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MMA |OT3| When you lose you're a can, when you win you're unstoppable.

Rewatched Silva vs Franklin II and if a ref can stop Arlovski vs Nelson than they could have stopped the Silva/Franklin fight the 2nd round. When Arlovski punched Nelson, Nelson just plopped on the floor than got right back up and was able to compete.

I'm not bitching at all and all in all Franklin was able to continue, but there are some weird guidlines to when a ref just stops a fight. It's pretty uneven. I won't even mention Fedor vs Hendo stoppage which is a joke compared the the Silva vs Franklin round 2.
 
Rewatched Silva vs Franklin II and if a ref can stop Arlovski vs Nelson than they could have stopped the Silva/Franklin fight the 2nd round. When Arlovski punched Nelson, Nelson just plopped on the floor than got right back up and was able to compete.

I'm not bitching at all and all in all Franklin was able to continue, but there are some weird guidlines to when a ref just stops a fight. It's pretty uneven. I won't even mention Fedor vs Hendo stoppage which is a joke compared the the Silva vs Franklin round 2.

Fedor was facedown ass up like his name was Gianna Michael. The only difference is GM is awake when it happens.
 
So is Silva not even gonna try to finish Sonnen until the later rounds? If he really wants to mess him up that seems to be the only outcome.
 

dream

Member
Fedor Emelianenko, a quiet Russian who was the closest thing to a myth that the competitive sport of MMA ever had, has apparently faded into the sunset this past week with one last flurry.

The 35-year-old Emelianenko cracked 38-year-old Pedro Rizzo with a right in the first serious punch of their fight on 6/21 in St. Petersburg, Russia, that put the UFC star of a decade ago on the canvas. Emelianenko finished him immediately after a few punches on the ground in just 1:24, before announcing his retirement at the post-fight press conference. Among those in the crowd were Russian president Vladimir Putin, a front row regular at his fights in Russia, who got into the ring and congratulated him after his victory.

Emelianenko was the dominant heavyweight in the sport for years, generally considered the fighter of the decade and a guaranteed first ballot Hall of Famer if the sport ever gets a worldwide legitimate version. He went as close to unbeaten as you could without being so for nearly a decade, a run that no fighter at the top in history has ever done. For a long time, he was considered the greatest fighter in the history of the sport. Some still consider him that today, although realistically from a skill standpoint and as far as wins over legitimate

top fighters, when you examine opponents, he’s since been surpassed by both Anderson Silva and Georges St. Pierre.

If he retires, he finishes his career with a 34-4 record with one no contest, the second of his three fights with Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira, his rival as the top heavyweight in the sport from 2002 to 2005. Emelianenko beat Nogueira twice via decision, winning solidly each time by taking Nogueira down and shutting down his submission game. The middle match was a no contest due to a nasty cut on Emelianenko’s head after they bonked heads.

By virtue of that record, he was the greatest of his time, and that’s all you can legitimately ask anyone to be. While the sport evolves and the Emelianenko who beat Nogueira would likely not be able to beat the top modern trained heavyweights of today, he still deserves the moniker for his domination of many years and long undefeated strike of being considered the greatest heavyweight in history.

People used to joke that if they didn’t see his blood spill in fights with Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira and Tsuyoshi Kosaka early in his career, they wouldn’t have believed him to be human. He was spoken of like a cyborg, a man who not didn’t even lose rounds, or would only momentarily be on the defensive. But his legacy was not so much about the people he blitzed, but the moments he showed vulnerability, which to some only underscored he was human, and what he did in those situations proved to his followers that he wasn’t.

In a 2003 fight with Kazuyuki Fujita, Fujita nailed him with a punch right on the button and he did the chicken dance, his mind losing control of the motions of his body. He was one punch away from that first decisive finish. But that punch never came. Seconds later it was Fujita tapping from a choke.

In 2004, he was suplexed on his head by Kevin Randleman in one of the most memorable moments in MMA history. Seconds later, it was Randleman tapping from a Kimura.

He was on his back in 2007, getting mauled by a jacked up, then 350-pounds of muscle, Choi Hong-man of South Korea, his face a mess and getting pounded on in the first minute of the fight. But seconds later, the giant was tapping from an armbar.

But for all the mythology, if you examine the records of Fujita, Randleman and Choi, you see fighters who were far more celebrated then their real ability. Fujita was a decent, but not great, wrestler, whose offense was limited but had a good chin, and was only a star because of his pro wrestling ties and because he was a Japanese star early on and somewhat protected. Randleman was a better wrestler with a great physique and good punching power, but never evolved into a complete fighter. Choi wasn’t even a fighter, but a jacked up freak show Japanese creation who was hand-picked for a push because those in the Japanese culture saw him as the recreation or resurrection of the iconic Giant Baba.

He became a rallying point for his followers, longtime fans of the Japanese version of the sport who argued its superiority, or those who wanted to say the UFC as an organization, and its fighters, were nothing but pretenders. And at times, they may have been right.

Emelianenko, on the other hand, never appeared to have any such illusions of himself, not as an athlete, a star or standing up for a make-believe cause. Virtually unknown in his native Russia during his heyday, his stardom in that country came long after his actual fighting prime, he was the best fighter in Japan for years, but far from the biggest star there. In the era of record ratings, Fedor’s fights never topped the bill. Fedor kept winning and had the belt, but Mirko Cro Cop, Wanderlei Silva, Kazushi Sakuraba, Hidehiko Yoshida, Royce Gracie and freak shows and celebrities like Ken Kaneko, Bob Sapp, Naoya Ogawa Akebono and Bobby Ologun that the general public knew about.

In the U.S., he was unknown to casual fans who only knew of UFC, but was revered by a group of fans and was considered by most in the media until his loss to Werdum as the best heavyweight in the world. He seemed almost embarrassed by what was said, always noting that he was not a God, he was not a Cyborg, and he was not unbeatable.

“I think it’s time,” said Emelianenko shortly after his win. “I’m retiring from sports. My family is the reason I will not be fighting again. My daughters are growing up without their father, so it’s the right time to leave. There’s no fantastic offer that could tempt me out of retirement. I’m retiring to spend more time with my family.”

But later, did not stamp it with complete finality.

“I’m not promising, but everything is possible.”

He had talked retirement for more than a year. After losing to Antonio Silva on February 12, 2011, he said he was retiring in the ring after suffering the first real honest to goodness beating of his career. While he was game, and not knocked out or submitted, he couldn’t handle his much bigger foe, the first reasonably talented large heavyweight he had ever faced and the fight was stopped due to his bleeding.

Ron Kruck of HDNet’s “Inside MMA” show was in Russia for the fight, and said those in M-1 believe he is going to fight again. He also said that UFC was very interested in Emelianenko, which Dana White then claimed wasn’t the case. UFC is a business and if they can get him at the right price, they should. There would still be huge money in a Lesnar vs. Fedor fight, and with Lesnar on the sidelines (both are about the same age), Fedor would be the favorite, and a win would springboard him into facing the upper level UFC guys. But that’s conditional on him wanting to do it and getting the right price, as well as Lesnar really fighting. There are other Fedor fights that would do well to a degree, but he’d be worth a lot less for those fights.

But even before that, the signs were there. The game had changed

greatly even during his period on top. He came in as a champion in Russia in the sports of sambo and judo. When the Japanese RINGS promotion ran events in Russia, he was brought in, and it was quickly discovered in actual fights, he was fearless, and had great punching power.

His training was primitive, and for the most part, remained so. But he was, like everyone who dominated the sport in their time, an athlete ahead of the curve. Heavyweights in those days consisted of wrestlers who could do little but wrestle, Jiu Jitsu players with mediocre wrestling and limited striking, and strikers who were mostly lost if they were taken off their feet. Emelianenko could easily submit a pure wrestler with his sambo background. He could takedown a good striker. And he was a better striker, had enough submission awareness and power in his upper body to thwart the Jiu Jitsu guys. While he physically didn’t look like a stereotype of the world’s greatest fighter, he was about 6-feet tall, about 235 pounds, and had a thick upper body, clearly functionally strong for his size, but he wasn’t overly muscular. And that was part of his charm, plus he was balding young, and hardly looked like a movie star. He didn’t brag, he seemed shy in public and unlike most, it seemed the last thing he wanted was to be a celebrity or even a great fighter. It was just a gift that called him.

He had a strong base and grip from judo, exceptional reflexes and the kind of power in his hands that simply can’t be taught.

But the reality is, his biggest career wins were over Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira and Mirko Cro Cop between 2003 and 2005, neither of whom he finished, and neither of whom really fared all that well once they came to UFC. Nogueira was stylistically a perfect opponent for him to look good at, in the sense Nogueira’s boxing was good, but he didn’t possess Emelianenko’s power, and Emelianenko was a physically stronger guy who was good enough on the ground to avoid submissions. The Cro Cop win, which some would argue was the most important heavyweight fight of all-time, and at its time was considered the biggest fight by MMA purists in history, was his most impressive performance as he beat Cro Cop at the stand-up game by constantly pressuring him and showing no fear, rendering Cro Cop’s left high kick meaningless since he was constantly having to move backwards.

It’s highly unlikely even a prime Fedor would have been able to regularly beat the caliber of athletes at the top of the heavyweight division today. He absolutely would have had a chance, because anyone with his one punch power would have, but his boxing technique was not there at all compared to a Junior Dos Santos or a Cain Velasquez. Silva threw him around, and Silva never looked good against any other top competition. He looked very human for several minutes standing with Andrei Arlovski, who he then knocked out, but Arlovski, who was a skilled fighter with great movement for a big guy, was tailor made for Emelianenko with his glass jaw. At the same time, he looked unreal when he knocked down and choked out Tim Sylvia on the first Affliction show, but Abe Wagner and a 48-year-old Ray Mercer did the same thing to Sylvia.

As for the current Fedor, let’s be real. You can chalk up the Fabricio Werdum loss to his being outsmarted, as Werdum faked being knocked silly by a punch to lure him into his guard as Emelianenko thought he’d pound him out for a finish, only for Werdum, not stunned, to be ready for a triangle for the submission in one of the biggest moments in MMA history.

But Silva ran all over him, at the time because of he idea that Silva was too big for a normal sized heavyweight. But the same Silva was nearly knocked out by light heavyweight Mike Kyle, was picked apart and finished quickly by Daniel Cormier, was out grappled for three rounds by Werdum and was absolutely destroyed in horror movie fashion by Velasquez. Emelianenko also was stopped by light heavyweight Dan Henderson in a crazy and undisciplined slugfest. That lack of discipline and swinging for the fences would have likely led to trouble most of the time against today’s top heavyweights. As the sport modernized, with better trainers, better techniques and better training partners, the story of the guy training old school in the frozen Russia made for a fun story for a documentary, but it wasn’t conducive to staying on top.

He was a split second from losing to a relatively unskilled Brett Rogers, who, like Silva, then could do nothing close to that against any other major league competition.

While the chinks didn’t really show up until 2010 in the Werdum fight, it was really late 2008, when he was dominated by Blagoi Ivanov in sambo competition, where you could see things had changed. He was out struck and thrown around by a younger man, and physically dominated. Since it was in another sport, few paid any attention to it. Some could point to his 2006 win over Mark Hunt, where he was on his back for minutes against a guy with no ground game as showing he no longer could have consistently beaten the top level of competition on a consistent basis.

But no matter what you say about competition, this is still a sport where going 33 fights over ten years without a legitimate loss (and the 2000 loss to Tsuyoshi Kosaka was a blood stoppage from an illegal elbow in a fight that under any kind of legitimate rules and sanctioning would have been a no contest) is a significant accomplishment. They weren’t all, or even most, against top competition, but there were enough dangerous opponents at one thing or another that beating the percentages of flukes and upsets that many times is impressive. Prime Nogueira and Cro Cop were the best of his era, Tim Sylvia and Andrei Arlovski were UFC champions, and Mark Coleman and Kevin Randleman were world class wrestlers.

But his career will largely be remembered more for the fights that never happened than those brief moments that did, like his blitzing of Sylvia and knocking Arlovski into a different zip code. The question will always be what part his handlers, such as Vadim Finkelchstein, played in keeping Emelianenko away from the top opponents, or whether Emelianenko was really a wolf in sheep’s clothing, manipulating his personal chessboard while having others play bad cop for him to keep his reputation intact.

The general feeling was that Emelianenko was a humble, wonderful man, who was in bed with sharks who were impossible to deal with and were partially responsible for the deaths of one promotion after another with their demands.

At the same time, until recently, they were always able to get someone to play their game, and fall for the notion that having the best heavyweight in the sport somehow brought a value to an organization that overrode signing deals that you couldn’t possibly make out financially with.

He started with RINGS, which was going down with him or without him. RINGS served a purpose in Japan, but by the time Emelianenko had become their world heavyweight champion, their style of pro wrestling was obsolete, and financially they couldn’t compete with Pride at doing the mostly real match promotion.

Emelianenko’s management was the catalyst for killing Pride, although it eventually was likely to have gone down either way with its big spending and no adherence to a bottom line and the decline in interest among the mainstream in a number of major sports in that country this past decade while the television networks that funded them fell on hard times. In 2003, when Emelianenko was Pride’s world heavyweight champion, his management instead signed him up on New Year’s Eve, the biggest night of the year, for the rival Inoki Bom Ba Ye promotion on NTV to face Yuji Nagata. This turned into a mob turf war battle with one set of Yakuza representing Pride threatening the promotions of the Inoki show, and when that got out a few years later, Pride lost its television and was done for. In 2007, he fought for Bodog on a U.S. PPV show from Russia. The cost was so much that the event was a financial disaster, paying millions for him while doing 13,000 buys. Bodog quickly went out of business, although the truth is, it would have anyway since they had no clue how to promote MMA and financier Calvin Ayre ended up having financial problems with his main gambling business.

Next were a series of American investors who were starting a promotion called M-1, which is not the same as the Russian M-1 Global group. They spent a lot of money to get the rights to use Emelianenko, and folded without even running a show.

Next was Affliction, which folded before its third show. Then came Strikeforce, which was doing well financially until overpaying for Emelianenko, and then were put on sale and purchased by UFC. And finally, the Dream promotion ran this past New Year’s Eve, hoping the idea of Emelianenko vs. Satoshi Ishii could get them the television deal they needed to stay alive. It was a risk that didn’t pay off, and that company hasn’t run since.

From 2007, UFC had at numerous times tried to reach a deal with Emelianenko’s handlers. The hold-up was that M-1 Global wanted to be 50% co-promoters of any show Emelianenko was on. Strikeforce instead took that deal, and there was a Zuffa show, based on the contract, last year with Fedor vs. Henderson that M-1 was listed as 50% partners. It was a surreal night, with the M-1 banners and announcements all night and in all the radio and local television commercials. Emelianenko’s back was against the wall after the losses to Werdum and Silva. When he lost that fight as well, his side lost all leverage in negotiations.

It will always be conjecture just how big a Fedor vs. Randy Couture fight in 2007 or 2008 or Fedor vs. Brock Lesnar fight in 2009 or 2010 would have done. The latter would have been booked at Cowboys Stadium had UFC been able to reach the deal. There were secret negotiations for such a fight where Dana White’s story about going to this island in the middle of nowhere to meet with them was true, but they never came close to terms. The Russians insisted on being co-promoters and didn’t trust the concept of being paid on a percentage of PPV, wanting the money guaranteed. It’s hard to know how well that fight would have done, but safe to say it would have been easily the second, and possibly the biggest non-boxing PPV in history. It is possible it would have been one of the five biggest PPVs of all-time. Emelianenko never drew big money on his own, but Lesnar did 35,000 buys for his debut, and then did 600,000 for his UFC debut. Emelianenko in Affliction, with strong undercards, was able to do 100,000 buys for a non-UFC event against Sylvia and Arlovski, which is actually very impressive for a company that had no television at all. Throw in the UFC machine, television and Lesnar, and you probably would have had another UFC 100 level event.

It’ll always be the one that got away. There were plenty of reasons to say Emelianenko couldn’t draw in the U.S., because his Bodog PPV was a flop and Affliction and Strikeforce lost millions building around him. But that was more because he wasn’t with the top company. His fight with Brett Rogers on CBS was a ratings success, and that’s mainstream network television. His Showtime fight with Silva did, by far, the largest audience that network ever drew for an MMA show. With the UFC machine behind him, Lesnar vs. Fedor could have been the biggest money event in the history of the sport. It had every emotional element needed, from contrasting looks, contrasting nationalities and contrasting personalities. As far as what would have happened, that can be debated forever. Everyone has their opinion and nobody knows. And that would have been part of its lure, because you would have people so strongly believing each guy would win.

But without the UFC brand, he very clearly, not in the U.S., nor in Japan, worth at the box office what he was earning. Kudos to his side to being able to get the money, but in the end, it left a trail of bankrupt companies that they danced from one to another of. Promoters, who fell to the MMA media lure that by getting Fedor they would somehow have the credibility of having the best heavyweight in the world, because for generations in boxing that meant everything, enabled his handlers to get their $1.5 million to $2 million per show. There is a place for a smart businessman with a name staying on the outside, maintaining a reputation by avoiding top contenders, and coming off as the marquee fighter for smaller groups looking for credibility. But to play that game, you have to remain No. 1, and there have to be a lot of promoters with dreams that they could supplant or at least be competitive with No. 1, using you as the big cog in the wheel for the fight. With the collapse of Japan, sale of Strikeforce and his losing streak, the time was up.

Had he gone to UFC, he’d have had his big money fights, but who is to say if he went in 2007 that he would have fared much better than Nogueira and Cro Cop. He may have been out of the picture before Lesnar and the real huge money arrived. He had gotten his big money on the outside from 2007 to 2009, and then signed for the Lesnar fight in 2010, and beat him, we’d be singing the praise of his handlers for outsmarting the system. Instead, Emelianenko’s true enduring legacy was as the best fighter of his time, and whose management, and himself, since at the end of the day, he had a hand in his decisions, outsmarted themselves by overplaying when the biggest payday of all was staring them in the face. But for M-1 to have made the deal, they’d have had to give up control of him. But at his age and with his fading reflexes and tougher talent pool combined with dying outside groups, they completely misread the landscape.

If you go back only two years ago, it’s almost amazing how little interest there was in Fedor’s last fight, and how little was talked of his retirement. Of course, fighter retirements historically last until the next promoter offers a big paycheck. At a reasonable price, Emelianenko has enough of an aura to be worth it to UFC given how many shows they are running. Whether he’s truly had enough, and whether his handlers are truly out of options, nothing is impossible. But the big one. That one got away. For everyone involved.



Regarding Brock Lesnar, even though everyone is skeptical of everything Dana White said regarding the meeting, from those who know the story not affiliated with White or WWE, they said White’s description was exactly what happened and it’s not a work leading to a surprise. Lesnar came in with some kind of idea and we don’t know what it is, but it was an idea that neither White nor Lorenzo Fertitta was going for. His game seems to be playing WWE and UFC against each other for maximum leverage. He does believe there is a loophole in his WWE contract (WWE does not believe that to be the case) where he could fight before WrestleMania. No doubt he’s looking ahead at doing something post-Mania, whether it be fighting or wrestling, and readily understands that the SummerSlam buy rate is going to be the key because it’s the last numbers he’s going to be judged on until Mania season, which is when WWE will first start looking at what to offer him, or if to offer him, for another year. The feeling is Mania is going to be huge next year between the live event in New York that’s expected to sell out immediately, and Rock, Lesnar and Undertaker all being back. There will be plenty of factors in place for Mania, but ultimately, SummerSlam, whether good, bad or indifferent will be based on whether HHH vs. Lesnar clicks or not.

Lesnar, if he was to fight again, and nothing is impossible and the bad meeting doesn’t close any doors, is said to be most interested in fighting Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira. That’s where the Nogueira stories from a few weeks back came from. I’m not sure why, but Lesnar’s always been intrigued by him, perhaps wanting to test if he can go to the ground and has learned enough to shut down a submission fighter of that caliber. From what we understand, Lesnar has no real interest in fighting Frank Mir a third time even though it may still be his biggest money fight possible at first. He’s also not hot on Roy Nelson as an opponent.
 

Heel

Member
Lesnar, if he was to fight again, and nothing is impossible and the bad meeting doesn’t close any doors, is said to be most interested in fighting Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira. That’s where the Nogueira stories from a few weeks back came from. I’m not sure why, but Lesnar’s always been intrigued by him, perhaps wanting to test if he can go to the ground and has learned enough to shut down a submission fighter of that caliber. From what we understand, Lesnar has no real interest in fighting Frank Mir a third time even though it may still be his biggest money fight possible at first. He’s also not hot on Roy Nelson as an opponent.

So Brock is a shell hunter like Schaub? There's no way Brock sees him as anything other than "that legend I can beat". I'd love to see Zombie Nog knock this myth's head off.
 

yacobod

Banned
So Brock is a shell hunter like Schaub? There's no way Brock sees him as anything other than "that legend I can beat". I'd love to see Zombie Nog knock this myth's head off.

why shouldn't 2 mma legends fight in the octagon friend?

or are you against exciting fights between ground technicians?

explain pls?
 

Heel

Member
why shouldn't 2 mma legends fight in the octagon friend?

or are you against exciting fights between ground technicians?

explain pls?

I'm not against the fight at all. Shell of Nog has a storied history of being a giant killer. The story line practically writes itself.

It's just very easy to question Brock's intentions here. dream presenting his story like Brock is a student of the game and intrigued stylistically by fighting a legendary ground technician is laughable. It's seen as an easy fight against a name, plain and simple. Hell I'd put even money on him even knowing how to pronounce Nogueira.
 

yacobod

Banned
friend, look at it as a humanitarian. neither fighter should be competing in the ultimate in 2012. mr. lesnar is missing a foot of his colon and recently overcame a life threatening illness, not to mention the fact that he doesn't care to get hit in the face. big nog has suffered enough brain trauma to render him a vegetable for the rest of his life.

one thing's for certain. if nog accepts the fight, he will stand to make the biggest payday of his career with that % share of the brock PPV gate. he'll be able to pay for his medical care for the rest of his life with that last ppv.

would you rather have nog fight matches against real contenders at HW like cain, jds, cormier, etc?
 

TheNatural

My Member!
I'm not against the fight at all. Shell of Nog has a storied history of being a giant killer. The story line practically writes itself.

It's just very easy to question Brock's intentions here. dream presenting his story like Brock is a student of the game and intrigued stylistically by fighting a legendary ground technician is laughable. It's seen as an easy fight against a name, plain and simple. Hell I'd put even money on him even knowing how to pronounce Nogueira.

Funny how many of these PRIDE "legends" became shells when they entered the UFC. Kind of reminds me when some team wins their conference in college basketball and gets in as a 16 seed only to be destroyed by real competition.

I forgot though, they were in their 30's and junk zomg past their prime doesn't count.

ibdsXM6AxhjR53.gif
 

yacobod

Banned
what's gonna happen to front runner natch when anderson gets bodied for 25 minutes next Saturday and is exposed for the can he always was.

man his resume looks flimsier each passing day, i can't even name one good win on spider's resume with revisionist history on my side.
 

Heel

Member
friend, look at it as a humanitarian. neither fighter should be competing in the ultimate in 2012. mr. lesnar is missing a foot of his colon and recently overcame a life threatening illness, not to mention the fact that he doesn't care to get hit in the face. big nog has suffered enough brain trauma to render him a vegetable for the rest of his life.

one thing's for certain. if nog accepts the fight, he will stand to make the biggest payday of his career with that % share of the brock PPV gate. he'll be able to pay for his medical care for the rest of his life with that last ppv.

would you rather have nog fight matches against real contenders at HW like cain, jds, cormier, etc?

I thought that "I'd love to see Zombie Nog knock this myth's head off." made it pretty clear that I like the match up. It just needs to be said that Brock calling out 2012's Nog is nothing more than shell hunting on the level of Brendan Fraud.

what's gonna happen to front runner natch when anderson gets bodied for 25 minutes next Saturday and is exposed for the can he always was.

man his resume looks flimsier each passing day, i can't even name one good win on spider's resume with revisionist history on my side.

Absolutely, friend.
 

TheNatural

My Member!
what's gonna happen to front runner natch when anderson gets bodied for 25 minutes next Saturday and is exposed for the can he always was.

man his resume looks flimsier each passing day, i can't even name one good win on spider's resume with revisionist history on my side.

How about an avatar bet yaco? Put it on the line, I got the GOAT next week.
 

yacobod

Banned
I thought that "I'd love to see Zombie Nog knock this myth's head off." made it pretty clear that I like the match up. It just needs to be said that Brock calling out 2012's Nog is nothing more than shell hunting on the level of Brendan Fraud.

i think it's a context thing. brock is a much bigger name than either big nog and schaub. he doesn't really have much to gain by fighting nog. i think it's pretty clear brock is a shell of ufc 100 brock as well. i don't have an issue with the fight, because both guys are past their prime HW legends. brock isn't using an old legend to try to build himself up. i think he just wants to make some money because he likes to compete, but doesn't want to compete against the best anymore, kind of like Fedor or Shogun.
 

TheNatural

My Member!
i have nothing to gain betting a fairweather, post UFC 100 fan like yourself. after anderson loses on saturday you are going to be trying to make GSP or JBJ bets with me.

Exactly. You guys run it but don't even put a simple picture up to bet. And calling me fairweather is hilarious.

I was watching all forms of combat arts long before you thought it was neato to listen to Jpop and stay up until 2AM to watch Japanese wrestlers you also never heard of, fight.

Prepare for your hero to be destroyed in a week.
 

yacobod

Banned
Silva isn't gonna lose, is he? That would be so weird.

he is friend. uncle dana couldn't protect anderson from real competition forever. when chael is giving anderson the beating of his life he's gonna wish he could be facing cote, leites, K1 maia, old vitor, leben, james irvin, or some other ultimate can that he's made his name off of.
 

Heel

Member
People need to come to terms with the fact that everyone loses in the end. When it's all said and done and it's time to analyze Anderson's career, we're going to wonder who he actually ever beat. The myth will be shattered, a shroud of lies will be lifted and a protected can will be exposed.

Maybe some of us are too entrenched in fanboyism to see the truth coming from a mile away.

Time and tide wait for no man. If it's not Chael it'll be someone else. Can you accept it?
 

TheNatural

My Member!
But the reality is, his biggest career wins were over Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira and Mirko Cro Cop between 2003 and 2005, neither of whom he finished, and neither of whom really fared all that well once they came to UFC. Nogueira was stylistically a perfect opponent for him to look good at, in the sense Nogueira’s boxing was good, but he didn’t possess Emelianenko’s power, and Emelianenko was a physically stronger guy who was good enough on the ground to avoid submissions. The Cro Cop win, which some would argue was the most important heavyweight fight of all-time, and at its time was considered the biggest fight by MMA purists in history, was his most impressive performance as he beat Cro Cop at the stand-up game by constantly pressuring him and showing no fear, rendering Cro Cop’s left high kick meaningless since he was constantly having to move backwards.

It’s highly unlikely even a prime Fedor would have been able to regularly beat the caliber of athletes at the top of the heavyweight division today.

Thank you essay.
 

Heel

Member
In the end the only parallel you won't be able to draw between Fedor and Anderson's careers is the consistency of excitement they brought to the table. There were many times Anderson was booed for being boring in his prime and even warned by the great Dan Mirgz for stalling. The man was even threatened to be cut from the roster.

For that reason, Fedor will be the greatest fighter of all time.

Yaco, friend, do you agree with this assessment?
 

Chamber

love on your sleeve
Funny how many of these PRIDE "legends" became shells when they entered the UFC. Kind of reminds me when some team wins their conference in college basketball and gets in as a 16 seed only to be destroyed by real competition.

I forgot though, they were in their 30's and junk zomg past their prime doesn't count.
Nobody mentions UFC fighters like Mark Coleman, Don Frye, Chuck Liddell, Ken Shamrock, and Carlos Newton getting their soul taken in Pride.
 

TheNatural

My Member!
In the end the only parallel you won't be able to draw between Fedor and Anderson's careers is the consistency of excitement they brought to the table. There were many times Anderson was booed for being boring in his prime and even warned by the great Dan Mirgz for stalling. The man was even threatened to be cut from the roster.

For that reason, Fedor will be the greatest fighter of all time.

Yaco, friend, do you agree with this assessment?

The difference is Fedor got passed by because the level of competition was horrible at that time and then came to the US and went 1-3. He wasn't old, he just got destroyed by better fighters he never faced. Obviously he went right back to can smashing in Russia, after those losses, proving my point. He wasn't any slower or less powerful than in PRIDE - he just couldn't do that shit to better fighters.

In other words, Anderson Silva is like Muhammad Ali and Fedor is along the lines of a Michael Moorer. You could even go as far to say Ali beat a prime Foreman that Moorer lost to, that KO'ed Moorer at about 50 - just like Silva choked out Hendo who destroyed Fedor at two weight classes higher.

That just proves that Silva is not only the GOAT, but would kill Fedor in a freeweight fight on his own. Nice try though.

And putting the boring tag on Silva to cheer on a Lay and Pray artist who has one finish in 14 UFC/WEC fights is rich.

Next week you're going to enjoy the crow and have to admit you're in nothing but the Super Fight League in MMA knowledge. Sonnen fans are basically the 'John Cena fanbase' of MMA. The intelligence of 8 year olds that fall prey to corny one liners and bright colors.

You all get extinguished July 7th. Permanently.
 

Chamber

love on your sleeve
Anyone who still thinks Fedor fights like he used to isn't paying attention. Dude became a sloppy brawler somewhere around 2008 and never turned back. Reminds me of the way Dan Henderson totally ignores half of his skillset.
 

TheNatural

My Member!
Natch got a closet full of 90s bulls, cowboys, and duke gear fucking frontrunner.

Signed, "omg Lesnar is going to kill Overeem."

Didn't see me losing any bets because I fell into a frontrunning WWE wrestler's hype.

Another big whiff for you July 7th yaco.

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