IMO it's aiming for a sort of epic "idealized reality", sort of like Destiny although nowhere near as extreme. In DCs case, through using aggressively-characterized fantasy tracks and the way the lighting can get rather punchy during funky phenomena (i.e. snazzy purple thunderstorms).
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Next-gen Racing Graphics Face-off | (Next-gen means current-gen)
- Thread starter Gestault
- Start date
Windom Earle
Member
All opinion of course, but to me that looks more stylised than real. It looks fantastic, but I'd say Forza's rain look is more aligned with reality, yet looks worse than DC.
I dunno. There are certain things which it handles very realistically, and you can capture short clips that look damned near like real life. But on an overall composition level, it's aiming slightly differently; like, if you took GT6's visuals and polished them up in accordance with that game's visual aims, I think you'd wind up with something that tends to look significantly more similar to reality than DC.
Overall that video just doesn't look like it's trying to look exactly like real life to me. (And IMO, even though the windshield rain effects are more complex than in other games, they're still way off from how rain actually looks on a windshield. Although that's a general tech issue, and more a matter of necessary consequences than visual aims.)
I think it's fair to say DC does have sort of a "hyper-realism" thing going for it's art. Depending on the time and atmospheric conditions it can look like one of those stylized wallpapers of real-life supercars.
vs.
It can also just look like regular real life at times depending on the lighting and atmosphere.
vs.
It can also just look like regular real life at times depending on the lighting and atmosphere.
1. You cant distinguish polygons at that gif's resolution.
2. Trees are indeed 2D (DC foliage also). But it doesnt make it look bad as long as you are not specifically looking for flaws.
3. Lighting is flat. The same as always...
Tell me where the sun is so it can cast shadows on the road or where is the road wet so it can reflex sun rays. It's almost like the graphic whores think the game must have one million color gradations in order to make it look real. NO.
It does not look terrible even if you tryhard like this.
Sure it can look game-ish. But you must look for it. In DC day-time, it looks game-ish without looking for it a lot of times.
Windom Earle
Member
lol, no reason to be upset.
The cars do not look very detailed to me, gif or not. You are crazy if you even compare this 2d wallpaper to the trees in DC. And yes, the lighting is mediocre compared to DC or GT. Always has been and they won't be able to fix it with this engine. It really needs a complete overhaul.
thelastword
Banned
There's aliasing/shimmering on the rails, I've also seen jaggies in some of the promo shots too (that's on the cars). More than anything, some of the assets in the environment looks bad, like the tire walls on the courses, some of the background shrubbery and trees look very low detail as well. I guess, these were the sacrifices done for 60fps solid and that's still commendable, just thought they had a little extra in the tank to one-up Forza 5 visually.
Also, why would using a controller change or impact the smoothness with which your car transitions from one side of the road to another, taking a corner, and just not looking twitchy maneuvering through a packed field? It looks like some below par physics/collisions work tbh. Obviously, we're talking how inputs transition to the screen.... and it looks bad from these gifs, they're not smooth at all.
Well precisely, the downsampling is suppose to improve the IQ, but since I'm still seeing lots of shimmering/aliasing in these gifs, it's just going to look worse at 1080p.
As you have mentioned the BRZ's roof, but I'm seeing jaggies on the outlines of the cars, between car exterior panels and grills. I think it's the jaggiest AAA racer out there. The jaggies in this are more visible than other AAA racers tbh.
The sim racer toning it down to keep it more casual, whilst the simcade racer is upping the ante for added realism….At least with the weather effects lol.
On a side note, both actually down it down compared to real life. Racing in heavy rain should be far more visually threatening and difficult than it is in either of these two games. They both dramatically reduce the amount of rain kickback and spray for example. Visibility and driving difficulty wise, things are a little bit better represented in PCars, though graphically DC takes the cake.
Tripolygon
Banned
WTF are people smoking in this thread, Driveclub is now a stylized game?
Driveclub can look stylized in some lighting just like how real life can look stylized in some lighting condition.
Driveclub can also look very bland, just like real life in some lighting condition.
When it comes to weather, lighting, graphics (and sound), there is no racing game that comes close. I hate that stupid but the rain drops are too big and oily argument that some like to bring into the conversation. This is usually the progression of these stupid arguments.
Title of thread "Next-gen Racing Graphics Face-off
A. Blank game looks Godlike
B. Na Driveclub is still king
A. But the physics of blank game
B. This is a graphics thread
A. Oh you wanna ignore other technical aspects of blank game
B. Na this is a graphics thread
A. But driveclub you cant see anything in heavy rain
B. Just like real life
A. But the rain is too big and oily
B. Yes it isnt perfect but it is the best we've ever had in a racing game
Que the overused screenshot of Driveclub to show its blandness
Let me quot myself from 12-31-2014, 12:47 PM in this very thread.
This is how far we have come in terms of weather simulations in games, no need to downplay it and nitpick just to make you feel better about another games. This is the standard every racer should aspire to.
Driveclub can look stylized in some lighting just like how real life can look stylized in some lighting condition.
Driveclub can also look very bland, just like real life in some lighting condition.
When it comes to weather, lighting, graphics (and sound), there is no racing game that comes close. I hate that stupid but the rain drops are too big and oily argument that some like to bring into the conversation. This is usually the progression of these stupid arguments.
Title of thread "Next-gen Racing Graphics Face-off
A. Blank game looks Godlike
B. Na Driveclub is still king
A. But the physics of blank game
B. This is a graphics thread
A. Oh you wanna ignore other technical aspects of blank game
B. Na this is a graphics thread
A. But driveclub you cant see anything in heavy rain
B. Just like real life
A. But the rain is too big and oily
B. Yes it isnt perfect but it is the best we've ever had in a racing game
Que the overused screenshot of Driveclub to show its blandness
Let me quot myself from 12-31-2014, 12:47 PM in this very thread.
This is how far we have come in terms of weather simulations in games, no need to downplay it and nitpick just to make you feel better about another games. This is the standard every racer should aspire to.
It's a graphics thread, so... yes.
It's a graphics thread, so... yes.
Edit: Oh, that was my quibble about the rain in DC looking "oily". Trust me, you'll find no bigger DC (or PGR, for that matter) fanboy, so when it's my only nitpick then that's it
Malcolm9
Member
Corridor arcades............cringe.
I really hate this term for a track racer/point to point racing game.
Jamesways
Member
pCARS is stylized and FM isn't? What the?
I'm not usually one to call out games for graphics as I think they all look great this gen, but I've never seen a screenshot of FM and said, "that looks like real life". The cars and lighting always seem just a bit off/video-gamey.
pCARS however, some shots do look closer to real life IMO.
I think it can look pretty great on Ps4.
But I have terrible opinions and like "bad" racing games like Race Pro and pCARS... so there's that.
I don't like the term but it's a necessity these days, especially when talking about current driving games usually defaults to either collect-a-thons or open world games. I hate that we have to make the distinction, but that term is usually the most succinct.
Windom Earle
Member
QFT. Some people don't go out enough to know how stylized the real world can look sometimes.
Psycho_Mantis
Banned
Yeah, if there's any racing game that can dethrone DC it will be GT7.
GT6 by Sunhilegend
Stillmatic
Member
There's bit of a misconception about DC graphics during day. I think this comes from people clinging to early bad screenshots. It looks every bit as great during the daytime.
All of these were taken with clear weather, no precipitation, and time set to 12:00pm. All are taken as I'm racing with no HUD, with no swinging cameras around for cool blur, just straight gameplay:
All of these were taken with clear weather, no precipitation, and time set to 12:00pm. All are taken as I'm racing with no HUD, with no swinging cameras around for cool blur, just straight gameplay:
Jamesways
Member
So stylized.
Man, DC looks great!
We're fickle folks when graphics in all these games look so good compared to last gen.
And now for something different!
Graphical detail, love it!
And the previous conversation about how difficult seeing the wet track can be reminded me of some of the shots I took on a wet track in this too. Looks great in motion, track sure gets some glare from the sun.
All MotoGP 15 by the way.
UpUpDownDown
Member
^Oooooo. Looks sexy^
Its called a fucking track lol.
Never have i heard the word corridor used in Motorsports. You honestly sound silly
Its called a fucking track lol.
Never have i heard the word corridor used in Motorsports. You honestly sound silly
Do you guys know that when I say overusage of precipitation that is for me alone, my experience, right? Do you really mean to tell me that I should be perfectly comfortable in racing in torrential rain? Can you yourselves drive at high speed in those conditions on tight roads with 8+ other cars and sharp corners?
The real issue in DC is that the AI doesn't have decreased visibility and they drive just like they do on dry pavement on a sunny day. Why is it that no one picked that part of my argument up but yet they've decided to focus on the subjective part?
The real issue in DC is that the AI doesn't have decreased visibility and they drive just like they do on dry pavement on a sunny day. Why is it that no one picked that part of my argument up but yet they've decided to focus on the subjective part?
Jamesways
Member
^Oooooo. Looks sexy^
Its called a fucking track lol.
Never have i heard the word corridor used in Motorsports. You honestly sound silly
Love MotoGP, finally looking like a next gen game this year.
That term "corridor" was coined from a DC thread comparing it to FH2 before release. It was so ridiculous it stuck.
Good times those threads were.
The problem with Driveclub's weather effects is not the way they are represented (they're top notch, actually). The problem is that in real life you have to slow down and drive way more carefully because of the lack of visibility, and if you do that in Driveclub you'll end up dead last, because the AI isn't affected by that.
D'ultimate
Member
One of the things I've noticed from the F6 demo is that the AI cars reacted to the wet track as well. The skidded out and ran off the track pretty much identical to how I did in one location due to the conditions in the rain in that corner.
I liked you from the first day I got in, and I still do.
Fascinating that so many people saw "overuseage of precipitation" and they immediately thought I was insulting the game's graphics. It was probably easier to think that than to think deeper about what I said, about the AI just plowing through that rain like it's not even there, and thus making the game that much more harder for me.
Thank you, though.
GoldenCrow
Member
Because this is a graphics thread. But the AI is impaired and they do drive significantly slower. Weather effects should be a layer of difficulty that change the gameplay and they clearly do in DC. You just have to look at the average AI times between the same track in wet and dry to see they are much slower. The problem you are having is user ability, many others have problems with it as well but it should be harder. I don't have much of a problem but like they should be my times are slower on wet conditions but the AI pose no problems in the events. Try looking at the road rather than the windscreen it might help.
DC has come the closest to representing wet conditions but is still significantly easier to drive in DC in the wet than in real life from a purely visual perspective as there are still many aspects that the game doesn't feature which significantly reduce viability that other have also mentioned prior.
Windom Earle
Member
I really don't remember having problems with the AI in wet or snowy conditions. I am pretty sure they do change behavior. But DC is not an easy game, so maybe git gud m8?
Also it is understandable people misunderstand you because you are being OT as usual. (Didn't you get banned recently for constantly talking about friends, etc. in DF threads?). Seems this is just your thing. Anyway, carry on.
Tripolygon
Banned
This is so stupid, you are very transparent and you've been since the beginning of this thread and many other threads you are in. You do know you can lower the intensity of the rain and snow as well as turn it off entirely if you don't want to. Evolution has said many times that the AI gets effected by all physics the player is effected by. But we have to be stupid because we don't understand your comment.
See the AI loses traction on the wet road and the player uses that opportunity to pass it.
http://youtu.be/xQp-CKCpPYw
GeordieMark
Member
I think its fair to temper the rain effects compared to real life due to the reduced field of vision that you have when playing a game. Most people's TVs aren't much bigger than 40" so you are seeing through a much smaller 'window'.
I do find driving in heavy rain at night in Driveclub to be almost impossible using the cockpit view, although it looks spectacular. Haven't had a go at Forza 6 yet to compare the two.
Graphical detail, love it!
Wow. That's good.
Mr. PlayStation
Member
Yes Yes Yes!!!
"Next-gen Racing Graphics Face-off | (Next-gen means current-gen)"
Jee-zus. Is that Milestone?
Mr. PlayStation
Member
That's the thing. Oh, the AI might be affected by the slippery asphalt and get a little slower. But the player is almost completely fuckin' blind. I could drive faster in a wet track if I could see it. Ah, but you can lower the AI level, one might say. But, honestly, is a matter of balance. The level of difficulty should remain somewhat the same under all situations (dry, wet, day and night).
Stillmatic
Member
But you're perfectly fine racing through massive puddles in a race. Can you yourself drive at high speed in the rain through big puddles covering a track with 23 other cars and long straights and sharp corners? No the race would be canceled. Some of this spin...
Yea, I do seem to have a habit of wanting to discuss adjacent elements to the main topics, physics/60fps for this thread, controller/friends for Digital Foundry threads. Perhaps because there are no threads other than OT's to discuss those particular specifics in, and OT's don't go up until the day before release.
Oh well, that's my cue, then.
Errr, how does that affect visibility? You can see the puddles, slow down, and try to avoid them in FM6. In fact, AI does this too, they try to avoid puddles. And when they fail to do so, it produces some hilarious .gifs.
D'ultimate
Member
Are these supposed to be proving that DC is great in the daytime? Cause I'm not seeing it. There's a very clear difference between your shots and the night time, weather shots in DC.
Jamesways
Member
Yeah, they've always done a great job on their bike and rider models and animations. The trackside details however, eh, not so good.
They finally put rain effects on the helmet cam this year too. Don't have a shot handy but it's nowhere close to as good as DC/pCARS/FM6.
I think we'll see more polish on Sebatian Loeb Rally next year.
Anyway, back to 4 wheeled games, great gif Noobcraft!
GeordieMark
Member
In my opinion DC looks pretty gorgeous at times in daylight, but is more consistently pretty at night. When the weather transitions from wet to dry it can look really impressive.
Oh, come on, it's not like most games look better under night and/or rain conditions.
The point here being that DC can also look great at noon under a clear sky.
Stillmatic
Member
Nah, my point was the game looks great at any time, obviously night/weather will look more impressive due to a lot of factors. But day time looks great also in DC.
It doesn't. You've clearly missed the point. You're down playing DC weather effects by comparing someones ability in real life to race in those conditions. I made a similarly ridiculous comparison of extreme weather in another game, that you seem completely fine with. You're cherry picking to fit your bias.
Those PCars pictures to me, look like they have an instagram filter. I just don't see it.pCARS is stylized and FM isn't? What the?
I'm not usually one to call out games for graphics as I think they all look great this gen, but I've never seen a screenshot of FM and said, "that looks like real life". The cars and lighting always seem just a bit off/video-gamey.
pCARS however, some shots do look closer to real life IMO.
I think it can look pretty great on Ps4.
But I have terrible opinions and like "bad" racing games like Race Pro and pCARS... so there's that.
What about this one? (Posted on /r/xboxone):
GravityInsanity
Member
D'ultimate
Member
I feel like I stepped in the Twilight zone or something.
All kinds of post about DC being on some next level graphically but when I clicked on those stills, in comparison to FH2, Project Cars, FM6, GT6 and some shots I've seen of FM5 they look like ass.
Yes, weather shots on DC are God-Tiered and the gifs are mind blowing at times, but otherwise I'm not seeing it. Definitely not how some of you carry on like it just can't be touched. I think PC gives it a run for it's money in the weather shots too.
All kinds of post about DC being on some next level graphically but when I clicked on those stills, in comparison to FH2, Project Cars, FM6, GT6 and some shots I've seen of FM5 they look like ass.
Yes, weather shots on DC are God-Tiered and the gifs are mind blowing at times, but otherwise I'm not seeing it. Definitely not how some of you carry on like it just can't be touched. I think PC gives it a run for it's money in the weather shots too.
Any of the "aliasing/shimmering" that you are seeing in those gifs is more likely due to bad compression than actual aliasing. There are obviously plenty of jaggies in forza 6, but trying to judge anything about that type of artifacting from super downsampled gifs is incredibly stupid.
As for the twitchiness of motion, that is something that is inherent in any racing game that is played using a controller. Here are a few examples:
Driveclub
Project Cars
GT6
It makes sense that they look twitchy, as people tend to do short, intermittent inputs on a pad rather than smooth continuous motions that you see with a wheel. Also, I would have posted a similar video of forza but I feel like the gifs in reference are good enough.
To be clear, driveclub is definitely better looking than forza 6 in many ways. I just hate it when people who want to support this fact exaggerate any sort of defect in another racing game especially when that "defect" is visible in other games (including driveclub).
Please, let's not pretend that you meant "overusage of effects" as anything other than a jab against Driveclub. One of Driveclub's main strengths is that it has a best-in-class dynamic weather engine. You saw a chance to list that engine as a negative, and hey, you got the reaction from this forum that you probably wanted.
I'm going to leave this thread given that I can't stay on the graphics-only topic, so I will PM you.
Etta's become a chore most threads lately. There's plenty of times I've seen said said user bashing PS topics but will be front and centre in an Xb thread talking it up. Look at this thread - ruined. Sorry etta.
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