Support NeoGAF

[yazenov]

Release more controllers

They should release those Pride color controllers for the RE crowd to keep them from losing their shit over this sad news.

 

[kyussman]

Oh shit,breaking news Joe Biden has weighed in with a statemate......"I heard there was ice cream,does anyone have ice cream,where's the ice cream,you know when I was a young boy I had very smooth legs,completely hairless they were..........".................sorry guys,nevermind.

 

[DJ12]

You really think investment groups can’t afford to buy Xbox? They manage trillions of dollars. Vanguard holds 8 trillion in assets.

You really think they'd spent that much on a brand even Microsoft cannot save?

 

[FUBARx89]

Now, at last, it’s time for Sony to deliver the killing blow. Blue Box Studios Silent Hill will be revealed. All is happening according the plan.

Hasan Rising.

You absolute bastard. I just spat my morning coffee all over.

Reading the news this morning and Brad Smith in full on slagging off mode.


"I think it leaves people worried and it leaves people thinking, actually, the process in Brussels worked far better than what we’re now addressing in London." - Brad Smith.

EU hasn't even signed off yet

 

[IlGialloMondadori]

You absolute bastard. I just spat my morning coffee all over.

Reading the news this morning and Brad Smith in full on slagging off mode.


"I think it leaves people worried and it leaves people thinking, actually, the process in Brussels worked far better than what we’re now addressing in London." - Brad Smith.

EU hasn't even signed off yet

 

[Elios83]

You absolute bastard. I just spat my morning coffee all over.

Reading the news this morning and Brad Smith in full on slagging off mode.


"I think it leaves people worried and it leaves people thinking, actually, the process in Brussels worked far better than what we’re now addressing in London." - Brad Smith.

EU hasn't even signed off yet

Imagine if EU blocks as well (although it seems like approval with a wide set of behavioural remedies is more likely atm).
Reality is that EU is as concerned as CMA about the cloud market, they delayed their decision twice, they asked Microsoft to extend their concessions. Regulators are in contact and share their findings.

We all understimated the impact of concerns about cloud market because as core gamers we thought it was all about consoles and because of this false conception we didn't consider the possibility that fears about cloud market alone could result in a block.
But what happened with CMA was a wakeup call. Nothing is guaranteed at this point.

 

[PaintTinJr]

Is this an actual Brexit benefit since the EU was ready to approve the deal?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-65407005

Answers on a postcard....

Not to toot my own horn but my intuition was that the deal was MS' strategy to be the monopolist (like Amazon) in cloud gaming.

https://www.gov.uk/government/speeches/martin-coleman-speech-to-the-law-society-2022

...
EU exit was significant for 2 reasons:

First, we now have jurisdiction to review some of the world’s largest mergers, where any effects in the UK previously would have been reviewed only by the European Commission, raising the prospect of parallel investigations between the Commission and the CMA.
...

 

[deriks]

So is this the final nail in the MS coffin? They put all their hopes and dreams in one Activision Blizzard basket and the CMA said hell no.

Does MS even have a plan B? I mean, they are currently being dominated by the competition and even with the deal getting potentially passed by the regulators, MS doesn't stand a chance at catching up to Sony this generation. And now without this deal, they are practically a floating corpse in the water.

They still can get an appeal

Also, CMA was the only one (at least for now) thet rejected

 

[KaiserBecks]

You really think they'd spent that much on a brand even Microsoft cannot save?

It’s more successful than ever yet it can’t be saved

 

[jm89]

Imagine if EU blocks as well (although it seems like approval with a wide set of behavioural remedies is more likely atm).
Reality is that EU is as concerned as CMA about the cloud market, they delayed their decision twice, they asked Microsoft to extend their concessions. Regulators are in contact and share their findings.

We all understimated the impact of concerns about cloud market because as core gamers we thought it was all about consoles and because of this false conception we didn't consider the possibility that fears about cloud market alone could result in a block.
But what happened with CMA was a wakeup call. Nothing is guaranteed at this point.

EU decision will be interesting.

With the CMA decision multiple companies came out of the woodwork to show their disapproval of the deal and we know google has raised issues with the EU regarding Microsofts behaviour in the cloud services market, those issues interestingly enough could be used in the cloud gaming market. Assuming those same companies provide their disapproval in the EUs response gathering from third parties, EU have something to think about.

Then add in FTC also disapproving, who knows what pressure that puts in the EU to not look spineless letting a trillion dollar company just force their way to success.

 

[Honey Bunny]

I really don't think MS understands this country. In general if you threaten us we will double down, not ease off. 'Microsoft in furious attack on UK' is an unusually pointed headline from the BBC.

Edit: on the other hand, this could be them buttering up the EU regulators to approve the deal for political reasons.

 

[DJ12]

It’s more successful than ever yet it can’t be saved

If I was you I'd buy shares in Microsoft so you can have a say when the rest of the shareholders decide to ditch it.

 

[Elios83]

EU decision will be interesting.

With the CMA decision multiple companies came out of the woodwork to show their disapproval of the deal and we know google has raised issues with the EU regarding Microsofts behaviour in the cloud services market, those issues interestingly enough could be used in the cloud gaming market. Assuming those same companies provide their disapproval in the EUs response gathering from third parties, EU have something to think about.

Then add in FTC also disapproving, who knows what pressure that puts in the EU to not look spineless letting a trillion dollar company just force their way to success.

EU will definetly have much less fear to block now that CMA has spearheaded the road for them.
The only extra pressure is that they want to make a decision that can totally stand a legal test in case of appeal.
This is something that CMA doesn't have to care about as much as EU because in UK there isn't a real appeal against their decisions.


China will also be interesting given what happened with Netease and given that Microsoft tried to sell this acquisition as a necessity to be able to compete and fend off the advance of chinese gaming companies.

 

[PaintTinJr]

Imagine if EU blocks as well (although it seems like approval with a wide set of behavioural remedies is more likely atm).
Reality is that EU is as concerned as CMA about the cloud market, they delayed their decision twice, they asked Microsoft to extend their concessions. Regulators are in contact and share their findings.

We all understimated the impact of concerns about cloud market because as core gamers we thought it was all about consoles and because of this false conception we didn't consider the possibility that fears about cloud market alone could result in a block.
But what happened with CMA was a wakeup call. Nothing is guaranteed at this point.

The thing is I wonder what happens if Sony decides to attempt an appeal to challenge the lack of SLC for the console market - while Microsoft attempts to get an appeal for the cloud SLC.

In that scenario where Sony are arguing to strengthen the outcome of the CMA finding, the CAT could just as easily find in Sony's favour - with nothing to lose - and send the CMA back to re-analyse the console SLC in greater depth. The worst outcome for the CMA in that scenario would be that they were wrong about the final console SLC decision but still got the merger decision correct. I still don't think they are correct about the console SLC because I don't believe Xbox is about directly making money and suspect they are at ATVI acquisition amounts in the red for the ROI over the two decades of Xbox between hardware losses and advertising the xbox brand through Bing.

Arguing it makes no financial sense for Microsoft to withhold CoD from PlayStation at billions per year in losses is a moot argument if Xbox has been losing billions per year directly on Xbox to defend Directx and Windows +90% market share for PC gaming all this time.

 

[laynelane]

I really don't think MS understands this country. In general if you threaten us we will double down, not ease off. 'Microsoft in furious attack on UK' is an unusually pointed headline from the BBC.

Edit: on the other hand, this could be them buttering up the EU regulators to approve the deal for political reasons.

I thought this was a well-spoken response to Brad Smith:

However, the regulator hit back, saying: "It is the CMA's job to do what is best for the people, businesses and economy of the UK, not merging firms with commercial interests."

I liked Sarah Cardell's response too.

 

[jm89]

EU will definetly have much less fear to block now that CMA has spearheaded the road for them.
The only extra pressure is that they want to make a decision that can totally stand a legal test in case of appeal.
This is something that CMA doesn't have to care about as much as EU because in UK there isn't a real appeal against their decisions.


China will also be interesting given what happened with Netease and given that Microsoft tried to sell this acquisition as a necessity to be able to compete and fend off the advance of chinese gaming companies.

Yeah it would have stand a legal challenge. just like with the FTC. Although at that point i wonder if Microsoft just throws in towel.

They'd be fighting 3 regulators, one of which the CMA is a losing battle.

But i'm more leaning towards EU approving anyway.

 

[Zok310]

All along, greenberg predicted the outcome

 

[Zok310]

I really don't think MS understands this country. In general if you threaten us we will double down, not ease off. 'Microsoft in furious attack on UK' is an unusually pointed headline from the BBC.

Edit: on the other hand, this could be them buttering up the EU regulators to approve the deal for political reasons.

Brits sure as shit dont quit, go ask the Germans, they will tell you.

 

[noise36]

We all understimated the impact of concerns about cloud market because as core gamers we thought it was all about consoles and because of this false conception we didn't consider the possibility that fears about cloud market alone could result in a block.
But what happened with CMA was a wakeup call. Nothing is guaranteed at this point.

"We" underestimated cloud market concerns because we understand the gaming market and CMA doesn't. i.e. Cloud gaming is a tiny loss making niche that no one cares about.

 

[Ronin_7]

They still can get an appeal

Also, CMA was the only one (at least for now) thet rejected

FTC also rejected.

MS has to fight in the US & UK courts for the next years to have this deal done.

In the UK even if CAT sides with MS, it goes back to the CMA lmao

It's as dead as it gets.

 

[hyperbertha]

Is this a joke? :

If this gen fails, I can easily see xbox folding.

 

[IlGialloMondadori]

FTC also rejected.

MS has to fight in the US & UK courts for the next years to have this deal done.

In the UK even if CAT sides with MS, it goes back to the CMA lmao

It's as dead as it gets.

And EU not reached decision yet, and could very well block, too.

Looks and smells like a corpse.

 

[Elios83]

"We" underestimated cloud market concerns because we understand the gaming market and CMA doesn't. i.e. Cloud gaming is a tiny loss making niche that no one cares about.

Nope that's not the case given that Microsoft is not looking at a console future but at a subscription based future where the service is platform agnostic and runs through cloud on multiple devices.
If cloud is destined to remain niche it means that the whole Microsoft business strategy would have no sense.

Regulators realize that with the acquisition Microsoft would be the only company in the world to own both a leading cloud infrastructure AND a wide array of contents.
Not even other big tech companies could compete, see what happened with Google that has the infrastructure but NOT the contents, let alone a small competitor.

This is why CMA blocked.

 

[RaySoft]

It sure seems like many don't know the prime reason why CMA exists. Their function is to make sure that the different markets don't turn into a monopoly. People reasoning that all gamepass games would be available for all devices means nothing when MS would be the sole supplier.

 

[Astray]

I think if things don’t turn around Microsoft will sale Xbox off and it will turn into a publisher. Then Sony will have a monopoly on high end console market.

If someone buys Xbox (say, Amazon or Facebook), won't that mean that they intend to compete with Sony in the console market? Why else would anyone buy the brand?

 

[PaintTinJr]

If someone buys Xbox (say, Amazon or Facebook), won't that mean that they intend to compete with Sony in the console market? Why else would anyone buy the brand?

Microsoft have completely stitched themselves up by calling the brand Direct - X - Box, because selling to anyone other than Nvidia would result in the buyer replacing the API use in all games with Opengl/Vulkan due to the inherent risk of being tied to a proprietary API you had no rights to and wasn't cross platform, which an Xbox company not using DirectX would just be such a marketing fail, so the Xbox brand has zero value, and all they'd be buying is the games/IP, which Microsoft wouldn't want to sell when they still would be running Microsoft Game Studios for Windows.

 

[shaddam]

Yesterday was not Microsoft's day

 

[gokurho]

Mr Smith said the CMA's decision marked "probably the darkest day in our four decades in Britain".
"It does more than shake our confidence in the future of the opportunity to grow a technology business in Britain than we've ever confronted before."
But on Wednesday the regulator said it was concerned the deal would hit innovation and give gamers less choice in the fast-growing cloud gaming market, where people buy subscriptions to access games online.
The UK government has made it one of its post-Brexit goals to bring in a "light-touch" set of rules for science and technology to encourage economic growth.
Mr Smith said that if the UK wants to bring in investment and make Britain a place "where technology is not only going to flourish, but be created", then "it needs to look hard at the role of the CMA and the regulatory structure".

He added that "people are shocked, people are disappointed, and people's confidence in technology in the UK has been severely shaken" by the CMA decision.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-65407005

Let's escape from UK

 

[noise36]

Nope that's not the case given that Microsoft is not looking at a console future but at a subscription based future where the service is platform agnostic and runs through cloud on multiple devices.
If cloud is destination to remain niche it means that the whole Microsoft business strategy would have no sense.

Regulators realize that with the acquisition Microsoft would be the only company in the world to own both a leading cloud infrastructure AND a wide array of contents.
Not even other big tech companies could compete see what happened with Google that has the infrastructure but not the contents, let alone a small competitor.

This is why CMA blocked.

Both Sony and Nintendo have had huge success by focusing on exclusive hardware and exclusive single player software, cloud doesn't exist in their success story. The big revenue in gaming, Apple, Tencent etc, cloud is non existent.

Cloud gaming existence is loss making ventures from google (failed already), nvidia? and xbox (bundled as no demand for stand alone service)?

The entire MS xbox business strategy has failed, their market position is a reflection of that failure, their focus on cloud has failed. The regulators dont understand the market and have used someday maybe corporate aspirations to gaze into the crystal ball to justify their actions from the ivory tower.

Without the deal proceeding UK consumers will continue to pay high prices to access ABK games at RRP and high prices to entry via a PS5 or XBOX console. i.e. Instead of via gamepass or cloud at much lower cost.

If CMA objective was to protect consumers from games, less people playing ABK games, they have done an amazing job here.

 

[Filben]

Because Activision championed and pushed cloud gaming in the past especially in the UK?

I don't see the connection to cloud gaming here.

 

[Fabieter]

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-65407005

Let's escape from UK

Sounds like a brat which doesn't get his will so be honest. Big oof.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

If someone buys Xbox (say, Amazon or Facebook), won't that mean that they intend to compete with Sony in the console market? Why else would anyone buy the brand?

Gaming will quickly move away from consoles, no major company is seriously considering entering the console market.

The future is mobile and cloud, which both have larger audiences and the potential for larger audiences. A console can help you leverage into those markets, but it isn’t a requirement and I don’t think anyone would see Xbox as a platform to leverage into that market more so than Microsoft themselves.

 

[Astray]

Gaming will quickly move away from consoles, no major company is seriously considering entering the console market.

The future is mobile and cloud, which both have larger audiences and the potential for larger audiences. A console can help you leverage into those markets, but it isn’t a requirement and I don’t think anyone would see Xbox as a platform to leverage into that market more so than Microsoft themselves.

Even then, no one is gonna be buying Microsoft's business without full-intent of competing in the gaming platform business.

If anything, the CMA's decision made it easier for say, Facebook or Amazon or even Sony/Nintendo to catch up to the future and actually challenge Microsoft in the new frontier of gaming platforms. Hell, even Google could make a comeback if Cloud gaming services become more tangible. Great decision by the CMA to safeguard future consumer choice.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

FTC also rejected.

MS has to fight in the US & UK courts for the next years to have this deal done.

In the UK even if CAT sides with MS, it goes back to the CMA lmao

It's as dead as it gets.

Even if US FTC and EU approved, it would be irrelevant because CMA denied. I believe the contract signed for acquisition stipulates that all major regulating bodies must approve or the deal cannot be consummated. So just 1 denial is enough to scuttle the deal. I don't really think MS will bother with even attempting to get a "symbolic" approval from the EU, nor will they continue to fight the FTC. CMA denied, that fails to fulfill the terms of the contract, so the deal is already dead.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Even then, no one is gonna be buying Microsoft's business without full-intent of competing in the gaming platform business.

If anything, the CMA's decision made it easier for say, Facebook or Amazon or even Sony/Nintendo to catch up to the future and actually challenge Microsoft in the new frontier of gaming platforms.

Yes, but there is no interest from anyone in buying Xbox. It‘s largely a failed ecosystem. There’s no price Microsoft would sell for that anyone would buy for.

Xbox is probably worth like 10 billion dollars, maybe 15.

 

[Ozriel]

So is this the final nail in the MS coffin? They put all their hopes and dreams in one Activision Blizzard basket and the CMA said hell no.

Does MS even have a plan B? I mean, they are currently being dominated by the competition and even with the deal getting potentially passed by the regulators, MS doesn't stand a chance at catching up to Sony this generation. And now without this deal, they are practically a floating corpse in the water.

Why is there this persistent, binary belief that success in the console market means selling more consoles than anyone else?

With or without this deal, they were never going to catch up to Sony hardware wise. That ship’s sailed long since.

I don’t believe the guys running Google Cloud expect to overturn Amazon’s AWS lead. Doesn’t mean they don’t have a viable market.

 

[PanzerCute]

I really don't think MS understands this country. In general if you threaten us we will double down, not ease off. 'Microsoft in furious attack on UK' is an unusually pointed headline from the BBC.

Edit: on the other hand, this could be them buttering up the EU regulators to approve the deal for political reasons.

The way some companies speaks to f*cking countries is baffling to me. I remember when EA said to the Uk that they had a bad interpretation of the law regarding loot boxes...

Like, bitch, THEY ARE the law wtf are you talking about.

 

[Astray]

Yes, but there is no interest from anyone in buying Xbox. It‘s largely a failed ecosystem. There’s no price Microsoft would sell for that anyone would buy for.

Xbox is probably worth like 10 billion dollars, maybe 15.

That's true indeed.

 

[IlGialloMondadori]

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-65407005

Let's escape from UK

"people's confidence in technology in the UK has been severely shaken" Speak for yourself, mate.

Buck up, Smith.

 

[Coulomb_Barrier]

FTC also rejected.

MS has to fight in the US & UK courts for the next years to have this deal done.

In the UK even if CAT sides with MS, it goes back to the CMA lmao

It's as dead as it gets.

Yeh exactly, though the MS shills on REE masquerading as legal experts are now convincing the sad Xbox fanboys on there that there is still hope. Leading them on another merry dance that will end in delicious salty fanboy tears again

 

[IlGialloMondadori]

MS right now

 

[Gamezone]

To protect cloud gaming? Ironically they would have made the entire Blizzard and Activision library available on xCloud and Geforce Now.

Now we won't have their games on anything.

 

[Lions Gate]

I haven't laughed like this in a long time, thank you guys for the content

 

[Mung]

The way some companies speaks to f*cking countries is baffling to me. I remember when EA said to the Uk that they had a bad interpretation of the law regarding loot boxes...

Like, bitch, THEY ARE the law wtf are you talking about.

Sadly in our current uber capitalist system megacorps worth trillions feel that they are able to dictate to nation states and openly want to bend the system and law to their will.

 

[Fuz]

...cloud?



Holy shit 37 pages already?

 

[John Wick]

For a normal company, selling 50-60 million of consoles in a generation of 6-7 years should be profitable. The console online store take 30% of any games or DLC sold there. It's a very comfortable position to be in. A lot of companies would buy the position MS is currently at.

It's just that Microsoft is greedy and does not want to waste time earning less than a billion for a division (profit). Gaming does not make sense for them unless it's earning (profiting) 10 billion and cornering the market. That's why they want to monopolize the market.

Bingo!

 

[gokurho]

FTC also rejected.

MS has to fight in the US & UK courts for the next years to have this deal done.

In the UK even if CAT sides with MS, it goes back to the CMA lmao

It's as dead as it gets.

Why ?
MS can exit from US&UK market.
We don't need FTC and CMA's approval.
Japan, Saudi Arabia, Brazil, Chile, Serbia has approved this acquisition.

 

[MasterCornholio]

Why ?
MS can exit from US&UK market.
We don't need FTC and CMA's approval.
Japan, Saudi Arabia, Brazil, Chile, Serbia has approved this acquisition.

Nah I'm pretty sure they need the CMAs approval as per the agreement they made.

 

[Badlucktroll]

Yes, but there is no interest from anyone in buying Xbox. It‘s largely a failed ecosystem. There’s no price Microsoft would sell for that anyone would buy for.

Xbox is probably worth like 10 billion dollars, maybe 15.

Microsoft could sell Xbox to like, Samsung or Amazon or something, then just make the games for it.

 

[Marvel14]

Not sure what 'answers on a postcard' means

Nope, the CMA and their responsibilities predates Brexit. Most EU countries do also do some antitrust infringement investigations as well.

True but pre Brexit i suspect the CMA would have at least done an alignment check with EU market regulators. Suspect Brexit removed those pressures and there may be more divergences going forward.