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PoliGAF 2012 Community Thread

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L

learnedhand

Member
Attempting to predict a SC judge's decision from his line of questioning is a very risky endeavor. It is almost never a clear indication of their ultimate ruling. In all likelihood, they have already studied the issues extensively and formed a very firm position.

Bottom line, even the most precise language is inherently vague and open to interpretation; even the Constitution. Hell, I believe a judge's political identification is a stronger predictor than even stare decisis, even at this level.
 
F

Frank the Great

Banned
learnedhand said:
Attempting to predict a SC judge's decision from his line of questioning is a very risky endeavor. It is almost never a clear indication of their ultimate ruling. In all likelihood, they have already studied the issues extensively and formed a very firm position.

Bottom line, even the most precise language is inherently vague and open to interpretation; even the Constitution. Hell, I believe a judge's political identification is a stronger predictor than even stare decisis, even at this level.
Click to expand...

yes, this whole media circus attempting to analyze what the judges' think based on their questions is absurd.

sometimes judges ask searching and difficult questions against the side that they agree with just to hear the answer and make sure they are correct. and sometimes they are just putting on a show. as a matter of fact oral arguments in general play little role in decisions.
 
J

Jackson50

Member
cartoon_soldier said:
When did Russia become a foe again?
Click to expand...
Bilateral relations aren't exactly brotherly. Perhaps there was a moderate rapprochement after the collapse of the Soviet Union. Still, it rings hollow because the PRC has become our principal geopolitical adversary and I can't recall Romney ever discussing Russia as a pressing foreign policy issue. He's focused primarily on Iran and Israel with Afghanistan and a few comparatively minor issues interspersed. If they were "the geopolitical foe," why has he ignored them?
Invisible_Insane said:
Yeah... I'm not seeing it.
Click to expand...
Yeah. I'm squinting mightily, yet I still fail to see it. My tentative conclusion is there's no difference.
 
G

GhaleonEB

Member
cartoon_soldier said:
More movement in gay rights

https://www.federalregister.gov/art...-for-purpose-of-filing-cbp-family-declaration

From Think Progress
Click to expand...

Every time I see one of these updates - and there have been a lot from the administration - it's just a reminder to me how deeply discrimination against same sex couples is ingrained in our society. Rolling back all these seemingly small matters is one way to slowly normalize them and bring them closer to equal status. It won't happen fully until DOMA is toast, but I find it encouraging that we're making small bits of progress under the radar.
 
B

brianmcdoogle

Member
On NPR today, they mentioned that the audio logs of the court proceedings are posted online in the afternoon. Does anyone have a link where I can download and listen to today's arguments?
 
M

Mortrialus

Banned
Flying_Phoenix said:
sims1_wideweb__470x365,0.jpg


MV5BNTUzOTMwNTM0OV5BMl5BanBnXkFtZTcwNDQwMTUxMw@@._V1._SY314_CR7,0,214,314_.jpg


800px-DaveMustaine2010.jpg


220px-AlexJonesBB2007.jpg


Or how about some in this website.
Click to expand...

Alex Jones? Seriously?
 
Zero Hero

Zero Hero

Member
I can't find the tweet right now, but it basically predicted that the ACA will pass 7-2 with Thomas and Alito being the ones who would role back 2 centuries of precedent in favor of their own ideological beliefs.

That's how I see it going down.
 
C

cartoon_soldier

Member
Zero Hero said:
I can't find the tweet right now, but it basically predicted that the ACA will pass 7-2 with Thomas and Alito being the ones who would role back 2 centuries of precedent in favor of their own ideological beliefs.

That's how I see it going down.
Click to expand...

Better than a 5-4 decision for or against it.
 
G

Gallbaro

Banned
Zero Hero said:
I can't find the tweet right now, but it basically predicted that the ACA will pass 7-2 with Thomas and Alito being the ones who would role back 2 centuries of precedent in favor of their own ideological beliefs.

That's how I see it going down.
Click to expand...

How can you argue that mandating people buy a private market product, as a result of no voluntary action has 2 centuries of precedent?
 
A

AlteredBeast

Fork 'em, Sparky!
Zero Hero said:
I can't find the tweet right now, but it basically predicted that the ACA will pass 7-2 with Thomas and Alito being the ones who would role back 2 centuries of precedent in favor of their own ideological beliefs.

That's how I see it going down.
Click to expand...

That is a stupidly brazen opinion and one that has little basis in fact. Yes, it should end up being a benefit to the whole of the nation to have 100% of the population, healthy or sick, buy health insurance to cut costs, but the government forcing people to buy from a private party is unprecedented. The arguments they bring up to defend the individual mandate are things that the government did to step in and prevent people from selling or producing something, not the other way around.
 
D

Dr. Pangloss

Member
Why does precedence matter? Did Social Security with its mandate that everyone pay into a central retirement account have precedence? This comes down to an economic question: If you forgo health insurance and get sick, then do your actions have an effect on the healthcare market that everyone participates in? The answer is yes. Your right to be inactive has an effect on my right to be active in the insurance market by pushing my premiums up to cover your liberty. Those who don't have healthcare are already taxing those that do.

And this is a conservative idea. They came up with the mandate. Where was the unconstitutional arguments then? It only became politically expedient to oppose it when Obama adopted it.

Edit: Great write up on the briefs in the case:

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/03/21/never-before/?hp
The brief uses the word “unprecedented” 10 times, by my count — I probably missed some — not counting such other formulations of the same thought as “novel” and “first ever.” O.K., I get it. I’ll even accept it as true: granted that passage of the Affordable Care Act ended decades of deadlock over how to reform the developed world’s most irrational health care system. It should have happened much earlier.

Unprecedented is a description, not an analysis. What’s unprecedented is the singular determination of the Republicans both on Capitol Hill and in the statehouses to deprive President Obama of his major domestic achievement.

The uninsured don’t exist apart from commerce. To the contrary, their medical care results in some $43 billion of uncovered health care costs annually and, through cost-shifting, adds $1,000 a year to the average cost of a family insurance policy. People who don’t want to buy broccoli or a new car can eat brussels sprouts or take the bus, but those without health insurance are in commerce whether they like it or not.
Click to expand...
 
O

Oblivion

Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
Some CNN commenter said:
"The White House hopeful also opened up about how he spent some recent time-off from the campaign trail, saying he went to watch "The Hunger Games" with his grandchildren over the weekend. "

He no doubt got off on it, considering it's sort of a vision of what a GOP/Teatroll utopia would eventually lead to. "Poor, minority, immigrant or female? Fight to the death for your food and our amusement!!!!"
Click to expand...

Speaking of this, I've been hearing a lot of righties say that The Hunger Games is a prime example of pro-conservative values. What the hell is the basis for this?
 
C

Chumly

Member
Oblivion said:
Speaking of this, I've been hearing a lot of righties say that The Hunger Games is a prime example of pro-conservative values. What the hell is the basis for this?
Click to expand...

Because its "Anti-Government". But thats about where the similarities end. In reality it is much more liberal than it is conservative.
 
S

sc0la

Unconfirmed Member
Oblivion said:
Speaking of this, I've been hearing a lot of righties say that The Hunger Games is a prime example of pro-conservative values. What the hell is the basis for this?
Click to expand...

It's the sequel to Santorum's Obamaville, after Obama becomes dictator in 2015
 
G

Gallbaro

Banned
http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com...ver-before/?hp
The brief uses the word “unprecedented” 10 times, by my count — I probably missed some — not counting such other formulations of the same thought as “novel” and “first ever.” O.K., I get it. I’ll even accept it as true: granted that passage of the Affordable Care Act ended decades of deadlock over how to reform the developed world’s most irrational health care system. It should have happened much earlier.

Unprecedented is a description, not an analysis. What’s unprecedented is the singular determination of the Republicans both on Capitol Hill and in the statehouses to deprive President Obama of his major domestic achievement.

The uninsured don’t exist apart from commerce. To the contrary, their medical care results in some $43 billion of uncovered health care costs annually and, through cost-shifting, adds $1,000 a year to the average cost of a family insurance policy. People who don’t want to buy broccoli or a new car can eat brussels sprouts or take the bus, but those without health insurance are in commerce whether they like it or no
Click to expand...

So go to single payer (tax, public entity), or allow emergency rooms to refuse to treat them (the actual incentive).


Invisible_Insane said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Militia_Acts_of_1792#Second_Militia_Act_of_1792
Click to expand...

So all men (excluding women who have become men), who are citizens, residents or illegal aliens, from the age of 18 to 25 and members of the armed forces can be required to purchase any product from any company or industry.
 
O

Oblivion

Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
Chumly said:
Because its "Anti-Government". But thats about where the similarities end. In reality it is much more liberal than it is conservative.
Click to expand...

That's what I thought. It seems the whole "big bad government" thing is the most generous way you can describe it. Yet, I have to say that I somehow doubt that the same people who cheer for people dying on the streets would see the type of government in the movie as "bad".
 
C

Chumly

Member
Oblivion said:
That's what I thought. It seems the whole "big bad government" thing is the most generous way you can describe it. Yet, I have to say that I somehow doubt that the same people who cheer for people dying on the streets would see the type of government in the movie as "bad".
Click to expand...

Yea you can pretty much destroy the argument if you actually think about what happens across the three books but that would be expecting too much of the conservatives.
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
Oblivion said:
Speaking of this, I've been hearing a lot of righties say that The Hunger Games is a prime example of pro-conservative values. What the hell is the basis for this?
Click to expand...
Can't see how that would jive considering it's about a teenage girl fighting to the death in an arena of the poor and desolate for the amusement of the 1%
and kicking all the other men's asses.
 
F

Flying_Phoenix

Banned
Can someone tell me how much of the U.S.'s economic share is from the public sector?

I seriously can't find this anywhere.

A site listing other nations as well would be welcomed.
 
A

adamsappel

Member
ClovingSteam said:
I have to ask. Is that you in your avatar?
Click to expand...

That is Paddy Costello, the lead singer of the punk band Dillinger Four. His tattoo "How Much Art Can You Take?" is a lyric from another punk band, SSD (Society System Decontrol).

I did not previously know this; I looked it up because I also wondered who it was (at no point did I think it was actually Bulbo).
 
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