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NBA Finals 2017 |OT| Same As It Ever Was
- Thread starter Jarate
- Start date
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No. Lakers did 16-1.
ryutaro's mama
Member
Cavs have talent but they seem very, very predictable. If LeBron isn't charging to the rim on a fast break it's one of these two things:
1. LeBron slowly dribbles at the top and waits for Love to take position in the corner, then he drives and kicks it out to Love for a 3.
2. Kyrie does some dribbling wankery on the perimeter and goes baseline for a reverse layup (which somehow falls like 80% of the time).
Is there more to their game? Am I just missing something?
1. LeBron slowly dribbles at the top and waits for Love to take position in the corner, then he drives and kicks it out to Love for a 3.
2. Kyrie does some dribbling wankery on the perimeter and goes baseline for a reverse layup (which somehow falls like 80% of the time).
Is there more to their game? Am I just missing something?
Vanillalite
Ask me about the GAF Notebook
Normally I'd agree, but the games haven't really been close, and the Warriors haven't even hit their A game yet.
Kyle Korver and Ian Clark had a mutual non-aggression pact going on at some point during the game.
PadWarrior
Member
I'll give Cleveland one game, at most. They've been outmatched in just about every way in these two games.
Jag
Member
That's the majority of what I've been seeing. Maybe Kyrie's drive percentage is a bit higher.
They also don't have any answer for the GS offense which is nearly cheat code level with Durant. I still think the Cavs are the second best team in the NBA, but GS is just too stacked.
LyleLanley
Banned
The "3-1" takes are going to be so incredibly stupid.
Can't fault LeBron tbh, KD is unguardable. It's just a matter of his shot falling in the game and how aggressive he decides to be. LeBron is similar but with not as good of a jumper.
In fact in a hypothetical world where rings aren't as highly valued and KD is injury free, he's probably tied with LeBron as the consensus best player in the league.
Curry hasn't been close to KD so far this series. Unless you only look at the box score I don't even see where Curry has an argument.
Yeah KD's defense probably makes him a lock even if Curry scores 40 a game for the rest of the series.
What is with people constantly having this need to call LeBron "THE BEST PLAYER IN THE WORLD" almost every time he makes a good play? It almost speaks to an insecurity within the fans and the media. Honestly, his game is somewhat comparable to Durant's (same position, similar freakish physicality) but he isn't nearly the scorer or defender Durant is at this point. He might be a slightly better passer but Durant has really upped that part of his game with the Warriors as well.
People look at stats, and they should, but they also have to realize the Warriors play a different game than anyone else in the league at this point. The % of time that Durant has the ball in his hands is very small compared to LeBron - this is offense 1.0 vs. offense 2.0. Offense 1.0 reaps huge stats and can be very effective but the ceiling isn't nearly as high as the distributed offense 2.0. On any given possession the Warriors have 3-4 different people that can bring the ball up, either half court or on the break, and start the offense. This also allows them to push up the court very quickly with any number of players that can make plays and good decisions. The pressure they put on defenses with their pace, speed and skill is just too much. Comparing stats with players on that team with those on a team running Offense 1.0 can be misleading. If you swapped Durant and LeBron the results would be similar but LeBrons stats wouldn't nearly be as high. Does that make him lesser and Durant greater? Of course not.
So, who is "THE BEST PLAYER IN THE WORLD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"? I'm not sure...depends on the context in which they are evaluated. A good argument could be made for LeBron, Durant, Curry and Leonard...but is this some critical distinction? Why do we have this insecure need to say "THIS IS THE BEST PLAYER IN THE WORLD!". It is getting sort of cringe-worthy at this point.
People look at stats, and they should, but they also have to realize the Warriors play a different game than anyone else in the league at this point. The % of time that Durant has the ball in his hands is very small compared to LeBron - this is offense 1.0 vs. offense 2.0. Offense 1.0 reaps huge stats and can be very effective but the ceiling isn't nearly as high as the distributed offense 2.0. On any given possession the Warriors have 3-4 different people that can bring the ball up, either half court or on the break, and start the offense. This also allows them to push up the court very quickly with any number of players that can make plays and good decisions. The pressure they put on defenses with their pace, speed and skill is just too much. Comparing stats with players on that team with those on a team running Offense 1.0 can be misleading. If you swapped Durant and LeBron the results would be similar but LeBrons stats wouldn't nearly be as high. Does that make him lesser and Durant greater? Of course not.
So, who is "THE BEST PLAYER IN THE WORLD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"? I'm not sure...depends on the context in which they are evaluated. A good argument could be made for LeBron, Durant, Curry and Leonard...but is this some critical distinction? Why do we have this insecure need to say "THIS IS THE BEST PLAYER IN THE WORLD!". It is getting sort of cringe-worthy at this point.
ryutaro's mama
Member
"Any man who calls himself King (or greatest player on the planet) is no King."
True Savior
Member
Cavs need a Zaza. Those Dahntay Jones fines were paid for a reason. He's about to be unleashed.
Kerr was jealous of Mike Brown and came back. Shameful.
Kerr was jealous of Mike Brown and came back. Shameful.
Its marketing.
The best team versus the best player.
Also its not really unusual. I heard the same shit about Kobe, Shaq, etc. when they were the best player in the game. When Rihanna is not there its the easiest thing to talk about for the announcers.
SwipeLeftHoney
Banned
A coach has nothing to do with it. Cavs tried to buy a championship. It worked in their favor last year but this year they're in way over their head. This sweep they're about to take will humble them.
SwipeLeftHoney
Banned
He wants to make sure he has a job next season.
Probably because KD plays with another MVP and GOAT Shooter type. He's been able to score forever and has only really finally added defense, passing and offball to his game. He is still being looked at in the lense of Golden State's system which allows for everyone to take great shots and be efficient.
I seriously doubt KD would be this good on the Cavs though. Minus the shooters, his team in OKC was as good as the Cavs are now and KD was no where near this level or Lebron's current level. There's a reason it took most of the season for him to get rid of his bad habits from OKC. He didnt know anything but iso ball in OKC, without a system to adapt to he would've likely been the same in CLE.
Sure this sounded cool in your head.
No?
I don't think anybody doubted he would flourish in GSW's system. He still hasn't made it to the Finals or won without them save 2012.
Vestal
Junior Member
No.
The narrative changes the second you win.
When LeBron went to Miami all the haters said no one would respect his championships there because he went to another player and another rivals team.
Literally 5 seconds after he won people started to debate whether he was the greatest of all time.
When Durant wins I predict the debate will be whether or not James is still the best player in the world and whether Durant as surpassed him based on his Finals performance.
Lebron's "narrative change" lasted all of 5 minutes as well as it then shifted to he "can't do it without Wade/Bosh". I doubt anybody seriously acknowledges this ring if GS wins and KD will likely be completely left out of the GOAT discussion. I mean to hear people talk about him now and its mostly just he's a HoFer.
I was wondering when you were going to fake news curry's stat line last night
Eh, that was a very small minority after the first ring.
I was a hater until literally game 6 against the Spurs. The Spurs were winning and the Heat were about to be eliminated. Before that moment the old LeBron would have become passive on offense and passed to some scrub in the corner, instead he started jacking up threes and trying to take over the game himself. Took some missed free throws, some lucky breaks and one of the greatest plays/shots I have ever seen but I feel like that was the moment he became the undisputed best player in the league. He then proved it in game 7.
I don't understand why this question still comes up....He has 3 other superstars you need to guard as well. If he gets FMVP, which he probably will and deservedly so, it does not change that fact. You cannot guard that. Someone has to be left open, also he is basically the 3rd best player in the game. Lol. So no, he is not riding the coat-tails per se, but the group, as a whole, allows this to happen.
I mean I was calling the shit out as the game went as well. At one point the dude was like 2-8 with like 14pts all on FTs. If the concept of watch the game because the box score can be misleading didn't dawn on you yesterday then it never will. You would probably think Irving has had a good series so far too don't you?
What? Its lasted up until last year. People still give the credit to Ray Allen for his 2nd despite Lebron going nuts.
No. I think it's a general but somewhat accurate assessment. They don't use the full extent of their roster effectively on a consistent basis. When the do, some great ball is played.
In fact, inconsistency is what I would say Cavs have the biggest problem with all around.
Their defense especially has always been a problem in recent years, and they're just not together enough to stop the GS juggernaut imo. They deserve to be where they are in the finals and I'll always love my home team for what they brought home last year, but this year's GS are damn good and on poin with KD.
Cornbread78
Member
No, it's still gonna always be a "bitch made" chip with him choosing GS.
There no out to that for him....
I was referring to the media narrative. Other then Skip Bayless (who is just a troll) who was doubting LeBron or saying these things in the media after ring number 1?
If you are going by message board and social media you are always going to have to deal with a certain level of crazy.
Only difference when Durant gets FMVP is that Lebron will be calling him daddy.
Lionel Richie
Member
I like Curry better than KD and him and Kawhi are probably tied. The battle for second place is tight but I legit still think Curry is the best player in the Warriors. When KD has it going, you have a great and really hard to beat team. When Curry has it going, you have showtime and you should just cramp up and forfeit the game.
Lol, and all of the teams that have played the Warriors really gave us a show aye?
If Curry and Klay played like they have without KD this would be a 1-1 series....
LyleLanley
Banned
I wonder what would happen to LeBrons legacy if he went to the Warriors and proceeded to win 5 more rings.
are you saying their stat lines are similar?
of course you watch the game I just find it funny the lengths you will go to downplay curry's success so far in the finals. dude had a double double game 1 and was almost approaching a triple double and actually got the triple double last night. like, curry's the smallest player on the court and he had 10 rebounds. not to mention his +/- was the same as kd's.
check it:
Carpe Dumdum
Banned
He's too much of a wuss to leave the safety of the Eastern Conference. Going to the west would take actual guts.
As long as after he wins those 5 rings he goes back to Cleveland, it doesn't matter.
Lionel Richie
Member
Utah is a better team than any team the Cavs faced. So is the Spurs probably even without Leonard.
LyleLanley
Banned
Jordan would've joined the Warriors.
friskykillface
Banned
Cavs needs MVP Jaylen
I'll do MVP Jaylen for Love 1:1
Or
Crowder, Smart, Zeller for Love
Take it or leave it
How the fuck is Steph getting all those rebounds and Thompson is a fucking zero on the boards?
I understand Thompson getting exposed on defense against a healthy Steph and KD, but I don't understand how he is not able to at least get at least 10 boards a game against the Warriors.
Seems like Warriors just want it more.
Reminds me of the Spurs rematch against the Heat. Curry and co. probably couldn't sleep for a whole damn year.
I understand Thompson getting exposed on defense against a healthy Steph and KD, but I don't understand how he is not able to at least get at least 10 boards a game against the Warriors.
Seems like Warriors just want it more.
Reminds me of the Spurs rematch against the Heat. Curry and co. probably couldn't sleep for a whole damn year.
he had two quick offensive rebounds in the 3rd quarter and I'm just like what the hell is going on
definitely feeling those spurs 2014 vibes so far
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