elaboration. I can see where you're coming from regarding Sonic: fans expect a certain level of quality and obviously feel short-changed when they don't get it. With very few exceptions, the Metroid series has always offered up a good game on release, it's just been question of whether fans would take to it or not. There are still people who don't like the Prime series for instance. There those who still want Super Metroid 2, and there are most definitely people who either love or hate Other M for their own passionate (some might say pedantic) reasons. The difference is that Sonic hasn't had this kind of privilege for a long time, irrespective of fan division etc. The Sonic Team have been pumping out garbage, whereas the studios behind Metroid have been pumping out good games, albeit different ones.
the aliens-like huge lifter boss, after you first meet mistery girl.
I'm more used to the combat, but the ridiculous tutorial at the beginning is not enough, that and the d-pad sucks, period. I don't know why I didn't have the same problem with New Super Mario Bros, probably the whole 3D thing, pressing up constantly is horrible with the remote's d-pad. The change to FPS mode is a really nice mechanic and I've enjoyed it a lot. People who try to use missiles in the way they were used in previous Metroid games are doing it wrong.
The device to achieve item progression is just retarded, I know people complain all the time that Samus always looses her powers at the beginning with some accident (something that really only happened in 2 games) but is so much better than Adam telling you when to use them, is stupid and that incredible sense of achievement of previous Metroid titles is gone. It's a big shame really.
And the other bad thing is the linearity of the game. I suspect it will be just like fusion and it will open up completely towards the end, but the progression feels so limited. Adam telling you all the time where to go sucks too. I hope at some point soon Adam dies or loses comunication and Samus has to decide where to go.
Samus is brutal though, something I've really enjoyed,
the finishing moves are awesome, the one that made the most impression in me was how she ripped off the wings of the bee like things. Also, when she finds the cyber pirates and tells everyone to not enter the room, and Adam locks her down with them, Adam knows she is the only one who can handle such situation. Certainly the sexism accusation are ridiculous, limiting items by Adam's orders is simply a terribly bad game design choice, but it actually tell us Adam holds Samus in a pretty high regard, I would dare to say he admires her although he probably wouldn't say it out loud.
Overall, I don't know what Sakamoto had against the old Metroids, but his team removed a lot of core elements and I can't understand why. the game has been enjoyable, but I miss a lot of what made Metroid Metroid.
The difference is that Sonic hasn't had this kind of privilege for a long time, irrespective of fan division etc. The Sonic Team have been pumping out garbage, whereas the studios behind Metroid have been pumping out good games, albeit different ones.
What worries me a bit is that some franchises hit a tipping point (a particular bad game, or their last good one) where they just never seem to recover (and from what I hear, Sonic never did). Imagine if everything Metroid went downhill, and it turns out that the trend started with Other M.
So, I'm not saying that the Metroid series is -in- a cycle of garbage. I'm just saying that they have to be careful or they'll end up taking that path real quick. If that were to happen, we'd have lost one of the greatest classic franchises in gaming and we're losing those faster than they're being replaced.
The Metroid series had a few shakey while still good points. Some common examples are Fusion or to a lesser extent Prime 3 being lauded for not having nearly the same amount of exploration, sequence breaking, etc. as Super Metroid or Prime 1, or personally I felt that the dual world mechanic in Prime 2 along with the dull and drab atmosphere (in both worlds) and significantly less impressive music when compared to Prime 1 really hurt the game. Hitting what I see as their lowest (while still a generally good game) point with Other M shakes my confidence in the franchise. That's why I ended up mentioning Deus Ex 2, Tribes Vengeance, etc. - the games that either ended the series or make everyone worried about how the next game will turn out.
Upon reflection, I can see the "invisible walls" aspect of the game seeming weird if you approach it in a naturalistic way. Essentially, it's a design choice that was a consequence of simulating the aspect of 2D Metroid games - locking Samus onto the tight grid.
The rooms and halls are laid out in boxes essentially, and the scenery doesn't have to conform to those boxes. The auto-map kind of helps you keep this in mind because it shows the true dimensions of the chamber you are in (generally) and not the visual dimensions. Not being able to space jump over railings and such or across large gaps between cross-threaded areas that /visually/ connect to one another seems unnatural. But it's basically there to keep game play on track.
Japanese developers seem far more willing to do stuff like this than western designers; I think largely because western designers are more literal minded, especially when building a three dimensional world. Eastern designers seem to put play mechanics ahead of simulating a virtual reality.
In the case of Other M, I do feel they made the right choice, overall. The game benefits from being able to speed through chambers and halls at full speed and not worrying about alignment or bits bobbles and jiggers in the scenery. It helps it feel like a 2D Metroid. There are other games with extensive invisible walls that end up being annoying - because invisible walls are too frequently used to cover up inadequacy in the design of a map. "Oh, the flow of the map breaks here... just put wall to keep the player from going there."
In Other M it works though. Not saying it doesn't sometimes look weird or "wrong".
However, the one thing I would disagree with are a few people who have said "Metroid Prime is far more interactive" - I don't know what they mean by that one. There's nothing "interactive" in Metroid Prime's environments. Most foliage that I recall doesn't even react to your character or weapons - it's all wallpaper. There's no destructible elements aside from specific secret chambers and cracked walls, just like Other M. So... okay. Prime's world just looks a lot more organic and lush.
Overall, I don't know what Sakamoto had against the old Metroids, but his team removed a lot of core elements and I can't understand why. the game has been enjoyable, but I miss a lot of what made Metroid Metroid.
I want a more organic way of highlighting where to go next. Even just suggesting where to go, in case there are multiple routes. Environmental clues, things like that. I don't like those big glowy spots like we got in Zero Mission and Other M. At least it's not as bad as Corruption's "hey look maybe you forgot but you're supposed to be going this way, okay better get going I'll remind you again in a few minutes."
Overall, I don't know what Sakamoto had against the old Metroids, but his team removed a lot of core elements and I can't understand why. the game has been enjoyable, but I miss a lot of what made Metroid Metroid.
I don't think Sakamoto has anything against the Metroid series to date. Despite Sakamoto saying Other M is the continuation of the 2D series on a console, I think it's pretty clear it's still an experiment. I will bet good money that the next game in the series, on a console, be it Wii or whatever comes next, will use a lot of concepts from Other M but massively expand on them.
Also, the "has this ruined Metroid?" fears are very exaggerated. People said the same thing about Metroid Prime, and the distance of time has made people forget how many reacted poorly to Prime back in the day - saying it was okay, but nothing like a true Metroid, and the series would go downhill from here.
But, we see the same thing every time an unexpected entry in a series comes out. Just last fall, there was a crazy amount of panic among fans because of New Super Mario Bros. Straight out disbelief at Mario "going backwards" after Galaxy. Constant talk that Mario was now going downhill, had lost it - err, yeah, and that was with Galaxy 2 already announced and coming six months later.
Nintendo isn't Sonic Team. Sonic the Hedgehog didn't go downhill because of any one game or a "turning point"; it went downhill because Sega as whole went downhill and lost any sense about how to deal with their own properties or what to do with their development teams.
What worries me a bit is that some franchises hit a tipping point (a particular bad game, or their last good one) where they just never seem to recover (and from what I hear, Sonic never did). Imagine if everything Metroid went downhill, and it turns out that the trend started with Other M.
I think from what you said, Metroid would've starting going downhill after Echoes, so the blame wouldn't be pinned solely on Other M.
JRPereira said:
So, I'm not saying that the Metroid series is -in- a cycle of garbage. I'm just saying that they have to be careful or they'll end up taking that path real quick. If that were to happen, we'd have lost one of the greatest classic franchises in gaming and we're losing those faster than they're being replaced.
When you think about it, Nintendo have been anything but careful with Metroid. For starters, the games aren't very popular in Japan. Ever heard of a company in the West that makes a franchise for the Eastern market? Exactly. (If you really want to go for it) Metroid had a female character. Metroid 2 appeared on the Gameboy. Then everyone loves Super on the SNES, but then there is no sequel on Nintendo's fifth gen console. A new Metroid shows up on the Gamecube - it's a first person shooter. See where I'm going? Nintendo have never been careful by any means, at least when it comes to Metroid. In fact, the only time that they have release more than one iteration of a Metroid on a single console has been on the Gamecube (Prime, Echoes), DS (Pinball, Hunters) and Wii (Corruption, Trilogy, Other M) respectively.
The difference between Deux Ex 2 or Tribes and Other M is Nintendo. Ion Storm disappeared. Hell, Dynamix went out in 2001, the same year that Tribes 2 came out. Nintendo on the other hand, well.. you can bet on them (as well as Duke). They simply won't allow that to happen - unless it's on their terms of course (no show on N64, DKC).
Worst case scenario: Nintendo do a DKC and leave the franchise alone for 15 years. Metroid fans go back to playing Super until 2025 when they go apeshit when Samus has a daughter or something.
I don't think Sakamoto has anything against the Metroid series to date. Despite Sakamoto saying Other M is the continuation of the 2D series on a console, I think it's pretty clear it's still an experiment. I will bet good money that the next game in the series, on a console, be it Wii or whatever comes next, will use a lot of concepts from Other M but massively expand on them.
Also, the "has this ruined Metroid?" fears are very exaggerated. People said the same thing about Metroid Prime, and the distance of time has made people forget how many reacted poorly to Prime back in the day - saying it was okay, but nothing like a true Metroid, and the series would go downhill from here.
But, we see the same thing every time an unexpected entry in a series comes out. Just last fall, there was a crazy amount of panic among fans because of New Super Mario Bros. Straight out disbelief at Mario "going backwards" after Galaxy. Constant talk that Mario was now going downhill, had lost it - err, yeah, and that was with Galaxy 2 already announced and coming six months later.
Nintendo isn't Sonic Team. Sonic the Hedgehog didn't go downhill because of any one game or a "turning point"; it went downhill because Sega as whole went downhill and lost any sense about how to deal with their own properties or what to do with their development teams.
A lot of the discussion on boards like these are "in the moment," very spontaneous and rough thoughts that don't take immediate shape. We see it over and over again with major releases. Everyone's got a different opinion, we want something new and hate it when we see it, there's some nebulous image we have in our heads that nothing conceivably will ever live up to.
A lot of people seem to think that a disagreeable entry in a series they enjoy instantly ruins that series. I don't get the idea of wanting a "new" Super Metroid released over and over again. It is a good game, but it, like Other M, is a single entry in the series. Go back and play Super Metroid if that's what you want to play. It isn't going anywhere. It won't frighten you with change.
I know the argument mainly revolves around the "poor" implementation of new elements in Other M, but much of it is due to holding this game to a standard it obviously wasn't aiming for.
Worst case scenario: Nintendo do a DKC and leave the franchise alone for 15 years. Metroid fans go back to playing Super until 2025 when they go apeshit when Samus has a daughter or something.
You know what? You're right. This isn't Super Metroid. I'd rather they remade Super Metroid again (which is arguably a remake already) than play another Other M. I've just finished the game and the last half hour of the game has to be some of the most insulting shit I was ever subjected to. The post-game is the best part of the game because you finally get to do what you want and not be bogged down by the completely retarded story (even though the damage is already done).
I do consider Super Metroid to be not just the best Metroid, but one of the best games ever made. It's like that for a reason; the game is just about perfect. Other M eschews everything that made that game classic and replaced it with the obvious lesser choice. How could this game ever be anything near as good when they go to complete opposite direction at every single design decision?
I don't want to see endless remakes of Super Metroid, but if it means that instead we get shit like Other M, then no thank you. I know this is just one game in a long running series, but I have the feeling that this isn't the last we'll see of this ill-fated Nintendo/Team Ninja collaboration and the good name of Metroid will be tarnished further.
I know the argument mainly revolves around the "poor" implementation of new elements in Other M, but much of it is due to holding this game to a standard it obviously wasn't aiming for.
That's my main point of contention really, with people who are overboard in slagging the game off.
In many senses, Other M /really is/ the NSMBWii to Super Mario Galaxy. It should have been reasonably clear from the outset that even though it would have Metroid-like elements, nobody should expect it to even attempt to create the same non-linear gameplay of Super Metroid, or the elaborate fully explorable worlds of Metroid Prime.
Often times, trying something new means getting back to basics, starting over, and that means dispensing with a lot of built-up conventions that people tend to consider synonymous with "quality".
There are a number of ways in which Other M is "not as good" as any of the 3 Prime games, for instance. When I sat down with it, I didn't feel a crushing sense of disappointment, because I wasn't looking for those elements. I was expecting, based on what I'd known in advance, to be surprised by a mix on Metroid I hadn't seen before. And I got that, so was quite happy.
In the interests of complete fairness to people who have walked away bitterly - not just a little - disappointed by this game, I do understand what that's like. For instance it happened to me... with Dragon Age: Origins. Due to my own foolishness, in hindset, the one idea I'd gotten about DA:O was that it was basically Baldur's Gate in 3D. I'd also gotten the idea thanks to having played Mass Effect that it represented Bioware's "standard" for visual design and production values. So I was very turned off by DA:O immediately and didn't even get halfway through a game with one character. And this is me, the person who has some of the broadest and most forgiving tastes with games I know.
I went back to DA:O last month, started over from scratch, and am entirely enjoying it, warts and all. It seems fine now; I don't have any fundamental problems. This was enlightening for how much expectations (including unconscious ones) alter the experience of playing a game for the first time.
That's my main point of contention really, with people who are overboard in slagging the game off.
In many senses, Other M /really is/ the NSMBWii to Super Mario Galaxy. It should have been reasonably clear from the outset that even though it would have Metroid-like elements, nobody should expect it to even attempt to create the same non-linear gameplay of Super Metroid, or the elaborate fully explorable worlds of Metroid Prime.
Often times, trying something new means getting back to basics, starting over, and that means dispensing with a lot of built-up conventions that people tend to consider synonymous with "quality".
There are a number of ways in which Other M is "not as good" as any of the 3 Prime games, for instance. When I sat down with it, I didn't feel a crushing sense of disappointment, because I wasn't looking for those elements. I was expecting, based on what I'd known in advance, to be surprised by a mix on Metroid I hadn't seen before. And I got that, so was quite happy.
In the interests of complete fairness to people who have walked away bitterly - not just a little - disappointed by this game, I do understand what that's like. For instance it happened to me... with Dragon Age: Origins. Due to my own foolishness, in hindset, the one idea I'd gotten about DA:O was that it was basically Baldur's Gate in 3D. I'd also gotten the idea thanks to having played Mass Effect that it represented Bioware's "standard" for visual design and production values. So I was very turned off by DA:O immediately and didn't even get halfway through a game with one character. And this is me, the person who has some of the broadest and most forgiving tastes with games I know.
I went back to DA:O last month, started over from scratch, and am entirely enjoying it, warts and all. It seems fine now; I don't have any fundamental problems. This was enlightening for how much expectations (including unconscious ones) alter the experience of playing a game for the first time.
Yeah, no one is beyond making those kinds of judgments. I'm with you on Other M: I went into it expecting something different, kept an open mind, and was pleasantly surprised at how much I enjoyed it.
I don't expect any franchise to be able to continually build on prior entries. That's impossible. There needs to be missteps, there needs to be experimentation, seeing what doesn't work, seeing what people don't ultimately like is a huge part in seeing what they actually do. You can argue that those kinds of wrinkles should be ironed out before release, but then you'd probably be in the camp that didn't enjoy Other M, period. As a branching out, an exploration of future possibility, I think Other M did fine. I liked it a lot. The cutscenes (I thought) were a huge problem, but then I think that's what cutscenes generally are across the entire medium. Others disagree. Okay. That's not the end of the world. My opinion doesn't matter much in the grand scheme of things, so I focus on the points I enjoy rather than the points I don't. That doesn't work all the time, since some games just turn me off completely for reasons I can't precisely say, but Other M isn't one of those titles. Here, enjoying the gameplay and ignoring the narration completely helped go a long way toward my enjoyment of the game.
That's a bit of a ramble. Just throwing some thoughts out there.
This is probably the only Metroid game I've wanted to play again right after completion. I've picked up on a lot of stuff that I didn't on my first playthrough. This game is just so much fun..
Let's see how I do in hard mode. I'm still having trouble with lethal strikes. Overblasts are easier to pull off but I can't tell when the time is right for lethal strikes.
This is probably the only Metroid game I've wanted to play again right after completion. I've picked up on a lot of stuff that I didn't on my first playthrough. This game is just so much fun..
Let's see how I do in hard mode. I'm still having trouble with lethal strikes. Overblasts are easier to pull off but I can't tell when the time is right for lethal strikes.
theres a morphball tunnel in the next room or so over from that door which would lead you to the missle. the tunnel dumps you out on the same platform as the pickup.
eXistor said:
I'd rather they remade Super Metroid again than play another Other M.
i think you wrote this sentence wrong. but i get what you mean, i think. youre saying that you dont want endless remakes of super metroid, but you kinda DO want endless remakes of super metroid.
lucky me, I just encounter the game breaking glitch (door wont open after beating the mini-boss in sector 3) . Anyone here know a way around it or do i really have to start over?
Most, if not all of the "invisible walls" are really invisible walls. The scenery extends beyond, but because you're in a ship they don't really go anywhere.
But as I mentioned before the game fails in that. I see many newcomers dropping the game at the where's waldo moments, or when combat gets tough. This is not an accessible game at all. Trying to make the controls simple made them actually very complicated, timed events are not exactly something newcomers will embrace, specially ones that require so much precision.
And I agree, zero mission is to date the Metroid game with the best balance in being accessible and at the same time offer a challenge for the ones who want one.
I have some issues with the targeting mechanic in FPS mode. In stressful fights like boss battles, I'll go into FPS mode and hold B. I find it can be a little unforgiving when trying to target the boss. I'll be in FPS mode, point towards the red circle and start blasting away. In a second or two I'll realize that I'm blasting at him with my beam weapon instead of missiles. Then I realize I'm not properly locked on.
Then I spend the next few seconds, while the enemy is moving, trying to get the target to lock. It can get annoying.
. I've died so many times, particularly on the elevator with the space pirates and then at the
subsequent mini-boss
. I made it past just now with 3 health.. :lol
What I do love is the fact that each time I'm reading the tells better, reacting quicker and generally attacking foes more ruthlessly. You genuinely have to work for your kills - all the while knowing that 2-3 hits and you're Solid Snaked.
I'm really not looking forward to
Phantoon in the epilogue... By the way - can you shoot through his projectiles a la the Groganch?
I didn't really stick around to find out first time around. That would make it a lot easier.
. I've died so many times, particularly on the elevator with the space pirates and then at the
subsequent mini-boss
. I made it past just now with 3 health.. :lol
What I do love is the fact that each time I'm reading the tells better, reacting quicker and generally attacking foes more ruthlessly. You genuinely have to work for your kills - all the while knowing that 2-3 hits and you're Solid Snaked.
I'm really not looking forward to
Phantoon in the epilogue... By the way - can you shoot through his projectiles a la the Groganch?
I didn't really stick around to find out first time around. That would make it a lot easier.
That's my main point of contention really, with people who are overboard in slagging the game off.
In many senses, Other M /really is/ the NSMBWii to Super Mario Galaxy. It should have been reasonably clear from the outset that even though it would have Metroid-like elements, nobody should expect it to even attempt to create the same non-linear gameplay of Super Metroid, or the elaborate fully explorable worlds of Metroid Prime.
Often times, trying something new means getting back to basics, starting over, and that means dispensing with a lot of built-up conventions that people tend to consider synonymous with "quality".
There are a number of ways in which Other M is "not as good" as any of the 3 Prime games, for instance. When I sat down with it, I didn't feel a crushing sense of disappointment, because I wasn't looking for those elements. I was expecting, based on what I'd known in advance, to be surprised by a mix on Metroid I hadn't seen before. And I got that, so was quite happy.
In the interests of complete fairness to people who have walked away bitterly - not just a little - disappointed by this game, I do understand what that's like. For instance it happened to me... with Dragon Age: Origins. Due to my own foolishness, in hindset, the one idea I'd gotten about DA:O was that it was basically Baldur's Gate in 3D. I'd also gotten the idea thanks to having played Mass Effect that it represented Bioware's "standard" for visual design and production values. So I was very turned off by DA:O immediately and didn't even get halfway through a game with one character. And this is me, the person who has some of the broadest and most forgiving tastes with games I know.
I went back to DA:O last month, started over from scratch, and am entirely enjoying it, warts and all. It seems fine now; I don't have any fundamental problems. This was enlightening for how much expectations (including unconscious ones) alter the experience of playing a game for the first time.
I think you bring up a good point in that people should embrace the game and enjoy it for what it is. That doesn't mean that the game couldn't have been a lot better though. It also doesn't mean that people's complaints aren't justified. Even when I did embrace the game for what it is, although I enjoyed it more, it didn't make the problems I had with it magically go away. The controls in the game are awkward and unconventional. They always will be because it was designed with that in mind. Some people will defend the design choice behind the controls it seems to the bitter end. I'll admit it did make a lot of improvements to the action genre, but it also took some steps backwards in the process. I now look at Other M as the game that will introduce a lot of people to the action genre. The controls are simple, even though they are unintuitive.
At the same time, the story is childish. It's almost like they kiddie-fied the Metroid franchise now. It's ironic that the game is rated "T for Teen" when it is clearly more appropriate for a younger audience. It's upsetting because Metroid was thought to be one of Nintendo's franchises aimed more at the older hardcore crowd. Gone are those days if they continue the path they're taking the series. I'm not going to say the game didn't have some redeeming value, but there are a lot, and I mean a lot of flaws with it that people are over looking. So on one hand, you say people are going over board on criticizing the game and pointing out it's flaws, but it's the exact same thing with the people praising it. They admit the flaws, but then brush them under the rug.
But as I mentioned before the game fails in that. I see many newcomers dropping the game at the where's waldo moments, or when combat gets tough. This is not an accessible game at all. Trying to make the controls simple made them actually very complicated, timed events are not exactly something newcomers will embrace, specially ones that require so much precision.
And I agree, zero mission is to date the Metroid game with the best balance in being accessible and at the same time offer a challenge for the ones who want one.
Finished the game a few days ago.. and now looking back it really was an amazing experience unlike anything I have played before
Sure there are som misses (waldo...) but overall it is a really original very well put together game. I really look forward to replaying it now actually.
I would put it in the same league as Fusion, that on of the better Metroid games but not classic like Prime 1 and Super
But as I mentioned before the game fails in that. I see many newcomers dropping the game at the where's waldo moments, or when combat gets tough. This is not an accessible game at all. Trying to make the controls simple made them actually very complicated, timed events are not exactly something newcomers will embrace, specially ones that require so much precision.
I completely agree. I couldnt help thinking, as I kept dying and dying in this game, that they worked so hard trying to make the controls accessible but forgot to make the actual game accessible.
Quick question to everyone who 100% this game. How do I get the missile on the very first room? I see a door that leads to it but it has always been orange for me, but I don't see any terminal to open it.
