Metroid Prime 2 Echoes 1UP review - 8.5
- Thread starter Sander
- Start date
Nerevar said:
You are arguing that all games that have a point, i.e. a set ending, are linear. How am I to argue that? Other than to say your view of linear is (very, very) wrong.
I would never dare call you wrong, I do not want you to have me exiled from your land of bullshit. Now I shall beg forgiveness for wasting any more of your time.
Hitler Stole My Potato
Banned
SantaCruZer said:
LOL! Where have you been at for the last 3 years?
radios shipping overview
Member
Get lives. All of you. Fall's almost over - go out and enjoy the leaves.
Catchpenny
Member
I think some reviews will take the 1UP route and focus on things not improved from the previous game, as well as having similar gameplay mechanics to its predecessor. Others will appreciate the departure in mood and art from previous games in the series, and say that the control setup from the previous game was already pretty damn good.
Majora's Mask 2: Electric Boogaloo.
Majora's Mask 2: Electric Boogaloo.
Hitler Stole My Potato
Banned
SantaCruZer said:
You've got to be shitting me. I probably should go and find some threads about Halo to show how unbelievably wrong you are but I imagine that everyone here at GAF already knows how ridiculous your statment is so I'll just leave it at that.
Rocket Punch
Member
WarPig said:
Hey WarPig, I've been meaning to ask, what's DFS?
Catchpenny
Member
DFS = Dislikes First-person Samus 
Musashi Wins!
FLAWLESS VICTOLY!
huzkee said:Hey WarPig, I've been meaning to ask, what's DFS?
Dave Fights Sadcubers.
krypt0nian
Banned
Nerevar said:
Needs a mother's love....
TheGreenGiant
Banned
Mrbob said:
I agree with this discussion but I just wanted to point out one thing. The game that MP is closest to in terms of play structure is something like LOZ. The item collection.. say weapons/beams is the same as collecting a hammer/mallet in LOZ so you can advance. Fact that said weapon can also open paths... is a bonus. = FACT
Woke up and checked out this thread and its obvious.
a) GAF is in full swing
b) Damage control is in full swing (Santacruzer gets an award)
c) Hater crowd is all over.
Read the review at 1up and I really have to say that I found his review to be rather negative. Nothing good; looking for faults.
1) samus isn't shinier/nicer. I don't think that's even a valid coment to make. 1 fucking paragraph. Nothing on the plot or how he thought the story in Echoes works. Nothing about the new weapons and how the visuals look when you use them. I've heard all about the Dark Beams "cel-shadedness" but nothing here about them. Just knock it back on the basis of her looking the same.
2) I'd ignore his difficulty comment myself. Hard = better.
3) The Multiplater sucks. I knew it. :lol Doesn't matter to me. I wonder how many other places will knock it for multi.
popcorn indeed.
OG_Original Gamer
Member
Mrbob said:
What your not understanding is, MP was created because the Metroid fans wanted it. Naturally including most things from the original 2d series on the NES was very important. It doesn't matter what title it is, Halo, MGS, there's things in the original some believe should be in the sequel.
The fans come before the casuals, these are the gamers you know will pick up the game. I say leave the Metroid series alone, there isn't need for change. All Nintendo need to do is not, pin Retro to just one franchise. Retro can create their on seperate franchise.
I don't see it as old school, its apart of the series. Mario Bros. didn't have backtracking and its the oldest franchise, compared the Metroid series.
I loved Metroid: Zero Mission, but I still hated the few parts of backtracking. I don't see that as an "ingredient" for the game or whatever. If anything, it's one of Zero Mission's weaknesses. To me, insisting that backtracking adds to the game somehow is similar to someone insisting that fans of Sonic Adventure games expect and desire a shitty camera in new Sonic Adventure games, since the old versions had it.
Do The Mario
Unconfirmed Member
snapty00 said:
Nail has been hit on the head
IAWTP
junkwaffle
In Front and Drawing Away
pilonv1 said:
Are you suggesting that 1up drank the kool-aid also?
Revisiting old areas with new strength and powers? I do not see how a perceptive compares to backtracking. The goal of MP was to make a 2d metroid in 3d, that includes everything the 2d ones had. If there had been another metroid after III that did not have backtracking, maybe they would of had something else to work with. You have a point with MP2 tho, seeing as the 2d in 3d version was already completed.snapty00 said:
snapty00 said:
Backtracking is inevitable in hub world-based games. It happens in GTA, it happens in Zelda. The only way to get rid of it is to completely change that characteristic of the game into level-based. Problem is, Metroid is not a level-based game. Never has been, never will be.
Do The Mario
Unconfirmed Member
People are getting a bit too technical, yes there Is back tracking in almost every game, however I have never ever back tracked in a game as much as in MP. It gets tedious having to clear out the same room of the same enemies 10 times or do the same platforming section several times. There is just no fun in it imo.
What makes the game great is the boss battles!
Next metroid game should be a collection of boss battles!
What makes the game great is the boss battles!
Next metroid game should be a collection of boss battles!
TheGreenGiant
Banned
snapty00 said:
the 2 aren't even comparable comparisions. Fact that in Metroid games, your power ups allow you to gain access to new area + get additional power up makes it more than backtracking. If you view this as a problem than stay away from MP2E. Seriously, nothings stopping you from not buying the game. It does sound like Retro balanced it out a bit funny although that could just be the reviewers bents. I quite enjoyed running around MP's universe again to collect the power ups. :O
Do The Mario
Unconfirmed Member
Each time you are exploring a different part of the world, so there is little back tracking plus it more fun!mumu said:
Floyd
Member
rastex said:
No he just pointed out there was a lot of it, much like Prime. And he didn't appreciate that they brought back another artifact fetch quest that Prime had. But did say there were less to collect this time. He also said the puzzles involved to get all the artifacts were very smart.
I respect his complaint even though its not a complaint for me, but he didn't say back tracking was implemented badly. Good review over all.
I won't be complaining about David's score because I don't know how he rated the original. Not to mention that I haven't played the game. But certainly I'm curious about some of his comments.
I wasn't a huge fan of the first game because I'm generally not into shooters, particularly those of the first person variation. For the most part however I enjoyed the game up until the point where you reach the Phazon Mines which looked and played too much like a traditonal FPS for my liking (if you look past the control scheme - which I haven't a problem with). The great thing about Metroid Prime was the emphasis on exploration which, at least to me, wasn't tedious because of the brilliant level designs and overall art direction. The genious of Metroid Prime really is the way this enormous would ties together and to remove that aspect from the game would only serve to make Metroid Prime more like any other FPS on the market. I think it's important to keep in mind that Metroid Prime while played from a first person perspective does not play like a traditional FPS and isn't meant to. If you're expecting a game of Halo or Doom get those games. Metroid is Metroid and that's the way it should be.
Another thing I've thought about is what it takes, or should take, for a game like MP2 that is a sequel to another game on the same platform to get the same score as the original. MP2 seems like a very traditional sequel. The game follows the same basic structure as MP1 but adds improved visuals, all new art, an interesting twist on the traditional backtracking through level design and mission structure, new abilities and so forth. Plus a multiplayer mode which was the most requested feature in a poll on Nintendo.com but doesn't seem to garner much interest with gaming publications and hardcore fans. So all in all a solid if somewhat traditional update. Now one could argue that Retro has done everything possible to provide a fresh experience within the confinements of the franchise and the system it's on. I'm almost certain that had MP2 not been a GameCube title but instead a launch title for the Revolution with the kind of graphics you can expect from a next gen platform the anticipation would be greater and people would be a little more forgiving concerning the lack of gameplay evolution.
It's interesting how reviewers apply different standards to different games. Sports games that realistically offer few improvements from year to year (and usually mess up something that used to work so there's something to fix later on) tend to get very consistent scores. So do many other franchises where perhaps the expectations are different. So is it fair to deduct points from the MP2 score for something which most games are guilty of - not offering the same freshness as the original? Hypothetically of course. I don't know if that happened in this case and I obviously don't know how MP2 will be rated by other publications.
I wasn't a huge fan of the first game because I'm generally not into shooters, particularly those of the first person variation. For the most part however I enjoyed the game up until the point where you reach the Phazon Mines which looked and played too much like a traditonal FPS for my liking (if you look past the control scheme - which I haven't a problem with). The great thing about Metroid Prime was the emphasis on exploration which, at least to me, wasn't tedious because of the brilliant level designs and overall art direction. The genious of Metroid Prime really is the way this enormous would ties together and to remove that aspect from the game would only serve to make Metroid Prime more like any other FPS on the market. I think it's important to keep in mind that Metroid Prime while played from a first person perspective does not play like a traditional FPS and isn't meant to. If you're expecting a game of Halo or Doom get those games. Metroid is Metroid and that's the way it should be.
Another thing I've thought about is what it takes, or should take, for a game like MP2 that is a sequel to another game on the same platform to get the same score as the original. MP2 seems like a very traditional sequel. The game follows the same basic structure as MP1 but adds improved visuals, all new art, an interesting twist on the traditional backtracking through level design and mission structure, new abilities and so forth. Plus a multiplayer mode which was the most requested feature in a poll on Nintendo.com but doesn't seem to garner much interest with gaming publications and hardcore fans. So all in all a solid if somewhat traditional update. Now one could argue that Retro has done everything possible to provide a fresh experience within the confinements of the franchise and the system it's on. I'm almost certain that had MP2 not been a GameCube title but instead a launch title for the Revolution with the kind of graphics you can expect from a next gen platform the anticipation would be greater and people would be a little more forgiving concerning the lack of gameplay evolution.
It's interesting how reviewers apply different standards to different games. Sports games that realistically offer few improvements from year to year (and usually mess up something that used to work so there's something to fix later on) tend to get very consistent scores. So do many other franchises where perhaps the expectations are different. So is it fair to deduct points from the MP2 score for something which most games are guilty of - not offering the same freshness as the original? Hypothetically of course. I don't know if that happened in this case and I obviously don't know how MP2 will be rated by other publications.
Oh! My Car!
Member
Well, Intelligent Systems consists of members from the old R&D1 which have been involved in all 2D Metroids upto this point.ge-man said:
Lemurnator
Banned
Wait...?
People care about 1up?
People care about 1up?
Lemurnator
Banned
I always thought that people thought of 1up as 'just another videogame publication... that sucks.'
Like GameInformer....
That's GMR nevermind....
Like GameInformer....
That's GMR nevermind....
Lemurnator
Banned
"David Smith, the biggest whining jackass to ever review a video game.
8.5 is probably the highest score he's ever given a game."
Is this true?
8.5 is probably the highest score he's ever given a game."
Is this true?
Yeah, I've wanted a Metroid where you can fly her ship to different planets. The only drawback is may take away from the feeling of isolation the games employ.
PS: I just want to know from the media guys, why certain issues are selectively challenged?
As this thread shows for exmaple, saying the control scheme might not work for everybody and it may present problems in the game. (Boss battles I guess?)
Meanwhile the control and gameplay in the GTA games is flawed as well and does cause problems with missions.
Usually this is stated with a score-qualifying statement like "but it does not detract from the overall game' or 'the sum outweights its parts' Yet, these issues have detracted from the GTA games for me and others. Whether it be the poor aiming making me die in a shootout, average combat and camera getting me turned around ont he street or odd driving physics leading to funky turns on a motorbike during a mission. It is a silenced minority as opposed to the loud minority that complains about MP. It still exists though. On what perception does one matter and the other not?