you could try enabling dynamic contrast or lowering the backlight setting to see if it makes any difference
Plasma, LCD, OLED, LED, best tv for next gen
- Thread starter spannicus
- Start date
I have one, due to the way our biological optic systems work all sample and hold screens work they smear if content doesn't flicker or change. It has nothing to do with response times (which I agree are superb and help the blur be very even), and I agree it's not trails left behind objects - it's a lack of pin sharp motion such as is created by things like strobe lights and short exposure photography. I agree with Dark, this is a dangerous myth to perpetuate.
Then you've most likely never owned a CRT television.
Changing topics, I tested an LG 2016 E6 OLED with PC icon input label mode and it feels fine to me from an input lag perspective, though I understand some have leo bodnar tested it as worse than game console icon mode, or in combination with game mode, and it does indeed add an Auto option to the black level setting. Unfortunately the auto mode doesn't seem to set the level correctly for PS3 (set to Limited) and WiiU (Also set to Limited), it just defaults them to Full. Xbox One in Recommended (Limited) and PS4 in Auto (Full) both seem to work ok.
Unfortunately the Auto option disappears when the TV receives an HDR signal..so in combo with the PS3/WiiU problem above makes it less than ideal.
holygeesus
Banned
How many more times? It is *not* smearing. Nor is it motion blur. Please take the time to research what both of those terms mean.
Motion Blur http://uk.rtings.com/tv/tests/motion/motion-blur-and-response-time
There is no trail on moving objects with these sets. Response time is important because the quicker it is, the less trail behind objects on quick movement, because the pixels change more rapidly. In the case of these sets 0.1 is about as good as you will get.
Check the motion blur score for all these sets at the link provided.
From another review from a respected site http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/oled65g6v-201608304343.htm
Any blur seen on movement, with these sets, is typical of 300 resolution motion on any set. You have the option to up the levels to 650 but risk artefacts. Any blur you are seeing is not motion blur by it's very definition, and if you are seeing trails, during motion, there is something wrong with your set or maybe you need to check your settings.
Art Vandilay
Member
How stark is the difference in regards to input lag between the B6 and C6? I'm almost certainly picking up one of these around Black Friday, but I can't decide which. I don't care about 3D, and I'm not a big fan of the curve. However, it's my understanding that the C6 uses the same SoC as the E6 and G6, and as such has better input lag. I've just been unable to find exactly how much better the lag is, especially with the most recent firmware updates.
ISF Light/Dark are going to be the most accurate out of the box.
I don't mind fiddling around for the Initial Setup. I just don't want to change settings for everyday use.
So what Else would you propose to change?
NYR
Member
I like putting up OLED to 100. Brightness should be lower as a result, I have it at 57. Good test case for me was kill bill vol 2 when she is about to be buried underground. The sky is supposed to be pitch black and you should see the sky blend into the black borders (truly a holy shit moment when you see the black is so damn black). Going anything past led to noise and grey in the night sky.
I keep color low, in the low 50s.
Contrast is a tough one that I have played with. I used the Xbox One test pattern and put it to 90, which I can see some people saying its too high but it works for me.
Keep in mind you can always reset to Inital so play with the settings! The biggest mistake people do is find settings online and put them in. Every room will be different. I put in rtings.com settings and it mademoiselle everything static-like and blocky!
What are you even talking about? I didn't use the term smearing in my post. You claimed there was no smearing OR motion blur but there is very clearly blur.
I said this...
Then you linked to that review for some reason. They claim it's "perfect" yet they're showing evidence to the contrary. That is a blurry logo right there in their review. I certainly don't need a review to explain this to me, however, since it's plain as day.
holygeesus
Banned
That's because you don't know what motion blur is. They explain it in the review I linked to. The blur you are seeing is a side effect of sample and hold, it isn't motion blur.
DJ Lushious
Member
LOL, that's rich! I can't wait to see the response to this!
Perhaps you should learn to read. I never actually called it 'motion blur'.
I said "blur". Period. I even said this earlier...
So I said the same thing earlier but somehow you've completely ignored it.
Still, telling me that I don't know what motion blur is...that's rich. Oh wise expert, please teach me the way of technology. I couldn't possibly know what I'm talking about.
holygeesus
Banned
I said 'there is no motion blur' you said that it was 'untrue' - I then went on to defend my point that you called 'disingenuous' - perhaps you should take your own advice! Read what I wrote.
I'm not sure if you're aware but he actually works for Digital Foundry, you know the guys that arguably provide some of the most indepth comparisons between games, as well as hardware etc.
Without taking away from anyone else on this forum (as there are many knowledgeable people) I think it's safe to say that he is aware what motion blur is.
With regards to oled and blur, as has already been mentioned they all have blurring during motion, this is simply because of the sample and hold. There are slight improvements to be had if you enable frame interpolation but that brings it's own set of disadvantages such as artifacts, increased input lag etc. Black frame interpolation is something that will help but it's not really widely implemented in oled as of yet.
As things stand though, in terms of detail resolved during motion an oled and lcd are on par, they both natively resolve around 300 lines of motion resolution. Oled is more tolerable due to the lack of trailing and smearing on top of the blur.
With regards to "smearing", "trailing" etc oleds do not exhibit these issues as the pixel response times are pretty much zero, so you're never going to see purple smearing on dark scenes like what you would see on a VA panel on an lcd for example.
Plasma (and crt) is still to this day the best with regards to motion handling, however the main negative for me is when feeding them low framerate content. You tend to see double imaging and judder when panning. Other display technologies display this too, however the blur minimises this effect so a 30fps game is more pleasing to me on an oled and lcd than it is on a plasma. With 60fps content however then there's no contest, plasma generally resolves all the detail during panning.
holygeesus
Banned
I'm perfectly aware of who he, thank you. I say again, there is no motion blur on these sets. There is no smearing on these sets. If you still maintain there is, then you don't know what either term is.
Did I say there was no blurring? No, I did not. I categorically said 'motion blur' and 'smearing' and was accused of being disingenuous and untruthful, whereas what I said is perfectly accurate.
I think you're focusing too much on the label. Some people refer to blurring they see on a display as motion blur, whether the term is correct or not is neither here nor there. The fact is that an oled natively produces around 300 lines of motion resolution, which is the same as an lcd. Frame interpolation and black frame insertion are band aids that can improve it, but as we've established lcds then have smearing and trailing on top of any loss in resolution during motion.
I've not once said there was smearing on oled tvs. There's not due to the near instant pixel response time. I'm well aware what smearing is and have witnessed it on many lcd displays, especially VA panels which are notorious for it due to the slower response times in certain pixel transitions. Newer VA panels have seen improvements but they aren't really near TN or IPS panels in that regard, but those panel types have their own negatives. I still personally prefer VA panels due to their lower mll and generally better uniformity.
I have witnessed smearing on some oled displays though, such as various samsung devices, the way the displays are driven seems to cause purple smearing on dark greys against black backgrounds when scrolling.
I own a EC930V (EC9300) and while there is no smearing, 60fps games are nowhere near as good as the VT65 I owned, on top of that while the black levels are incredible, the above black performance is terrible. On the lower levels of the greyscale I have lots of vertical bands and streaks. This manifests itself on panning shots on darker uniform colours. I'm also very sensitive to the screen door effect that's apparent due to the pixel structure LG have used on their 1080p oleds. It wasn't all good with the plasma though, I hated the line bleed, dynamic false contouring, the buzzing on bright scenes, the aggressive abl, and the sheer heat it put out.
I've been tempted to upgrade to a 4k set for a while but I'm still seeing issues with uniformity, and motion handling still isn't where I'd like it to be.
You are basically arguing semantics here and I don't think it helsp your case.
Your statement might lead people to believe there is no blurring of any sort on these displays. That was my issue there as I felt it was misleading. Arguing over the inclusion of the word "motion" before "blur" is stupid simply because most folks READING your statement won't necessarily understand the difference. The sample and hold blur you see on OLED TVs can only be observed in motion, after all, so surely you can understand the confusion.
I COMPLETELY disagree with you on this point as well. 300 lines of motion resolution on OLED displays is not superior to plasma displays. This is disingenuous and untruthful.
Your statement is basically leading people to believe that they will see better motion than anything else on the market when that just is not true. CRTs and plasma displays are still capable of outperforming LG's OLED displays when it comes to motion resolution.
Yeah when it comes to high framerate content, plasma is still superior. On a 60fps game my Panasonic resolved pretty much every single drop of detail. If I panned the camera around in a 60fps game say call of duty, everything remained clear as day.
The only time I prefer the way motion is handled on an oled (and lcd) is in low framerate content. I find the blur helps mask (and soften) any double imaging when panning the camera in 30fps games on an lcd.
Panning the camera in a 30fps game is not pleasant for me on a plasma. Because there's no blur at all, the double imaging and judder of low framerate content on plasmas is very jarring.
DJ Lushious
Member
holygeesus
Banned
No, hang on. I made a statement specifically about motion blur you then came blustering in with claims of untruthfulness that I didn't appreciate. What I said was 100% accurate.
I can't really have any control over what people read into my comment. Again, there is nothing stupid about accurately describing a facet of these sets. Motion blur is a descriptive term used to describe trailing of objects upon fast motion. It is directly related to pixel response time, which on these sets is near instantaneous, hence no motion blur.
No motion blur makes it superior to plasma by my own definition of 'superior'. My plasma did not have near instantaneous pixel response time. If motion resolution is your prime consideration, then you may have a different definition. Motion blur *was* an issue on my plasma, because it had a significantly slower pixel response time. So hence, I prefer the motion of an OLED.
Now you are making things up. Where did I say motion resolution is superior on an OLED? Again, you are reading things that aren't there. If you would choose a plasma or a CRT over one of these sets, then more power to you.
Insane Metal
Member
I have a doubt: I put the brightness on my Samsung Plasma 60" F5500 usually at 45 or 50, but I just got the XBone and I used the HDTV image calibration tool it has in its general configurations menu, and according to it, I should set the brightness at 27... wth? Is it common to have it this low?
OK, so the fact that it blurs in motion due to sample and hold is not an issue for you then. Fair enough.
It's obviously not a huge issue for me either as I purchased an OLED TV less than two months ago and mostly love it.
Now, you posted...
I feel it needs to be pointed out when discussing TVs on a gaming forum. If you play 60 frames per second games you will see blur like this. Detail is lost in motion at higher speeds compared to high-end plasma displays. While those image may not feature "trails" in the LCD sense, it still visibly lacks defined edges due to the sample and hold blur.
So you suggest...
...but the best plasmas are closer to 0.001 ms in addition to faster motion resolution.
The fact is, I love my OLED TV and would recommend it to many people but I also feel that its limitations need to be spelled out. When I switched from the Pioneer Kuro to the B6 OLED, I was taken by surprise by the additional blur visible on the display in motion and I feel others need to know. It's not like "motion blur" and "smearing" are technical terms to begin with.
What would SOLVE this on the OLED displays is something like black frame insertion. They are 120hz panels, after all, so enabling this for normal sources could dramatically improve motion handling and it's a shame that such an option is not available.
Which plasma were you using?
George Claw M.D.
Member
I have no good source on this, but from bits I've read elsewhere, Panasonic may be introducing some sort of BFI in their next gen OLEDs. Speculation is that current OLEDs don't have it because it would effectively halve the brightness of the set, which is something OLEDs already lag behind and would make them non-UHD by definition. Maybe next gen OLEDs will be brighter, and hopefully LG will follow suit for those of us in the U.S. if Panny doesn't bring their OLEDs stateside.
Theonik
Member
OLED is currently not bright enough to reproduce HDR content correctly even without BFI. BFI would only make it worse. (even with the shifted spec for OLED, good luck getting 0.0005nits in anything but a black room with dark clothing and chairs)
Next year's OLEDs might be better though and pricing might even come in line with LCD though by the sounds of it the later might still be ways off.
Next year's OLEDs might be better though and pricing might even come in line with LCD though by the sounds of it the later might still be ways off.
Insane Metal
Member
Panasonic just showed an OLED with 1000+ nits capability... I think it was last month? It was posted in this thread a few pages back.
More brightness certainly helps and is needed, but it's not as if LCD is currently that much higher in non-test screen images. I had posted the below in another thread:
dreamcastfan
Member
Well, I am excited. Just ordered the Vizio P75 C-1 this week, with delivery for next Tuesday. I am really looking forward to seeing the movies I have (4k bluray) in HDR and of course games (will pick up an xbox one S soon- yes I know about the current issue, but a firmware update is coming.). 
For the money, it seemed like the best balance of screen size/features I could find. Sony and Samsung make great sets, but with no Dolbyvision support, I didn't want to drop thousands on a TV that didn't support both. Super stoked.
For the money, it seemed like the best balance of screen size/features I could find. Sony and Samsung make great sets, but with no Dolbyvision support, I didn't want to drop thousands on a TV that didn't support both. Super stoked.people should go into stores and check the tv's they are buying instead of reading the specs... specs just tell a partial story.
This is exactly the reason why (as of this writing) my plasma will be my primary television until it dies. I've installed every LG OLED that has hit the US market numerous times and the perceptible blur is a deal breaker for me. I also loathe interpolation, so that's not an option.
And I too keep banging on about BFI implementation on OLED. I'd gladly give up excessive brightness/HDR for acceptable motion.
See no reason why BFI couldn't be implemented on current OLEDs. There's plenty of brightness overhead to do it in my opinion. I mean I run my set at about 40% of the max brightness and it's still plenty bright imo
LG hasn't cared much about this stuff in the past, so I think it's more just a matter of priorities. Perhaps they'll get around to adding it on next year's sets
LG hasn't cared much about this stuff in the past, so I think it's more just a matter of priorities. Perhaps they'll get around to adding it on next year's sets
The chances of BFI being included on LG oleds is very slim. Despite them using it on some of their lcds they made comments a while back that they felt it wasn't needed on oled displays.
The best bet is once more manufacturers start making oled tvs (most likely using LG displays). I'm looking forward to the day when more manufacturers start making oled displays, the way we have several making lcd panels such as innolux, samsung display, lg display, AU Optronics etc as that will drive the price of oled down. As things stand having only one manufacturer of panels is keeping costs relatively high (although oled prices have drastically reduced since the first gen came out.
As already mentioned Samsungs S9C oled used BFI with no real adverse effects. I'm not sure I agree with the notion that oleds can't go bright enough. I'm disappointed that Samsung felt oled tv's weren't a path they wanted to continue, especially considering they have been the one carrying the oled flag in mobile devices for some time now. I can see the reasoning though, their yields weren't great and so their profit margin was nowhere near their lcd tv business.
While it's true that lcds have managed to reach a higher peak brightness than current oleds, oleds still go plenty bright.
We mustn't forget that the peak brightness on lcds is almost a marketing band aid to try and increase dynamic range, they can't compete with oled in terms of minimum luminance, and even full array lcd sets aren't really comparable as they are still prone to many issues such as blooming etc.
I'd honestly rather have a HDR oled with less peak brightness and lower black levels than higher peak brightness and raised black levels. There comes a point when you can have too much brightness, especially when viewing in a dim room with controlled lighting. But you can never have blacks that are too low lol. There's no way anyone with an lcd would be like "Nah my black levels are good enough, I don't need them lower"
The best bet is once more manufacturers start making oled tvs (most likely using LG displays). I'm looking forward to the day when more manufacturers start making oled displays, the way we have several making lcd panels such as innolux, samsung display, lg display, AU Optronics etc as that will drive the price of oled down. As things stand having only one manufacturer of panels is keeping costs relatively high (although oled prices have drastically reduced since the first gen came out.
As already mentioned Samsungs S9C oled used BFI with no real adverse effects. I'm not sure I agree with the notion that oleds can't go bright enough. I'm disappointed that Samsung felt oled tv's weren't a path they wanted to continue, especially considering they have been the one carrying the oled flag in mobile devices for some time now. I can see the reasoning though, their yields weren't great and so their profit margin was nowhere near their lcd tv business.
While it's true that lcds have managed to reach a higher peak brightness than current oleds, oleds still go plenty bright.
We mustn't forget that the peak brightness on lcds is almost a marketing band aid to try and increase dynamic range, they can't compete with oled in terms of minimum luminance, and even full array lcd sets aren't really comparable as they are still prone to many issues such as blooming etc.
I'd honestly rather have a HDR oled with less peak brightness and lower black levels than higher peak brightness and raised black levels. There comes a point when you can have too much brightness, especially when viewing in a dim room with controlled lighting. But you can never have blacks that are too low lol. There's no way anyone with an lcd would be like "Nah my black levels are good enough, I don't need them lower"
Even if high end LCD's have higher peak brightness OLED's still offer the best HDR experience due to being able to control the full brightness range from true blacks to 600-700Nits pixel by pixel you end up with a higher dynamic range.
FlatPanelsHD write up on the matter explains it best:
FlatPanelsHD write up on the matter explains it best:
Jigolo
Member
http://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/lg/uh6500
FauxK blows. This shouldn't be a thing.
EDIT:
4K movies coming to Google Play in November
http://flatpanelshd.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=1475665903
New Chromecast does Dolby Vision
http://flatpanelshd.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=1475596616
FauxK blows. This shouldn't be a thing.
EDIT:
4K movies coming to Google Play in November
http://flatpanelshd.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=1475665903
New Chromecast does Dolby Vision
http://flatpanelshd.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=1475596616
It's always been marketing spiel.
It was the same story when "dynamic contrast ratios" used to be highlighted. The native contrast ratio of any lcd panel even VA is poor compared to any self-emissive technology be it CRT Plasma or Oled.
Manufacturers know that there's not a lot they can do at the lower end of the scale, full array is expensive to implement (hence why it's not that common), so the easiest thing to do is just make everything brighter.
For me personally resolution and peak brightness aren't that important for me in terms of what effect they have on image quality. I'd much rather watch a blu-ray on a KRP (Pioneer Elite), or ZT60 than any 4k lcd.
I personally think 4k is far too early, in the UK we barely have any 1080p content, cable companies broadcasts are really poor quality, and what little 4k material there from the likes of Netflix etc doesn't really compare to a good quality 1080p Blu-Ray. Yes I'm aware we've got 4k blu-rays but physical media is a dying breed. I'd have preferred companies focus on increasing the bit-rate of 1080p material before jumping ahead massively to 4k.
What's really laughable is the typical consumer that purchases a 4k tv tends to watch mainly sd content that is being upscaled (badly) anyway.
Funnily enough I feel that the new consoles are jumping the gun attempting 4k too, I'd much rather they had focused on improving the performance at 1080p, I'd have preferred to have the choice between a ps4 and 1080p 30fps at med to high settings, and a PS4 Pro at 1080p 60fps ultra settings. But instead we're going to have consoles at 1080p at low framerates or 4k at low framerates and lower graphical settings.
I get why they've done that as we're reaching a point where 4k adoption is only going to increase as 1080p tvs are a dying breed. It's not going to be long before it's impossible to purchase a brand new 1080p tv.
DJ Lushious
Member
You did good. You won't be disappointed by the Vizio P. I still am surprised at how good the picture quality is. As for not yet supporting the Xbox One S' HDR, at least we know a fix is coming. I'll give Vizio lots of credit for supporting their sets so well. Granted, it can be argued that an issue like the Xbox HDR is an issue, at least it is being addressed as quickly as it is.Well, I am excited. Just ordered the Vizio P75 C-1 this week, with delivery for next Tuesday. I am really looking forward to seeing the movies I have (4k bluray) in HDR and of course games (will pick up an xbox one S soon- yes I know about the current issue, but a firmware update is coming.).
Have you picked out what will be the first piece of content you view on it?
dreamcastfan
Member
Indeed I have. The Revenant 4K Bluray. I am really interested in seeing Forza Horizon 3 (Once I get a One S), having heard it's quite amazing with HDR.
Theonik
Member
The thing to remember though is that while the eye is much more sensitive for dark content, hence in the pre-HDR era we used the gamma function to represent this fact, content is still mastered on LCDs with up to 2000nits of brightness. The content is meant to be bright, the problem with how OLED sets at the moment deal with it is that even with their superior black performance, are not able to reach the required blacks in normal viewing as any reflection from the viewing room will affect the black level dramatically when the bar is that low. It also means you can only have an HDR presentation in a dark room that is also a problem even high end LCDs face by being unable to compensate since they already are at their brightest with HDR.
Morevover extension in the dark range makes less sense because content creators don't master at 0.0005nit at all and often use dark areas of the screen to hide things the viewer is NOT meant to be able to see, which results in an unpleasant experience and unintended artefacts.
FarFromAnyGame
Banned
What's best for HDR? Full or Limited RGB in PS4 settings for Deus Ex?
You have to use full mode with Deus Ex. Limited mode is completely broken.
That's an odd comment. I've found that the material the display is made of appears extremely black even in a well lit room (unlike a plasma TV, which looks awful when light shines upon the glass). The benefit of the black levels remain.
I think black levels are more important for games than films, though, to be honest.
Cranberrys
Member
I have a Sony 55w905 and no the Auto Scene doesn't work with Xbox One (or Xbox 360). I have to change manually between Game, Cinema and Standard modes depending on the content I'm playing/watching.
With Auto Scene (24p sync), it can however switch to Cinema Mode when playing a blu ray (24 fps) but never to Game Mode.
DrunkShogun
Member
Can I get an opinion on LG 49UH610V 49 inch 4K Ultra HD Smart TV WebOS 2016 Model. It's pretty cheap and plan to have it in my bedroom while the main tv will be in the living room. Not tv savvy unfortunately.
Wireframe
Member
I have an LG OLED from this year and I can say this is just false.
The more I read this, the more it confuses me. I suppose we're simply looking for very different things.
I tend to do 90% of my viewing in a completely dark or nearly dark room and, at its maximum brightness, the OLED TV is just about at the limit of what my eyes can stand in that environment.
Now, clearly, top end LCD displays can produce even brighter results but based on my experience with them, this comes at a huge cost - black level degradation or serious blooming. For HDR to work well on LCD displays, the backlight needs to be cranked up to the max and local dimming, even at its best, just can't fully deal with this.
You give up a LOT for that higher overall brightness level, I feel.
...but again, this is the situation in my viewing environment. I can certainly see how, in a different environment, these issues may not be a problem and the maximum brightness is more important.
I've always been someone that just likes truly dark black levels, though, and that is more important than anything else when it comes to choosing a display.
I do think black frame insertion is still a great idea for OLED. For HDR content? Maybe not but for normal 60hz games? It would be perfect.
You have to keep in mind that the 2016 OLED TVs are 3-4 times brighter than high-end plasmas that many of us used for years. So even if you cut the brightness of the OLED in half, it would still appear plenty bright for gaming.
...and ultimately, I do believe that OLED produces a more visually striking and pleasing image overall next to the competition.
It's not just you. Just about every professional reviewer agrees so you're in good company.
(And I only say "just about" to cover myself but I've personally not seen any prefer LCD to OLED)
We need HDR tv makers implement settings so people can modify the built in HDR eotf tonemapper bias. Current settings are woefully insufficient, and the default fixed tonemappings themselves are all over the place/wrong. The LG oled HDR tonemapper bias causes black crush for instance.
papersleeves
Member
I just have to say that coming from both a Kuro 2009 and a Panasonic VT60 2013, I do not regret my decision to switch to a LG OLED B6P.
The blacks are perfect, the colors pop out like nothing else. There is something about having a pixel fully lit next to another one that is turned off that makes the picture perfect.
Everyone I know loved my plasmas but they all agree that the OLED simply looks better. While the peak brightness is beaten by the best of Sony and Samsung LCDs, it still is leagues above the rest, especially my old plasmas. I'm not exactly sure how bright is a valor of 787cd2 is (top brightness measurement of the B6P), but I know it's enough to blind my eye if I look at it for too long.
I understand that the motion resolution isn't perfect but to me it's barely noticeable. I did some tests like scrolling some web pages vertically at a certain speed and I could see a small blur but I had to look for it and it didn't prevent me to be able to read the text anyway so I consider this a non issue.
Anyway, I love it but I had to pay the price. Those cost about 4000$ here in Canadia.
Edit: Just to be clear, I did not have the Kuro and the VT60 at the same time. I replaced my Kuro with the VT60 in 2013 for 3D, bigger screen and smart tv functionalities. To me, they pretty much had the same picture quality. Yes, the Kuro had better black in theory but in practical term it wasn't noticeable, at least in my environment.
The blacks are perfect, the colors pop out like nothing else. There is something about having a pixel fully lit next to another one that is turned off that makes the picture perfect.
Everyone I know loved my plasmas but they all agree that the OLED simply looks better. While the peak brightness is beaten by the best of Sony and Samsung LCDs, it still is leagues above the rest, especially my old plasmas. I'm not exactly sure how bright is a valor of 787cd2 is (top brightness measurement of the B6P), but I know it's enough to blind my eye if I look at it for too long.
I understand that the motion resolution isn't perfect but to me it's barely noticeable. I did some tests like scrolling some web pages vertically at a certain speed and I could see a small blur but I had to look for it and it didn't prevent me to be able to read the text anyway so I consider this a non issue.
Anyway, I love it but I had to pay the price. Those cost about 4000$ here in Canadia.
Edit: Just to be clear, I did not have the Kuro and the VT60 at the same time. I replaced my Kuro with the VT60 in 2013 for 3D, bigger screen and smart tv functionalities. To me, they pretty much had the same picture quality. Yes, the Kuro had better black in theory but in practical term it wasn't noticeable, at least in my environment.
finalflame
Banned
Sometimes I wonder if selling my KS8000 and getting a B6 would be wise.
I'll probably wait 'til next year. But sometimes I wonder.
I'll probably wait 'til next year. But sometimes I wonder.
Backfoggen
Banned
At this point that would be a pretty dumb move. Definitely wait. Announcements are in January.
Unless you get a really REALLY good price.