Support NeoGAF

[Loki]

Bless you, my children.

Hoist up your crosses and you shall find graphical salvation.

:lol

dark10x has a sense of humor!? The wonders never cease. Your humor is fillrate-limited, however, and I figured it would be apropos to point that out. You should add another pipeline or shader or something to compensate.


(none of this is intended to offend, btw-- like I said, I'm rarely in the gaming forum, and you seem to rarely be in OT, so the only posts I've seen you make were always about games and technology, and were characteristically dry given the subject matter )

 

[God's Hand]

Here's the difference between you (random forum member) and dark10x: You see the graphical anomalies, but you couldn't give a shit, because you still enjoy the game. Meanwhile, dark10x is sitting in his dark bedroom in his basement and is inundated with color banding, dithering, low-res textures, seams, clipping, etc. so much so, that he decides to immediately log into his computer and nitpick on GAF about things that happen in every game, on every console, due to either restrictions in hardware or developer limits.

What's the point in posting what you post when mostly everyone sees exactly what you see? You think you have some kind of 6th sense that only allows you to see the minor visual decline in RE4? I don't understand you. You were at your worst when Splinter Cell came out for PC.

The game you bought is the game you have to deal with. We all see the graphical (and otherwise) incongruities in games. They're there, they stay there, there's not much you can do about it. Pointing and complaining does nothing.

Ever thought of making a website with a games database where you point out every instance of dithering, banding, DOF irregularities, etc.? That would be interesting.

 

[Mrbob]

Bless you, my children.

Hoist up your crosses and you shall find graphical salvation.

:lol :lol :lol :lol

 

[cvxfreak]

Here's the difference between you (random forum member) and dark10x: You see the graphical anomalies, but you couldn't give a shit, because you still enjoy the game. Meanwhile, dark10x is sitting in his dark bedroom in his basement and is inundated with color banding, dithering, low-res textures, seams, clipping, etc. so much so, that he decides to immediately log into his computer and nitpick on GAF about things that happen in every game, on every console, due to either restrictions in hardware or developer limits.

What's the point in posting what you post when mostly everyone sees exactly what you see? You think you have some kind of 6th sense that only allows you to see the minor visual decline in RE4? I don't understand you. You were at your worst when Splinter Cell came out for PC.

The game you bought is the game you have to deal with. We all see the graphical (and otherwise) incongruities in games. They're there, they stay there, there's not much you can do about it. Pointing and complaining does nothing.

Ever thought of making a website with a games database where you point out every instance of dithering, banding, DOF irregularities, etc.? That would be interesting.

:lol:lol:lol

I like dark10x and he's a great poster, but most of his posts focus on stuff that don't really matter much... to me at least.

 

[xabre]

I'd take the graphics of RE4 over something like Doom 3 anyday of the week. To fuck with pedantic technical aspects, it is the attention to detail and effort the developer puts into the little, almost insignificant things that add together to create a complete graphical showcase. The world of Doom 3 is a lifeless and repetitious place, it may have environment and bump mapping coming out the arsehole but there isn't any real 'detail' or ‘life’ to those environments, no personality to the levels. This is why I think so highly of Metroid Prime's graphics, plenty of other games may technically trump it, but very few go so such lengths to differentiate every room, to make floors appear cracked and withered or with vines and decaying trees growing out of ancient walls and floors. With most games it's just model a room, texture it with some fancy shit and move on, but it is the little unnecessary aspects that ultimately come together to create something more than a bunch of polygons and textures.

 

[nightez]

I'd take the graphics of RE4 over something like Doom 3 anyday of the week. To fuck with pedantic technical aspects, it is the attention to detail and effort the developer puts into the little, almost insignificant things that add together to create a complete graphical showcase.

RE4's doing more polys than DOOM 3.
Its a technical choice on the part of the developer to go for low poly normal mapping (Doom3 look) or go for high polys.

There was a scan with Leon's wire, the amount of triangles was just ridiculus.

 

[cybamerc]

Dark10x is crazy. Nothing in the old RE4 media ever suggested the forest would be as dense as the one in Far Cry.

From what I've seen so far RE4 is easily the best looking console game based on polish alone. The attention to detail is simply unmatched.

 

[Gamedude]

when will we see Gamespot's review?

 

[SantaC]

The only title darkx10 hasn't complained about was the graphics in Halo2 which makes it kind of a joke. I remember he saying how awesome the graphics in Halo 2 was. I agree it's very good, but not exactly best on the market.

Anyway can we stop critisizing RE4 for it's graphics because it's one aspect of the game that shouldn't be critisizied(capcom has outdone themselves), because it's on GAMECUBE(and not on xbox), hello?

All 3 reviews out there has been more than satiesfied with the graphics, so we are we sitting around bashing capcom for it when we haven't even played the final game like they have.

when will we see Gamespot's review

Monday morning 12:01 am

 

[Hitman]

The only title darkx10 hasn't complained about was the graphics in Halo2 which makes it kind of a joke. I remember he saying how awesome the graphics in Halo 2 was. I agree it's very good, but not exactly best on the market.

Anyway can we stop critisizing RE4 for it's graphics because it's one aspect of the game that shouldn't be critisizied(capcom has outdone themselves), because it's on GAMECUBE(and not on xbox), hello?

All 3 reviews out there has been more than satiesfied with the graphics, so we are we sitting around bashing capcom for it when we haven't even played the final game like they have.



Monday morning 12:01 am

That's because dark10x is an Xbot masquerading as some multi-platform fair and balanced poster in attempt to make his agenda not look as childish as it is.

 

[AssMan]

Twin Snakes, the game was a visual train wreck and I posted quite a bit on that subject

What was wrong with TS's graphics? Besides the frame rate and textures on a FEW character models, the game looked great. I thought the textures on Liquid Snake in some scenes almost looked as a good a next generation game. The shadows were amazing too, but made me wished they were used more often instead of areas, like the armory.

 

[SantaC]

I have nothing against dark10x. I think he is a good poster and a nice guy, but I think he is too strict when it comes to RE4, plus that I think he should wait to form his final graphic opinion after he played the full game. Not basing everything on an outdated demo.

 

[dark10x]

I have nothing against dark10x. I think he is a good poster and nice guy, but I think he is too strict when it comes to RE4, plus that I think he should wait to form his final graphic opinion after he played the full game. Not basing everything on an outdated demo.

Alright, I'll give RE4 a break.

It's just that it looks so good that some of the flaws really end up sticking out more than they should.

Halo 2's visuals are loaded with problems, though. I've never suggested otherwise. Of course, most of my Halo 2 discussion didn't even occur on the GAF.

 

[-=::[Eagle-Vision]::=-]

There was a scan with Leon's wire, the amount of triangles was just ridiculus.

RE4 is easily the best looking console game based on polish alone. The attention to detail is simply unmatched.

I agree.

 

[SantaC]

plus that Leon looks like a bad ass modern hero.

 

[olimario]

Attention to detail? I haven't seen more attention to detail than in the Metroid Prime titles.

 

[SantaC]

Attention to detail? I haven't seen more attention to detail than in the Metroid Prime titles.

It's pretty clear that RE4 have more attention to detail than Metroid Prime 2 does.

You might as well bring up pics of Samus vs Leon and compare.

 

[JasoNsider]

It's pretty clear that RE4 have more attention to detail than Metroid Prime 2 does.

You might as well bring up pics of Samus vs Leon and compare.

Is this bizarro world? From what I've played of RE4, it doesn't hold a candle in the "attention to detail" department. Though, I would say that both Metroid Prime titles are in a league of their own for that category (MGS3 very close).

 

[olimario]

It's pretty clear that RE4 have more attention to detail than Metroid Prime 2 does.

You might as well bring up pics of Samus vs Leon and compare.

How do you figure such a thing? Each room in the Metroid Prime titles is unique, insanely detailed, and recognizably different from the last. The overworld design is huge, brillaint, and laid out perfectly to allow you to progress and unlock secrets as you make your way through the game.

I just don't see what kind of attention to detail you're talking about. In the models? In the level design?

 

[SantaC]

Is this bizarro world? From what I've played of RE4, it doesn't hold a candle in the "attention to detail" department. Though, I would say that both Metroid Prime titles are in a league of their own for that category (MGS3 very close).

Well Metroid Prime has nice attention to detail, but it uses a fantasy setting. RE4 goes a step further and use real enviroments.

Atleast what GMR said:

If you can’t tell from the screenshots, you’ll believe it in motion: RE4 is the best-looking game around. Ninja Gaiden may look a bit slicker, but that game is made up almost entirely of fantasy-based environments. RE4 goes a step further by constructing a remote (don't read ahead if you don't want locations spoiled for you)

ok ok that might have nothing to do with attention to detail, but still.

How do you figure such a thing? Each room in the Metroid Prime titles is unique, insanely detailed, and recognizably different from the last. The overworld design is huge, brillaint, and laid out perfectly to allow you to progress and unlock secrets as you make your way through the game.

ah so you meant Metroid Prime 1? I remember you saying that MP2E looked very bland. (except Sanctuary fortress)

 

[olimario]

That GMR comment is stupid. I would give more credit to those who can create a wonderful fantasy environment and not base it on anything in real life. It seems easier to visit a place, take a bunch of pictures, and model your game after it than it is to come up with completely new and unique places, draw them out, then model your game after that.

 

[SantaC]

That GMR comment is stupid. I would give more credit to those who can create a wonderful fantasy environment and not base it on anything in real life. It seems easier to visit a place, take a bunch of pictures, and model your game after it than it is to come up with completely new and unique places, draw them out, then model your game after that.

On the contrary; a real setting would be more open for nitpicking than a fantasy setting since it's "real" (sorry it was hard for me to say it in correct english )

Oh well everybody has an opinion, and Metroid Prime do have amazing details. So I give up arguing for now. I gotta go

 

[Deg]

I'm sick of all this graphical talk bullshit. :lol

 

[Timbuktu]

That GMR comment is stupid. I would give more credit to those who can create a wonderful fantasy environment and not base it on anything in real life. It seems easier to visit a place, take a bunch of pictures, and model your game after it than it is to come up with completely new and unique places, draw them out, then model your game after that.

Somehow I don't think that's what they did for RE4, maybe that's the case with GT4 or The Getaway, but I doubt there places in RE4 actually exist ; )
It's harder IMO to paint a convincing portrait than it is to paint a convincing ghost, as SantaCruzer said, we're more nitpicking with things we know. But making something 'convincing' is a technical craft and has nothing to do with artistic merit. From what we're hearing, it seems that RE4 has both. I think that the art in 'realistic' games are easy to take for granted since they have to be subtle and not look out of place. The artists in RE4 have shown perfect restrain.

 

[AssMan]

BUT, BUT, BUT, LEON HAD FUR ON HIS JACKET IN THE OLD RE4 BUILD!

 

[Buggy Loop]

Leon imo is the best looking male model of this gen, up there along Snake.

 

[Deg]

I agree the model is superb.

 

[dark10x]

Yeah, that's one area where the game certainly excels. The models are fantastic looking.

 

[cybamerc]

The Metroid Prime games look spectacular as well. The uniqueness of the various locations down to each specific room is astonishing. But RE4 has a similar quality to it (from what I've seen) while offering much higher detail and trying to mimic something you'd see in the real world. While other games may challenge RE4 in certain aspects I don't think there's anything on another console that does everything as well as RE4.

 

[Goreomedy]

I'm also impressed with RE4's particle system.

Many times during the demo, after I've climbed the tower for some more shotgun shells, I'm met at the bottom of the ladder by a group of 5 enemies. Last time I played, I dropped an incendiary grenade at my feet to clear them out. The fire engulfed all of us, so I was able to see up-close-and-personal the damage being done to them. Beautiful. No slowdown either, which surprised me.

 

[duckroll]

Is there any confirmation that IGN's 20 hour count for RE4 is remotely accurate? Not to doubt it (after all MGS3 surprised us all by being actually 18-20+ hours long) but what do other reviewers say? Have we hear from EGM yet?

Edit: Oh and about dark10x, I'll just have to say, I've come to accept his visual standards to be around the level of my polish/storytelling standards. He has very high ones and loves to rat on things that bug his eyes, I think RE4 looks great and don't go spotting for flaws, but at the same time he could enjoy SO3, and other games that I couldn't remotely stomach because well, the story and polish is abyssmal.

 

[Goreomedy]

Gamespy:

Over the course of the 20+ hour adventure, Leon will be required to learn what motivates and afflicts them, take them down, and save the girl. It's all in a day's work for a former member of S.T.A.R.S., right? You better believe it.

GMR:

This basic premise provides the backdrop against which 25-plus hours (You read that right) of the tightest, most tension-filled gameplay you’ve ever experienced unfolds.

MarkMacD(of EGM):

My clock was around 23 hours at the end, but I took my sweet time. Still, it's easily the longest and biggest RE game ever, by a wide margin. I'd say @20 hours will be the average time....

 

[dark10x]

Edit: Oh and about dark10x, I'll just have to say, I've come to accept his visual standards to be around the level of my polish/storytelling standards. He has very high ones and loves to rat on things that bug his eyes, I think RE4 looks great and don't go spotting for flaws, but at the same time he could enjoy SO3, and other games that I couldn't remotely stomach because well, the story and polish is abyssmal.

Ha ha, that's a great way to look at it.

 

[duckroll]

Wow, great to know that RE4 is actually LONGER than RE:CV. Should be awesome!

 

[maximum360]

RE4 is $38 with FREE ground shipping on outpost.com

I ordered yesterday.

 

[Floyd]

Dark lol you really do love going into the greatest detail to explain yourself. I admire your commitment.

You make a lot of good points on graphics and seem really committed to perfection, its just a shame your obvious hatred for Nintendo fans makes you go overboard sometimes.

 

[DSN2K]

Oilmario you really want to hate this game dont you ? :lol

 

[Master Z]

20+ hours? Nice. I beat Code Veronica in 13 hours my first time through and I thought that was a pretty long quest (the first time anyway). It's gonna be a bitch to beat RE4 in three hours...

 

[GamerDiva]

I'm sick of all this graphical talk bullshit. :lol

I saw the commercial last night for the first time ever and was shocked how truly amazing the graphics looked.

 

[raYne]

dark10x, xbot in disguise, dark10x, biased in the eyes.. tananana nananana the decepticons..

:lol!

 

[Fantasmo]

The two most important quotes in this (dark10x) thread are:

.... gaming visuals are always about fooling an audience ... Capcom has thought up some 'cheap' tricks to make things look great, but they're nothing that other developers couldn't have done by putting more effort into art direction and trying new techniques...

Thinking about it so technically can only hurt your enjoyment of a game that is obviously visually stunning.... Capcom puts lots and lots of energy into their art direction, I have complete faith that RE4 will look just as good on ps2 (unless you pick it appart technically)....

And this:

Here's the difference between you (random forum member) and dark10x: You see the graphical anomalies, but you couldn't give a shit, because you still enjoy the game. Meanwhile, dark10x is sitting in his dark bedroom in his basement and is inundated with color banding, dithering, low-res textures, seams, clipping, etc. so much so, that he decides to immediately log into his computer and nitpick on GAF about things that happen in every game, on every console, due to either restrictions in hardware or developer limits.

What's the point in posting what you post when mostly everyone sees exactly what you see? You think you have some kind of 6th sense that only allows you to see the minor visual decline in RE4? I don't understand you. You were at your worst when Splinter Cell came out for PC.

The game you bought is the game you have to deal with. We all see the graphical (and otherwise) incongruities in games. They're there, they stay there, there's not much you can do about it. Pointing and complaining does nothing.

Ever thought of making a website with a games database where you point out every instance of dithering, banding, DOF irregularities, etc.? That would be interesting.

Everything else graphically is arguing for the sake of arguing.

 

[mrkgoo]

The only problem I have with the presentation of RE4 is the fact that it is so realistic, that flaws in the gameplay department can stick out like a sore thumb. For me, Silent Hill 2 (my first in the series) had fanatastic atmosphere and awesome graphics (if my memory serves me well, it probably still looks pretty good), but because it was so realistic, little things like not being able to climb a small fence, or invisible walls on a small path really took me out of the world (I guess naff controls and gameplay mechanics had their part too).

I fear that isn't the case for RE4.

 

[GaimeGuy]

Holy shit. His head is like 3000 polys.

 

[-SRV-]

RE4 looks great. It looks appropriate. I don't care how it stacks vis a vis *insert title*. I may down the road for silly argument's sake. But, the ratings are through the roof. I have had this game on preorder for months. I'm a happy man.

 

[Naked Snake]

Why is SantaCruZer allowed near a computer with internet connection?

 

[shantyman]

If you have a widescreen TV and use the zoom feature you won't see text displayed in game because it will be cut off. Capcom should be raked over the coals for this. I made a thread about this subject, and am still surprised so many people are defending them.

 

[Musashi Wins!]

Why is SantaCruZer allowed near a computer with internet connection?

I think it's a ploy by Microsoft.

 

[Deg]

I dont think people care THAT much.

I saw the commercial last night for the first time ever and was shocked how truly amazing the graphics looked.

Stop it. Its terrible

 

[Buggy Loop]

If you have a widescreen TV and use the zoom feature you won't see text displayed in game because it will be cut off. Capcom should be raked over the coals for this. I made a thread about this subject, and am still surprised so many people are defending them.

What makes you say that? It doesnt make sense, there's black bars in its 4:3 image, it only cuts into the black bars with a good zoom, it doesnt go cut into the gameplay image. Matt from IGN said it zooms perfectly, i assume that means it doesnt cut into the image at all (depending on TV of course), it would cut them off had it not been for the black bars.

 

[koam]

What makes you say that? It doesnt make sense, there's black bars in its 4:3 image, it only cuts into the black bars with a good zoom, it doesnt go cut into the gameplay image. Matt from IGN said it zooms perfectly, i assume that means it doesnt cut into the image at all (depending on TV of course), it would cut them off had it not been for the black bars.

action commands get displayed in the black bars area.