darkwing-buck
Member
I don't even think that's enough to beat them.
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NBA Finals 2017 |OT| Same As It Ever Was
- Thread starter Jarate
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I don't even think that's enough to beat them.
LeBron is not the issue. I honestly feel like he can score 50 and they would still lose by 10 if his teammates play like the past 2 games.
LegendofDragoonLives
Member
Kawhi was getting outplayed by Harden until he got injured, and then Harden played like the worst basketball player on the planet. Kawhi has not proved he's better than Curry other than outplaying him and KD for one half. And if we go by that, then we may as well crown the Rockets > Spurs due to their game 1 W.
Kawhi > Harden due to the most pathetic display by a superstar I've seen after Kawhi went down though. That's something I know Kawhi would never do, and Harden actually did.
You gotta feel for those poor 3 all stars, one of them being one of the GOAT breh, esp since they barely scraped to the final with that garbage 12-1 record
Stabby McSter
Member
what's with their bench this series
Nydius
Member
FTFY.
Even if James goes nuts and manages to put the entire team on his back, they'll probably still lose. Just not by 20+. Watching these last two games, it's really been like watching a bunch of old men trying to compete with a bunch of young rookies who are on a completely different level. I know the analogy fails because the age differences aren't that great but damn if the Cavs don't look like they're gassed by half - and that's with LeBron performing well.
I hope like hell they don't get swept but if they do I hope it ignites a discussion about the state of the league because right now we have one dominant team in each conference and everyone else is second tier ball. If the Cavs gets swept that means the singular dominant team in the East still isn't truly competitive with the Monstars of the West. I can honestly say that this year I have been more disinterested than not about the status of the league. As a Wizard fan it's been great to see the progression of Wall and Beal but knowing that they still weren't going to make it to the Finals, let alone have a snowball's chance in hell of competing against Golden State, made the entire season one gigantic "meh, why bother".
CassidyIzABeast
Member
Kyle Korver - old
D will - old
Channing Frye - old
Richard Jefferson - old
Shump - Not that good to begin with
JR Smith - having a terrible season
LyleLanley
Banned
Because young talented players are hard to get.
Cavs are in the same rut as the Heat where the team got old fast and they were trying to retool with Luol Deng and Josh McRoberts.
Cavs problem is that no one predicted in summer 2014 that the most talented roster ever assembled would be the 2017 Golden St. Warriors. No one did. It's actually a very different situation from the Heat.
MegaManTrigger
Banned
He does that and it's still not enough. It's his team that's simply not competitive enough. J.R. Smith has been playing like garbage (seems there are personal issues? Not too sure), Shumpert has no business being in an NBA Finals roster, Kyrie hasn't been himself, Love has been playing better. And on top of that, the team's defense is exposed for what they really are, which isn't surprising considering the struggles before the playoffs.
RBelong2Us
Member
Warriors had 12 more turnovers in the game and still ran through the Cavs.
Cavs defense is really bad and they have no competent bigs. It's far too easy for the Warriors to rack up points. Cavs needs to slow the game down and play a half court style for any chance to make this competitive but I think if they try that Warriors end up playing big more often and they have the advantage in that department with how well McGee and Zaza are playing .
Cavs defense is really bad and they have no competent bigs. It's far too easy for the Warriors to rack up points. Cavs needs to slow the game down and play a half court style for any chance to make this competitive but I think if they try that Warriors end up playing big more often and they have the advantage in that department with how well McGee and Zaza are playing .
beat
Member
Fair, but I'm not asking why they don't have a fourth star, just why they specifically got Deron Williams and company for the bench.
(Looks this up... Channing Frye was traded to the Cavs for a guy who was quickly waived and fell out of the league altogether? I take it back, maybe Griffin is doing all he can.)
Cracklox
Member
Yup I said the exact same at the half earlier. Cleveland needed to slow the game down. They were never going to be able to keep pace with the warriors going at 60 odd points a half, and they had done well to keep pace in the first. I was a bit distracted during the second half, but the final score reflected exactly that happening.
And the rim protection thing is a real issue. KD, took full advantage of that particularly last game. Love's not a shotblocker at all and TT, while lengthy and works hard inside, isn't really what you would want as your first preference for defending the basket. Not sure what the solution is. Get old man Frye some more minutes, and park him somewhere around the bucket on defense? Dunno.
DasPenguin
Member
Because they are bringing in the guys James wants. Proven veterans. It's interesting to see, because that is exactly why LeBron left the first time. They brought in Shaq and other veterans. Team got old and he switched to a younger, more competitive super team. Then they got old, and he... well you know the story. Just funny to see them make the same mistake twice. Championship teams often do that though and stick with the same players for too long.
It would've been interesting to see the Spurs vs GS series with everyone healthy for San Antonio. That might have been competitive at least. Cavs defense is so horrendous that they need a terrible shooting night and a ton of turnovers from GS to have a chance of winning. At home it might be a different story, maybe the home crowd gives them the boost they need.
LyleLanley
Banned
In general young guys aren't going to help you win a championship and LeBron doesn't want to waste years developing young talent. Deron sucks but he'll probably give you more than anything most attainable young guys will give you right now.
I think if you wanted to pin anything on LeBron (and I'm a warriors fan who thinks he's better than jordan), it's that in the middle of this year he was demanding a playmaker when the real issue was the Cavs defense. I mean, having another playmaker would have been nice but the Cavs should have traded their 1st round pick for a guy who can at least passably defend KD (PJ Tucker?) or a rim protector. Not Kyle Korver.
Of course Bogut got hurt, and that messed up the rim protector plans. But the Cavs never put in any resources into finding someone who could guard KD, and they had to know that they were most likely going to face the Warriors in these finals.
And yea I know it was Griffin made the Korver trade and LeBron was still unhappy, but wing defense and/or rim protection looks a hell of a lot more important than a playmaker right now.
Of course Bogut got hurt, and that messed up the rim protector plans. But the Cavs never put in any resources into finding someone who could guard KD, and they had to know that they were most likely going to face the Warriors in these finals.
And yea I know it was Griffin made the Korver trade and LeBron was still unhappy, but wing defense and/or rim protection looks a hell of a lot more important than a playmaker right now.
beat
Member
At the time I thought it was a bad trade just because it mortgaged the future, but they got a championship out of it and esp given the championship drought the city had had, it was worth it.
scoobs
Member
I don't see how the Cavs win a championship with Wiggins against last years Warriors team, and certainly not this years. Love was the right move to win now, I think this series is far from over... look what happened last year. Granted, they didn't have freaking Kevin Durant last year, but still you just can't count out LeBron.
macfoshizzle
Member
Did u guys see the obvious dirty play jr did to kd? Trying to take him out
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7CwccKUM1m0
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7CwccKUM1m0
Nydius
Member
And Draymond Green couldn't keep his hands or feet to himself.
And Steph Curry was inconsistent from game to game.
While I don't dispute the impact of adding KD, it's not like the Warriors lost in 5 games last year. If Steph Curry stays hot, Draymond Green keeps from kicking/slapping people in the junk, and Klay Thompson plays decently, they'd be formidable against Cleveland just as they were last year without KD. Maybe even more so because Cleveland isn't as strong as they were a year ago.
Not counting out LeBron but I don't see any scenario where he puts the team on his back and wins four games out of the next five.
GraveRobberX
Platinum Trophy: Learned to Shit While Upright Again.
Cracklox
Member
That wasn't so bad by JRs standards. Looked like he thought about about the Dray style kick to the nuts, but ended up trying to bust out a Zaza
I saw Zaza hold him yeah
crazy monkey
Banned
Did people forgot about last year finals? Give Cavs chance.
Yeah, I saw it. He even snapped his leg to further extend it to get below KD. Nothing more really needs to be said. Luckily KD didn't land on it.
While you are absolutely correct a few things are different this year. Namely KD, a healthy Steph, and Draymond not in jeopardy of getting suspended.
Really looks like it but when you focus on zaza and his hold of JR, it (his extended leg) could be because of that.
Indeed. We need to see how game 3 plays first.
However it does look grim for the Cavs. As good as last year GSW were, this team is even better.
Like how do you even beat this team? LeBron is playing really well but it's not even close to good enough.
johancruijff
Banned
So uh
we're gonna have half the league tanking for the foreseeable future
we're gonna have half the league tanking for the foreseeable future
Nate Duncan says he's noticed a trend, veteran players clench up in their first finals. I don't know if they get over it or what, David West has been bad as well. Or maybe they're washed. Lue doesn't trust Frye against the Warriors, he's said as much. Korver can be "solved" by disciplined enough defense, he got 3 fts on a foul tonight because Draymond had an awful game, but that's been the extent of it. If Lebron forces help and rifles a pass to him that's another matter, but I don't remember much of that happening. Deron Williams has looked good during the season, I remember people whining about how it wasn't fair the Mavs just let him go for nothing, but it hasn't materialized in the finals.
Mostly I would have a problem with JR and Thompson.
Miami drafted Norris Cole(and Napier later thinking it would appease Lebron), GSW took McCaw, I don't know if the Cavs traded their round 1 pick or what, but that's pretty much it. Win now and the league's rules structured the way they are make for a range of Ray Allen at the top to Greg Oden(or Larry Sanders may be more apt).
LBJ isn't entirely blameless, he sticks with guys like Birdman and James Jones, but what's the alternative? We don't know. The Cavs aren't the Spurs, we know that much..
Avon Barksdale
Member
This isn't last year's GSW. Even if you took off KD, healthy Steph is a difference maker.
It was a bone headed decision that will hunt the franchise way after Lebron decides to take his talent to the retirement home and JR traded to the glue factory. I would even argue they would have chipped last year if you replaced Love with Wiggins. Love is pure garbage outside the comfort of regular season.
Cracklox
Member
But LeBrons better, plays now, and only average 28ppg.
Arguably Tom Gugliotta was better then both, and averaged less then 10, so read into it, and my opinion, what you will though
Your Entertainer
Member
This is stupid, warriors are too stacked
I honestly don't even wanna watch
Even super Saiyan 3 Lebron won't be enough
I honestly don't even wanna watch
Even super Saiyan 3 Lebron won't be enough
darkwing-buck
Member
If KD and Curry sweep while keeping there level of play, I could see the league giving them both the Finals MVP award. Both of them are just too good to look over.
Cart before the horse, but Durant deserves it. He's on Lebron, Curry is on JR Smith.
They need to win 4 games out of the next 5 for that to happen. Good luck with that against KD and the dubs. Just reading some of the predictions before the first game of the series is absolutely hilarious. Without the extenuating circumstances last year, the GOAT JR still would be ringless.
darkwing-buck
Member
Nothing1016
Member
Then thing is lebron and KD can basically trade blows. If lebron drops 45 so will KD. The problem is Steph and that one role player that always steps up for GSW. No one on Cleveland looks like they can contribute in the same way as Steph plus one for an entire series.
Only half? You mustn't be afraid to dream a little bigger, darling. More like everyone outside the top two minus the Spurs and that lunatic Westbrook.
BassForever
Member
I doubt Harden would let his team tank either
Bam Bam Baklava
Member
Have there ever been two players who are so equally god awful at defending each other as Irving and Curry?
Just having Harden and pringles in the same organization is equivalent to tanking by default. They'll barely make the playoffs next year and will get their collective arses handed to them in the first round.
BassForever
Member
Thats not tanking though that's competeting to he mediocre until the gm does something to fix it
Prime Gary Payton guarding either of them would be interesting to see.
ViperVisor
Member
The 3-Point Line is being spammed vs the 90s is part of how the game is played differently and there are less tight games.
Bulls had some smackdowns in the Finals, won by 42 33 22 21.
Also had a total margin of 18 in wins vs the Suns
20 vs the Jazz in the 1st match-up
The playoffs sucked and blew. The hype machine revving up for a finals to undo some of the 'why bother' feeling.
Outlook No So Good
Bulls had some smackdowns in the Finals, won by 42 33 22 21.
Also had a total margin of 18 in wins vs the Suns
20 vs the Jazz in the 1st match-up
The playoffs sucked and blew. The hype machine revving up for a finals to undo some of the 'why bother' feeling.
Outlook No So Good
LegendofDragoonLives
Member
Keeping JR to 1.5ppg doe (yeah, this is a real statistic LMAO)
KD definitely leading the charge
lol, replace Love with an even worse defensive player whose a 1 trick pony. That won't end up in a disaster at all vs the high iq play of the Warriors.
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