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[Black Mamba]

I just don't buy this. The White House's gameplan since 2010 has been to send Obama out to give speeches about various issues and shame congress for not doing x,y,z. I don't remember the last time it worked. This year valuable time was wasted on a shitty gun bill and a pie-in-the-sky Pre K. When the WH pivoted back to the economy (due to NSA/IRS problems), there was very little focus outside of speeches. I don't want to hear about a Jobs Bill that went nowhere - it should be obvious the House will not pass a White House bill. The goal should be to work with the senate on smaller bills that can pass the House.

Does anyone think a corporate tax cut couldn't pass? Or tax reform in general. It's a pinata Paul Ryan has wanted to pop for awhile. Likewise Dave Camp has been trying to make moves on tax reform, but was shut down by Boehner apparently. Democrats can't get the ball rolling in the senate, with the White House nudging them a bit?

Empty Vessel time: eliminate the payroll tax for employers and employees; the big reason the GOP didn't like the past payroll tax holiday was because it was temporarily and thus increased "uncertainty" (lol, I know). End it outright then.

I don't see any focus from the White House on anything, economically.

LOL.

1. The GOP will NEVER eliminate the payroll tax. Are you high? It's a direct tax on the middle and lower class, something the GOP loves. Remember, the GOP is not opposed to tax hikes for regular folk (see airline fee hike), they're solely opposed to taxes on "job creators" aka the elite. They are very much in favor of hiking taxes on the middle to lower classes.

2. Passing a corporate tax cut is useless unless it is accompanied with closing loopholes, which again the GOP will not pass.

FFS, Ryan refused to name a single deduction he'd eliminate during their election run. Reason being he only wanted to eliminate deductions for children and such, not mortgages and charity.

Stop with this pie in the sky bullshit. Nothing of consequence is ever getting through the House unless their control of the House is directly affected by it (ie debt ceiling). None of these smaller bills are possible.

The only card Obama has is to use the bully pulpit and slowly erode or eliminate their advantage through election. Any other reasoning is purely delusional.

 

[Oblivion]

Does anyone think a corporate tax cut couldn't pass?

Dude, he tried that, and Republicans rejected that cause they don't want to do anything to help improve the economy.

Seriously, think about that for a sec: the REPUBLICAN PARTY reject A TAX CUT DESIGNED SPECIFICALLY FOR THE RICH.

 

[RustyNails]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...68fd00-667e-11e3-a0b9-249bbb34602c_story.html

Thats one poll. I have seen others where the numbers were back to pre-october levels.

Still, fumbled rollout of the website, Obama's "lie of the year" and NSA crap certainly dont help.

 

[bonercop]

Does anyone think a corporate tax cut couldn't pass?

i'm sure a(nother) corporate tax cut could easily be passed, i'm less sure about why you seem to think this would be a good thing.

 

[Black Mamba]

Those looking for dirt on Rep. Steve Stockman (R-TX) need look no further. TPM has obtained photographs taken by the local officials who recently shut down Stockman's campaign office in Webster, Texas. And the images are dirty. And dusty. And grimy.

The story, to recap, was reported last month by The Houston Chronicle. According to the Chronicle, officials in Webster, Texas in November ordered the emergency closure of Stockman's campaign headquarters, citing multiple safety violations. The newspaper reported that various campaign staffers and volunteers were working and sleeping in the office, located in a former a former motorcycle shop considered unsafe for habitation.

Stockman, who since the office closure has announced a Republican primary challenge to Sen. John Cornyn (R-TX), spoke about the arrangement in an August 2012 profile in Human Events.

"Well, you'll hear a lot of 'Stockman was lucky' and similar stuff -- just don't believe it," Stockman told the conservative outlet. "I could not have done it without all the hard-working, grass-roots volunteers. Believe me, we had them -- young conservatives who came into an old motorcycle shop, worked the precincts and made phone calls, slept on the floor, and ate MREs [Army rations] for their three meals. There's nothing like volunteers who believe in a candidate and a cause."

In response to a public records request from TPM, the city of Webster released photographs taken during an inspection of the property on Nov. 4. The images show a makeshift kitchen, a crumbling bathroom, a closet doubling as storage space for campaign signs, and beat up furniture. The refrigerator in the kitchen is decorated with bumper stickers, one of which appears to be Stockman's infamous "If babies had guns they wouldn't be aborted" sticker:

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/muckra...de-steve-stockman-s-condemned-campaign-office

Wow @ those pictures.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/muckra...de-steve-stockman-s-condemned-campaign-office

Wow @ those pictures.

¯\_(&#12484_/¯

Thats not that bad to be honest, have you guys not been in frat houses?

 

[The Librarian]

Good article I found: Of Course Washington Is Broken: It Was Designed to Be.

 

[Aylinato]

I don't even know if the public is aware of Obama's specific policies. What they are aware of is middling growth, partisanship, NSA, HealthCare.gov... it's unfortunate, but I don't know if the public is even aware of Obama's austerity measures because all people see is the perception of a stagnant economy.

They will forget all of that come elections lol

 

[Aaron Strife]

Polling dump:

Kentucky Senate (PPP)

Mitch McConnell 43
Alison Grimes 42

Matt Bevin 39
Alison Grimes 38

(more to come later today or tomorrow)

Florida Governor (Rick Scott internal)

Charlie Crist 49
Rick Scott 45

US National (PPP)

Barack Obama

Approve 41
Disapprove 55

Generic Ballot

Democrats 43
Republicans 40

US National (ABC/WaPo)

Barack Obama

Approve 43
Disapprove 55

Generic Ballot

Democrats 47
Republicans 45

re:Matheson's retirement, that's a bummer but he wasn't exactly a reliable Democratic vote. If Democrats can win the Virginia seat I think that's a fair trade.

7 Republicans have announced their retirements to 1 Democrat (I'm not counting instances where the congressperson is seeking higher office), this usually predicates who has the upper hand in the next election.

I still think Democrats will win the House, while the generic ballot isn't as high as it was during the shutdown fiasco they've clearly bottomed out and Democrats still have the advantage. When all's said and done Democrats should have a +5 lead on election day on the back of a better economy, Obamacare working and more tea party shenanigans.

OFA should blunt conservative turnout by running ads in moderate districts thanking Republican reps for voting for Obama's budget.

 

[Wilsongt]

Bad news for Kay Hagan.

 

[Averon]

Rick Scott being that close is disappointing. Are Floridians gluttons for punishment?

 

[RustyNails]

I hope Grimes can unseat the turtle king. Not looking likely...she hasnt pulled ahead so far.

 

[Aaron Strife]

I hope Grimes can unseat the turtle king. Not looking likely...she hasnt pulled ahead so far.

The last PPP poll had her up 2. That she's only down 1 after a glut of bad news for Democrats is encouraging, but this is a race where it'll be tough to make up that difference.

Rick Scott being that close is disappointing. Are Floridians gluttons for punishment?

Well, they did give us Bush. And four years later decided it was such a good idea they did it again!

PD might get his perfect candidate for 2016, give or take 20 years:

If he weren’t the nation’s oldest governor, a ripe 75, Jerry Brown would automatically be counted among serious Democratic candidates for president in 2016.

He boasts a household name, an impressive list of accomplishments in the country’s most populous state — a state some once deemed ungovernable — glowing national media coverage and a deep familiarity with the pitfalls and rigors of a White House bid, having run three times before.

Now, some are pushing Brown to consider another try for the White House, even if it means taking on Hillary Rodham Clinton, the prohibitive, if still undeclared, Democratic favorite.

“I think Jerry is precisely what America needs,” said Rose Ann DeMoro, the leader of a national nurses union and a strong political ally of Brown. “He has the courage of his convictions, which we haven’t seen in a very long while.”

Brown, who is up for reelection in 2014, has not yet stated his intention to seek another term, though he has raised millions of dollars for what would appear to be an easy campaign.

 

[ivysaur12]

Were access lanes to the George Washington Bridge, the nation's busiest span, closed as political retribution against a mayor who didn't publicly endorse New Jersey's Gov. Chris Christie's re-election?

The governor denies that politics played a role in the traffic-snarling decision but the controversy has put an ever-growing stain on Christie's glossy November re-election victory. And the episode could have an impact on Christie's White House ambitions.

What began as a local story involving the N.Y.-N.J. Port Authority, the agency that oversees the Hudson River crossings between the two states, has snowballed into an alleged case of political revenge and abuse of power. Now it's gone national, in large part because of Christie's well-known political ambitions.

On Monday, Sen. Jay Rockefeller, D-W.V., who chairs the Senate committee with jurisdiction, called on the Transportation Department to investigate the lane closures, which pretty much guarantees the federal agency will launch a probe.

"Unwarranted lane closures with no public notice can have serious ramifications on interstate commerce and safety in the region, and as the Committee with oversight responsibility of the Port Authority, I continue to have serious concerns about the actions of this agency," Rockefeller wrote in a letter to the department. "The gravity of this situation demands a comprehensive investigation. It also exacerbates my concerns with the governance and previous oversight of the Port Authority."

http://www.npr.org/blogs/itsallpolitics/2013/12/17/251979688/bridge-controversy-could-take-toll-on-chris-christies-future?ft=1&f=1001&utm_content=socialflow&utm_campaign=nprnews&utm_source=npr&utm_medium=twitter

Looks like this story is picking up national coverage. Too bad it's so far out.

 

[GhaleonEB]

I just don't buy this. The White House's gameplan since 2010 has been to send Obama out to give speeches about various issues and shame congress for not doing x,y,z. I don't remember the last time it worked. This year valuable time was wasted on a shitty gun bill and a pie-in-the-sky Pre K. When the WH pivoted back to the economy (due to NSA/IRS problems), there was very little focus outside of speeches. I don't want to hear about a Jobs Bill that went nowhere - it should be obvious the House will not pass a White House bill. The goal should be to work with the senate on smaller bills that can pass the House.

You assume the Senate will pass bills - with the filibuster intact - when the House will not. Obama has tried multiple approaches, both public and private. Remember the charm offensive? Identify specific GOPers who support specific policies they agree on, and...it went nowhere. And it's more than a little disingenuous to dismiss Obama's efforts as giving speeches. Outside of proposing legislation and trying to work directly with Congress, the bully pulpit is about all the president has in terms of getting legislation through. Obama worked all fronts for the Jobs Act and other initiatives. He was stonewalled in both houses.

Does anyone think a corporate tax cut couldn't pass? Or tax reform in general. It's a pinata Paul Ryan has wanted to pop for awhile. Likewise Dave Camp has been trying to make moves on tax reform, but was shut down by Boehner apparently. Democrats can't get the ball rolling in the senate, with the White House nudging them a bit?

No, it won't pass. Not if it conforms an anything borderline sane. Are you kidding?

Empty Vessel time: eliminate the payroll tax for employers and employees; the big reason the GOP didn't like the past payroll tax holiday was because it was temporarily and thus increased "uncertainty" (lol, I know). End it outright then.

I don't see any focus from the White House on anything, economically.

It's linked (stupidly) to Social Security and will only further drum up demands to cut it. Some of which Obama supports. Giving businesses more money, which they will not pass on to workers, and in turn upping pressure to cut Social Security by starving it of funding, does not make for good policy or politics.

Which means it might actually pass!

 

[PhoenixDark]

Polling dump:

Kentucky Senate (PPP)



(more to come later today or tomorrow)

Florida Governor (Rick Scott internal)



US National (PPP)



US National (ABC/WaPo)



re:Matheson's retirement, that's a bummer but he wasn't exactly a reliable Democratic vote. If Democrats can win the Virginia seat I think that's a fair trade.

7 Republicans have announced their retirements to 1 Democrat (I'm not counting instances where the congressperson is seeking higher office), this usually predicates who has the upper hand in the next election.

I still think Democrats will win the House, while the generic ballot isn't as high as it was during the shutdown fiasco they've clearly bottomed out and Democrats still have the advantage. When all's said and done Democrats should have a +5 lead on election day on the back of a better economy, Obamacare working and more tea party shenanigans.

OFA should blunt conservative turnout by running ads in moderate districts thanking Republican reps for voting for Obama's budget.

How can you possibly believe this with Obama underwater dragging democrats down with him, and the generic ballot collapse. It has bottomed out, but it's still not nearly close enough to where it needs to be to overcome gerrymandering.

 

[Black Mamba]

In 6 months, the narrative will be drastically different.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

In 6 months, the narrative will be drastically different.

I agree its just not going to be dems will save the country, wave election type stuff.

 

[The Librarian]

http://www.npr.org/blogs/itsallpolitics/2013/12/17/251979688/bridge-controversy-could-take-toll-on-chris-christies-future?ft=1&f=1001&utm_content=socialflow&utm_campaign=nprnews&utm_source=npr&utm_medium=twitter

Looks like this story is picking up national coverage. Too bad it's so far out.

Don't know how he'd be able to avoid it when running for the presidency.

 

[PhoenixDark]

You assume the Senate will pass bills - with the filibuster intact - when the House will not. Obama has tried multiple approaches, both public and private. Remember the charm offensive? Identify specific GOPers who support specific policies they agree on, and...it went nowhere. And it's more than a little disingenuous to dismiss Obama's efforts as giving speeches. Outside of proposing legislation and trying to work directly with Congress, the bully pulpit is about all the president has in terms of getting legislation through. Obama worked all fronts for the Jobs Act and other initiatives. He was stonewalled in both houses.


No, it won't pass. Not if it conforms an anything borderline sane. Are you kidding?


It's linked (stupidly) to Social Security and will only further drum up demands to cut it. Some of which Obama supports. Giving businesses more money, which they will not pass on to workers, and in turn upping pressure to cut Social Security by starving it of funding, does not make for good policy or politics.

Which means it might actually pass!

You mean the "charm offensive" where Obama ate with republicans two times, and that was the end of communication? It seems pretty obvious Obama has no interest in building relationships with people in congress, on either side of the aisle to be honest. It hasn't worked. You have John McCain in open rebellion against House extremists and Ted Cruz, yet democrats haven't attempted to take advantage of that rift by passing some decent legislation in the senate (outside of the immigration bill of course, which was never going anywhere).

The bully pulpit does not work in the second term, especially when voters tune you out. I'm sorry, I just cannot buy the idea that there's absolutely nothing Obama could do here.

 

[Aaron Strife]

How can you possibly believe this with Obama underwater dragging democrats down with him, and the generic ballot collapse. It has bottomed out, but it's still not nearly close enough to where it needs to be to overcome gerrymandering.

PPP has Democrats up 3, WaPo has them up 2, Pew has them up 4.

If that's with Obama dragging them down and the numbers bottoming out, they're going to be in pretty good shape when unemployment is down, Obamacare enrollment is up and Obama's approval ratings are back to 50.

I agree its just not going to be dems will save the country, wave election type stuff.

Even a modest gain for the Democrats would be a lot better than what most pundits are predicting right now, though it wouldn't be enough to win the House.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

real headline

Rep. Hartzler moves flag for press conference to avoid image with Obama

U.S. Rep. Vicky Hartzler visited Truman Memorial Veterans Hospital Tuesday and directed an aide to move a flag so a portrait of President Barack Obama would not be in the background of her television interviews.

PPP has Democrats up 3, WaPo has them up 2, Pew has them up 4.

If that's with Obama dragging them down and the numbers bottoming out, they're going to be in pretty good shape when unemployment is down, Obamacare enrollment is up and Obama's approval ratings are back to hovering around 50.

You do know the dems won the generic vote last year? doesn't equal winning the house.

 

[Aaron Strife]

You do know the dems won the generic vote last year? doesn't equal winning the house.

By a point.

 

[GhaleonEB]

You mean the "charm offensive" where Obama ate with republicans two times, and that was the end of communication? It seems pretty obvious Obama has no interest in building relationships with people in congress, on either side of the aisle to be honest. It hasn't worked. You have John McCain in open rebellion against House extremists and Ted Cruz, yet democrats haven't attempted to take advantage of that rift by passing some decent legislation in the senate (outside of the immigration bill of course, which was never going anywhere).

The bully pulpit does not work in the second term, especially when voters tune you out. I'm sorry, I just cannot buy the idea that there's absolutely nothing Obama could do here.

Then be specific about what he could do. Short of shutting the government down to get UI benefits passed, I'm not sure what his options are other than what he's done.

And I seem to recall you advocating for exactly the kind of "charm offensive" he undertook, though that may well have been under your trolling guise.

 

[Black Mamba]

But it also finds that overall support for the law is back to pre-rollout levels, with the public now almost evenly split on it again, at 46-49.

Among people under 30, support for the law has bounced back by 20 points, dropping sharply to 36 percent in November and returning to 56 percent now. (There has been a ton of chatter about young voters supposedly abandoning the law; we’ll see if this new poll causes anyone to revisit that assessment.)

* Among independents, support has come back by nine points, dropping to 36 percent in November and returning to 45 percent now.

* Among moderates, support has come back by 10 points, dropping to 44 percent in November and returning to 54 percent now.

The groups who already disliked the law the most also saw a big drop and then a comeback:

* Among conservatives, support has come back by a surprising 16 points, sinking to an abysmal 17 percent and returning to 33 percent now.

* Among Republicans, support has come back by nine points, dropping to a terrible 14 percent in November and returning to 25 percent now.

DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM!!!

 

[NYCmetsfan]

DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM!!!

I imagine some of that is people getting plans and going, "well I'm paying less now"


The issue to me was never the top line number is the trust in Obama and democrats and government to solve problems.

 

[Black Mamba]

I imagine some of that is people getting plans and going, "well I'm paying less now"


The issue to me was never the top line number is the trust in Obama and democrats and government to solve problems.

I don't think it's moved much because of that, even. I just think people are like "hm, looks like the website works. I'm going to keep my previous opinion again."

It will be next summer where if there is going to be movement we'll see it when millions have gotten on the exchanges and medicaid.

Once that happens, all the other numbers will shift too.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

Matheson moving on up?

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/politics/57275962-90/2014-already-continue-duty.html.csp

 

[Aaron Strife]

Matheson moving on up?

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/politics/57275962-90/2014-already-continue-duty.html.csp

I hope he gives a run for senate in 2016

 

[NYCmetsfan]

I hope he gives a run for senate in 2016

Don't think he stands much of a chance (don't know utah politics) but he could draw money from lee can could hit him for libertarian things.

 

[mckmas8808]

Yup. The law is arguably the greatest expansion of dental care for children in US history. I can't speak for all states, but in Michigan it has had quite a big impact due to a private insurance company now handling the children's Medicaid program. Previously a lot of dentists refused to see Medicaid patients due to how poorly they were reimbursed. For instance I used to work at a dental office, and we charged $155 for a one surface filling (basically the smallest filling you can get). Medicaid might pay $10 of that, and we'd have to write off the remainder; we refused to see any Medicaid patients because it simply wasn't worth it, financially. Since October 1st, Medicaid would pay about $90, with the rest being written off. That's similar to what many private insurance companies pay, only difference is that no co-pays are involved obviously.

So it's a win for providers as well as patients.

Wow that's amazing.

 

[Aaron Strife]

I don't think it's moved much because of that, even. I just think people are like "hm, looks like the website works. I'm going to keep my previous opinion again."

It will be next summer where if there is going to be movement we'll see it when millions have gotten on the exchanges and medicaid.

Once that happens, all the other numbers will shift too.

My hope is that moderate/independent voters will reward the Democrats when they see healthcare working, coupled with conservative voters being spurned by budget deals that don't repeal Obamacare and decide not to show up on election day.

Don't think he stands much of a chance (don't know utah politics) but he could draw money from lee can could hit him for libertarian things.

Indeed but he's the only real chance Dems have of winning anything statewide. I was actually hoping he'd run in 2012 but Romney being on the ballot probably made that extremely tough.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

I think the whole house is quiting

Tom Latham is now out r+1 with a senate race in the state. Good chance for a pick up

 

[PhoenixDark]

Then be specific about what he could do. Short of shutting the government down to get UI benefits passed, I'm not sure what his options are other than what he's done.

And I seem to recall you advocating for exactly the kind of "charm offensive" he undertook, though that may well have been under your trolling guise.

I listed some general ideas I think could go somewhere, specifically tax reform. And with respect to the charm offensive yes, I did say Obama should attempt to have some type of relationship with congress. But having two dinners and then disappearing doesn't equal "trying to build a relationship." I'm assuming we can agree on that.

There's a middle ground between being too chummy (Clinton) and not being sociable at all (Obama thus far). Some people just want to be invited to the White House, or think they have the president's ear, etc. I'm not saying those types of things will lead to far right idiots deciding to vote for Obama's agenda, I'm just saying having a decent relationship with congress makes it easier to work together. There are certainly people Obama "likes" in congress; we know he's good friends with Tom Coburn, he likes Tim Kaine, etc. Wouldn't it make sense to be able to have consistent channels of communication with folks, try to figure out some - if any - common ground, and get things done? I just don't see that, and there are multiple reports about the WH having a limited relationship with congress.

Harry Reid's staffers openly grumbled multiple times about Obama's involvement in budget issues, Nancy Pelosi muted him on speakerphone at one point, etc. I don't get the impression Obama is effective with his own party either, and perhaps this is why many are so quick to throw him under the bus.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

I listed some general ideas I think could go somewhere, specifically tax reform. And with respect to the charm offensive yes, I did say Obama should attempt to have some type of relationship with congress. But having two dinners and then disappearing doesn't equal "trying to build a relationship." I'm assuming we can agree on that.

There's a middle ground between being too chummy (Clinton) and not being sociable at all (Obama thus far). Some people just want to be invited to the White House, or think they have the president's ear, etc. I'm not saying those types of things will lead to far right idiots deciding to vote for Obama's agenda, I'm just saying having a decent relationship with congress makes it easier to work together. There are certainly people Obama "likes" in congress; we know he's good friends with Tom Coburn, he likes Tim Kaine, etc. Wouldn't it make sense to be able to have consistent channels of communication with folks, try to figure out some - if any - common ground, and get things done? I just don't see that, and there are multiple reports about the WH having a limited relationship with congress.

Harry Reid's staffers openly grumbled multiple times about Obama's involvement in budget issues, Nancy Pelosi muted him on speakerphone at one point, etc. I don't get the impression Obama is effective with his own party either, and perhaps this is why many are so quick to throw him under the bus.

There isn't any. Stop trying to pretend there is. Stop. Its really annoying and not how policy gets done.

Immigration is the illustration of this. There is 'common ground' and its gone no where. People agree on the ideas but they can't politically vote for it, look at Rubio disavowing his own bill. Having more dinners and building relationships doesn't fix this. The problem is heritage, SCF, red state even if they go away your gonna get grand bargain type policy. Which isn't something I want.

The only time this congress has moved is crisis and deadlines. And you win that by maximizing leverage at the point it comes to a head.

 

[The Librarian]

I think PD's trolling again.

 

[Jooney]

You have John McCain in open rebellion against House extremists and Ted Cruz, yet democrats haven't attempted to take advantage of that rift by passing some decent legislation in the senate (outside of the immigration bill of course, which was never going anywhere).

What filibuster proof legislation could Democrats in the Senate pass? Honest question.

He's tried, GOP blocks every idea to stimulate the economy.

But has he tried tax cuts and deregulation? American business is shackled, and tax cuts pay for themselves, so it's win-win.

[Note: Forgive the snark, but here in Australia we are facing a budget crisis of sorts, and the newly formed conservative government are proposing cuts to health, education, broadband infrastructure and disability insurance to alleviate the pain. It's like I'm living my own PoliGAF nightmare].

DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM!!!

When things go south for Obama or the democrats the hand-wringing here can be insufferable. Thank gawd there are cooler heads here that prevail.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

[Note: Forgive the snark, but here in Australia we are facing a budget crisis of sorts, and the newly formed conservative government are proposing cuts to health, education, broadband infrastructure and disability insurance to alleviate the pain. It's like I'm living my own PoliGAF nightmare].

Sucks but at least you have those things to cut. We're already at the bone on safety net programs.

And didn't they just start disability insurance there?

 

[Jooney]

There's a middle ground between being too chummy (Clinton) and not being sociable at all (Obama thus far). Some people just want to be invited to the White House, or think they have the president's ear, etc. I'm not saying those types of things will lead to far right idiots deciding to vote for Obama's agenda, I'm just saying having a decent relationship with congress makes it easier to work together. There are certainly people Obama "likes" in congress; we know he's good friends with Tom Coburn, he likes Tim Kaine, etc. Wouldn't it make sense to be able to have consistent channels of communication with folks, try to figure out some - if any - common ground, and get things done? I just don't see that, and there are multiple reports about the WH having a limited relationship with congress.

Wait, you can't have it both ways. You can't say that:
(1) Obama hasn't built a working relationship with Congress; and
(2) Congress won't pass anything because the White House gets too involved and people want to distance themselves from the President.

Those are two contradicting statements.

 

[B-Dubs]

I think PD's trolling again.

I just assume he's always trolling, makes it easier to deal with.

 

[Jooney]

Sucks but at least you have those things to cut. We're already at the bone on safety net programs.

And didn't they just start disability insurance there?

Legislation has passed, but implementation won't be for another few years. But there's talk of cuts to the funding. The plan still has bipartisan support though.

I should also add that during this crisis not a single proposal has been made to the raise taxes. We're gonna take up the mantle of balancing the budget on the backs of the middle class.

Spoiler

Thanks Obama

 

[GhaleonEB]

I listed some general ideas I think could go somewhere, specifically tax reform. And with respect to the charm offensive yes, I did say Obama should attempt to have some type of relationship with congress. But having two dinners and then disappearing doesn't equal "trying to build a relationship." I'm assuming we can agree on that.

I was hoping we'd agree that when the GOP played nice in the meetings and then walked out the door and started talking shit immediately - sometimes even live-tweeting said shit talking during the meeting - that Obama was wise to realize he was wasting his time. Only one side was talking in good faith. You can only build a relationship with people who want to build a relationship with you.

There's a middle ground between being too chummy (Clinton) and not being sociable at all (Obama thus far). Some people just want to be invited to the White House, or think they have the president's ear, etc. I'm not saying those types of things will lead to far right idiots deciding to vote for Obama's agenda, I'm just saying having a decent relationship with congress makes it easier to work together. There are certainly people Obama "likes" in congress; we know he's good friends with Tom Coburn, he likes Tim Kaine, etc. Wouldn't it make sense to be able to have consistent channels of communication with folks, try to figure out some - if any - common ground, and get things done? I just don't see that, and there are multiple reports about the WH having a limited relationship with congress.

Harry Reid's staffers openly grumbled multiple times about Obama's involvement in budget issues, Nancy Pelosi muted him on speakerphone at one point, etc. I don't get the impression Obama is effective with his own party either, and perhaps this is why many are so quick to throw him under the bus.

We're talking about a GOP Congress that turns around and blocks their own bills and ideas once Obama endorses them. One that made denying him a second term their top priority for four years (recession be damned) before he was even sworn in, and who are now working to deny him a legacy. His genuine friendship with Coburn (they trade letters) has resulted in no help.

I do agree that Obama's approach in negotiations with Congress has been poor; I thnk you're right about the administration not working that relationship well. There's definitely work they could do there. I'm just highly dubious of achieving any real results from it.

Most of the objections seem to be when they step in, rather than when they stay out. Reid was furious when Biden and company are dispatched and derail negotiations with McConnell. If anything they want him kept out because Obama's fingerprints on policy is so toxic to the GOP it tends to kill deals.

 

[PhoenixDark]

Wait, you can't have it both ways. You can't say that:
(1) Obama hasn't built a working relationship with Congress; and
(2) Congress won't pass anything because the White House gets too involved and people want to distance themselves from the President.

Those are two contradicting statements.

It's getting to the point where this thread is fucking unbearable due to blatant mis-characterizations of what I've said, and tiring spin. The thread loses track with reality the minute things start going bad for the White House. Whatever.

I've made it very clear that I don't think legislation can come from the White House - ie Obama saying "here's my bill, pass it please." I think we all agree on that. That's a separate issue from the congressional outreach and dialogue I'm calling for. Getting a few people in a room to discuss general tax reform views, then having the senate handle the issue is not the same as passing "Obama's tax reform."

I have never said chumming it up is the main key to getting things done. My point was simply that it's easier when you have decent communication with congress. I have never denied GOP obstruction. My point remains that the White House has been ineffective in handling the obstruction. I don't think Obama needs to triangulate, Clinton style. But I think it's ridiculous to believe Obama's record of getting next to nothing done with a republican house is somehow 100% the fault of obstruction. There are opportunities to get things done.

 

[kehs]

Obama admin dipping into the private sector for healthcare.gov fixing:

The administration is set to announce that Kurt DelBene, a former executive at Microsoft, will succeed Jeff Zients in leading the oversight of the embattled HealthCare.gov.

…

“A project of this size and scope demands the sustained leadership and day-to-day management of a chief executive officer – someone whose sole responsibility would be an unrelenting focus on healthcare.gov and who has experience overseeing large and complex consumer-facing technology projects,” the senators wrote.
Senators who signed the letter were Shaheen and Democratic Sens. Richard Blumenthal of Connecticut, Mark Warner of Virginia, Chris Coons of Delaware, Mark Udall of Colorado, Mary Landrieu of Louisiana and Tim Kaine of Virginia. Sebelius credited those senators for providing key input on the HealthCare.gov role.

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/12/kurt-delbene-jeff-zients-obamacare-101237.html

 

[RustyNails]

Shooting reported in University of Nevada campus medical center. 4 injured

Spoiler

Time to arm doctors and nurses

 

[Oblivion]

Wow, Obamacare is so bad that even Obama hasn't signed up for it yet:

 

[Jooney]

It's getting to the point where this thread is fucking unbearable due to blatant mis-characterizations of what I've said, and tiring spin. The thread loses track with reality the minute things start going bad for the White House. Whatever.

I've made it very clear that I don't think legislation can come from the White House - ie Obama saying "here's my bill, pass it please." I think we all agree on that. That's a separate issue from the congressional outreach and dialogue I'm calling for. Getting a few people in a room to discuss general tax reform views, then having the senate handle the issue is not the same as passing "Obama's tax reform."

I have never said chumming it up is the main key to getting things done. My point was simply that it's easier when you have decent communication with congress. I have never denied GOP obstruction. My point remains that the White House has been ineffective in handling the obstruction. I don't think Obama needs to triangulate, Clinton style. But I think it's ridiculous to believe Obama's record of getting next to nothing done with a republican house is somehow 100% the fault of obstruction. There are opportunities to get things done.

No one is spinning or mis-characterising what you have said. People here agree with your diagnosis (the white house and congress are not working together) but they are just not convinced of your prescription (that Obama could and should do more to fix this and that he takes a significant part of the blame for not doing so).

We are talking about a Republican congress that has:
- walked away from their own legislation;
- not negotiated in good faith with the President in the times where he has opened up lines of communication;
- has employed unprecedented use of procedures like the filibuster and anonymous holds to obstruct legislation and appointments; and
- have used every tactic in the book to hinder rather than help with already passed legislation (e.g. ACA)

What have republicans done to show that they are willing to negotiate with the white house and actually have some responsibility in governing the country? What examples can you point to?

It's not the immigration bill, which went nowhere fast.

It's not in passing routine legislation like the farm and transportation bills, things which were never contentious but all of a sudden are (I wonder why?)

It's not in the blocking of judicial and administrative appointments, even in cases where there was no point of contention with the appointee in question.

It’s not in the practice of leveraging BAU processes like the debt ceiling and the budget to extract legislative gains (with the perpetual looming threat of a shutdown).

I don’t think Obama is perfect, but I don’t blame him from walking away from Congress and trying other options if they do not negotiate with him in good faith. I've said this here for years now but in the American system it takes two to govern. One side has clearly demonstrated that they are not in the slightest bit interested in doing so.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Totally checks out, friend on my Facebook:

 

[Jooney]

Totally checks out, friend on my Facebook:

Sounds like that $319M should have been invested in remedial math.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

Wow, Obamacare is so bad that even Obama hasn't signed up for it yet:

Boehner and Rubio have though lol