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[Crazymoogle]

So I went for the gusto. GTX285 ready to install, along with an SE16. Pics tonight, hopefully. Still hoping to get an SSD but waiting for a few more reviews of the Corsair.

Why is a Lara Croft clone on my Sapphire 4870 box?

Because it was the trendy thing to do at the start of the decade. It's basically just the clipart way to do ads now. :lol

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

I think I mentioned before that we need an Official PC GAF gamer avatar.

 

[Hazaro]

Victim's is pretty good.

So I went for the gusto. GTX285 ready to install, along with an SE16. Pics tonight, hopefully. Still hoping to get an SSD but waiting for a few more reviews of the Corsair.

If I had to buy one I would go with Intel because of the way it manages the random writes.

Intel and Samsung controllers (and SSD's) don't have the freeze/slow down issues of the OCZ/G.Skill/ others have.

 

[Crazymoogle]

If I had to buy one I would go with Intel because of the way it manages the random writes.Intel and Samsung controllers (and SSD's) don't have the freeze/slow down issues of the OCZ/G.Skill/ others have.

The Corsair uses a Samsung controller, actually.

Intel is definitely the speed king right now with the X25M, but at 80GB for $400, it's still way too expensive. 128GB for $400 is a lot more palatable. There's also the OCZ Vertex (64MB Buffer!) but it looks like it will street at 635 (all prices canadian.)

 

[vpance]

Was afraid of that. I'll probably pick up the second board you posted after doing some more research... I looks very good and fairly cheap.

I have the EP45C version of that second board and it actually supports DDR2 and DDR3 ram, if that's your interest.

 

[brain_stew]

I have the EP45C version of that second board and it actually supports DDR2 and DDR3 ram, if that's your interest.

That's not much use though since it obviously doesn't support core i7 processors, core i7 uses triple channel memory and there's also no performance advantage for DDR3 of socket 775. He's better off sticking with DDR2.

 

[Ruprit]

That is the PC-x500. I am not sure I want that model. The main reason why I am getting rid of my 900 is because I want room inside. My components are getting friend. I never play more than 30 minutes at a time, but knowing that playing for more than 2 hours could kill my components is irritating.

edit: What temps do you have now?

Right now I have a Q9550 over-clocked to 3.4ghz, it's being cooled by a Thermalright Ultra 120 Extreme. That idles at around 23C and 40C on load. The graphics card is an 4870 which has an Artic Cooling Accelero S1 on it. That idles at 36C and hits around 47C on load. All in all, I'm really happy with it, it's the best case I have ever owned. Before this I have had 4 different Lian-Li cases. Check out this thread for some more opinions on it. I did get rid of all the stock fans for better ones (a mix of Noctuna and Sythe, for silence). I also removed the fan filter and replaced it with a better one.

 

[Hazaro]

The Corsair uses a Samsung controller, actually.

Intel is definitely the speed king right now with the X25M, but at 80GB for $400, it's still way too expensive. 128GB for $400 is a lot more palatable. There's also the OCZ Vertex (64MB Buffer!) but it looks like it will street at 635 (all prices canadian.)

I remember someone telling me that

I understand the size, but after reading Anandtech's article on Intel's SSD's I would personally go that route for the long term. Of course I haven't read up anything on the Corsair so...

 

[Hazaro]

Dell has a deal for a really cheap C2D system up. NO OPERATING SYSTEM (You can use Windows 7 for a few months free if you want)
Includes a fantastic 1920x1080 22" Dell monitor.
Just toss in a 8800GT/9800GT or 4830 and you are set to fly. (+$80)


http://configure.us.dell.com/dellst...acd=10466193-1225267-u283940t0f0fp18029c0s558

 

[Captain Knutsman]

Im planning a build, but I will first be able to buy it next month, so i have had tons of time to plan The system will be used for gaming, school (which sometimes will involve some 3dsmax) and work (mainly webpages and programming).

gfx: ASUS EAH4850/HTDI (512 MB)
cpu: Pentium Dual Core E5200 2 MB
mobo: ASUS P5Q PRO
ram: OCZ Enhanced Latency 2 x 2 GB
psu: Chill CP-520A4M
hdd: WD Caviar Green WD10EACS 1 TB
case: Antec Three Hundred

my main questions are:
Will the cpu bottleneck my computer? I plan on overclocking it.
Does the cpu's cache size matter?
Should i switch the asus mobo for a abit - the reviews seems to favour them in overclocking scenarios, but i haven't done much research in the different abit boards.
Is 520W enough power for the system? (I chose the specific psu because it is manufactured in the land I live in, and because it high quality)

Other than that comments are welcome

 

[brain_stew]

Im planning a build, but I will first be able to buy it next month, so i have had tons of time to plan The system will be used for gaming, school (which sometimes will involve some 3dsmax) and work (mainly webpages and programming).

gfx: ASUS EAH4850/HTDI (512 MB)
cpu: Pentium Dual Core E5200 2 MB
mobo: ASUS P5Q PRO
ram: OCZ Enhanced Latency 2 x 2 GB
psu: Chill CP-520A4M
hdd: WD Caviar Green WD10EACS 1 TB
case: Antec Three Hundred

my main questions are:
Will the cpu bottleneck my computer? I plan on overclocking it.
Does the cpu's cache size matter?
Should i switch the asus mobo for a abit - the reviews seems to favour them in overclocking scenarios, but i haven't done much research in the different abit boards.
Is 520W enough power for the system? (I chose the specific psu because it is manufactured in the land I live in, and because it high quality)

Other than that comments are welcome

The E5200 is about 10% slower clock for clock than a normal 45nm Core 2. Once overclocked past 3ghz or so your bottlenck is going to be with the GPU in a a single GPU setup.

I have mine running at 3.66ghz and couldn't be happier. Comfortably outperforms a stock E84000 for less than half the price. If you're not going quad and don't mind OCing I personally see no benefit in spending any more on your CPU. Its more than enough for any dual core optimised game there's ever likely to be.

Chill? Never heard of them before? I'd stick with a more established brand of PSU like Corsair, Sesonic etc. What amperage does that PSU have on its 12V rail? Even a 400w PSU from a decent brand is enough for that setup but it all depends on what its output on the 12V rail is. This should be listed on the manufacturer's website.

Since you'r overcloking go with the Gigabyte P45-UD3P, its not particularly expensive and has been roven to be the best P45 board around.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

Ok, So i installed the AGEIA physX card, and it gave me some extra frames and a bit more eye-candy. thats all good, but in order to fit the card in, i had to remove the SLI bridge and put it back in, now every game that I play has a green bar on the side and it says SLI. what did I do?
edit: stupid me, under what nvidia menu do i disable this?
rdit2: never mind, found it.

 

[Captain Knutsman]

Expected the cpu to be able to handle it, so im happy to hear your comfirming it. The psu is from Chill Innovation and it has two 12V rails with 20A each - the specs can be seen here. I have been very happy with my previous Chill Innovation psu so if it has enough power im pretty sure i'll stick with it

I just saw that i wrote abit where I meant gigabyte X) That's what happens when posting after an 8 hour night shift X)

 

[fatigues_gasolini]

I have a question that may or may not be for this thread. Games im playing keep crashing. Fallout 3 within a minute of starting to play, and Dawn of War 2 Beta hangs both causing crashing to the desktop. Is this a graphics card issue or Steam? I reinstalled Fallout 3 and its doing the same thing.

 

[Ruprit]

Expected the cpu to be able to handle it, so im happy to hear your comfirming it. The psu is from Chill Innovation and it has two 12V rails with 20A each - the specs can be seen here. I have been very happy with my previous Chill Innovation psu so if it has enough power im pretty sure i'll stick with it

I just saw that i wrote abit where I meant gigabyte X) That's what happens when posting after an 8 hour night shift X)

Also never heard of them. That website looks SUPER un-trustworthy. But some research leads me to believe that they are a know brand in Denmark. Even so, Brain_stew touches on a important point. The psu is really the most important part of the computer, spending extra for an established part is highly recommended.

 

[Ruprit]

I have a question that may or may not be for this thread. Games im playing keep crashing. Fallout 3 within a minute of starting to play, and Dawn of War 2 Beta hangs both causing crashing to the desktop. Is this a graphics card issue or Steam? I reinstalled Fallout 3 and its doing the same thing.

Your computers specs would be very helpful. Do you see and graphical glitches before the crash? I know that there is an AA related glitch with Fallout 3. An underpowered computer may also be the problem too. Specs please.

 

[fatigues_gasolini]

Your computers specs would be very helpful. Do you see and graphical glitches before the crash? I know that there is an AA related glitch with Fallout 3. An underpowered computer may also be the problem too. Specs please.

Im at work right now but ill try to remember.

I dont see any graphical clitches. For DOW it still plays the music, and I can move my cursor, but cant click on anything. Fallout 3 just dumps to desktop.

AMD Athlon 64 X2 5000+ AM2 CPU Black
XFX GeForce 8800 GT 512MB
Vista Ultimate 64
4 Gigs Ram

 

[Ysiadmihi]

Im at work right now but ill try to remember.

I dont see any graphical clitches. For DOW it still plays the music, and I can move my cursor, but cant click on anything. Fallout 3 just dumps to desktop.

AMD Athlon 64 X2 5000+ AM2 CPU Black
XFX GeForce 8800 GT 512MB
Vista Ultimate 64
4 Gigs Ram

Are you overclocking at all?

 

[fatigues_gasolini]

Are you overclocking at all?

Not that I know of. Ive tried in the past, but all attempts had my computer barking at me that it didnt work. So stock speed.

 

[Ruprit]

Not that I know of. Ive tried in the past, but all attempts had my computer barking at me that it didnt work. So stock speed.

Have you updated to the latest drivers? Graphics and all that jazz?

 

[Ysiadmihi]

Not that I know of. Ive tried in the past, but all attempts had my computer barking at me that it didnt work. So stock speed.

That's odd, I have the same CPU and it overclocks very well (and easily).

I would have thought for sure the problem was caused by overclocking. Can you check your CPU and GPU temps?

 

[Median]

Can anyone point me toward a good tutorial for putting a PC together? I've found a couple by Google but if anyone has a specific guide that they prefer or like, I'd really appreciate it.

 

[fatigues_gasolini]

That's odd, I have the same CPU and it overclocks very well (and easily).

I would have thought for sure the problem was caused by overclocking. Can you check your CPU and GPU temps?

Im not at home, so I cant check right now. IVe read about the cpu and how easy it is to overclock, but never got it to work.

Have you updated to the latest drivers? Graphics and all that jazz?

Yup, latest Nvidia as of late January.

 

[fatigues_gasolini]

Can anyone point me toward a good tutorial for putting a PC together? I've found a couple by Google but if anyone has a specific guide that they prefer or like, I'd really appreciate it.

Try Youtube, there are tons of walkthroughs.

 

[Ysiadmihi]

IVe read about the cpu and how easy it is to overclock, but never got it to work.

All you really have to do is set the vcore to 1.45 and change the multiplier to 16. Been running this CPU for over a year now with no problems.

Of course, you may have tried this and it didn't work for some reason : /

 

[Ruprit]

Yup, latest Nvidia as of late January.

I would lean more towards a component overheating. I remember my 8800gt with the stock single slot cooler ran real hot. Is it only those two games? and do they only crash to the desktop?

Fallout 3 is a really buggy game. For me it would crash every couple of hours.

 

[Minsc]

Can anyone point me toward a good tutorial for putting a PC together? I've found a couple by Google but if anyone has a specific guide that they prefer or like, I'd really appreciate it.

This was recommended earlier.

 

[fatigues_gasolini]

I would lean more towards a component overheating. I remember my 8800gt with the stock single slot cooler ran real hot. Is it only those two games? and do they only crash to the desktop?

Fallout 3 is a really buggy game. For me it would crash every couple of hours.

I sorta Suspected that. I had a previous graphics card that did something similar.

 

[Captain Knutsman]

Also never heard of them. That website looks SUPER un-trustworthy. But some research leads me to believe that they are a know brand in Denmark. Even so, Brain_stew touches on a important point. The psu is really the most important part of the computer, spending extra for an established part is highly recommended.

About their homepage - I was just thinking the exact same thing. It really is an embarresment. There litteraly isn't any excusions for it, it's just silly :l

Their psu's doesn't come cheap, it matches the price of an Corsair VX550W, so it got me thinking that i maybe should choose the corsair instead. The chill has detachable cables, so I only have the cables in my cabinet that im going to need, which i think is really neat. I'll do some more research, and return once i've made my final decision

In the meantime, i'm having a hard time figuring out how much the cache of the cpu affects the performance of the entire system. If i understand it right, the cache is the cpu's ram, so to speak, which are superfast?

 

[K.Jack]

wait if I have a Dell with a GeForce 8400M

does this mean I can upgrade it to a 4850?

Too bad my CPU will bottleneck it though, since its only a 1.8ghz Core2Duo

No, I'm sorry, but you can't. Just about every Dell notebook (with the exception of the Vostro 1500 and Inspiron 1525) has the GPU soldered to the motherboard, and even then, it'd only be an MXM-II slot.

 

[Ruprit]

About their homepage - I was just thinking the exact same thing. It really is an embarresment. There litteraly isn't any excusions for it, it's just silly :l

Their psu's doesn't come cheap, it matches the price of an Corsair VX550W, so it got me thinking that i maybe should choose the corsair instead. The chill has detachable cables, so I only have the cables in my cabinet that im going to need, which i think is really neat. I'll do some more research, and return once i've made my final decision

In the meantime, i'm having a hard time figuring out how much the cache of the cpu affects the performance of the entire system. If i understand it right, the cache is the cpu's ram, so to speak, which are superfast?

Corsair, Seasonic, PC Power and Cooling are all great brands. The Enermax Revolution85+ is getting fantastic reviews. So much so, it's looking like it will become the new king. But it's also extremely expensive ($250 to $300+).

I don't know too much about the cpu cache, my thoughts on it are what you said. That being said, whenever I buy a new cpu, it always has more than the previous. Obviously the new cpu is faster, but I wouldn't put too much of a focus on the cache. Buy whatever fits your budget.

Last week I had a Q9550 delivered to replace my E8500. Going from dual to quad was a much bigger improvement than I expected

 

[Median]

This was recommended earlier.

Cheers, looks pretty good.

 

[fatigues_gasolini]

Here is the temps from my computer

 

[Zyzyxxz]

No, I'm sorry, but you can't. Just about every Dell notebook (with the exception of the Vostro 1500 and Inspiron 1525) has the GPU soldered to the motherboard, and even then, it'd only be an MXM-II slot.

shit lame!

I have a Vostro 1400, dam shoulda went with the 1500.

 

[brain_stew]

About their homepage - I was just thinking the exact same thing. It really is an embarresment. There litteraly isn't any excusions for it, it's just silly :l

Their psu's doesn't come cheap, it matches the price of an Corsair VX550W, so it got me thinking that i maybe should choose the corsair instead. The chill has detachable cables, so I only have the cables in my cabinet that im going to need, which i think is really neat. I'll do some more research, and return once i've made my final decision

In the meantime, i'm having a hard time figuring out how much the cache of the cpu affects the performance of the entire system. If i understand it right, the cache is the cpu's ram, so to speak, which are superfast?

Its about 10% clock for clock compared to a 6MB Wolfdale. They're pretty much nek and neck with the older 65nm Core 2s clock for clock but run cooler, use less power and are better at OCing. Its nothing at all to worry about, I did read quite a few decent articles on the subject but not sure if I can find them atm but trust me, I'm running an E5200 at 3.68ghz and couldn't be happier.

 

[SpinningFrog]

Nothing uses 2.0 except $400 and above cards to my knowledge. Even then the gains are minimals.

Your CPU will most likely need to be upgraded as well.

As far as I can tell the majority of cards I've looked at with a range from 100 and up all use 2.0.

 

[bee]

unwinder/evga just released a really sweet utility for soft volt modding gtx 260/280/295 65nm cards

http://www.evga.com/articles/00462/

non evga owners download link - http://cid-eb57d793e134d541.skydrive.live.com/browse.aspx/EVGA%20V%20TUNER

be careful

 

[Hazaro]

As far as I can tell the majority of cards I've looked at with a range from 100 and up all use 2.0.

They are compatible, but don't make use of the bandwidth. If used on a PCI-E 1.0 16x they will be just as fast.

 

[Hazaro]

unwinder/evga just released a really sweet utility for soft volt modding gtx 260/280/295 65nm cards

be careful

CAREFUL

HA :lol

I'm not going to touch this though, I get awesome performance in everything.
Plus I have a PNY card and if it kicks the bucket no way am I getting warranty support :lol

*To clarify you'd have to flash your BIOS to eVGA or wait until someone modded the program.

 

[Crazymoogle]

Finally finished the parts upgrade on my PC last night.

Quadro FX3500 -> Geforce GTX285
250GB Seagate -> 640GB WD Caviar Blue

...yeah, it's pretty fast right now. Haven't given it much of a workout but I did try loading up Portal. It suggested various things, I ignored it, and I really haven't noticed framerate issues despite turning on anisotropic 4x and 2xMSAA. (I'd have to figure out getting the console up and checking FPS though.)

The scary thing is that, pricewise, the GTX285 is far cheaper than the Quadro. :lol

Video card install was pretty easy; the card is big but solid. I had no idea you could do S/PDIF linking, but I can't seem to find any info on whether my motherboard supports it. (Dell's manual mentions SPDIF in the glossary...and that's it. But there's no motherboard diagram either.)

The only real issue was that Windows 7 Beta refuses to believe the card is anything but a "Generic VGA Device", so you have to just download the 181.22 drivers for Vista, which for some reason also contain the 181.22 drivers for Windows 7. After that, it's fine. The OS easily figures out your native res and away you go.

 

[Lastone]

What's a good free program that would let me see the cpu temperature under load?

 

[Hazaro]

Quadro FX3500 -> Geforce GTX285
250GB Seagate -> 640GB WD Caviar Blue

I really haven't noticed framerate issues despite turning on anisotropic 4x and 2xMSAA. (I'd have to figure out getting the console up and checking FPS though.)

The scary thing is that, pricewise, the GTX285 is far cheaper than the Quadro. :lol

Good upgrades, why not use 16xAA and 16xAF?
Grab fraps to check your fps or use the console.

What's a good free program that would let me see the cpu temperature under load?

RealTemp or Coretemp

 

[Pachinko]

So how are the newly minted i7's working for the couple of you that bought one ?


Here's a question for ya- right now I'm still using a cheapo geforce 8800gt from last year , if I built a core i7 system with the 940(2.8hz I think) would I be able to get 30 fps on high detail in crysis @ 1680X1050 ?


If not then what would I need to obtain that framerate ? and when I say 30 fps , I mean 30 fps mininum, like even the most intensive portions of the game still run at 30 fps such as allegadly the ice areas. My current rig chokes as soon as the game needs to render more then 2 enemies as video card aside it's pushing onto it's 4th birthday.

Also when I say core i7 system I mean the proper mobo, processor and whatever the highest amount of ram I can get is. I was planning to do it this summer originally but I may wait until fall because of windows 7 so I skip vista completly.

 

[Slavik81]

Finally finished the parts upgrade on my PC last night.

Quadro FX3500 -> Geforce GTX285
250GB Seagate -> 640GB WD Caviar Blue

...yeah, it's pretty fast right now. Haven't given it much of a workout but I did try loading up Portal. It suggested various things, I ignored it, and I really haven't noticed framerate issues despite turning on anisotropic 4x and 2xMSAA. (I'd have to figure out getting the console up and checking FPS though.)

The scary thing is that, pricewise, the GTX285 is far cheaper than the Quadro.

A GTX285 should be able to handle Portal with 1920x1200 at a rock-solid 60 frames per second, even if you turn all settings to max and crank AA and AF as high as it can go.

Anyways, the reason why the Quadro isn't as good for gaming, but is still very expensive is because it's designed with a different emphasis. It's meant for Maya, AutoCAD and all sorts of CGI tools, not Crysis or Bioshock.

That $800 goes into colour accuracy and such. Gamer's don't care about those things too much, particularly when their monitor is unlikely to display colours accurately anyways. We're more concerned with frame rate.

The only real issue was that Windows 7 Beta refuses to believe the card is anything but a "Generic VGA Device", so you have to just download the 181.22 drivers for Vista, which for some reason also contain the 181.22 drivers for Windows 7. After that, it's fine. The OS easily figures out your native res and away you go.

This is because Vista and Windows 7 handle drivers in the same way. It isn't that the Vista drivers contain the Windows 7 drivers, it's that Windows 7 uses Vista drivers too.

 

[Crazymoogle]

Good upgrades, why not use 16xAA and 16xAF?
Grab fraps to check your fps or use the console.

I just haven't tried it yet. :lol If fraps runs in W7, I'll grab it and see what happens. I'm guessing Source doesn't really tax the GPU because the GTX285 was basically silent.

I guess I should finally go buy Crysis and see what happens.

Anyways, the reason why the Quadro isn't as good for gaming, but is still very expensive is because it's designed with a different emphasis. It's meant for Maya, AutoCAD and all sorts of CGI tools, not Crysis or Bioshock.

Oh, I know. I've worked in studios using those tools since Maya was in beta. (Nightmares of IRIX :lol) But there are much, much cheaper Quadro's on the market right now, so it was surprising to see how much a 7900GT equivalent goes for.

This is because Vista and Windows 7 handle drivers in the same way. It isn't that the Vista drivers contain the Windows 7 drivers, it's that Windows 7 uses Vista drivers too.

You'd think so...but when you run the Vista installer it clearly calls it the Windows 7 installer. So I imagine 181.22 is just built for both, even though the Nvidia website clearly says that you should be installing W7 pre-release beta drivers using Windows Update (which in my case, just can't tell at all that you have a GTX285 by itself.)

 

[Hazaro]

So how are the newly minted i7's working for the couple of you that bought one ?


Here's a question for ya- right now I'm still using a cheapo geforce 8800gt from last year , if I built a core i7 system with the 940(2.8hz I think) would I be able to get 30 fps on high detail in crysis @ 1680X1050 ?


If not then what would I need to obtain that framerate ? and when I say 30 fps , I mean 30 fps mininum, like even the most intensive portions of the game still run at 30 fps such as allegadly the ice areas. My current rig chokes as soon as the game needs to render more then 2 enemies as video card aside it's pushing onto it's 4th birthday.

Also when I say core i7 system I mean the proper mobo, processor and whatever the highest amount of ram I can get is. I was planning to do it this summer originally but I may wait until fall because of windows 7 so I skip vista completly.

GTX 260 + custom config. (I use Mster)
i7 is not needed if you have a 3Ghz C2D for gaming (IMO)
I'm running a E7200 @ 3.8Ghz + my GTX 260 and get about 38fps average with a low of 28 fps with equivalent to very high settings at 1680x1050.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=14627299&postcount=2068

i7 + 8800 will not magically give you more frames if your GPU is still not up to par.

8800GT is a fine card for Crysis, use CCC level 3 and give it a shot.

 

[Clevinger]

i have a quick question

if i install a new motherboard, would I have to reinstall windows? or is that only with a harddrive?

thanks

 

[Crazymoogle]

i have a quick question

if i install a new motherboard, would I have to reinstall windows? or is that only with a harddrive?

thanks

Chances are strong you'd have to reinstall windows. If you blew away all chipset devices and drivers from Device Manager I'd guess you'd have a shot at just booting back in, but odds are not so great that Windows will be happy with the change.

(And I have no idea what Windows activation would think about this...)

 

[Hazaro]

i have a quick question

if i install a new motherboard, would I have to reinstall windows? or is that only with a harddrive?

thanks

Very strong chance you'll have to reinstall. I looked extensively into this a few months ago and just decided to stick with my old P5B.

Read:
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=772307
http://arstechnica.com/hardware/new...-motherboard-without-reinstalling-windows.ars
http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?t=541605

 

[Ysiadmihi]

Here is the temps from my computer

Would you be able to find out what they are under load? Try running the 3D mode in ATI Tool for awhile and wait for the GPU temp to max out.