Lostconfused
Member
Playing against someone good makes it even more depressing when you realize that you've been losing against scrubs the entire day.
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Persona 4 Arena Ultimax |OT| It's SHO time!
- Thread starter FluxWaveZ
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If you're feeling discouraged and at a loss, I suggest saving match videos and rewatch them.
If anything, I'm sure other people can help you if you show them the vid and ask for help.
Lostconfused
Member
The problem is that I am just far too new to fighting games, I can't do any of the basic things that are expect of you when you play them.
This makes things like character choice even more complicated, did I pick the character that's wrong for me and that's why I am having such a tough time? Does a character choice really matter at the bare bottom skill level?
This makes things like character choice even more complicated, did I pick the character that's wrong for me and that's why I am having such a tough time? Does a character choice really matter at the bare bottom skill level?
Yo what is up with a lot of Minazukis and spamming teleport? There's a whole lot of them.
Character choice does matter at the bare bottom skill level simply due to some characters having a lower barrier of entry due to their mechanics or skills.
If you feel like a character is right for you, just keep at it and don't feel discouraged so much. You can do it. This is the dilemma that new...actually, all fighting game players have. Taking an L just means that you need to up your game, and it's common in all of us.
Man losing sucks
Character choice does matter at the bare bottom skill level simply due to some characters having a lower barrier of entry due to their mechanics or skills.
If you feel like a character is right for you, just keep at it and don't feel discouraged so much. You can do it. This is the dilemma that new...actually, all fighting game players have. Taking an L just means that you need to up your game, and it's common in all of us.
Man losing sucks
Lostconfused
Member
That's one of the best tools he has? You cross people up or not, if they start DPing you can spend meter to make the teleport safe and block the DP then punish. The teleport on its surface is a rather balanced game mechanic that involves a lot of decision making and mind games. Which is what fighting games are about, I think, maybe?
At your level, pick anyone that you feel like you're willing to spend time with. Don't worry about character viability right now since it won't matter as much until later on (and even then, that's more for high level tourney play). There might be better choices than others since some might lack some tools, but I feel like choosing a character you can feel in sync with is most important and what's fun in fighters.
Lostconfused
Member
The problem here is that I feel like I end up picking the characters that are wrong for the way I play and I end up just having a rough time but then I don't feel like spending the effort in learning anyone else.
I'd take some suggestions from Flux because he played against me a bunch of times and has experience with a bunch of characters. But then again recommending characters to anyone is extremely hard outside of just "this is the most basic character so just use it".
It may be a good tool but oh lord do people spam it. Good minazukis hurt so much though.
I always choose characters that are technical as hell and I end up dropping them
RIP Bridget and BB hood, I hardly knew ye.
Not everyone gets it right the first time when choosing a character. Sometimes it takes awhile.
Maybe try asking yourself what type of gameplan do you want to accomplish? Zoning, being in their face, etc., and work your way from there. I'm sure quite a bit of people here are willing to help you. Just need to ask the right (and specific) questions if you want to get better.
I feel you on the character choice problem, Lost. Hell, I think Persona is the only game where I struggled significantly trying to find a good fit (and still would not say Naoto feels the best, but it's better than nothing). And the main character I really wanted to try to learn is far beyond my skill and execution level at the moment (Yukari).
Lostconfused
Member
I think my problem is that I might be coming at fighting games with the wrong attitude in the first place.
I am really passive and don't have any plan of attack against other players. My offense is really weak, I just kinda spam things that I think are safe even if they aren't like long range projectile spam or normals at around mid screen . I prefer to play a defensive/reactive game even if my reactions are really bad. This is how I play all fighting games, Persona and SF4, I don't even know if there is a character fit for that or I just need to get over this habit.
I am really passive and don't have any plan of attack against other players. My offense is really weak, I just kinda spam things that I think are safe even if they aren't like long range projectile spam or normals at around mid screen . I prefer to play a defensive/reactive game even if my reactions are really bad. This is how I play all fighting games, Persona and SF4, I don't even know if there is a character fit for that or I just need to get over this habit.
If you're a passive player on offense that likes to threaten people by just looking at them while tossing out dangerous stuff and reacting to other players, then you should definitely play Narukami. He has the boss mode aura going on that creates fear in all who face him no matter what he's doing. Sounds like your style to me.
If you're looking for something somewhat passive, maybe a character that's more of a low risk would work best that'll let the opponent play at your pace. Have you given Teddie a shot? He doesn't really have a high/low mixup game and you get access to some good normals and items to annoy opponents.
If that's not to your liking, there's also Narukami. You can afford to be patient and create opportunities with air Zio. With moves like 5B and 2C being backdash cancelable, you don't have to commit too hard all the time with him if you're not comfortable with that. He might help you on your offense once you knock your opponent down too.
Lostconfused
Member
The problem with Narukami is that I can't find any easy combos for him. So at best if I were to try and play him it would be just mash A.
Seconding this. Yu is just really good and safe character. Hands down the least stressful fighter in the entire game.
I hate to break it you man, but his combos are incredibly easy. (At least in comparison to the other characters). The trick is to your work your way up; trying to perform his more advanced combos right off the bat is a bad idea if you don't have a feel for the character.
I'd start off with something like:
Simple midscreen meterless combo. After you got down, work on combos that require meter:
Simple midscreen OMC combo. There are more optimal combos, but for now i'd work on at least mastering this. Moving away from the autocombo is crucial, as Yu's autocombo only deals 2.5k whereas that particular OMC combo does 3.2k.
Don't hesitate to use the Yu combo thread on dustloop. It's a great resource.
Lostconfused
Member
This is impossible because I haven't seen a fighting game yet with combos easier than Minazuki's.
And yeah I looked at the dustloop thread. It didn't help, everything seemed overly difficult and specific.
Perhaps. I've personally had trouble getting his more complex combos down, such as:
But YMMV. I could probably get it with some practice.
In any case, Yu's combos are fairly straightforward.
Lostconfused
Member
Right he has complex combos, but you don't really need them. His basic BnBs go from 2K to 4K with 50 meter and he has really simple 3K punish on a counter hit. Plus if you really want to you can still use the combo listed above anyway as it will hit and continue unless the person techs it right away.
You can go for complex combos, but you don't have to. You can just save that meter for an easier combo with a super.
In fact this is exactly what I am complaining about. I need simple easy to do combos that will carry me for the early part of the game. I don't need every combo possible and especially not the difficult ones.
Interface23
Member
So I think I should practice offline or something, I win one out of like 10 matches and only as Kanji by luck >_<
If you really want to learn Narukami, I can teach you Narukami.
Lostconfused
Member
Lol I am already reluctant to give up my 2 week Minazuki but I'll take whatever advice I can get.
No need to fear, Narukami's combos are easy and were definitely designed to be easy. As a person with (very) bad execution myself (I can land Minazuki's teleport air-to-ground combo, like 1/20 times) I had no trouble with Narukami. The cool thing about his simple-ness is that extending his combos once you're in the corner is a very natural thing.
And as for footsies... well, it's Narukami. He's a pretty funny guy. I'm sure you'll get him pretty quick.
--
On another note, I've been watching more top Minazukis recently, and I noticed they rely on the knife a lot more than I do. Not at full screen, but to end midscreen blockstrings. That's pretty smart for lockdown. I'm a bit nervous cause I know the knife is negative at closer range and have been blown up for trying to cancel into it recklessly before. Looks like it comes down to spacing.
Other notes; ending a close string in sweep is actually fairly safe and tends to catch people off guard.
2D is great for a respect move. Stronger players keep an eye out for it. But for players that like to hold forward to get in that ass, it's a really nasty move. Mitsuru players in particular sure don't like blocking, I think my success rate of teleports and 2D is about 500% higher on Mitsuru players.
Lastly; I read up on the fuzzy and throw OS. But it's not as easy to implement as I thought it would be. Like I thought, doing that motion while blocking feels a bit unnatural. But I'll keep trying to get used to it. In the heat of the moment, it's easy to forget to implement it.
And as for footsies... well, it's Narukami. He's a pretty funny guy. I'm sure you'll get him pretty quick.
--
On another note, I've been watching more top Minazukis recently, and I noticed they rely on the knife a lot more than I do. Not at full screen, but to end midscreen blockstrings. That's pretty smart for lockdown. I'm a bit nervous cause I know the knife is negative at closer range and have been blown up for trying to cancel into it recklessly before. Looks like it comes down to spacing.
Other notes; ending a close string in sweep is actually fairly safe and tends to catch people off guard.
2D is great for a respect move. Stronger players keep an eye out for it. But for players that like to hold forward to get in that ass, it's a really nasty move. Mitsuru players in particular sure don't like blocking, I think my success rate of teleports and 2D is about 500% higher on Mitsuru players.
Lastly; I read up on the fuzzy and throw OS. But it's not as easy to implement as I thought it would be. Like I thought, doing that motion while blocking feels a bit unnatural. But I'll keep trying to get used to it. In the heat of the moment, it's easy to forget to implement it.
Lostconfused
Member
Yeah the Minazuki teleport into 5A is a link, so you have to press the button after the hit out of teleport but before landing to get it to connect. I don't think you have to micro dash for it to connect, you just have to omit 2B from the combo as you won't be in range for the 2nd hit on it. Unless they were still holding back and just walked right into you heh.
Yeah the sweep is a 2 hit so some people get caught by that, it also gives you plenty of space. If they do get tagged by the sweep, you can easily go into the rekka from it. Personally 2D is way too dangerous for me, there is too much recovery on it.
Yeah the sweep is a 2 hit so some people get caught by that, it also gives you plenty of space. If they do get tagged by the sweep, you can easily go into the rekka from it. Personally 2D is way too dangerous for me, there is too much recovery on it.
"It's time you burn that dread!"
Every time I turn the game on, I immediately head online to play some matches, but I should really force myself to go into training mode instead next time. I prefer learning from actual matches, but there's certain things I could hammer out and optimize in training mode that I'm not taking the time to do.
Personally I admire players who can learn a lot just by feeling out in matches. I'm a lab guy and it shows; too much freezing up during real fighting. When shit hits the fan and chaos strikes I'm usually on the losing end.
Also I burned my bread. Thanks, Flux.
SquirrelSoup
Member
As a completely new Mitsuru player i can confirm a 101% hit rate of these moves on me.
=(
Yea so Lost... Just faced you with my shadow junpei and man... you need a lot of work. Not saying that I'm the greatest but you felt so stiff throughout the match. My junpei really needs work but you gotta stop relying on those autocombos man, you'll get knowhere with those there are much simpler combos that you can do meterless that will do the exact same job.
Lostconfused
Member
I am starting to think I am trying to block too much. I can't react to over heads or tech throws. Might as well just mash A and hope for random hits, I'd probably have a better chance with that.
So how's Yukiko's control of the screen space and long range game? I think that's what I need, a good zoning character that can control the screen and limit opponents movement and options. So either something like Ken, Yukiko, Margaret. Which one is better or easier.
So how's Yukiko's control of the screen space and long range game? I think that's what I need, a good zoning character that can control the screen and limit opponents movement and options. So either something like Ken, Yukiko, Margaret. Which one is better or easier.
Mr Fahrenheit
Member
None of them are particularly easy, but Ken is probably the easiest of them, I also think he's a lot of fun to play. Margaret isn't a zoning character either, she also has a very unorthodox neutral game and that sounds like it's where your having issues, so that might not be the best choice.
Who do you play as now?
Lostconfused
Member
Minazuki, because its a super easy character to play. However you still need to have some familiarity with fighting games lol. But I don't have the experience, or the reactions, needed to fall back on for rapid decision making trying to mix some up or being stuck in a block string your self.
After getting double perfected yesterday online, I've been thinking if playing at a longer range with more of a focus on space control would offset my weaknesses somewhat.
Mr Fahrenheit
Member
I've never seen you play so it'd be hard to give you anything besides really generic advice, but you should just DP through block strings because there's a good chance it isn't a true block string and that's its entire purpose, just don't do it so much that you have half a bar of blue health.
The tournament is now live!
Report your results to me once you've completed your match. Preferably on GAF, but any of the contact methods I've listed on Challonge will suffice. You can also contact me through Challonge.
As I said earlier, the number of rounds that must be completed by each day (Friday/Saturday/Sunday) would be determined after the bracket was finalized.
Remember, we are playing this out this week/weekend (ending on Sunday, October 19).
So here's what I've decided to do...
By the end of Friday (11:59 PM CDT), Winners Round 1 and 2 must be completed, along with Losers Round 1 and 2.
By the end of Saturday (11:59 CDT), Winners Round 3 must be completed, along with Losers Round 3 and 4.
On Sunday (by 11:59 CDT), we'll wrap things up, so that means Winners Finals (Semifinals on Challonge), Losers Round 5 and Finals (Semifinals on Challonge), and Grand Finals (Finals on Challonge).
Although not required, I encourage people to play their matches out as soon as possible.
If you cannot complete your matches by the specified days and times, you will be disqualified, no exceptions. If neither player in a pair is able to play, both will be disqualified.
Again, while it is recommended that you play your matches as soon as possible, you will not face any penalties until Friday at the earliest.
Have fun everyone!
Report your results to me once you've completed your match. Preferably on GAF, but any of the contact methods I've listed on Challonge will suffice. You can also contact me through Challonge.
As I said earlier, the number of rounds that must be completed by each day (Friday/Saturday/Sunday) would be determined after the bracket was finalized.
Remember, we are playing this out this week/weekend (ending on Sunday, October 19).
So here's what I've decided to do...
By the end of Friday (11:59 PM CDT), Winners Round 1 and 2 must be completed, along with Losers Round 1 and 2.
By the end of Saturday (11:59 CDT), Winners Round 3 must be completed, along with Losers Round 3 and 4.
On Sunday (by 11:59 CDT), we'll wrap things up, so that means Winners Finals (Semifinals on Challonge), Losers Round 5 and Finals (Semifinals on Challonge), and Grand Finals (Finals on Challonge).
Although not required, I encourage people to play their matches out as soon as possible.
If you cannot complete your matches by the specified days and times, you will be disqualified, no exceptions. If neither player in a pair is able to play, both will be disqualified.
Again, while it is recommended that you play your matches as soon as possible, you will not face any penalties until Friday at the earliest.
Have fun everyone!
Tyrant Rave
Banned
GGs Rean
I dropped a lot of combos, ugh. I've been playing too much Margaret in training. Got off a one more burst combo but I don't even think it was optimal-- I was just kind of winging it.
I dropped a lot of combos, ugh. I've been playing too much Margaret in training. Got off a one more burst combo but I don't even think it was optimal-- I was just kind of winging it.
Good stuff Rean.
You shouldn't be going for so many full screen Raging Lions, and try and approach on the ground sometimes.
You've got your combos down, but you definitely need to work on your defense.
We can play in a little bit, if you're up or it.
You shouldn't be going for so many full screen Raging Lions, and try and approach on the ground sometimes.
You've got your combos down, but you definitely need to work on your defense.
Whenever the winner of Busaiku vs Rean is decided, I'll be ready
We can play in a little bit, if you're up or it.
yea ggs, I still have to figure out what I can do to play narukami better. I also lost my first match of the tournament so I have to learn quickly.
Ragingnight
Member
Too late to entee? I forgot. But if so then its cool. Ill body flux some other day. #fluxsux.
yeah right, I would be in a body bag so fast
Ragingnight
Member
It's cool. I know ill probably place the same area anyways
SquirrelSoup
Member
Margaret going ham is surprisingly hard to deal with. =x
Lostconfused
Member
As expected, moving on to the losers bracket.
Nice and quick on the bracket updates.
Don't be too hard on yourself, you got a game.
Don't be too hard on yourself, you got a game.