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No More Heroes 2: Desperate Struggle |OT| of Ultimate Vengeance (loli too)
- Thread starter hellclerk
- Start date
RelentlessRolento
Member
I know I'm most likely suda 51 fanboy material, but this game makes me glad video games exist.
also, I'm getting a very 'Paris, Texas' feel to the in between moments... its weird I say that cuz I always thought NMH1 had that same color tone.
also, I'm getting a very 'Paris, Texas' feel to the in between moments... its weird I say that cuz I always thought NMH1 had that same color tone.
Seraphis Cain
bad gameplay lol
EatChildren said:
The gym does get hard near the end, and with it also getting more expensive it can be a pain in the ass if you fail, since you burn through money quickly that way. The jobs...I guess it's a matter of opinion but I didn't find any of them to be all that fun. Almost all of them have some sort of ridiculous design flaw that hampers their enjoyment. And the revenge missions aren't completely identical to assassination missions, in that you don't get paid for them. Which was what made the assassination missions worth doing in the first place. The revenge missions have virtually no point at all, aside from unlocking
the option to not wear a jacket
If it weren't already obvious, I'm in the same camp as yankeeforever2. I FAR prefer the first NMH to NMH2. Not that NMH2 isn't a good game, though. Hell, if it weren't a good game I wouldn't have bothered beating it twice. :lol
Up to Rank 8, the game is very good, but I, like some others, miss the deliberate pacing of the first game. Desperate Struggle is consistent in quality, but the highs aren't quite as high, and scenes and bosses don't seem quite as memorable.
I really really love the 2D games, bug and burger games are so fun.
I really really love the 2D games, bug and burger games are so fun.
Need help.
why the fuck won't Batt Jr die? I just run under him waiting for him to get zapped and wail on him, but for some reason he doesn't seem to take damage anymore. I've got him to about under half health but his bar won't go down any further. am I missing something or does he just have a shitload of health for no reason?
silverbullet1080
Banned
Fuck me, this happened to me too before I had to jet to class and shut the game off.Jenga said:
RelentlessRolento
Member
I'm honestly glad they decided to use the whole NMH Darkside music album for this game. works so good.
Crash Station
Member
So anyone ever find out the name of the overworld theme?
Seraphis Cain
bad gameplay lol
So I figure that since I seem to have a lot to say about No More Heroes 2, I'll go ahead and just get it all out of the way in one long post. There's a lot of things in NMH2 that I felt were inferior to the first game, so I'm going to break this post into sections. So be warned, wall o'text incoming.
The Overworld (or lack thereof)
Way back when NMH2 had only been announced for a few months, we heard from Suda that one of the main things they were working on was improving the overworld, since the first game's overworld had been one of the things the gaming press had been really critical about. Then the game comes out, and what do we get? Not an improved overworld, but...a menu. I can understand this decision to a point, since many didn't like the fairly barren Santa Destroy in the first game. But for me, that was a big part of the charm in NMH. I spent a lot of time searching for Lovikov balls, checking dumpsters for new clothes, poking the ground with my beam katana looking for money and collectables, and stuff like that. And I enjoyed every second of it. So having a menu instead of an overworld feels like a loss for me.
The Assassins
The assassins in NMH2 lack a lot of the characterization that the assassins in NMH had.
This time around, it's clear that the game TRIES to make you feel for some of the assassins, but with so little backstory or development to them, it's hard. Like, are we supposed to feel sad that
Or feel bad about killing
? There's so little emotion attached to the majority of these fights that you just don't feel as "drawn in" as the first time around. And, it may just be me, but the assassins don't even seem to be as much fun this time around. I can use the same tactics I use on the tougher thugs to beat the majority of the bosses. It seems like the bosses in NMH2 have far less varied movesets than their NMH counterparts. Don't get me wrong, they're still fun to fight, and of course are the highlight of the game, but the majority of them just don't feel as much fun as the assassins in the first game.
The Side-Jobs
Another thing that got a lot of criticism in the first game were the side-jobs. They weren't very much fun at all. So GHM decided to replace them with 8-bit minigames this time around. I've seen a lot of people say they enjoy them, but I just don't share that sentiment. I don't find the majority of them to be much fun at all, and the ones that ARE fun the first time around quickly lose their charm once you've done them over and over and over. Not to mention that a lot of them have weird design flaws that hamper their enjoyment greatly. Like the pizza delivery game. If you crash, you explode then respawn a few seconds later. However, if something crashes into your explosion, you explode AGAIN, thus making it take even LONGER before you're back on your bike. Or in the bug catching minigame. Where a bug can get caught in the corner of a wall, forcing you to re-position yourself to be able to grab it.
Revenge Missions
The Revenge Missions in NMH2 are kind of confounding to me. They seem to serve no purpose whatsoever except as a cheap way to replace the Assassination side-jobs from the first game. However, GHM forgot to include the one reason people played the Assassination Missions to begin with: you got PAID for them. You want to know why I never had a big problem with the side-jobs in the first game? It's because due to the inclusion of the Assassination Missions, you never had to do any of the side-jobs more than once. While the side-jobs were boring, the Assassination Missions were fun, for the most part, and a great way to earn money and blow off some steam by slicing up some enemies at the same time. The Revenge Missions, however, just serve no purpose at all.
The Story (WARNING: Massive spoilers within, don't highlight anything in this section unless you're already done with the game)
While the story in NMH2 is good for the most part, there's several things that don't make a lot of sense. And not in the good, "Suda's weird method of storytelling" way. I have two main issues to address here. The last boss, and the ending. First, the last boss.
The Playable Characters
A lot of the excitement surrounding NMH2 pre-release was that you'd be able to play as
The Stages
Okay, I'll admit, the stages in the first part of the game aren't all that bad. Hell, they're mostly enjoyable. But then you get to the latter half of the game, and you quickly realize that something feels off. Like
The Clothes
This is a fairly minor complaint of mine, but still a valid one, I feel. What happened to all the awesome clothes, Suda? The wardrobe in NMH was awesome. Lots of really creative t-shirts, awesome pants and jackets, stuff like that. This time around, the outfits seem to lack a lot of style compared to the first game. Out of all the outfits in NMH2, I could only find two that I really liked. And as for the t-shirts, I had a huge list of favorites in NMH. This time around, I couldn't find a single one that I liked more than the default shirt. Not a big issue, really, but still one that I feel is worth mentioning.
The Music
NMH2 suffers greatly, in my opinion, from the absence of Masafumi Takada. The soundtrack of the first game was amazing. Pleather for Breakfast, We Are Finally Cowboys, Stop Hanging DJ's, Speed With Teeth, the list goes on and on. This time around, Jun Fukuda is the sole music supervisor. And, no disrespect to the talented Mr. Fukuda (whose work I do greatly enjoy), but he's just not up to par with Takada. Aside from a few standout tracks (
song and the final stage music in particular), NMH2's soundtrack is really, really underwhelming. Plus the fact that so many tracks from the NMH Darkside Tracks album were used in NMH2 really reeks of laziness.
So there you have it. Don't get me wrong, I do like NMH2. Just not NEARLY as much as the first game. I've beaten NMH2 twice now, and I can safely say that short of the discovery of a "true" ending, or a hidden fifth beam katana or something, I'll never replay it again. Conversely, I can see myself replaying NMH again in the future. NMH2 lacks a lot of the charm and magic of the first game. This may be due to Suda 51's decreased involvement in the sequel, but whatever the reason, it's greatly disappointing.
The Overworld (or lack thereof)
Way back when NMH2 had only been announced for a few months, we heard from Suda that one of the main things they were working on was improving the overworld, since the first game's overworld had been one of the things the gaming press had been really critical about. Then the game comes out, and what do we get? Not an improved overworld, but...a menu. I can understand this decision to a point, since many didn't like the fairly barren Santa Destroy in the first game. But for me, that was a big part of the charm in NMH. I spent a lot of time searching for Lovikov balls, checking dumpsters for new clothes, poking the ground with my beam katana looking for money and collectables, and stuff like that. And I enjoyed every second of it. So having a menu instead of an overworld feels like a loss for me.
The Assassins
The assassins in NMH2 lack a lot of the characterization that the assassins in NMH had.
You almost felt bad for killing Dr. Peace, after hearing his song and his story about his daughter. Same with Holly Summers. You could almost feel Travis' sorrow at killing her.
Sylvia gunned down Ryuji?
Margaret
The Side-Jobs
Another thing that got a lot of criticism in the first game were the side-jobs. They weren't very much fun at all. So GHM decided to replace them with 8-bit minigames this time around. I've seen a lot of people say they enjoy them, but I just don't share that sentiment. I don't find the majority of them to be much fun at all, and the ones that ARE fun the first time around quickly lose their charm once you've done them over and over and over. Not to mention that a lot of them have weird design flaws that hamper their enjoyment greatly. Like the pizza delivery game. If you crash, you explode then respawn a few seconds later. However, if something crashes into your explosion, you explode AGAIN, thus making it take even LONGER before you're back on your bike. Or in the bug catching minigame. Where a bug can get caught in the corner of a wall, forcing you to re-position yourself to be able to grab it.
Revenge Missions
The Revenge Missions in NMH2 are kind of confounding to me. They seem to serve no purpose whatsoever except as a cheap way to replace the Assassination side-jobs from the first game. However, GHM forgot to include the one reason people played the Assassination Missions to begin with: you got PAID for them. You want to know why I never had a big problem with the side-jobs in the first game? It's because due to the inclusion of the Assassination Missions, you never had to do any of the side-jobs more than once. While the side-jobs were boring, the Assassination Missions were fun, for the most part, and a great way to earn money and blow off some steam by slicing up some enemies at the same time. The Revenge Missions, however, just serve no purpose at all.
The Story (WARNING: Massive spoilers within, don't highlight anything in this section unless you're already done with the game)
While the story in NMH2 is good for the most part, there's several things that don't make a lot of sense. And not in the good, "Suda's weird method of storytelling" way. I have two main issues to address here. The last boss, and the ending. First, the last boss.
Jasper Batt, Jr. What the holy fucking shit is this? In the first game, we have Jeane, and optionally Henry, as last bosses. They were both memorable, interesting characters who added a LOT to the story, especially Jeane. This time around? A psychotic, strange looking manchild who has a grudge against Travis for killing his father and two brothers (presumably the Skelters). Wait, killing his father? When did THAT happen? Answer: in NMH. Don't remember it? Well there's good reason for that. It was one of the random assassination side-jobs. You had to kill the CEO's of Pizza Bat. That's right, they took an unimportant, OPTIONAL non-plot point from the first game that some gamers might not have even DONE and based the story of the sequel around it. Wonderful idea, there.
Then there's the ending. I won't go into too much detail here, but...really, Suda? Really? After all the hell I went through fighting Jasper, THIS is the payoff? No resolution with Henry, no resolution with Shinobu, just...THIS? In NMH, the ending raised more questions than it provided answers. You could say the same for NMH2, except this time around the question is "What the HELL was that?". Easily one of the most disappointing endings I've seen in a video game in a long, long time.
The Playable Characters
A lot of the excitement surrounding NMH2 pre-release was that you'd be able to play as
Henry and Shinobu. But I personally found both of their sections underwhelming. Like, could they have made Shinobu's jumping controls ANY worse? Not to mention that both of the bosses you fight while using her require a fair amount of platforming. Million Gunman is especially annoying in this regard. Then there's Henry, who you get to play as for all of two or three minutes. Seriously, the Henry vs Mimmy fight is the easiest fight in the game. Just spam Henry's long range move and dodge every now and then. That's about it. Why not at least give us a stage before fighting Mimmy?
The Stages
Okay, I'll admit, the stages in the first part of the game aren't all that bad. Hell, they're mostly enjoyable. But then you get to the latter half of the game, and you quickly realize that something feels off. Like
Captain Vladimir's stage. If you can call it that. You ride your motorcycle through a barren stretch of highway, and then you're suddenly at Vladimir. Really? That's it? That's not even a stage! That's a flimsy excuse to include the Schleptiger in the game! And Margaret's stage, which opens in the parking lot of a supermarket. Basically, you sit in this parking lot fighting thugs FOREVER. Literally, it must be 20-30 solid minutes just hacking away at thugs. On my second playthrough of the game, I DREADED this part. It just goes on far too long for it's own good. Then there's Alice's stage. Which opens with a long, barren street that you walk down, eventually finding a picture of Travis' face painted on the side of a building. O...kay. Um, excuse me, what? I mean, I can see that this is meant to be NMH2's version of the dark hallway from Letz Shake's stage in the first game. But that stage had ATMOSPHERE. This section of Alice's stage just feels pointless. And then there's the stage itself, which, while not as bad as Margaret's stage, does feel like it goes on just a bit too long.
The Clothes
This is a fairly minor complaint of mine, but still a valid one, I feel. What happened to all the awesome clothes, Suda? The wardrobe in NMH was awesome. Lots of really creative t-shirts, awesome pants and jackets, stuff like that. This time around, the outfits seem to lack a lot of style compared to the first game. Out of all the outfits in NMH2, I could only find two that I really liked. And as for the t-shirts, I had a huge list of favorites in NMH. This time around, I couldn't find a single one that I liked more than the default shirt. Not a big issue, really, but still one that I feel is worth mentioning.
The Music
NMH2 suffers greatly, in my opinion, from the absence of Masafumi Takada. The soundtrack of the first game was amazing. Pleather for Breakfast, We Are Finally Cowboys, Stop Hanging DJ's, Speed With Teeth, the list goes on and on. This time around, Jun Fukuda is the sole music supervisor. And, no disrespect to the talented Mr. Fukuda (whose work I do greatly enjoy), but he's just not up to par with Takada. Aside from a few standout tracks (
Margaret's
So there you have it. Don't get me wrong, I do like NMH2. Just not NEARLY as much as the first game. I've beaten NMH2 twice now, and I can safely say that short of the discovery of a "true" ending, or a hidden fifth beam katana or something, I'll never replay it again. Conversely, I can see myself replaying NMH again in the future. NMH2 lacks a lot of the charm and magic of the first game. This may be due to Suda 51's decreased involvement in the sequel, but whatever the reason, it's greatly disappointing.
MidnightScott
Banned
Aww at the ending, I just beat the game on Sweet difficulty. Doubt I'll ever play it again for a long time as I have enough other games in my backlog.
I finished it in like 8 hours though, very short!
I finished it in like 8 hours though, very short!
MidnightScott
Banned
Jenga said:
Here is your help dude:
Get in front of his car when he is about the blast across the room, and then attack at that moment. A challenge will begin and you will automatically lose. That is when Pizza Batt Jr. stabs himself with needles and transforms into a super-hero looking bat. The bat you have to dodge his attacks, he moves really fast. Then after that he turns into like a giant baby version of himself and you just keep slashing away at the center. It was pretty simple, hope it helps you.
MidnightScott
Banned
Like the gym?
I only bought one katana in the whole game. I did all the ranking matches and played all the mini-games.
I didn't do the extra stuff like Revenge matches though.
I only bought one katana in the whole game. I did all the ranking matches and played all the mini-games.
I didn't do the extra stuff like Revenge matches though.
RelentlessRolento
Member
are the old school outfit parts as well as the special katana only available if you have a previous NMH1 gamesave? I find it nice they did that if true.
Alright, I'm 11 hours in at rank 4, and while that fight was absolutely fantastic, I have to side with Cain on this. I liked the original better. Exploring the overworld sucked HOURS into my playtime (though I'm not opposed to them removing it, there are other concerns, such as...), and the bosses are far less characterized this time. I would think that they would have some sort of tongue in cheek, lightly philosophical banter about the pitfalls and dangers of revenge before and after the fight. Because of how castrated the character of the bosses feel and how I HATE the side jobs, I can't help but feel that this game is unironically (or perhaps even worse, ununironically) suffering from the sophomore sequel slump, barring any future saving grace, which I don't really see coming.
And to use a phrase from the job guy. I HATE THE SIDE JOBS WITH ALL MY HATE. I ALSO HATE THE TRAINING GAMES WITH ALL MY HATE. The former are beyond dull, monotonous, and I'm just not digging them. That's what the Assassin's missions were for in the first game, as a literal escape from the monotony of every day life, but here, Travis has even more reason to escape. Sure, there are the Revenge missions, and they're fun in their own right, but revenge doesn't pay! I'm a little OCD when it comes to my games, so when I see that I haven't finished the training games, I get annoyed, but they're needlessly difficult and have shitty hit boxes, just like the side jobs, and when I can't succeed in them like I could in the simplistic training games in the first, it drives me up a wall. The gym stuff is basic character progression, and when I can't go through some BASIC FUCKING CHARACTER PROGRESSION because the hit detection feels like being a stingy piece of shit, I get frustrated, to the point where I don't even bother with either of them. It's fucking ludicrous. I don't care if it means something, it's NOT FUN.
I mean, the combat is just as fun if not improved on. The ecstasy gauge is a brilliant addition to the system that takes the focus off of random darkside modes (though they severely gimped the darkstep. I've only gotten it on accident)
I AM playing it on Mild though. Maybe I should rip through it in Sweet to get everything. Is it more forgiving on those difficulties?
EDIT:
And to use a phrase from the job guy. I HATE THE SIDE JOBS WITH ALL MY HATE. I ALSO HATE THE TRAINING GAMES WITH ALL MY HATE. The former are beyond dull, monotonous, and I'm just not digging them. That's what the Assassin's missions were for in the first game, as a literal escape from the monotony of every day life, but here, Travis has even more reason to escape. Sure, there are the Revenge missions, and they're fun in their own right, but revenge doesn't pay! I'm a little OCD when it comes to my games, so when I see that I haven't finished the training games, I get annoyed, but they're needlessly difficult and have shitty hit boxes, just like the side jobs, and when I can't succeed in them like I could in the simplistic training games in the first, it drives me up a wall. The gym stuff is basic character progression, and when I can't go through some BASIC FUCKING CHARACTER PROGRESSION because the hit detection feels like being a stingy piece of shit, I get frustrated, to the point where I don't even bother with either of them. It's fucking ludicrous. I don't care if it means something, it's NOT FUN.
I mean, the combat is just as fun if not improved on. The ecstasy gauge is a brilliant addition to the system that takes the focus off of random darkside modes (though they severely gimped the darkstep. I've only gotten it on accident)
I AM playing it on Mild though. Maybe I should rip through it in Sweet to get everything. Is it more forgiving on those difficulties?
EDIT:
Really? Looks like I should stop playing this then and delete the save. I'm not playing on my own Wii right now, but a friends. I need to get mine sent to me. Well, I'll be off again. See you next week... hopefully...RelentlessRolento said:
You know how I feel about this game? This game is like Green Day post American Idiot. It still mostly sounds and feels like Green Day, and it's still mostly fun to listen to, but something seems missing, a certain happy-go-lucky streak I guess you could call it. If this game continues to disappoint me as it has been, I'm certain I'd like a NMH3 that reconciles the problems of both games without losing itself.
Gonna make this short for now, gonna go play Mass Effect. But just finished up NMH2. Yeah, I'm echoing a lot of the complaints. Well, I don't miss the overworld. But the finale, the assassins, its all missing something. That said, I'll look into this more later. IT was a fun ride, but NMH1 was definitely a lot more memorable.
Hey, I'm a nice person with a wide range of musical tastes. American Idiot WAS Green Day if they were suddenly possessed by the spirit of giving a shit. What made Green Day's earlier music sound good was that it didn't try too hard, it just was. That's what NMH feels like: it tries too hard and because of that, some things fall apart.Jenga said:
"Punx Not Dead" the game proclaimed to me as I booted it up, but who cares if what we're listening to is punk? It's just a label, and ironically, punk should never be happy with a label.
Seraphis Cain
bad gameplay lol
I really think that Suda/GHM listened to the critics too much, in regards to changes made in NMH2. Especially those who didn't "get" the first NMH. Sure, it had it's issues and quirks, but it was fun because of those quirks, not in spite of them. Were there things that needed improved/changed? Yes, of course there were. But to me it feels like GHM went overboard in trying to please the majority, and in the process made a game that "hardcore" (I really hate using that word) fans of the first NMH are disappointed in. And GHM's specialty has NEVER been catering to the majority. And NMH2 makes that obvious. I mean, I've seen complaints similar to those that I and others have posted in this thread all over the internet. That's got to count for something.
I for one am not terribly worried. It's plain to see that Suda has further plans for NMH and he'll definitely listen to the small, but dedicated fanbase in order to create a better game.
Also, some of the games music is up on youtube. It's really growing on me, however I really do miss Takada.
Also, some of the games music is up on youtube. It's really growing on me, however I really do miss Takada.
Family Fry
Member
Just finished it on mild and unlocked bitter which you can new game+,
Dont know if I can go through it all again, does anyone know if there is another ending? Anyone finished it on bitter?
Dont know if I can go through it all again, does anyone know if there is another ending? Anyone finished it on bitter?
Family Fry said:
No word on it, and seriously with how it ended, I think that's as complete as an ending we'd get. I'm glad things carry over on bitter. Getting that last muscle upgrade costed me a fortune and lots of stress. Not sure if I'm up for it. I'm actually feeling like replaying NMH1 to remove my mixed feelings on 2. Although I don't want to put up with the overworld and the UAA fees.
Family Fry
Member
Know what you mean I enjoyed NMH lot more, although I'm thinking that maybe due to it's originality with it's attitude and style, this one still has it but it felt a little hollow in places. I don't think I have the patience to try the last boss on Bitter or even get there, tried it and I struggled on the tutorial boss so that doesn't bode well at all.
Rank 4 and 2 (setting, dialogue, level) are great videogame moments. Nothing less.
About 2,
Beautiful.
About 2,
loved the fact that the best way to beat it was to go with punch and kick. She became an ascetic because she focused too much on the ranked fights, which is why she had those lightsabers on her back, and that's why she lost.
sevenchaos
Banned
The killing blow to that
on the
was so fucking awesome. So satisfying. Man this game is gooooooood.
Chloe chick
island prison
Been scouring forums and etc to gather my thoughts, and I'm still mixed. I mean they got everything right but the story, characters, and the music. Which were part of the charm of the original IMO. Argh. I guess the wiimote phone calls are still here, they;re just in a different onscreen form.
Why the story ?
The characters were right, too. They're not meant to have the same weight, that's why you start at 51 and not at 11. Travis himself says he want to go quick after killing 51.
My only grief is the length, now. I'll leave the keyboard and kill #1. I'm around 10 hours. Which is OK by today's standards for action games, but like 7 hours less than the first.
No problem with the gym, just at the beginning.
Naomi is a useless pair of oversized boobs.
The characters were right, too. They're not meant to have the same weight, that's why you start at 51 and not at 11. Travis himself says he want to go quick after killing 51.
My only grief is the length, now. I'll leave the keyboard and kill #1. I'm around 10 hours. Which is OK by today's standards for action games, but like 7 hours less than the first.
No problem with the gym, just at the beginning.
Naomi is a useless pair of oversized boobs.
As someone who didn't play the first game and didn't have much desire to, I'm enjoying NMH2 so far. I'm about 2 hours in on rank 23. The side missions have been good so far, but I haven't been forced to repeat any more than once yet. I don't really have any complaints yet, and it seems most complaints are coming from fans of the first game.
Seraphis Cain
bad gameplay lol
Nicktals said:
It's just recycled dialogue. I think the same thing happened with Naomi in the first NMH.
So, finished.
.
It's pretty much the opposite of a Suda character. No wonder why people are disappointed, the first's ending was epic, this one is ridiculous (probably intended, even
).
Can't wait for the brainstorming.
either I missed something, or Jasper Batt is a joke. It's the most generic boss of the whole series, and everything he says sounds cliche and ridiculous
It's pretty much the opposite of a Suda character. No wonder why people are disappointed, the first's ending was epic, this one is ridiculous (probably intended, even
Henry acknowledges that it's not "by his standards"
Can't wait for the brainstorming.