potatohead
Member
This game deserves a neo update.... But do us peasants deserve it?
I'll still be playing this on my neo though regardless. One of the few games I made sure to bring with me on a move lol.
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Next-gen Racing Graphics Face-off | (Next-gen means current-gen)
- Thread starter Gestault
- Start date
I'll still be playing this on my neo though regardless. One of the few games I made sure to bring with me on a move lol.
DirgeExtinction
Member
Of course a racing game that comes out...what? 2 years after DC should look better in at least a few areas, if not more. If it didn't, then something would've been wrong with Playground. Overall, I think FH3 looks great. DC was Evo's first PS4 game, and what they achieved was amazing as was Playground's first XB1 game(FH2). FH3 shows what more mature tools and more experience can help accomplish. Unfortunately, Evo won't be able to do that with a DC sequel.
Though, I have to say, DC's lighting looks leagues above most,if not all, racing games at the moment. It just looks more natural(and yes, of course it causes scenes to look bland at times. That's how real life lighting works as well. Not everything will look vibrant).
Though, I have to say, DC's lighting looks leagues above most,if not all, racing games at the moment. It just looks more natural(and yes, of course it causes scenes to look bland at times. That's how real life lighting works as well. Not everything will look vibrant).
Jamesways
Member
Seriously. DC is better! No, FH3 is better! No, DC is the best! No, FH3 is the best!
Stop liking what I don't like!
So anyway, both those games look great. And on another note, AC still looks good to me.
Like the gloves? Yeah, they're new. Got me a sweet deal with Sparco, life is looking up.
Alright, a somewhat bland pic...
And behold the glory that is WRC 6!
They added a new helicopter replay cam, neat!
The graphics actually are a nice step up from 5.
Clean car
Middle of the stage/getting banged up car
Edit- Holy Shit dumb! I forgot about those pics. WOW!
And a DC shot pre-photomode patch from way back when just 'cause.
TBiddy
Member
Yes, clearly people who think FH3 is prettier are deluded. This thread is filled to the brim with people comparing cherry-picked small GIFs with full-size PNG gameplay screenshots. But I'm not sure why I'm surprised about that...
I doubt there's any single person in this game who's able to make an unbiased comparison, and thus it turns into a shitfest of "look at this GIF! DC is clearly better looking!" or "look at this screenshot from FH3! Much better than DC".
John Wick
Member
It just goes to show how good DC was graphically that it's being compared to a game that was the second iteration of Forza Horizon on current gen. You can see the very noticeable difference between FH2 and FH3. It's better in every graphical department. Yet DC is better in a lot of respects. Imagine what a DC 2 would be like graphically? If Playground can do that with their second effort surely Evolution could do a similar job on DC2. I hope Sony allow a Pro patch at least.
TBiddy
Member
DC is also running on at platform 40% more powerful, plus it's linear. That makes a whole lot of difference.
I'd argue the other way around - it's a credit to Playground Games, that they managed to make FH3 compete (sometimes looking slightly better, other times slightly worse) with DC in terms of graphics, when you take the above into consideration. Evolution might've been able to take it a step further, given the chance, but we probably won't know.
I'd completely agree that PlayGround are top-tier with Horizon 3. It's very impressive for an open-world game.
I was thinking about this earlier anyway but reading your post made me...post. That one word I highlighted is key. We know open-world is generally more demanding than static-scene circuit racers. We know Horizon is a big open-world game, however, we also know that Evolution Studios renders a much larger area around the circuit in DriveClub. Here's a quote I found
http://www.techradar.com/news/gamin...ally-be-the-next-gen-we-were-promised-1251681
With that technology...is it not possible Sony could make an open-world title using the DriveClub engine?
DriveClub is linear by design but with that amount of environmental processing and an amazing effects pipeline already available, surely with the streaming technologies available now an open-world game could be possible, like a Top Gear Challenge game or something? A game that deals with roads exclusively, everything from single way country lanes of the UK to the mega highways of the US. I can just imagine the sights using that engine! Let's not forget some of the little road-side touches they used like the water spraying the fields etc...
So yeah, creative pipe-dream but, technically, could it be done?
1.21Gigawatts
Banned
Unkarted has the lushest environments to race through: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSq5svmxOzo
I hope its ok to post driving parts of non-racing games, since we also posted some GTA V in this thread.
TBiddy
Member
I won't pretend to know much about the technology driving these engines, but even though they are rendering it, it doesn't mean that it's 'up to snuff', so to say. But yes, an open-world game with the engine is absolutely possible. The question is whether or not, they'd be able to maintain the same amount of fidelity
John Wick
Member
I don't get why people bring this linear argument to the table? FH3 doesn't store the whole map in memory. It's streaming assets. No different as it can only store what's available in Ram.
Evolution might have took it a step further? Why is PlayStation optimisation and improvement standing still?
Of course not but it's a question of resources.
An open world game has to make compromises on what to put into the game as it has way more components than a linear game which puts different emphasis on how you spend your development time.
I don't get why people can't understand this.
dr guildo
Member
Totally agreed !
Of course...like any game objects out of sight will never be up to snuff and those that are, in the distance, are simplified. I mean much of the world is 'culled' until required within the scope of the software. That's where streaming comes in to play. I can't think of an open-world racing game that really needs 260km viewable distance either. I mean The Crew's open world is massive but it's not scaled to 260km's.I won't pretend to know much about the technology driving these engines, but even though they are rendering it, it doesn't mean that it's 'up to snuff', so to say. But yes, an open-world game with the engine is absolutely possible. The question is whether or not, they'd be able to maintain the same amount of fidelity
The point is people say linear but, because it's actually rendered, what we see indicates DriveClub could be open-world...just not off-road. I'd be fine with that. It's a testament to the technology and it's more impressive than we may like to think. Maybe it's more comparable than people think too?
TheAdmiester
Member
This one looks really, really good. I also noticed that from the button prompts this is clearly the PS4 version so it isn't even the best version, crazy.
What's the car selection like? I might have to actually try this one.
nycgamer4ever
Member
Just imagining DC with better shadows in 60 fps upscaled to 4k with hdr. Damn.
nycgamer4ever
Member
I play the game on my 4k tv and it's no where near a "jagged blurry textured mess" or "down right atrocious". Maybe you should by a better tv. The upscaler must not be that good, or turn the upscaler off since the game is not 4k anyway.
So because it doesn't store the whole world in RAM, it's not really open world??
A new low in rationalization.
Can we go lower?!?
Jamesways
Member
They really stepped up the graphics this year. There's big performance issues on ps4 though, lots of tearing and the usual unlocked frame rate with dips.
As far as cars, in the WRC Class you have
-Volkswagen Polo R
-Hyundai i20
-Ford Fiesta RS
-Citroen DS3
-Mini John Cooper Works
-Toyota Yaris Test Car
And in WRC 2 you also get
-Skoda Fabia R5
-Peugeot 208 T16 R5
-Mitsubishi Evo X
There might be one or two I'm missing in WRC2 and Junior WRC. At work and nit in front of the game.
I'll post more pics the next few days.
Sorry to interrupt the same old cycle of arguments of open world vs corridor racer / FH-DC slug fest.
Remember, be respectful of others (even if the opinion is shitty).
To quote the hangman in Blazing Saddles, "Everyone is equal in my eye!"
TheAdmiester
Member
They really stepped up the graphics this year. There's big performance issues on ps4 though, lots of tearing and the usual unlocked frame rate with dips.
As far as cars, in the WRC Class you have
-Volkswagen Polo R
-Hyundai i20
-Ford Fiesta RS
-Citroen DS3
-Mini John Cooper Works
-Toyota Yaris Test Car
And in WRC 2 you also get
-Skoda Fabia R5
-Peugeot 208 T16 R5
-Mitsubishi Evo X
There might be one or two I'm missing in WRC2 and Junior WRC. At work and nit in front of the game.
I'll post more pics the next few days.
Sorry to interrupt the same old cycle of arguments of open world vs corridor racer / FH-DC slug fest.
Remember, be respectful of others (even if the opinion is shitty).
To quote the hangman in Blazing Saddles, "Everyone is equal in my eye!"
Thanks. Hmm, seems like the car list is really thin for a racing game. Maybe I'm just too demanding but this has been the main turnoff of past WRC games for me too.
nycgamer4ever
Member
So because it doesn't store the whole world in RAM, it's not really open world??
A new low in rationalization.
Can we go lower?!?
I don't think that is what they mean. Just because a game is open world does not mean the tech behind it is completely different to a none open world game. It's a design choice. In the end both open world games and non-open world games still require rendering pipelines and stream information when needed. It's what I got out of it anyway.
Jamesways
Member
Well it's the licensed game for the current year.
No classics or anything yet. I imagine in the future they could follow Milestone and add a legends mode.
Dirt Rally gives you variety in cars but this gives you some decent variety in the 14 calendar stages. China is the new location this year.
Your TV doesn't fix blurry dash textures and stair-stepped water. LOL
Not picking up on it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Your post makes no sense. Did your TV come with an HD texture pack and new water simulation?
DC has some good moments though. A lot of times the shots come down to who is taking them...
...see post #8558 for some great shots.
Edit**
On topic screenshot wise....that IQ!!!
That moment when gameplay IQ darn near matches photomode.
Sometimes I have this weird black bar glitch going back and forth from 4k and 1080p...it's weird...you can see it here. I think it may be due to a switch from 3,840 x 2160 (also "4k") vs 4,096 x 2160 (TV's actual res that I can also run the games at) though? Not sure.
Jamesways
Member
Ha! That's pretty good Shandy.
I just swapped out our tvs. The 1080p Sony came with the Prestige pack for Assetto Corsa. Turned it on and there it was.
thelastword
Banned
I think a lot of the people comparing DC to FH3 really don't know the technology behind DC. The worse comment by far is that FH3 "is open world". Open world does not mean draw distance is better, it certainly does not mean that and LOD is better, as in the case of FH3 where it's clearly not. It only means you can drive anywhere within the confines of the entire map. An open world game does not win a graphics debate because it's open.
I'm pretty sure a dev can create an open world racer with great draw distance and level of detail that resolves well way into the distance, but FH3 has not done that, yet nobody is blaming the devs, they are working through the limitations of the hardware. So DC may have linear tracks, but it's draw distance is massive on any track/location...more so than in FH3, that says a lot. As a linear racer they could have skimped on a lot of details, they didn't need such a massive draw distance, but they went there anyway.
The biggest takeaway is the amount and also quality of detail you see way into the horizon or the amount of detail that exists way above the immediate driving atmosphere in the clouds etc... This is certainly not a linear game skimping on details in the traditional sense. Before you approach bridges in DC, you see them from far away on approach, they're all massively detailed, the water bodies below them or elsewhere move and look real and don't appear like flat textures on approach. Couple that with cars on these tracks locations that never skimp on detail, high poly high detail cars, perhaps some of the most impressive cockpits we've seen in a racer with a detailed enough driver, wipers that animate superbly. Then we have the excellent lighting that impacts all these high end assets and details, when the sun hits the glass approaching a corner in India, it's almost blinding. Hell, you see dry streaks on your windshield in dry weather when the sun hits the glass. Cars stay wet and actually look wet when they go through torrential periods, brake calipers hot up and are visible during certain race cams.
As a linear racer they could have skimped on a lot of details, they didn't, they could have skimped on draw distance, they didn't, they could have made water bodies that are much further away from the player look flat on approach like FH3 does just a few feet away but they didn't, they could have made mountains 2D bitmaps, flat or untextured but they didn't. They could have baked their lighting to save performance or suit a linear track profile, they didn't. They could have skimped on their cloud render and skyboxes with a cheaper alternative, they didn't. That's the point really, so many areas that people would not immediately notice they could have skimped detail, but chose not to.
The point is, in any scene in DC, with it's huge draw distance, a high level of detail in the environs/track/location, better looking and more detailed cars, better lighting, better effects (debris, weather-rain, lightning, precipitation changes, dry weather-dust pickup etc.) POM, quality of foliage..DC is always doing much more than FH3 per scene. So if one says they prefer how FH3 looks, that's fine, they may prefer the sunnier locales but technically it's not even close and visually there's no doubt which racer looks more authentic and more visually stunning. That's why when you do a video comparison with all racers, it's not even a contest, some racers look comical in contrast and this is where all the high detail, great lighting and volumetrics of DC comes together.
One thing is sure, I've zoomed in on many details in DC and it's amazing how much they didn't skimp on. I've zoomed in on trees, water sources, rocks, cars, mountains, they're all pretty kosher. I'm sure there are some shitty compressed Jpegs of DC out there showing stuff no one else have noticed during extended play, but all the pics I've shown of FH3, even the video of the hummer were pretty good quality. The pics were PNG at least. There's no need to be disingenuous about it.
I'm pretty sure a dev can create an open world racer with great draw distance and level of detail that resolves well way into the distance, but FH3 has not done that, yet nobody is blaming the devs, they are working through the limitations of the hardware. So DC may have linear tracks, but it's draw distance is massive on any track/location...more so than in FH3, that says a lot. As a linear racer they could have skimped on a lot of details, they didn't need such a massive draw distance, but they went there anyway.
The biggest takeaway is the amount and also quality of detail you see way into the horizon or the amount of detail that exists way above the immediate driving atmosphere in the clouds etc... This is certainly not a linear game skimping on details in the traditional sense. Before you approach bridges in DC, you see them from far away on approach, they're all massively detailed, the water bodies below them or elsewhere move and look real and don't appear like flat textures on approach. Couple that with cars on these tracks locations that never skimp on detail, high poly high detail cars, perhaps some of the most impressive cockpits we've seen in a racer with a detailed enough driver, wipers that animate superbly. Then we have the excellent lighting that impacts all these high end assets and details, when the sun hits the glass approaching a corner in India, it's almost blinding. Hell, you see dry streaks on your windshield in dry weather when the sun hits the glass. Cars stay wet and actually look wet when they go through torrential periods, brake calipers hot up and are visible during certain race cams.
As a linear racer they could have skimped on a lot of details, they didn't, they could have skimped on draw distance, they didn't, they could have made water bodies that are much further away from the player look flat on approach like FH3 does just a few feet away but they didn't, they could have made mountains 2D bitmaps, flat or untextured but they didn't. They could have baked their lighting to save performance or suit a linear track profile, they didn't. They could have skimped on their cloud render and skyboxes with a cheaper alternative, they didn't. That's the point really, so many areas that people would not immediately notice they could have skimped detail, but chose not to.
The point is, in any scene in DC, with it's huge draw distance, a high level of detail in the environs/track/location, better looking and more detailed cars, better lighting, better effects (debris, weather-rain, lightning, precipitation changes, dry weather-dust pickup etc.) POM, quality of foliage..DC is always doing much more than FH3 per scene. So if one says they prefer how FH3 looks, that's fine, they may prefer the sunnier locales but technically it's not even close and visually there's no doubt which racer looks more authentic and more visually stunning. That's why when you do a video comparison with all racers, it's not even a contest, some racers look comical in contrast and this is where all the high detail, great lighting and volumetrics of DC comes together.
One thing is sure, I've zoomed in on many details in DC and it's amazing how much they didn't skimp on. I've zoomed in on trees, water sources, rocks, cars, mountains, they're all pretty kosher. I'm sure there are some shitty compressed Jpegs of DC out there showing stuff no one else have noticed during extended play, but all the pics I've shown of FH3, even the video of the hummer were pretty good quality. The pics were PNG at least. There's no need to be disingenuous about it.
You've got to be kidding me.
Here's some food for thought, the art direction is the way it is because the developer chose it, built a game with it in mind, and intended the players to play it that way. The more colorful and vivid is not an inferior "setting", and only the more intelligent, superior class can choose not to use it, what a terrible analogy.
Is Uncharted 4's art direction inferior because it's more vivid and colorful?
Pfffft.
TheAdmiester
Member
This is getting hilarious now. The only way you can justify it is that people who want to compare just don't understand, and I'm sure you're implying their opinions don't count too, right?
Bro we're stupid mkay. We don't get how the tech works, we don't get how THX movie preset is better, we don't get how open world is not stored all in RAM so it's not really open world, we just stupid.
This fucking thread. It's become a mockery.
Lys Skygge
Member
Yeah people need to realize that art style is subjective. Most of the time I prefer a stylized look over a realistic look, but that doesn't make one objectivity better looking than the other.
Inf3cted_b3ast
Member
You act as though only one side of the argument is guilty of this.
Whilst the general back-and-forth shit is basically equal on both sides, I would actually argue only one side is claiming that the other's preferences stem from a lack of knowledge/understanding.
TheAdmiester
Member
Like only one side is guilty of the "you just don't understand" stuff?
I act that way because it's true.
Inf3cted_b3ast
Member
I wasn't talking just about that specific example. In general, both sides make pretty outlandish statements.
thelastword
Banned
GT6 looks so much better than this though, with a much higher and stable framerate. I like that they got rid of tearing with the latest patch, but they didn't exactly improve framerate with it. For a game which looks like it does, you would expect better in the framerate department at least.
Like the gloves? Yeah, they're new. Got me a sweet deal with Sparco, life is looking up.
Alright, a somewhat bland pic...
Jamesways said:And behold the glory that is WRC 6!
They added a new helicopter replay cam, neat!
The graphics actually are a nice step up from 5.
Clean car
Middle of the stage/getting banged up car
Wrc 6 looks ok, but it's a far cry from how impressive and ahead of the curve WRC games used to be a few gens back. They were really the best looking offroad racers back then. Technically/visually, I think Dirt Rally looks better, better draw distance, lighting, reflections etc...
TheAdmiester
Member
Random fence in the suburbs outside of downtown. I'm pleased with how consistent the detail is. I'm pretty sure this was from drone mode.
Edit: I can't tell if thelastword is joking at this point. I'm not being sarcastic. Before, I thought he was just a big fan of DC, and wanted more recognition of the stuff it does right. The last few comments/essays now are just...out there.
Thelastword, do you think getting some screengrabs to share from the games you like might be cool? The shots you've been using and been other people's (and older stuff, and some just from stage presentations). I feel like you'll come up with good stuff.
Edit: I can't tell if thelastword is joking at this point. I'm not being sarcastic. Before, I thought he was just a big fan of DC, and wanted more recognition of the stuff it does right. The last few comments/essays now are just...out there.
Thelastword, do you think getting some screengrabs to share from the games you like might be cool? The shots you've been using and been other people's (and older stuff, and some just from stage presentations). I feel like you'll come up with good stuff.
VeryNicePerson
Member
DirgeExtinction
Member
Even DC downsampled from 4K* would look amazing. That and better shadows.
RichiRamjag
Member
No need get crazy now. It's two groups arguing subjective opinion as fact. What did you expect?
Jamesways
Member
Well then we're in for a treat in this thread when GTSport comes out in two years.
And yeah Dirt Rally does look better (and performs better) in several aspects. WRC6 looks a hell of a lot better than 5 though.
I never claimed these were the best looking games, just wanted to post some actual pics of new games other than FH and DC rather than writing long dissertations on why the games that people like are exiguous.
This shit show of a thread needs more pics of racing game graphics of all kinds and less verbs.
No kidding.
This thread is lol-worthy.
Everyone knows PCARS on XBONE is the greatest racer of all time.
Any other assertion renders your argument invalid.
Jamesways
Member
Change it to ps4 and we have a deal!
...except don't talk about the road car handling.
Lol
Inf3cted_b3ast
Member
Yeah it's true that the other side haven't made any outlandish claims right s/
psn
Member
Well rendering realistic lighting is much more demanding than baked lighting. Feel free to like what you want, but its technically still inferior. Just as an example.
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