Only if you stop concern trolling; that offends me.
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PoliGAF 2015 |OT| Keep Calm and Diablos On
- Thread starter Aaron Strife
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Only if you stop concern trolling; that offends me.
I like the one dude in the back who stands up
Yes she is, smashable I mean. Not fat, I dunno why anyone would call her fat.
They missed the chance to use Schumer's best anti-body shaming comment.
http://www.theverge.com/culture/2015/6/4/8729575/amy-schumer-glamour-awards-little-mix
http://www.theverge.com/culture/2015/6/4/8729575/amy-schumer-glamour-awards-little-mix
PhoenixDark
Banned
check your privilege, Caucasian.
On a serious note, it sounds like Biden and Obama's relationship is very strong.
http://www.bloomberg.com/politics/a...sked-barack-obama-to-deliver-his-son-s-eulogy
I remember there being some tension early but it seems like they've really formed a bond. I wonder what Biden thinks about Obama's handling of the middle east though.
BertramCooper
Banned
Just got back from the annual Human Rights Campaign Columbus Gala, which a friend of mine coordinates. Jim Obergefell was a keynote speaker.
Not a dry eye in the house.
Not a dry eye in the house.
ErasureAcer
Banned
No idea how to copy on mobile.
Wispolitics.com reports democrats had a straw poll. Hilary at 49 percent. Bernie at 40 percent. Go to the site and check their press release for full results also included is Wisconsin governor.
Wispolitics.com reports democrats had a straw poll. Hilary at 49 percent. Bernie at 40 percent. Go to the site and check their press release for full results also included is Wisconsin governor.
I'm not making fun of Christie because he's fat, I'm making fun of him because I find his politics repugnant.
Yeah, it's not the most sophisticated form of comedy, but really, this is no different than Trump hair jokes.
I love making jokes about that disfigured fox-pelt he calls hair. It makes me smile, on the inside. On the outside too, but also on the inside.
Yellowtail
Member
Hillary got 55% in their poll last year, running essentially unopposed. Sanders is consolidating the Anyone But Hillary vote, but there's no evidence so far he's eating into hers (considering he has the boost of a recent announcement and an ABH candidacy going from hypothetical to real). The problem is that the ABH vote isn't a majority of the party anymore.
And if you want to get an idea of how much stronger she is than 8 years ago, here are the results from the 2007 straw poll:
Also everyone is jumping off the Carson ship:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...08f9b2-0ba8-11e5-a7ad-b430fc1d3f5c_story.html
He's made $18 million in the last 16 months from all this though so I doubt he cares.
Yellowtail
Member
Can you imagine the right wing reaction if there was a picture of Obama eating ribs with gloves on.
Dude couldn't even order Dijon.
When asked about riding motorcycles, Rubio responded that he would be more interested when they start making jet-skis.
The hypocrisy of the party is shocking - can you *imagine* what a democrat would suffer had they responded to a question like that? Chris, look what Kerry went through for having the temerity to windsurf!
BertramCooper
Banned
It's hard to really give a shit about people making fun of male politicians' bodies, given the constant physical scrutiny female politicians (and female public figures in general) constantly face by default.
Well I think that's a good starting point for why it's wrong though. Women obviously have it worse and get this type of shit so often that it's almost considered normal female political commentary.
But that doesn't mean it's right that men of any weight would have to go through that either. I'm just saying maybe there should be a blanket moratorium on that sort of thing. (Alongside jokes about how un-masculine/un-American someone is because they don't look "right" on a motorcycle or a tank or because they like Arugula or some shit.)
BertramCooper
Banned
It's just funny how it takes a man getting ridiculed for his personal appearance for certain people to give a shit about it.
In other news, I came extremely close to making a complete ass of myself at the aforementioned HRC Gala I attended last night. Abercrombie & Fitch was one of the event's main sponsors, and they showed a video talking about how they value diversity and equality in their workforce. I came very close to making a snarky comment about their loss at the Supreme Court last week, but before I could, one of the other people at the table mentioned that he works at Abercrombie, and he seemed to be in a pretty prominent position there.
Derp. I really should know better. There are Abercrombie employees everywhere in Columbus, and you just kind of have to learn to bite your tongue when discussing them.
Chris Christie is a living proof that being obese does not prevent you from being a very successful politician, if you're a man that is.
I mean sure, there is lookism in politics, even for men, and that shit isn't ideal, but I personally still feel find to crack a fat jokes at politicians I don't like in a place like this.
And it's not like I don't like him because he's fat or that I'd never vote for a fat person.
Well we all know how that works in politics
I don't think you're doing it maliciously, I'm just saying it'd be wrong if there was a female politician getting called out for aspects of her appearance (as always happens), and it's similarly wrong to do it about men. In other words, women have it way worse, but that doesn't mean we don't have to do some internal soul searching about the way we talk about men as well.
It just seems to lower the level of discourse. Yeah, the guy is obese. But they also have a point... he was doing this for charity, and the big commentary on the event now is his baseball pants looked awkward. I do think there's a sort of problem with that, at least if we ever want to aspire for politics to be a little better.
PhoenixDark
Banned
I see nothing wrong with criticising the morbidly obese. At this point his weight merely confirms what we already know about Christie: he has no impulse control. Also he clearly doesn't give a fuck. He had bypass surgery a couple years ago, back when he seemed like a contender, but he has clearly gained weight since then. Part of it might be stress but ultimately the sacrifice of eating healthy wasn't worth it to him, even with presidential aspirations on the line.
If you're that overweight you have a problem and should seek help.
If you're that overweight you have a problem and should seek help.
Yet another typically shallow bit of political commentary from PhoenixDark. First of all, plenty of people are far more obese than Christie and actually cannot control it. There are actual diseases and physical problems with people that can sometimes cause great obesity, outside of "impulse control." And second of all, by your own post he has tried to get help with the bypass surgery. That he has been unable to control the weight suggests that it's something he genuinely struggles with.
Third of all, in what world does someone having impulse control issues - which would mean a mental malady, something someone struggles with - mean it's OK to be cruel and make fun of someone for it? That's the worldview you want to stick to?
It doesn't meant to be high level of discourse, it's poligaf, we make dumb jokes from time to time, this is on the mom jeans and Paul Ryan douchebro gym pictures level.Well we all know how that works in politics
I don't think you're doing it maliciously, I'm just saying it'd be wrong if there was a female politician getting called out for aspects of her appearance (as always happens), and it's similarly wrong to do it about men. In other words, women have it way worse, but that doesn't mean we don't have to do some internal soul searching about the way we talk about men as well.
It just seems to lower the level of discourse. Yeah, the guy is obese. But they also have a point... he was doing this for charity, and the big commentary on the event now is his baseball pants looked awkward. I do think there's a sort of problem with that, at least if we ever want to aspire for politics to be a little better.
Right, but it's not just PoliGAF. This commentary on his pants has been the dominate discussion everywhere about this charity event. That's what I'm referencing more than just a few comments on this topic. We can indulge in it if we like, but I'm saying maybe it's important to stop and think about what we're playing into when we do it. If we genuinely want the system to change in how we discuss our politicians, it's worth a thought.
PhoenixDark
Banned
Not everyone who is obese has a disease. Let's get that bullshit out the way first. Especially in this country.
Wasn't Christie just popped for spending thousands of dollars on food at sports stadiums? He has a history of reckless behavior which colors every aspect of his personaility. From his temper to his weight. He deserves the criticism he faces. I never said people should be laughed at.
Bypass surgery isn't a cure. If you continue to eat poorly you'll regain the weight. I'd argue that having the surgery but not taking any serious measures to change his behavior ties right into his problem with controlling his behavior.
How do you tell the difference? Until we have a way of casually glancing at someone and telling whether it is self-control or a disease that is causing the obesity, there's really no good excuse to just being mean about obesity. There's layers of complexity here that people like you consistently ignore because it's not convenient to our desire to be mean about something that grosses us out.
And even in a world where it's a "impulse control" issue, that is not actually that far removed from a disease. People can be depressed for example and fight to change their mood but never actually be able to no matter how hard they try. Similarly, someone with a serious enough impulse control problem will find the issue springing up throughout their life, and some will successfully fight the problem, others not. That's a genetic problem, a mental issue. It doesn't say anything about whether someone might be a good politician or not. We've had many great fat politicians.
Everyone likes a good fat joke. It's an easy target. When I was young I made them too all the time. And when I got older and went through my fat phase, I was on the receiving end of them. But the point is that using obesity as a means of condemning someone's character is wrong. If it's a casual joke just poking a little fun, fine. But from your comment, you're trying to draw more significant conclusions about who Christie is as a person because of it. That's where it really crosses the line.
Well he has a weight problem, so I'm sure there's more overbuying food anecdotes/stories behind the scenes we'll hear about one day. But his temper is the bigger problem, because that does speak to how he'll deal with diplomatic problems or his colleagues (and it has effected this many times). That's a subject actually worth dissecting politically I'd think.
It isn't a cure, but it is certainly him seeking help for his problem. That it didn't work out doesn't mean he didn't try. Plenty of people try extremely hard to quit their food addiction but end up failing, no matter how many actions they try. Contrary to what you've been told, merely trying at something is not a guarantee of success.
Being a food addict is not equivalent to being a drug addict. We've had many successful and great fat politicians.
As an aside, we have had drug addict presidents before, and the world survived
PhoenixDark
Banned
Not being mean. This is a health issue and we live in a country dominated by poor eating decisions and a general disinterest in working hard at being healthy as opposed to a variety of diet/exercise scams. It's a health issue that impacts the entire country and costs billions of dollars a year. Of course I'm concerned about it, and am tired of people being coddled or made to think there's nothing wrong with unhealthy behavior. If you have a disease obviously that's a different situation. But it doesn't take a lot of research to determine a lot of this is a product of poor eating habits, portion control, and a general "fuck it" attitude about health.
Why? You yourself brought up his anger issues, which is a sign of having poor self control. I'm merely arguing that everything he does is a function of that lack of self control. This is the type of guy who shuts down a bridge because an insignificant politician didn't endorse him. We're going to argue over whether he has a comprehensive problem with this stuff?
Just because something is a health issue does not mean someone should be made fun of for it. Do you realize how that sounds? Many people are obese for reasons beyond their control, and there's literally no way for you to tell who fits into that category by looking at them. And on top of that, if you ACTUALLY had a desire to fix the problem, condemnation and insults is not how you're going to do it. It's not 'coddling' someone to not subject them to fucking petty insults so that you can feel better about yourself and the state of the health industry.
This is like you saying that you should make fun of people with depression because it's a health issue and you're tired of people pretending it's not. First of all, very few people pretends obesity is not a health issue. Some people argue that it's OK to be happy with your body image even if you're fat, but how mainstream is the argument that it's not impacting your health? Right, not very mainstream at all.
And for you it apparently requires more research, because plenty of obesity is not at all caused by a "fuck it" attitude to health. Yes, naturally in order to get fat you need to eat more than you should. But trying to say it's about teaching proper portion control is the answer so one dimensional a view it's almost comical we're having this discussion.
Yes, tell someone with Cushing's Syndrome to 'control their portions.' Tell the scientists studying the issue that the answer is merely good education about food intake. They'll laugh you out of the building.
That's the problem with all these discussions about obesity. We want the solutions to be simple, we want it to be merely a problem with an individuals character so that we can put the blame on something easily identifiable. But as we can see from various studies, obesity is often a problem resulting in a mix of easily identifiable genetic issues and environmental conditions. Even if we fixed the environmental conditions and eradicated all fast food joints, many people would go on being very obese for the simple fact that their genes regulating satiety, appetite, metabolic rates and physical activity are mutated in a negative way. And although some may successfully master themselves and overcome this problem, others never will. Until you have an easy way to identify who falls into what category regarding obesity, your posts on the subject reek of little more than unbridled cruelty toward a people you refuse to acknowledge as sometimes having conditions beyond their control.
PhoenixDark
Banned
Funny, I don't remember saying the obese should be made fun of. To the contrary it's no laughing matter, and should be discussed and criticized appropriately.
This entire discussion is about whether it is right or wrong to make fun of Christie for how he looked in those baseball pants, and you responded you see no problem with criticizing him for his weight.
If you just mean you think it's OK to take Christie aside and compassionately discuss that he should try to seek even more help for his obesity, your posts certainly don't come across that way.
PhoenixDark
Banned
There's a difference between making fun of someone and criticizing them. I'm on record as saying I think criticisms of Christie's weight are in bounds and fine. Having bypass surgery and gaining weight suggests a serious problem with self control. His spending habits confirm that problem, as does is general behavior. This is a guy who exerts poor self control and should be called out on it, especially since he is running for president.
I don't think anyone should be pulled aside either - this should be a national discussion, in the open and very frank. People would prefer to be told something isn't their fault. We live in a country that subsidizes poor eating, and a culture that doesn't value health. These are problems that need to be addressed - not spun by tumblr activists or Mo'Nique types who will tell you there's nothing wrong or unhealthy about this shit.
Hillary Clinton supports a minimum wage of $15. Sanders is making her take these far left positions. What happened to triangulation like Bill Clinton from the 90's.?
x(
http://www.politico.com/story/2015/06/clinton-to-fast-food-workers-i-want-to-be-your-champion-118708.html?hp=l2_4
x(
http://www.politico.com/story/2015/06/clinton-to-fast-food-workers-i-want-to-be-your-champion-118708.html?hp=l2_4
The people against this won't vote for her anyway.
She's also abandoning the Bill Clinton electoral map in favor of Obama's. Southern and Rural Democrats are upset she wont entertain the idea of campaign in their red states. Steve Beshear thinks Clinton could win Kentucky lol. Basically she wont win by being Republican lite but by turning out the liberal base who dont vote.
James Carville said it best:
James Carville said it best:
I think you're off base on that. The "why should burger-flippers earn as much as I do with a college degree?" contingent cuts across both sides of the spectrum.
Now whether that would actually sway anyone's vote...
It likely won't sway anyone on either side, but it could help turn out. If she can approach Obama's levels of turnout then she can win easily.
A higher minimum wage is an overwhelmingly popular policy. 63% of Americans support a $15 minimum wage.
http://www.nelp.org/content/uploads/2015/03/Minimum-Wage-Poll-Memo-Jan-2015.pdf
I don't dispute that, I dispute that the people opposed to it aren't voting for Hilary anyway.
Roland_Gunner
Member
Thats interesting, I'm closer to Sanders than Clinton politically and to me a $15 min wage is a bad idea in 90% of the country. There are too many businesses wouldn't hire people who need jobs at that rate.
Well that's more of a misunderstanding of the economics. Businesses only hire what they need and no more. If a restaurant only needs 4 cooks then they only hire 4 cooks. If you want businesses to hire more people then you need to increase demand so that, say the restaurant needs a 5th cook.
PhoenixDark
Banned
I think you took the wrong lesson from the general downgrading of labor over the last 8 years...
Good point, they'll hire 2 or 3 and make them work harder. The larger point stands, companies won't hire more people because they can pay them less.
Roland_Gunner
Member
I think you're underestimating the ability of modern companies to reduce the number of jobs by investing in automation, outsourcing, or just being open fewer hours. A small increase in the minimum wage would not substantially increase those factors but doubling it, even over a period of years, would. And this is a time when millions of people are still either out of work or under-employed. I would support a move of the national minimum to $10 over a few years and allow localities to stay above that level but $15 is too much a risk right now.
Aaron Strife
Banned
The media wants elections to be close and they want Hillary to compete in red states so there's something worth talking about in those states. But Democrats have a solid path to victory even without the traditional swing states like Ohio and Florida.
Grade-A political hackery by saying Obama had "narrower" paths to victory than Bill did. I mean... not by much, EV wise. And he won a larger share of the popular vote both overall and in the swing states.
T
thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
It was only a couple months ago that Jeb Bush called for the end of the federal minimum wage. Really amazing how polarized the two parties have become on a lot of issues.
Depends on the state. We did this in Nebraska to raise the minimum wage
http://ballotpedia.org/Nebraska_Minimum_Wage_Increase,_Initiative_425_(2014)
3 other Republican states passed minimum wage increases in 2014 via similar methods
Coriolanus
Banned
They'll do that regardless as soon as they possibly can. That they still haven't done it, even in places like Australia and the nordic countries, where average fast food wages are considerably higher than in the US (and in the case of australia, way higher than 15 usd), is evidence that they simply cannot currently do so.
If they stay open fewer hours, they cut directly into their revenue.
Businesses will do what businesses have always done: cut costs and maximize profit whenever and wherever they can. They do nothing out of concern for their employees in the lower strata.
I fail to see why the government should keep subsidizing their payroll when it has clearly only resulted in more accrual of wealth at the top.
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