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PoliGAF 2013 |OT2| Worth 77% of OT1

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O

Oblivion

Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
I always find it interesting whenever you have a case of two conservative viewpoints that wind up battling each other, such as this one.

Here you have Republicans love for guns, and using any and every opportunity to get more people to purchase them, and on the other end you have Republicans' general feelings about the blah community. This happened a year or so ago when Ice-T said something in favor of 2nd amendment, and he used some big sounding word, which Limbaugh found oh so amusing. Sure, he could have used the opportunity to say "See! Even one of Obama's people likes guns!", but instead he used his time to laugh at how cute it was that someone like Ice-T was using a word with more than one syllable.

The lesson here is: when in doubt, always bet on black.
 
J

jamesinclair

Banned
Lambtron said:
We always get this shit in North Dakota. It's so incredibly frustrating.
Click to expand...


Frustrating? You bet its fucking frustrating. 2 senators per state is a fucked up rule, especially since the dakotas should be on.


Didnt the supreme court in the 60s rule on one person = one vote when it comes to representation?

Why does the senate get to shit all over the law?
 
N

NYCmetsfan

Banned
jamesinclair said:
Frustrating? You bet its fucking frustrating. 2 senators per state is a fucked up rule, especially since the dakotas should be on.


Didnt the supreme court in the 60s rule on one person = one vote when it comes to representation?

Why does the senate get to shit all over the law?
Click to expand...
Have you read the constitution?
 
J

jamesinclair

Banned
APKmetsfan said:
Have you read the constitution?
Click to expand...

"The eight justices who struck down state senate inequality based their decision on the principle of "one person, one vote". In his majority decision, Chief Justice Earl Warren said "Legislators represent people, not trees or acres. Legislators are elected by voters, not farms or cities or economic interests.""

I trust this Warren guy more than some moldy piece of paper
 
C

Carpe Libertatem

Member
jamesinclair said:
Frustrating? You bet its fucking frustrating. 2 senators per state is a fucked up rule, especially since the dakotas should be on.


Didnt the supreme court in the 60s rule on one person = one vote when it comes to representation?

Why does the senate get to shit all over the law?
Click to expand...

jamesinclair said:
"The eight justices who struck down state senate inequality based their decision on the principle of "one person, one vote". In his majority decision, Chief Justice Earl Warren said "Legislators represent people, not trees or acres. Legislators are elected by voters, not farms or cities or economic interests.""

I trust this Warren guy more than some moldy piece of paper
Click to expand...

The U.S. Constitution says that each state shall have 2 Senators and the Constitution is the highest law in the U.S. The Senate doesn't "shit all over the law" because its members are elected exactly how the law says they should be. What Justice Warren ruled in the 60s doesn't change how the Senate should be elected because the Supreme Court doesn't have the power to change what the Constitution explicitly says (there is no interpretation here).

That doesn't necessarily make it a good thing that states like Wyoming and Vermont have 2 senators. Personally, I don't really have too much of a problem with that but I think the District of Columbia needs representation in Congress given that it has a higher population than both of those states. I want more representatives too. Roughly 600-700k population per representative is terrible and not at all helpful to democracy. 100-200k per district would be much better. Perhaps even lower.
 
J

jamesinclair

Banned
Carpe Libertatem said:
The U.S. Constitution says that each state shall have 2 Senators and the Constitution is the highest law in the U.S. The Senate doesn't "shit all over the law" because its members are elected exactly how the law says they should be. What Justice Warren ruled in the 60s doesn't change how the Senate should be elected because the Supreme Court doesn't have the power to change what the Constitution explicitly says (there is no interpretation here).

That doesn't necessarily make it a good thing that states like Wyoming and Vermont have 2 senators. Personally, I don't really have too much of a problem with that but I think the District of Columbia needs representation in Congress given that it has a higher population than both of those states. I want more representatives too. Roughly 600-700k population per representative is terrible and not at all helpful to democracy. 100-200k per district would be much better. Perhaps even lower.
Click to expand...

There should be some kind of bonus system. Every 1m people gets you a new senator.

And yes the house needs 100 new members, but their salary should be the us median income.
 
S

sc0la

Unconfirmed Member
jamesinclair said:
There should be some kind of bonus system. Every 1m people gets you a new senator.

And yes the house needs 100 new members, but their salary should be the us median income.
Click to expand...
I like this idea. I don't know if median is the best indicator, but basing the house's income on raising everybody's collective boat Is an interesting concept. It could help ensure they support policies that reduce income equality if it meant helping their personal income. Some metric that looked the gap would probably be more meaningful than median.

I don't have a problem with the Senates number allocation (though DC and Puerto Rico should have senators but that is another discussion) IF you get rid of the filibuster. The filibuster makes it so that the senate representation of just 12% percent of the total US population (the twenty least populace state's senators plus 1) can stop any legislation, nomination etc dead in its tracks. This is completely non-democratic travesty IMO.

The senate was intended to give smaller states a say, but it's the tyranny of the minority at this point.
 
B

Black Mamba

Member
Another Huge Blow To Obamacare!!!

Individuals buying health insurance on their own will see their premiums tumble next year in New York State as changes under the federal health care law take effect, state officials are to announce on Wednesday.

State insurance regulators say they have approved rates for 2014 that are at least 50 percent lower on average than those currently available in New York. Beginning in October, individuals in New York City who now pay $1,000 a month or more for coverage will be able to shop for health insurance for as little as $308 monthly. With federal subsidies, the cost will be even lower.
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DAMN YOU OBAMA!!!!!


edit:

The new premium rates do not affect a majority of New Yorkers, who receive insurance through their employers, only those who must purchase it on their own. Because the cost of individual coverage has soared, only 17,000 New Yorkers currently buy insurance on their own. About 2.6 million are uninsured in New York State.
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WHAT THE FUCK!?
 
O

Oblivion

Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
So this was kind of amusing. Teabagger says military health care would work better than Obamacare, but backtracks once he realizes that it's even more socialistic than Obamacare:

CALLER: Good morning. I have looked at all the insurance companies all over the world and the governmental plans all over the world and it comes back to one item that sticks out that would work for everybody, employers, retired people, people who have a small business, people who have low insurance and high insurance. That is TRICARE. TRICARE is what would lower everything and increase everything as far as services and there is not a doctor who doesn’t know about TRICARE. [...]

CLANCY: TRICARE is an employer provided insurance for Pentagon employees and their families. I think it is fairly popular with them. It may have some problems, but in general it works better than Obamacare is likely to do. Employer provided insurance works pretty well, in fact Congress has the best employer provided insurance in the country, it’s the gold standard.
Click to expand...

The backtrack:

Haha, Igor! You got me.

I was confused, misremembering Tricare as being like the popular and relatively market-based FEHBP, when in fact from your description Tricare is a bit like ObamaCare.

I did a little refresher research after the show and discovered that Tricare is actually extremely unpopular with its members. (Try gooogling "I hate Tricare" for fun.) I should have remembered that, since one of my colleagues at FreedomWorks grew up in a military household and spits at the word, "Tricare."

My point, which I stand by, was that employer based health care is more efficient and popular than government-run health care is likely to be. True patient-centered care, if we can establish it, will be even better still.

Igor, I would love to hear your answer to all the folks out there who hate their Tricare, which I hereby cheerfully "un-endorse."
Click to expand...

http://thinkprogress.org/health/201...stically-endorses-government-run-health-care/
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
Black Mamba said:
Another Huge Blow To Obamacare!!!



DAMN YOU OBAMA!!!!!
Click to expand...

Man that's extremely exciting. I really really hope that's the case across the states. I have to admit at times i find myself rooting for policies I liked to succeed and hoping for policies I don't like to fail, but something like this happening nationwide can only be good for the country, no matter who in which party proposed it or implemented it.

This is not just good but absolutely great, not for Obama, but for New York and America.
 
F

Fuchsdh

Member
Aaron said:
No. They should work minimum wage and for tips.
Click to expand...

If you made senators and house members have no real salary that would only increase the motivation for many to turn to other sources of income, hence corruption--or just increasing their motivation to perform more insider trading than they do now. Taking away the money doesn't remove the power of the position they're elected to so it's not solving any issue. Far more effective are working on transparency of the office, but since they have little interest in doing so (and struck down key parts to the Stock act) that's the uphill climb.
 
T

The Librarian

Banned
#Demsindisarray

Sen. Kay Hagan is up by double digits over all of her potential Republican challengers in 2014, when she will seek a second term in the Senate, according to a new poll released Wednesday.

The North Carolina Democrat got 49 percent of the vote in the Democratic firm Public Policy Polling survey in each of eight matchups. She led Phil Berger and Greg Brannon by 10 points, Thom Tillis by 11 points, Virginia Foxx by 12, Jim Cain and Renee Ellmers by 13, Mark Harris by 14 and Lynn Wheeler by 15.

Hagan has widened her lead: A June poll by PPP found that Hagan was only leading her challengers by 4 percentage points to 9 percentage points.​
 
W

Wilsongt

Member
Dax01 said:
#Demsindisarray

Sen. Kay Hagan is up by double digits over all of her potential Republican challengers in 2014, when she will seek a second term in the Senate, according to a new poll released Wednesday.

The North Carolina Democrat got 49 percent of the vote in the Democratic firm Public Policy Polling survey in each of eight matchups. She led Phil Berger and Greg Brannon by 10 points, Thom Tillis by 11 points, Virginia Foxx by 12, Jim Cain and Renee Ellmers by 13, Mark Harris by 14 and Lynn Wheeler by 15.

Hagan has widened her lead: A June poll by PPP found that Hagan was only leading her challengers by 4 percentage points to 9 percentage points.​
Click to expand...

Democrats are doomed. I fully expect a Republican surge around June or July of next year and expect them to retake many senate and house seats.
 
N

NYCmetsfan

Banned
The one thing I'm hopeful for even if the senate is lost (I can't help but think its gonna be hard for the GOP to run the tables and pick up 6 seats.) Is we might when back some governorships (Florida, Michigan, Penn) and maybe legislatures
A lot of the horrible stuff is happening at the state level and having veto power will be good.

Also, one think I have learned working in my senators district office is that people even if they disagree politicallylove incumbents. Especially when they help with the federal bureaucracy, its another reason why I think people like Landrieu have a better shot than people give them credit for being there for 10 years gives you a tremendous advantage when its not a wave elections, which I don't think 2014 will be
 
I

ivysaur12

Banned
Dax01 said:
#Demsindisarray

Sen. Kay Hagan is up by double digits over all of her potential Republican challengers in 2014, when she will seek a second term in the Senate, according to a new poll released Wednesday.

The North Carolina Democrat got 49 percent of the vote in the Democratic firm Public Policy Polling survey in each of eight matchups. She led Phil Berger and Greg Brannon by 10 points, Thom Tillis by 11 points, Virginia Foxx by 12, Jim Cain and Renee Ellmers by 13, Mark Harris by 14 and Lynn Wheeler by 15.

Hagan has widened her lead: A June poll by PPP found that Hagan was only leading her challengers by 4 percentage points to 9 percentage points.​
Click to expand...

Definitely flipping.
 
S

smokeandmirrors

Banned
Dax01 said:
#Demsindisarray

Sen. Kay Hagan is up by double digits over all of her potential Republican challengers in 2014, when she will seek a second term in the Senate, according to a new poll released Wednesday.

The North Carolina Democrat got 49 percent of the vote in the Democratic firm Public Policy Polling survey in each of eight matchups. She led Phil Berger and Greg Brannon by 10 points, Thom Tillis by 11 points, Virginia Foxx by 12, Jim Cain and Renee Ellmers by 13, Mark Harris by 14 and Lynn Wheeler by 15.

Hagan has widened her lead: A June poll by PPP found that Hagan was only leading her challengers by 4 percentage points to 9 percentage points.​
Click to expand...

But what are the unskewed numbers?
 
T

Tamanon

Banned
Dax01 said:
#Demsindisarray

Sen. Kay Hagan is up by double digits over all of her potential Republican challengers in 2014, when she will seek a second term in the Senate, according to a new poll released Wednesday.

The North Carolina Democrat got 49 percent of the vote in the Democratic firm Public Policy Polling survey in each of eight matchups. She led Phil Berger and Greg Brannon by 10 points, Thom Tillis by 11 points, Virginia Foxx by 12, Jim Cain and Renee Ellmers by 13, Mark Harris by 14 and Lynn Wheeler by 15.

Hagan has widened her lead: A June poll by PPP found that Hagan was only leading her challengers by 4 percentage points to 9 percentage points.​
Click to expand...

It's funny, one thing that Republican filibuster nonsense actually does is it really lowers the amount of votes they can use to cudgel opponents in elections. It's hard to have an unpopular vote on your record if nobody lets you vote.
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
Tamanon said:
It's funny, one thing that Republican filibuster nonsense actually does is it really lowers the amount of votes they can use to cudgel opponents in elections. It's hard to have an unpopular vote on your record if nobody lets you vote.
Click to expand...
Probably the biggest reason nothing actually gets done - from either side.

Democrats know Republicans will manipulate their votes in attack ads, while Republicans don't want to stake out positions on issues like abortion that won't play well.
 
O

Oblivion

Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
UH OH. Linsey Graham's gonna need to drown a whole litter full of puppies or start using the n-bomb a lot more often to make up for this transgression:

Many Republicans admitted their efforts to hobble executive agencies by denying confirmation of their leadership was wrongheaded. “Cordray was being filibustered because we don’t like the law” that created the consumer agency, said Senator Lindsey Graham, Republican of South Carolina. “That’s not a reason to deny someone their appointment. We were wrong.”
Click to expand...
 
O

Oblivion

Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
Oh by the way, Cordray got 70+ votes for his confirmation. I haven't seen the breakdown, but why would so many additional Republicans stick their necks out for something they didn't have to?
 
N

NYCmetsfan

Banned
Oblivion said:
Oh by the way, Cordray got 70+ votes for his confirmation. I haven't seen the breakdown, but why would so many additional Republicans stick their necks out for something they didn't have to?
Click to expand...

because they don't want to be seen opposing a "consumer protection agency"
I'd imagine its republicans like portman, rubio, flake. People in purple or blue states. They hide behind the filibuster but when it comes to votes they can't be as radical as the base wants.

and it looks like the house might be coming around to legalization
 
P

PhoenixDark

Banned
Dax01 said:
#Demsindisarray

Sen. Kay Hagan is up by double digits over all of her potential Republican challengers in 2014, when she will seek a second term in the Senate, according to a new poll released Wednesday.

The North Carolina Democrat got 49 percent of the vote in the Democratic firm Public Policy Polling survey in each of eight matchups. She led Phil Berger and Greg Brannon by 10 points, Thom Tillis by 11 points, Virginia Foxx by 12, Jim Cain and Renee Ellmers by 13, Mark Harris by 14 and Lynn Wheeler by 15.

Hagan has widened her lead: A June poll by PPP found that Hagan was only leading her challengers by 4 percentage points to 9 percentage points.​
Click to expand...

An incumbent below the 50% mark? Bad news for democrats.
 
B

Black Mamba

Member
thepotatoman said:
Man that's extremely exciting. I really really hope that's the case across the states. I have to admit at times i find myself rooting for policies I liked to succeed and hoping for policies I don't like to fail, but something like this happening nationwide can only be good for the country, no matter who in which party proposed it or implemented it.

This is not just good but absolutely great, not for Obama, but for New York and America.
Click to expand...

It most likely won't reduce prices before subsidies in other states. New York is unique in that you can't deny for preexisting conditions but there is no mandate for insurance which drives the prices up. But hey the GOP wanted to get rid of the mandate!
 
A

Avon Barksdale

Member
Oblivion said:
So apparently Alex Trebek is a Republican?

http://www.salon.com/2013/07/15/jeopardy_accepts_war_between_the_states_for_civil_war/
Click to expand...

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2010/10/31/why-game-show-hosts-vote-republican.html

Sajak—whose first National Review Online column asserted that since “none of my family and friends is allowed to appear on Wheel of Fortune,” government employees shouldn’t be allowed to vote—declined, through the magazine, to comment.
Click to expand...

Terrible false equivalency, Pat.
 
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