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PoliGAF 2012 |OT3| If it's not a legitimate OT the mods have ways to shut it down

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S

Snake

Member
I honestly think Pawlenty fleeing the sinking ship is a "Big Fucking Deal" as our VP would say.

This is a guy who was first to drop out of the race in order to shine Mitt's rod for a sweet spot in his Administration. And here he is, very publicly declaring that this race is over and its time for Republicans to move on. I had expected Republicans to still try their best to put on a brave face, turnout the base and hope for a squeaker. But man, this is brutal. If I were a Republican I'd be absolutely furious at T-Paw right now.
 
P

pigeon

Banned
PhoenixDark said:
I don't buy it. They'll move the goal posts to 2014; this is all about retaking the senate and ensuring Obama's term or terms are obstructed as much as possible; they essentially want to turn him into the democrat Bush.
Click to expand...

Makes no sense. Bush got stuff done. Bush getting stuff done was kind of the whole problem with Bush. Blocking Obama getting stuff done hasn't helped them so far, why would it suddenly start helping them now?
 
A

Amir0x

Banned
PhoenixDark was fake concern troll right all along, Obama's sunk with this redistribution comment!


And I hear the Republicans just paid the courts in Pennsylvania - ALL OF THEM - $50 a piece to ensure some form of voter ID law called "IF YOU ARE BLACK YOU NEED EIGHTEEN DIFFERENT FORMS OF IDENTIFICATION AT THE POLLS TO VOTE" passed.
 
P

PhoenixDark

Banned
pigeon said:
Makes no sense. Bush got stuff done. Bush getting stuff done was kind of the whole problem with Bush. Blocking Obama getting stuff done hasn't helped them so far, why would it suddenly start helping them now?
Click to expand...

I think we are agreeing here that the obstruction won't stop, and there's no reason for the GOP to work with Obama. My point about turning Obama into the democrat Bush is that republicans want to ensure he's seen as a bad president. That would in a sense neutralize the Bush years - when asked how he is different from Bush, future republicans could just turn the question around and ask how their opponent is different from Obama. To reuse 1980 analogies for the trillionth time, republicans don't want Bush to be their Carter, and they don't want Obama to be democrats' Reagan

Think about it: if Obama wins, the economy recovers as the CBO projects (12mil jobs), health care isn't a disaster, and we don't have a terrorist attack...Obama becomes the greatest democrat since LBJ arguably (I would disagree still of course).
 
P

PhoenixDark

Banned
Thompson Suggests Romney Is Dragging Him Down

Tommy Thompson said Wednesday that Mitt Romney is dragging him down in his Senate race against Rep. Tammy Baldwin.

"The presidential thing is bound to have an impact on every election," Thompson told the local ABC affiliate in Madison. "Whether you're a Democrat or Republican. If your standard-bearer for the presidency is not doing well, it's gonna reflect on the down-ballot."

The PollTracker Average shows Democrat Tammy Baldwin leading 49 percent to 43.9 percent.
Click to expand...
http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entry/thompson-suggests-romney-is-dragging-him-down

lmao

You rarely see a candidate with the balls to say that
 
F

Farmboy

Member
kaching said:
Romney has had at least 6 years of campaigning to fix his problem with unforced errors and hasn't shown any real awareness of that problem, so he isn't going to suddenly get it with 1 month left.
Click to expand...

Pretty much this. We may well have reached the bottom for Romney (the GOP is certainly in very deep shit if we haven't, as further deterioration is certain to have downballot effects). He will almost certainly crawl back up a little bit.

But there's a reason he's in this position now - and that reason certainly is not that this is all part of some masterplan of lowering expectations and then staging a comeback. Of course being the underdog has its advantages, but Romney did *not* want to be in this position, at this stage of the race.
 
C

Clevinger

Member
from Romney's rally today:

FjIzG.jpg


bonus points if you spot Romney's "Strengthen and Protect Medicare" banner in the background
 
M

Manos: The Hans of Fate

Banned
Clevinger said:
from Romney's rally today:

FjIzG.jpg


bonus points if you spot Romney's "Strengthen and Protect Medicare" banner in the background
Click to expand...
Assuming someone didnt put the sign up as a troll or for optics.

Part of the problem is for Medicare and SSN they've paid in through decades of mandatory withholding. So it's not entirely inconsistent.
 
P

pigeon

Banned
PhoenixDark said:
I think we are agreeing here that the obstruction won't stop, and there's no reason for the GOP to work with Obama.
Click to expand...

No, we're explicitly not agreeing on that. The GOP's motivation to work with Obama is survival -- something they're currently failing at. An American political party that doesn't potentially represent a majority of the country can't continue.

PhoenixDark said:
My point about turning Obama into the democrat Bush is that republicans want to ensure he's seen as a bad president. That would in a sense neutralize the Bush years - when asked how he is different from Bush, future republicans could just turn the question around and ask how their opponent is different from Obama. To reuse 1980 analogies for the trillionth time, republicans don't want Bush to be their Carter, and they don't want Obama to be democrats' Reagan

Think about it: if Obama wins, the economy recovers as the CBO projects (12mil jobs), health care isn't a disaster, and we don't have a terrorist attack...Obama becomes the greatest democrat since LBJ arguably (I would disagree still of course).
Click to expand...

Right, but they can't accomplish that. That's actually the point YOU'RE making at the end -- all of that happens if Obama does nothing. So what benefit do they get from obstructing? They simply can't make Obama look like a failure if he wins a second term. All they can do is paint themselves even more as the party of No, and lose more voters.
 
P

PhoenixDark

Banned
pigeon said:
No, we're explicitly not agreeing on that. The GOP's motivation to work with Obama is survival -- something they're currently failing at. An American political party that doesn't potentially represent a majority of the country can't continue.

Right, but they can't accomplish that. That's actually the point YOU'RE making at the end -- all of that happens if Obama does nothing. So what benefit do they get from obstructing? They simply can't make Obama look like a failure if he wins a second term. All they can do is paint themselves even more as the party of No, and lose more voters.
Click to expand...

I disagree. If republicans can further stall the economy, they can win big in 2014; Obama will not be on the ticket. They'll let the 2016 republican candidate move to the center-right, in the meantime they'll benefit electorally by handicapping Obama and continuing to take control of state legislative bodies/governments. That has not worked so far this year because Romney is a horrible candidate.

For instance, why would republicans pass the Jobs Act next year? Why would they work with Obama on immigration, or anything else outside of tax reform for the rich. This was never just a four year plan for Obama - if he wins they'll just move to the next step.
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
PhoenixDark said:
I disagree. If republicans can further stall the economy, they can win big in 2014; Obama will not be on the ticket. They'll let the 2016 republican candidate move to the center-right, in the meantime they'll benefit electorally by handicapping Obama and continuing to take control of state legislative bodies/governments. That has not worked so far this year because Romney is a horrible candidate.

For instance, why would republicans pass the Jobs Act next year? Why would they work with Obama on immigration, or anything else outside of tax reform for the rich. This was never just a four year plan for Obama - if he wins they'll just move to the next step.
Click to expand...
The CBO projects 12 million jobs if nothing happens. That's the problem Republicans face - their obstruction won't negatively hurt the economy.

Democrats winning the House also looks like a realistic possibility, and that's come out of the GOP's "Make Obama a one-termer" game plan. When the economy wasn't moving in 2010 it was a boon for them, now Obama looks pretty good, Romney's a buffoon and the Republican platform contains NOTHING but c/p opposite of Obama's ideas. Democrats face a higher hurdle than usual thanks to gerrymandering but they're on track to beating that anyway. If 2012 comes and goes and Republicans don't even have the House, then their whole strategy has been a complete failure.
 
P

PhoenixDark

Banned
Aaron Strife said:
The CBO projects 12 million jobs if nothing happens. That's the problem Republicans face - their obstruction won't negatively hurt the economy.
Click to expand...

They can obstruct on the debt ceiling, refuse to agree to any deficit reduction thus resulting in a rating downgrade, republican governors can continue cutting public sector jobs, etc. That's not "nothing"
 
A

ari

Banned
I liked McCain a lot of a hell more then I like mitt. If they would have swapped elections, McCain would have a very good chance compared to this fucking idiot. Dude campaign is mostly finished. Fox News is really pissing me off with all the bullshit also, god Obama just needs to win already.
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
PhoenixDark said:
They can obstruct on the debt ceiling, refuse to agree to any deficit reduction thus resulting in a rating downgrade, republican governors can continue cutting public sector jobs, etc. That's not "nothing"
Click to expand...
There really is only so much they can do.

Public sector's been cut to the bone as it is, and the debt ceiling fight didn't have a major long-term effect on the US economy, considering the stock market is doing better than ever and jobs are chugging along.
 
S

Snake

Member
Defending Romney, McCain cites 2008 campaign trail misspeak

CNN said:
(CNN) - Sen. John McCain on Wednesday compared a comment he made during his 2008 presidential bid to one made by his party's 2012 nominee, Mitt Romney, which is similarly drawing heavy Democratic flak.

At the time, McCain later pedaled back on his comment.
...
"I don't know if you remember when I said the fundamentals of the economy are strong even though we're in a fiscal crisis - oh my god!" he continued, referencing comments that drew heavy criticism from Democrats four years ago.

McCain made his comments on September 15, 2008, meaning both his and Romney's 2012 comments hit the political cycle in mid-September.
...
Some might point to a difference in venue: McCain's comments were made at a campaign rally in Florida, while Romney's were made behind closed doors at a fundraiser.
Click to expand...

Heh. Yes, we remember.
 
M

Measley

Junior Member
Dax01 said:
They've already moved on: "I can't change Washington from the inside."

Throwing everything at the wall and seeing what sticks.
Click to expand...

I've never seen a news network so far in the tank for one candidate. Good God.

You can try to say MSNBC, but they have Morning Joe, and they don't blatantly make up shit to make one side look better.
 
P

pigeon

Banned
PhoenixDark said:
I disagree. If republicans can further stall the economy, they can win big in 2014; Obama will not be on the ticket. They'll let the 2016 republican candidate move to the center-right, in the meantime they'll benefit electorally by handicapping Obama and continuing to take control of state legislative bodies/governments. That has not worked so far this year because Romney is a horrible candidate.
Click to expand...

This is all complete fantasy. The 2010 win came after Obama DOING THINGS that were unpopular. 2012 is happening now after two years of Obama not doing things that he can then easily say WOULD HAVE been popular if the GOP hadn't prevented them. Which way looks better for the Republicans for you? Remember that over 50% of the population already thinks that the Republicans are intentionally preventing Obama from helping the economy for their political gain. Does it look like that's playing well for them?

Moreover, the level of intensity that the Republicans built up in order to justify their unified obstructionism is a direct cause of Mitt Romney being the candidate -- a more moderate policy would mean a more moderate constituency and thus a more moderate candidate. Again, when your coalition has multiple contradictory desires, you get a candidate with multiple contradictory positions. If they continue to obstruct, they're setting themselves up for another beating in 2016.
 
F

Fenderputty

Banned
PhoenixDark said:
They can obstruct on the debt ceiling, refuse to agree to any deficit reduction thus resulting in a rating downgrade, republican governors can continue cutting public sector jobs, etc. That's not "nothing"
Click to expand...

What are the odds Bams grows a pair and calls them out on this? I feel like the last 4 years he played softball to give off the impression that he wants to work with congress. They even used this in his DNC speeches calling them out on their stalling and made working together a focal point of their message.
 
F

Farmboy

Member
Last time Republicans tried everything in their power to prevent a Democratic president from becoming "their Reagan", up to and including starting inpeachment procedings, they failed miserably. Now, Bill Clinton is so popular that all the Romney camp can do is attempt to contrast him with Obama, never attacking him directly. The only reason Clinton isn't quite as revered as Reagan yet is because he's still alive.
 
O

Oblivion

Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
Holy shit, this is a new low. We're descending into parody now:

Politifact said:
Summary: Because 53 percent and 47 percent combine to make 100 percent, because Mr. Romney's campaign is for the presidency, and because if he were to win the presidency he would be president of 100 percent of Americans, we conclude that Mr. Romney's comment is a fact. Therefore, our ruling is true.
Click to expand...

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/...ey-says-his-campaign-is-about-the-100-percent

okay, fortunately it IS a parody, but stilll
 
B

Byakuya769

Member
Farmboy said:
Last time Republicans tried everything in their power to prevent a Democratic president from becoming "their Reagan", up to and including starting inpeachment procedings, they failed miserably. Now, Bill Clinton is so popular that all the Romney camp can do is attempt to contrast him with Obama, never attacking him directly. The only reason Clinton isn't quite as revered as Reagan yet is because he's still alive.
Click to expand...

They got 8 years of domination immediately after though.
 
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