nhlducks35
Member
I thought it was:
i3 had nothing
i5 has turbo boost
i7 has turbo boost and hyperthreading
-
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Microsoft Surface Pro 3 Announced (12", 3:2 aspect ratio, new stand)
- Thread starter enzo_gt
- Start date
I thought it was:
i3 had nothing
i5 has turbo boost
i7 has turbo boost and hyperthreading
Shogmaster
Member
You sure about that?
I could be wrong, by looking at Intel's website, they i5 don't seem to have hyperthreading -
http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/processors/core/core-i5-processor.html
Did they change Hyperthreading implementation from Ivy Bridge to Haswell? My IB i5 has 2 physical cores and 4 virtual cores (hyperthreading).Core.
Should. Try calling and mention the GRADUATION promotion and student discount.
Weird, didn't i5 processors have 4 physical cores but no hyperthreading vs i7's which have 4 cores + hyperthreading.
Atleast the desktop processors did, don't know about mobile though.
Shogmaster
Member
Here's the Intel page on 4300U. It lists 4 threads.
http://ark.intel.com/products/76308
Status Launched
Launch Date Q3'13
DMI2 5 GT/s
Processor Number i5-4300U
# of Cores 2
# of Threads 4
Clock Speed 1.9 GHz
Max Turbo Frequency 2.9 GHz
Intel® Smart Cache 3 MB
Instruction Set 64-bit
Instruction Set Extensions SSE 4.1/4.2, AVX 2.0
I think it's mostly a branding thing, though digging around a bit further, there seem to be older Haswell CPUs with hyperthreading, though they all seem to be dual core.
And another thing, it seem that the review model that AnandTech got has a Core i5-4300U CPU, which is a dual core with hyperthreading, if that's the CPU in the final model, than you can expect a fairly noticeable perf bump going to quad core i7 (though again, it really depends on the model).
We'll have to wait and see what CPUs are in them exactly.
Shogmaster
Member
Quad core i7? On SP3? No smoking and message-boarding please.
It's gonna be a dual core ULV i7. TDP of less than 20W.
I bet my Fujitsu T902 on it.
I could've sworn they don't make dual core Haswell i7.Quad core i7? On SP3? No smoking and message-boarding please.
It's gonna be a dual core ULV i7. TDP of less than 20W.
I bet my Fujitsu T902 on it.
I was wrong though, and yeah, no fucking way they put quad core on a surface, I have no idea what the fuck I was thinking.
Whatever, that i5/7 is stupid ass confusing branding, give me model numbers dammit.
And to bring this discussion to a more productive avenue, if it's i5-4300U vs i7-4500U, i5 all the fucking way, you'll be hard pressed to notice the difference.
Shogmaster
Member
No need. The only ULV i7 with the right TDP for SP3 is the 4600U (They won't use i7 4500U since it's slower clock than 4300U).
So it's either i5 4300U or i7 4600U, That's your choice.
1.9GHZ vs 2.1GHz
3MB L3 vs 4MB L3.
Both with 2 core/4 threads
2.9GHz Turbo vs 3.3GHz Turbo
Both with HD4400 (GT2) @ 1100MHz
ncsuDuncan
Member
i5 256GB
Red Type Cover
and now the wait begins
Red Type Cover
and now the wait begins
Shogmaster
Member
So jelly...
Doominated
Member
Wow, pretty surprised that nobody has managed to post the correct information for the core series differences from i3-i5-i7 lol. So much misinformation in the last dozen or so posts
The difference breakdown works like this (Assuming Mobile/ULV parts)
Jumping from Pentium (I know there isn't a Surface model with a Pentium, just using as reference) to i3 gets you Hyperthreading, an extra meg of cache (50% increase) and the newer series of HD graphics. This is actually the most substantial performance bump you'll see in Intel's sets; You typically see a 100% performance boost when comparing a Pentium model to it's i3 counterpart.
Jumping from i3 to i5 gets you Turboboost for the CPU and a slightly higher dynamic max clock speed for the GPU. You get all of what would be considered the "business user" extras, like vPro and SIPP. You also get features like Smart Response, but that only comes into play when you have a mechanical drive, so it won't affect the Surface Pro series. You generally see a 40% performance boost with an i5 compared to its i3 version, mostly due to Turboboost.
The i5 to i7 jump is much less drastic than the others when you're dealing with ULV/Mobile parts. You are still on the same 2core/4thread system as the i3/i5 sets. What you do get is an extra meg of cache (33% increase over i3/i5) and generally higher clock speeds. The difference here is, truthfully, negligible when you consider the price difference. You're usually looking at a 15-20% performance boost over the i5 it goes against, which while decent, isn't worth the hundreds of dollars it will cost. And to make the i7 jump even less satisfying, Haswell i7 parts have proven to be less power efficient than the i5's, meaning you'll actually take a slight (Usually 5-10%) hit to your every day battery life in comparison.
Of course, we still don't know what i7 part MS is using. They could surprise us all and bust out an HD5000+ chip, which would make the i7 option much more appetizing considering the huge GPU performance boost over what the i5 would have.
All of this information changes depending on what kinds of parts you're looking at, by the way. It's completely different with desktop parts, and gets most confusing the Mobile laptop option parts. The ULV sets that the Surface Pro uses (And the Y series that they'll probably move to in the next iteration) are pretty straight forward however.
The difference breakdown works like this (Assuming Mobile/ULV parts)
Jumping from Pentium (I know there isn't a Surface model with a Pentium, just using as reference) to i3 gets you Hyperthreading, an extra meg of cache (50% increase) and the newer series of HD graphics. This is actually the most substantial performance bump you'll see in Intel's sets; You typically see a 100% performance boost when comparing a Pentium model to it's i3 counterpart.
Jumping from i3 to i5 gets you Turboboost for the CPU and a slightly higher dynamic max clock speed for the GPU. You get all of what would be considered the "business user" extras, like vPro and SIPP. You also get features like Smart Response, but that only comes into play when you have a mechanical drive, so it won't affect the Surface Pro series. You generally see a 40% performance boost with an i5 compared to its i3 version, mostly due to Turboboost.
The i5 to i7 jump is much less drastic than the others when you're dealing with ULV/Mobile parts. You are still on the same 2core/4thread system as the i3/i5 sets. What you do get is an extra meg of cache (33% increase over i3/i5) and generally higher clock speeds. The difference here is, truthfully, negligible when you consider the price difference. You're usually looking at a 15-20% performance boost over the i5 it goes against, which while decent, isn't worth the hundreds of dollars it will cost. And to make the i7 jump even less satisfying, Haswell i7 parts have proven to be less power efficient than the i5's, meaning you'll actually take a slight (Usually 5-10%) hit to your every day battery life in comparison.
Of course, we still don't know what i7 part MS is using. They could surprise us all and bust out an HD5000+ chip, which would make the i7 option much more appetizing considering the huge GPU performance boost over what the i5 would have.
All of this information changes depending on what kinds of parts you're looking at, by the way. It's completely different with desktop parts, and gets most confusing the Mobile laptop option parts. The ULV sets that the Surface Pro uses (And the Y series that they'll probably move to in the next iteration) are pretty straight forward however.
Hmmmm I think I may be getting one of these before the year is up to replace my Surface Pro OG, which I still have to swap under the extended warranty due to a panel defect...
Kinda waiting on that so maybe they run out of OG Pros to give me lol!!
I can see this machine being alot more useful for university work with the increased screen real estate, better battery life (as long as it can go around 6-7 hours of moderate use with WiFi and decent brightness), much improved stylus feel and lack of parallax, and the way way better keyboard. I think I would be inclined to go with the i5/128gb like my current Pro, but honestly I think the i3 is enough for what I do...
Too bad it's not Broadwell, but the battery life seems sufficient, so I think it's alright.
Kinda waiting on that so maybe they run out of OG Pros to give me lol!!
I can see this machine being alot more useful for university work with the increased screen real estate, better battery life (as long as it can go around 6-7 hours of moderate use with WiFi and decent brightness), much improved stylus feel and lack of parallax, and the way way better keyboard. I think I would be inclined to go with the i5/128gb like my current Pro, but honestly I think the i3 is enough for what I do...
Too bad it's not Broadwell, but the battery life seems sufficient, so I think it's alright.
Shogmaster
Member
I think I can pretty much guarantee that these are the 3 processors in SP3:
http://ark.intel.com/products/75110/Intel-Core-i3-4100U-Processor-3M-Cache-1_80-GHz
http://ark.intel.com/products/76308
http://ark.intel.com/products/76616
They are all very close, with the only practical difference being that i3 will not have turbo boost, which means it's just 1.8GHz max.
http://ark.intel.com/products/75110/Intel-Core-i3-4100U-Processor-3M-Cache-1_80-GHz
http://ark.intel.com/products/76308
http://ark.intel.com/products/76616
They are all very close, with the only practical difference being that i3 will not have turbo boost, which means it's just 1.8GHz max.
Shogmaster
Member
Looks like Celsys made a video about Clip Studio Paint using N-Trig equipped Sony VAIO (Duo 13 with Duo Sense 2?):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FhtnKzmxfQ
edit: LOL, Sony did a way KAWAIIIIIII~er video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dnDSu5p_PDU
This is essentially the same pen hardware as in the SP3.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FhtnKzmxfQ
edit: LOL, Sony did a way KAWAIIIIIII~er video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dnDSu5p_PDU
This is essentially the same pen hardware as in the SP3.
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
I've toyed around with Sony's digitiser. I'm not a pro, but it feels fairly decent for an amateur like me. I'm interested in knowing the improvements made my Microsoft.
brotkasten
Member
Would it be possible to use the WinTab driver from the Surface on other N-Trig devices?
Someone is spreading Shog's post.
http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/Some-insights-into-Wacom--N-Trig-change-Surface-pro-3
http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/Some-insights-into-Wacom--N-Trig-change-Surface-pro-3
Shogmaster
Member
Ganked again! lol
The obvious solution is to write crappier posts...
Shogmaster
Member
I thought I've already reached the bottom. Must go lower...
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
brotkasten
Member
Surface Pro 3 review by The Verge
Microsoft Surface Pro 3
Verge Score: 8.0
Good Stuff
Bad Stuff
The ideal physical form for Windows
The Surface Pro 3’s hardware is undoubtedly impressive. Although Microsoft calls it a tablet, it’s better to think of this Surface as a full-fledged PC that can work as a large tablet in a pinch. More than anything else, the Surface Pro 3 is the ideal physical form for Windows 8.1. Both the OS and the hardware feel like a computer with some (occasionally great) tablet features tacked on top. It’s as though the bits that make up Windows prayed really hard and created a physical version of themselves.
The Surface is so PC-centric, it’s hard to even think of it as being in the same category as the iPad. Instead, Microsoft is very clearly taking aim at the MacBook Air, but beating the most popular laptop on the market is a very tall order. Taking everything into account, the hardware is now very competitive between the two. So whether you think the Surface Pro 3 is a better alternative depends almost entirely on what you think of Windows and the Microsoft ecosystem.
It took three iterations for the hardware to live up to Microsoft’s original vision for the Surface, but now it finally does. If you believe that Windows 8.1 hasn’t taken off because the hardware hasn’t been good enough, the Surface Pro 3 removes that argument from the table. It’s simply hard to identify areas where it can get radically better. If the Surface Pro 3 can’t get consumers on board with Windows, Microsoft is going to need to seriously rethink its software strategy at a fundamental level.
http://www.theverge.com/2014/5/23/5743416/microsoft-surface-pro-3-review
Microsoft Surface Pro 3
Verge Score: 8.0
Good Stuff
- Thin and light
- Greatly improved kickstand
- High-resolution screen
Bad Stuff
- So-so battery life
- Some software bugs
- No full SD card slot
The ideal physical form for Windows
The Surface Pro 3’s hardware is undoubtedly impressive. Although Microsoft calls it a tablet, it’s better to think of this Surface as a full-fledged PC that can work as a large tablet in a pinch. More than anything else, the Surface Pro 3 is the ideal physical form for Windows 8.1. Both the OS and the hardware feel like a computer with some (occasionally great) tablet features tacked on top. It’s as though the bits that make up Windows prayed really hard and created a physical version of themselves.
The Surface is so PC-centric, it’s hard to even think of it as being in the same category as the iPad. Instead, Microsoft is very clearly taking aim at the MacBook Air, but beating the most popular laptop on the market is a very tall order. Taking everything into account, the hardware is now very competitive between the two. So whether you think the Surface Pro 3 is a better alternative depends almost entirely on what you think of Windows and the Microsoft ecosystem.
It took three iterations for the hardware to live up to Microsoft’s original vision for the Surface, but now it finally does. If you believe that Windows 8.1 hasn’t taken off because the hardware hasn’t been good enough, the Surface Pro 3 removes that argument from the table. It’s simply hard to identify areas where it can get radically better. If the Surface Pro 3 can’t get consumers on board with Windows, Microsoft is going to need to seriously rethink its software strategy at a fundamental level.
http://www.theverge.com/2014/5/23/5743416/microsoft-surface-pro-3-review
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
"No full SD card slot" sounds like some real nitpicking, TBH. Flush looks better, but that also means another flimsy mechanism. I've honestly lost the count of how many times I've forgotten my SD card because I had it inserted in my laptop instead of wherever should be (my camera, mostly). It can be a real PITA during events, when you are scooting around all day long and suddently you find that you can't shoot shit because you forgot to dislodge the SD card from the laptop. Being able to see it (and thus making the card less easy to forget) would be nice for certain beats.
I'm really, really intrigued about its usability as a magazine/catalogue reader. My Dell Venue Pro 8 is mostly fine for that, but I find myself zooming in a bit too frequently at times.
I'm really, really intrigued about its usability as a magazine/catalogue reader. My Dell Venue Pro 8 is mostly fine for that, but I find myself zooming in a bit too frequently at times.
"Taking everything into account, the hardware is now very competitive between the two."
Eh, the surface is like two years ahead of the MBA (I'm an Apple fan, but the display for example is very aged)... Honestly, the Surface sounds like really great hardware, only held down by W8
Eh, the surface is like two years ahead of the MBA (I'm an Apple fan, but the display for example is very aged)... Honestly, the Surface sounds like really great hardware, only held down by W8
And they give it 8.0?
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
Well, there's Windows 8...
Edit: And this is not a fun. Having to deal with the shit-tacular situation of Microsoft's Windows Store is not good. The number and quality of the apps is still abysmal.
maximum360
Member
256 GB i5 with blue type cover is my preference.
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
AnandTech reviews are fucking surgical. I mean, I love them and I consider them the gold standard in tech, but most people don't have the guts or the knowledge to go through them. The Verge covers a different niche.
Abso-friggin-lutely. At least there's an actual card reader (already better than some superthin Ultrabooks, which baffles me to no end) and the keyboard connects to its own interface, so one USB 3 port should suffice for most people.
Do they even cover much tech anymore? I kinda stopped paying much attention after their weed week.
Perhaps my interpretation is off, but I believe the nitpick is more about it being a micro-SD slot rather than a slat for full size SD cards. Which I too find worth mentioning and see as a slight negative. I don't want to have to buy an expensive micro SD card that is still slower than a full size card to easily review images from my camera.
Wow they actually say the app store is improving fast. That's new.
SP3 would be a much more attractive option for the masses if the pen were more integrated into the OS and most applications and actually improved usability significantly. If they can sell the pen, then they can sell Surface Pro. That's one big selling point of SP3 for us who can imagine the pen being very useful. The next version of Office would contribute to that but it needs to be much more cohesive.
I'm still disappointed Apple decided to abandon pen input and essentially made the iPad an upsized iPhone.
Why would you buy a micro SD card to review images from your camera? You mean you people actually use microSD cards for the SD slot in their cameras through an adapter? Ew.
SP3 would be a much more attractive option for the masses if the pen were more integrated into the OS and most applications and actually improved usability significantly. If they can sell the pen, then they can sell Surface Pro. That's one big selling point of SP3 for us who can imagine the pen being very useful. The next version of Office would contribute to that but it needs to be much more cohesive.
I'm still disappointed Apple decided to abandon pen input and essentially made the iPad an upsized iPhone.
Why would you buy a micro SD card to review images from your camera? You mean you people actually use microSD cards for the SD slot in their cameras through an adapter? Ew.
While a full size SD card would be a bit more convenient for digital cameras, the USB 3.0 port also allows you to easily connect a card reader (which I bought for my Surface Pro) or simply connect the camera directly to the Surface without needing to use micro-SD cards.
Why not, that way you can use the same card on your camera and any other device that only accepts microSD and not SD.
I guess for most point and shoots it doesn't matter. Generally there are a lot more choices for premium SD cards than microSD cards.
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
Oh wow, you are right. I totally believed Surface 3 Pro had an actual SD slot instead of a microSD one and I thought The Verge was bitching about being a reader of the "half-in/half-out" type. My bad.
Not having a SD slot yet is an actual con, and a pretty big one for me (I really dislike having to carry around readers and adaptor and extra junk for portable devices).
Edit: I'm guessing I confused the stylus "perch" (or is that a ventilation port?) with an SD slot.
Via Purifico
Banned
Damn if this device would have been announced a couple of months ago, I wouldn't have gotten the Sony vaio pro instead. It's everything I wanted the surface pro 2 to be. I truly believe this is the best windows 8.1 device availlable right now and a marvel of engineering.
Stephen_drewz
Member
I know its not a gaming device first but any thoughts as to what the most demanding game that this would run would likely be?
With Steam in home streaming it can run anything your rig can play!
In all seriousness I was curious about this as well. Anandtech will most likely have some benchmarks soon if not already.
Stephen_drewz
Member
Dead Prince
Banned
i THINK i'm able to preorder the i7 256GB model. gonna have to decide what color cover i want, blue or red.
