looking further into it now, you even have all these democrats propping him up by endorsing him. What the hell? why aren't they backing their own candidate?
PoliGAF 2013 |OT2| Worth 77% of OT1
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looking further into it now, you even have all these democrats propping him up by endorsing him. What the hell? why aren't they backing their own candidate?
smokeandmirrors
Banned
We had McGreevy and Corzine, that'll be enough to get us Christie for 2 terms unfortunately.
RustyNails
Member
I smell lawsuit. Anyone else smell lawsuit?
Pai Pai Master
Banned
This kinda reminds me of Microsoft's policy reversals and how people were applauding them for realizing that they were about to do some very stupid things. I wonder how far the GOP is willing to go just to make it look like they had a plan here and succeeded.
I don't see how they are going to recover from this as a party if they back down without making any real point.
I don't see how they are going to recover from this as a party if they back down without making any real point.
JesseEwiak
Member
New Jersey is still a machine politics state, where you have local bosses who hand out patronage jobs like they're candy. Since a lot of those people aren't actually all that liberal (many times, they're just as racist as your average Tea Partier and hate unions that aren't their own) and they like their own power, it's easy to keep Christie in office than cotton to the idea of a progressive-ish reformist actually coming into office.
Co-signed.
No concessions. No bone thrown out. Let them pay the full political price.
AP retracts McAuliffe story
http://www.poynter.org/latest-news/mediawire/225492/ap-retracts-story-about-terry-mcauliffe/
This is some disgraceful stuff by the AP.
http://www.poynter.org/latest-news/mediawire/225492/ap-retracts-story-about-terry-mcauliffe/
This is some disgraceful stuff by the AP.
jamesinclair
Banned
It makes no sense.
Look at Trenton. Look at Camden. What has he done to fix things? Hell, look at the Giants. He ruins everything he touches.
True story, look what happened to the Jersey shore after a Chris Christie photo tour
So NJ is like every GAF minimum wage thread. Seems about right.
PhoenixDark
Banned
Christie is cruising on Sandy sympathy and let's face it, people rally around charismatic figures after a crisis; I think Bush was a horrible president but I still get chills when I watch his megaphone speech on top of the ground zero rubble. Sooner or later Christie will fall back to reality: a shitty state with high taxes and high unemployment. He has cut a lot of money from state workers but what else has he accomplished as governor?
To an extent. Noun, verb, 9/11 got Giuliani only so far.
Aaron Strife
Banned
That we'll find out is coupled with Obama and Biden's resignations.
i wonder if this is a gambit to lure democrats into not voting for it until a clean cr is passed, thereby shifting the blame of the debt ceiling onto them and muddying the waters more.
it also depends how short-term the debt ceiling thing will be.
Black Mamba
Member
This is when they demand Obama's eldest daughter.
I'm kind of with Scheiber on this -- I'm not really sure what this accomplishes. How does this get Boehner off the hook for raising the debt ceiling six weeks from now? We'll just be right back in the same place, except now Republicans can claim the President negotiated dishonestly.
Six weeks? GTFO.
The GOP are pleading for anything now. They're like a boy telling a girl "oh c'mon, just the tip!"
You lose, GOP. You get nothing. Good day!
wsoxfan1214
Banned
Guys, as insane as it sounds, sometimes reporters make mistakes. Leave the man alone. He has a proven record of being a fantastic journalist. He apologized and took the blame for it and never once tried to act as though it wasn't a big deal.
R10Neymarfan
Member
Well the Tea Party already disowned him because he praised Obama.
Bam Bam Baklava
Member
Let's do this every six weeks you guys.
Black Mamba
Member
There's no time to make a deal, anyway, so they have to get at least this.
And Obama has to sign it if there's no real conditions on it (let's talk isn't one) because saying no puts the default on his shoulders since the GOP gets nothing substantial for it.
It'll be interesting if they ask for the medical device tax. If they do, Obama/Reid should then demand a full repeal of the sequester cuts. I'd be fine with that trade-off for sure.
I think if Republicans want a six week extension of the debt limit that it's ok, because I don't think they are crazy enough to put the country through this shit twice in the same year. I think right now they are just trying to find their way out of this mess the least politically damaging way. Although I could be wrong because you can never underestimate republican stupidity.
Six? That's too long. Once a month!
Judging from guys like Yoho and Cruz, I'd say they are exactly that crazy.
ridethepiggy
Banned
A family has to budget each month so should Congress.
Black Mamba
Member
if the GOP extends the DL for 6 weeks without any real concessions, what is the point of keeping the government shutdown?
They have no real leverage on the government shutdown. The Dems won't give them anything on Obamacare and there's no threat of default. All there is is the status quo, which obviously the Dems don't like but not to the point that they'd cave on anything relevant.
I don't get the endgame here at all. But then again, it's been clear for a while the GOP has absolutely no idea what it's doing.
They have no real leverage on the government shutdown. The Dems won't give them anything on Obamacare and there's no threat of default. All there is is the status quo, which obviously the Dems don't like but not to the point that they'd cave on anything relevant.
I don't get the endgame here at all. But then again, it's been clear for a while the GOP has absolutely no idea what it's doing.
I thought the medical device tax was intended as a way to fund the ACA. Is it not necessary for aca to function properly?
I think for a lot of the Tea Party, the shut down is the win. Which is scary as hell.
If I'm understanding the plan correctly, the ideal Boehner timeline is something like
* pass the short DL with the negotiation requirement
* negotiate a grand bargain in six weeks
* pass the grand bargain to reopen the government and raise the debt ceiling further
* never face consequences
The big takeaway from the Politico cover on Boehner today is that Boehner really does view himself as a deal-maker and really does want to make a deal with Obama. That's where all this Grand Bargain stuff comes from in the first place! So if Boehner's saying his plan is to negotiate, there's a good chance that might actually be his plan.
The big problem with this plan, of course, is that Boehner hasn't demonstrated any ability to provide Republican votes for a bargain, and he hasn't demonstrated any ability to provide Republican CONCESSIONS for a bargain. That's presumably Paul Ryan's job -- but it remains to be seen whether Ryan can actually bargain, or just extort.
It's just money. As long as that money comes from somewhere, it doesn't really matter for the law's purposes. It'd probably be nice to hang onto it, but the reality is that the taxes on Obamacare were mainly put on there to make the bill deficit-neutral, so now that it won't be scored again, it's okay if we jettison some of them (with the exception of the individual mandate).
Black Mamba
Member
Right, I get that. But while they negotiate for the next 7 weeks, the government will be shut down. This doesn't seem to make sense to me.
And if there is no grand bargain, the GOP will simply have to move the DL again (as they are here) for no concessions...with the gov't still shutdown?
My point is that by moving the DL, I see no reason for the GOP to continue the gov't shutdown. It gives them no real leverage and if anything, hurts them as the weeks go by. And in 7 weeks from now, lots of people will be signed up on Obamacare. Why bother keeping it?
I'd imagine if this DL thing passes, the shutdown won't last the full 6 weeks. Maybe nowhere close.
rocketknight
Member
On the one hand, sick burn, Bams. On the other hand, does anyone really want to do this every six weeks (or less) until the GOP loses a few House seats next year and realizes that yelling obscenities from gerrymandered districts is destroying their entire party and dragging everyone else down with them?
rocketknight
Member
Why does the GOP do anything these days? Frothing up the base. (Straight from my Facebook feed, unfortunately. No previous indication that this friend was a loon.)
I'm not sure "sense" is the right metric here. If Boehner thinks he can reopen the government with a grand bargain safely, but not with a clean CR, then he'd obviously prefer to leave the government closed until he can get a grand bargain. This isn't politically pleasant for the GOP or good for the country, obviously, but at this point nothing is.
Basically, I don't think Boehner is trying to position himself for maximum leverage here, he's just trying to find something he can get away with.
One valuable takeaway from Boehner's previous strategies is that he clearly doesn't spend a lot of time thinking about what happens if he FAILS to make a deal. He's kind of a perpetual optimist. But yes, presumably if he blows it he'll just be back in the shit and have to pass the clean CR and debt ceiling increase.
Black Mamba
Member
I largely agree with you but I don't see how the government stays shutdown til the end of November. I guess the GOP is stupid enough to do it, but man that's a long fucking time.
T
thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
Just yesterday they were talking about how default wouldn't be that bad, and today they're talking close to that "unconditional surrender" they were afraid of? Amazing what one bad day of poll numbers can do.
This is all thanks to the American people knowing who to actually place the blame on. I'm actually surprised how the approval ratings moved so much so quickly. I assumed the Republican party of today would always get at least 40% approval thanks to the modern Republican media machine.
Things are looking very good now. Still a tiny bit worried since Boehner's flip flopping has become hard to predict, but I find it hard to believe Republicans will forget the lesson they learned today in only 6 weeks.
Don't worry about being bored though. There's still plenty of fun to be had in watching how the Republicans deal with this defeat, and in worrying about Boehner being replaced by someone radical enough to not pass any debt increases ever.
This is all thanks to the American people knowing who to actually place the blame on. I'm actually surprised how the approval ratings moved so much so quickly. I assumed the Republican party of today would always get at least 40% approval thanks to the modern Republican media machine.
Things are looking very good now. Still a tiny bit worried since Boehner's flip flopping has become hard to predict, but I find it hard to believe Republicans will forget the lesson they learned today in only 6 weeks.
Don't worry about being bored though. There's still plenty of fun to be had in watching how the Republicans deal with this defeat, and in worrying about Boehner being replaced by someone radical enough to not pass any debt increases ever.
TheHeretic
Banned
The Republican party will always get 45% of the National vote, or so. This is of course unless there is a serious disparity in the popularity of the candidates, say Hillary vs Cruz.
They better not get away with 6 weeks. And if it comes with a medical device tax repeal they are out of their minds. Democrats better not go along with it.
Christie would be a formidable candidate as I just said in the other political thread.
He'd be the first obese President since Taft.
Christie would be a formidable candidate as I just said in the other political thread.
He'd be the first obese President since Taft.
I think they'd get 45 even with Cruz. Cruz isn't a true believer; he's an opportunist. Only reason he's saying this stuff is it puts the spotlight on him. He'd have no problem pulling a Romney and flip flopping on everything for the general election, and similar to Romney the media won't call him on it enough for it to matter all that much.
The incredible skill in modern day republican propaganda plus an incompetent media means we'll never see a Republican do as bad as Goldwater again. At least for the foreseeable future.
Officerrob
Banned
Morning Joe showed a few clips from the Booker/Lonegan debate last night, that got really nasty.
NYT has a hilarious article today about some ultraconservative district in Georgia and how they all hate Obama. One guy doesn't have health insurance and just had major surgery but hates Obamacare and when asked how he'd fix it he proposes single payer.
These people are just incredible.
These people are just incredible.
NYCmetsfan
Banned
Graves district? I could of swore I read that last week
Hey, you're right. It's dated last week. Derp, I didn't even notice.
House GOP Meeting with Obama
I saw Virginia Foxx's name as part of the 18 and thought she was part of the Tea Party. Anyway, if the bolded is true, I'm surprised that thereI hasn't been any kind of screaming from the Tea Party platform in not being represented at that meeting.
I saw Virginia Foxx's name as part of the 18 and thought she was part of the Tea Party. Anyway, if the bolded is true, I'm surprised that thereI hasn't been any kind of screaming from the Tea Party platform in not being represented at that meeting.
empty vessel
Member
Taxes don't fund anything. The medical device tax isn't necessary, but the Republicans desire to repeal it demonstrates that they are unopposed to increasing government debt (which is a good thing!). Rather, their objective is to inflict harm on Americans by slashing programs that help them (not a good thing!).
There's two different things going on:
- The budget for the fiscal year ran out at the beginning of October. Congress hasn't passed a new budget, nor a contuining resolution to keep the government open
- The US government will hit its debt ceiling in 7 days (it has to be raised by Congress). This doesn't authorize spending (that's what the budget does) but just says we can issue more Bonds to pay the bills we've already incurred that are law.
StopMakingSense
Member
2 separate things. A proper budget was never passed, so the government has been operating via continuing resolutions. The last one expired, hence the shutdown. The debt limit is separate from that.
NYCmetsfan
Banned
I thought it might have been another. Forgot to post it here after reading it. Quotes like that though show America isn't this center-right country that the GOP and media trolls pretend we are.
Reminds me that there was someone the other day who was saying the democrats are center right but I never got to respond to him. Both of these are memes that never die and aren't born out by comparisons with other countries and instead rely on cherry-picked examples (aka pet issues) and ignorance of the conservatism of so called center left countries.
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