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PoliGAF 2015 |OT| Keep Calm and Diablos On

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I'm not 100% convinced the law discriminates, given that it focuses on government interference - not person to person (or business to business) interactions. The language mirrors that of nearly 20 states with the same law, and most of those states don't protect gays & lesbians under civil rights legislation.
It does do this.

And I'll say it again rfra bills are unnecessary and possibility unconstitutionally vague. Write exceptions in bills or challenge it on 1st amendment grounds. All RFRA bills do is allow a religion (often corporate with hobby lobby case) veto of duly enacted legislation.

On a side note lol conservatives
https://twitter.com/mattyglesias/status/582207729151815680
 

Metaphoreus

This is semantics, and nothing more
And I'll say it again rfra bills are unnecessary and possibility unconstitutionally vague. Write exceptions in bills or challenge it on 1st amendment grounds. All RFRA bills do is allow a religion (often corporate with hobby lobby case) veto of duly enacted legislation.

The First Amendment only protects against laws that discriminate on the basis of religion--it's functionally nothing more than an adjunct of the Fourteenth Amendment, under current jurisprudence. Pretending that the First Amendment offers protection that is the same as or similar to that provided by the RFRA is absurd.

As for your first sentence, how do you figure the law is vague? "Broadly applicable" isn't the same as "vague."
 
The First Amendment only protects against laws that discriminate on the basis of religion--it's functionally nothing more than an adjunct of the Fourteenth Amendment, under current jurisprudence. Pretending that the First Amendment offers protection that is the same as or similar to that provided by the RFRA is absurd.

As for your first sentence, how do you figure the law is vague? "Broadly applicable" isn't the same as "vague."

What more do you need? Your religion doesn't give to a right to ignore laws because your religion has others. The first amendment prevents the government from targeting your religion, it doesn't give you free reign to do whatever. And most tellingly conservatives concede that point. They say of course there are limits but they never define them. They just love the standard that judeo-christian ideas about restricting women's rights, hating gays and minorities and shielding themselves from science are the prime benifactors and others like the use of weed, islamic use of family law are not given the same protection.

I thought conservatives were for banning foreign law?

I think their vague because they possibly too many laws and pretty much give judges extreme descresion with not much oversight, see the ridiculous hobby lobby decision which had the court arbitrary deciding which laws could and couldn't be overturned because they forced people to violate their religion. And broadly applicable when the standard is ever changing and hard to define, that is vauge.

Its a horrible standard and codifies religious law beyond what the court held in the case that prompted RFRA.

Scalia was right here

The "compelling government interest" requirement seems benign, because it is familiar from other fields. But using it as the standard that must be met before the government may accord different treatment on the basis of race, see, e.g., Palmore v. Sidoti, or before the government may regulate the content of speech, see, e.g., Sable Communications of California v. FCC, is not remotely comparable to using it for the purpose asserted here. What it produces in those other fields -- equality of treatment, and an unrestricted flow of contending speech -- are constitutional norms; what it would produce here -- a private right to ignore generally applicable laws -- is a constitutional anomaly.
… The rule respondents favor would open the prospect of constitutionally required religious exemptions from civic obligations of almost every conceivable kind -- ranging from compulsory military service to the payment of taxes to health and safety regulation such as manslaughter and child neglect laws, compulsory vaccination laws, drug laws, and traffic laws; to social welfare legislation such as minimum wage laws, child labor laws, animal cruelty laws, environmental protection laws, and laws providing for equality of opportunity for the races.[3]

RFRA is an unworkable standard
 

ivysaur12

Banned
Well, Pence stepped in it on "This Week" on ABC and basically fired up the controversy again.

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/indi...rsial-religious-freedom-law/story?id=29985752

Won't answer yes or no question on whether this will allow businesses to deny services to gay couples, says he won't push for legislation to add LBGT as protected class from discrimination. "We're not going to change this law". Won't answer whether it should be legal for people to discriminate against gays & lesbians in Indiana.

It's like Pence got all of red herring talking points from Metaphoreus. Was there an email that went out from HQ?

Also, Pence... that's not how you do damage control? "Bill Clinton signed it!" is probably the stupidest defense you could have of said law. There are many things that Bill Clinton did that people did not like, both on the right and the left! Him signing a bill does not necessarily mean that those on the left have to go, aw shucks! There are many things signed throughout history, even on a voice vote, that we've now looked at through a more modern lens and seen potential problems within modernity.
 

Mario

Sidhe / PikPok
Also, Pence... that's not how you do damage control? "Bill Clinton signed it!" is probably the stupidest defense you could have of said law. There are many things that Bill Clinton did that people did not like, both on the right and the left! Him signing a bill does not necessarily mean that those on the left have to go, aw shucks! There are many things signed throughout history, even on a voice vote, that we've now looked at through a more modern lens and seen potential problems within modernity.

Fox News uses a similar strategy for sourcing a lot of supposedly Democrat or left leaning commentators, proudly pushing the "Something Advisor to the Clinton Administration".

Even a Clinton advisor is speaking out against Obama? He must be a commie!
 

Oblivion

Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
Well, Pence stepped in it on "This Week" on ABC and basically fired up the controversy again.

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/indi...rsial-religious-freedom-law/story?id=29985752

Won't answer yes or no question on whether this will allow businesses to deny services to gay couples, says he won't push for legislation to add LBGT as protected class from discrimination. "We're not going to change this law". Won't answer whether it should be legal for people to discriminate against gays & lesbians in Indiana.

Yeah, just saw this a few minutes ago.

What is with conservatives and their obnoxious habit of passing unpopular laws and then trying to pretend it doesn't do what they clearly want it to do?
 

NeoXChaos

Member
Paul: April 7th
Rubio: April 13th(insiders say that is tentative on what Clinton does)
Clinton: 20th???

Rubio would make 5 open senate seats: 2 toss ups, 1 lean GOP, 2 likely D's
 
Yeah, just saw this a few minutes ago.

What is with conservatives and their obnoxious habit of passing unpopular laws and then trying to pretend it doesn't do what they clearly want it to do?

Its not like the fund raise on the very issue at heart

http://www.hoosierfamily.org/blog/opportunity-knocking-indiana

As many of us know, the next legislative session begins in January. Indiana Family Institute and many affiliated elected officials are proposing legislation that will bring similar federal religious protection to the state level. In 1993, the Religious Freedom Restoration Act was passed protecting citizens from laws that placed substantial burden on their free practice of religion. Indiana does not have their own Religious Freedom Restoration Act like many other states. The absence of such a State Act has allowed many municipalities to intrude on individual practice of religion, especially when it comes to businesses.

Contributing to this effort requires sharing this information with friends, family and fellow church members, calling and emailing your respective elected officials and donating to organizations like the Indiana Family Institute. With these contributions we can enact policy that will prevent incidents that have happened here and nationwide. Below are the links to specific cases that are similar to the countless tales we have heard in the past few years. It is not too late to make a tax deductible contribution for the 2014 tax year.
 

ivysaur12

Banned
Fox News uses a similar strategy for sourcing a lot of supposedly Democrat or left leaning commentators, proudly pushing the "Something Advisor to the Clinton Administration".

Even a Clinton advisor is speaking out against Obama? He must be a commie!

Also, like, Pence, no shit? The modern movement of gay rights didn't really begin en masse outside of liberal enclaves until recently. And the idea that a RFRA could threaten to turn away gay couples from wedding vendors probably didn't matter in 1998 because... there were no gay weddings. Commitment ceremonies, perhaps, but for an unpopular minority that had limited legal rights.

But Bill Clinton signed it! ...means nothing. Bill Clinton also signed DOMA as a compromise, and we know rightfully view that law as the terrible piece of shit it is, even though many sitting Democratic politicians voted for it who are now in favor of marriage equality. Posting videos of Bill Clinton signing RFRA is stupid.

The general populace might not even be aware that their state has RFRA like laws. They might not even be aware that their state doesn't have anti-discrimination laws for LGBT people. Pence's bemusement at why his state is being attacked isn't really that surprising at all, especially because it's a right-leaning state (but not a hard right state) in 2015 when gay rights are at the hight of popular approval.
 
Yeah, just saw this a few minutes ago.

What is with conservatives and their obnoxious habit of passing unpopular laws and then trying to pretend it doesn't do what they clearly want it to do?

goes hand in hand with them pretending unpopular laws passed by dems do what they want it to do, instead of what it actually does
 

sprsk

force push the doodoo rock
Yeah, just saw this a few minutes ago.

What is with conservatives and their obnoxious habit of passing unpopular laws and then trying to pretend it doesn't do what they clearly want it to do?

Hold on while i google that...
 

Metaphoreus

This is semantics, and nothing more
PD and Meta joining forces? A troll and an avid conservative law defender?

Lord. I need some popcorn.

I think you mean APKmetsfan and Scalia.

What more do you need? Your religion doesn't give to a right to ignore laws because your religion has others. The first amendment prevents the government from targeting your religion, it doesn't give you free reign to do whatever. And most tellingly conservatives concede that point. They say of course there are limits but they never define them. They just love the standard that judeo-christian ideas about restricting women's rights, hating gays and minorities and shielding themselves from science are the prime benifactors and others like the use of weed, islamic use of family law are not given the same protection.

You're overlooking the fact that a law that applies equally to everyone weighs heavier on the person who believes it requires him or her to sin against God than the person who simply doesn't care for the law. The RFRA understands that fact and seeks to minimize the tension for religious people between what man commands and what God commands.

As for limits to the RFRA, we know exactly what they are, abstractly. We may not know ahead of time at what point the government fails to have a compelling interest in enforcing a given law, or what is the least restrictive means of furthering that interest. But we know that a law must satisfy those requirements to be enforceable against a religious challenger. Because it would be impossible to state a rule or exception that covers every possible religious belief, it's better to use a standard that can be applied in diverse contexts, such as that under the RFRA.
 
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/30/w...ks-away-from-key-detail-in-nuclear-deal.html?

LAUSANNE, Switzerland — With a negotiating deadline just two days away, Iranian officials on Sunday backed away from a critical element of a proposed nuclear agreement, saying they are no longer willing to ship their atomic fuel out of the country.

For months, Iran tentatively agreed that it would send a large portion of its stockpile of uranium to Russia, where it would not be accessible for use in any future weapons program. But on Sunday Iran’s deputy foreign minister made a surprise comment to Iranian reporters, ruling out an agreement that involved giving up a stockpile that Iran has spent years and billions of dollars to amass.

“The export of stocks of enriched uranium is not in our program, and we do not intend sending them abroad,” the official, Abbas Araqchi, told the Iranian media, according to Agence France-Presse. “There is no question of sending the stocks abroad.”

*gulp*
 

Trouble

Banned
Carly Fiorina (who many have called the worst CEO of all time) says there's "higher that 90%" chance she's gonna run for President.

LMAO.

I'm sure there have been and will be worse, but yeah she was pretty terrible at HP.

Her entire political career consists of failing to get the VP seat on McCain's ticket and failing to unseat Barbara Boxer . If she runs it's probably in hopes of getting picked as running mate for whoever gets the nomination.
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
Carly Fiorina (who many have called the worst CEO of all time) says there's "higher that 90%" chance she's gonna run for President.

LMAO.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...ikely-to-run-for-gop-presidential-nomination/
Fiorina said she could appeal to voters with a “deep understanding of how the economy actually works, having started as a secretary and become the chief executive of the largest technology company in the world.”
She was able to make millions of dollars from HP having to force her out after she lost investors half their money thanks to an idiotic Compac merger, while pushing all the blame and consequence of her stupid actions on her underlings, by shipping their jobs overseas.

Seems like she has a perfect understanding of Republican economics to me. She might have ruined the lives of thousands of others, but she came out ahead, and isn't that really all that matters?
 

Cloudy

Banned
I saw O'Malley's interview on ABC this morning. He's ridiculous and has no rationale for his candidacy. Basically talking down the economy as a reason to run.
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
I saw O'Malley's interview on ABC this morning. He's ridiculous and has no rationale for his candidacy. Basically talking down the economy as a reason to run.

Reminds me of Benji's post from a couple of days ago.

What the Democrats have to do in 1988 is turn themselves into a usable opposition. If they present themselves as a liberal party, the electoral college will do to them exactly what it did in 1968, 1972, and 1984. But they can't become a conservative party either. Liberals are right when they say that faced with a choice between two Republican parties, the voters will choose the real thing every time. The answer is for the Democrats to define themselves as the party of change. Instead of posing an ideological choice, in which people are asked to vote their beliefs and values, the Democrats must do exactly what Ronald Reagan did in 1980- forget ideology and turn the election into a referendum, a choice between continuity and change. Once the Democrats win, they will have ample opportunity to convince the voters that their principles are correct. All they have to do is show that they work.

What the voters seem to want in 1988 is change, but not too much change. They want the new President to deal with Reagan's mistakes. But they do not want to endanger the two things Reagan is credited with having achieved: lower inflation and a greater sense of military security. The Democrats cannot do anything that threatens to put those achievements at risk. To Jackson voters and liberal activists, Dukakis is a timid choice. Instead of posing a direct ideological challenge to everything Reagan stands for, Dukakis promises only to make government work better In Jesse Jackson's words, "Dukakis will manage the damage." That is called "me too" politics, and activists don't like it. On the Republican side, many conservatives are critical of Bush for the same reason--"He's bland, he's dull, he isn't saying anything." But conservatives, like liberals, get into trouble when they say too much.

What both parties have to offer is a safe alternative for voters who are unhappy with the status quo. Dwight Eisenhower was a safe alternative in 1952. Richard Nixon was believed to be safe in 1968, especially since everywhere Hubert Humphrey and George Wallace went that year, riots broke out.

You lose if you act like the opponent, and you lose if you differentiate yourself from the opponent, so just fling mud and hope they choose you for simply not being the other guy.

Seems to sum up the entire party over the last 30 years pretty well, minus the part where they follow their real principles once they enter office.
 

benjipwns

Banned
I hope O'Malley's entire focus of his campaign is around "no dynasties" and similar.

Also Graham over Gohmert? wut
Gohmert was just joking [about all the non-candidate candidates], in the video it's actually pretty clear too, but media gonna media.

Plus he's not on the wiki page, NOT ON THE WIKI PAGE!
 

benjipwns

Banned
would-you-consider-voting-for-each-for-the-republican-nomination-1.jpg


would-you-consider-voting-for-each-for-the-democratic-nomination-1.jpg



http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/presidential-races/237313-cruz-i-was-not-a-community-organizer
Sen. Ted Cruz (R-Texas), the only major declared Republican presidential candidate, is defending his credentials as a freshman senator while pursuing a White House bid.

“Unlike Barack Obama, I was not a community organizer before I was elected to the Senate,” Cruz said during an interview aired on CNN's "State of the Union."

"I spent five-and-a-half years as the solicitor general of Texas," Cruz said. "I supervised and led every appeal for the state of Texas in a 4,000-person agency with over 700 lawyers. And over the course of five-and-a-half years, over and over Texas led the nation defending conservative principles and winning."

Cruz panned Obama, a fellow Harvard Law graduate, as a "backbencher" during his time in the Senate.

"There are a lot more noticeable differences between us than similarities," Cruz said.
 

Metaphoreus

This is semantics, and nothing more
This is pretty funny:

Orin Kerr said:
In 2011, Chief Justice Roberts commented that if you "pick up a copy of any law review that you see," "the first article is likely to be, you know, the influence of Immanuel Kant on evidentiary approaches in 18th-century Bulgaria, or something, which I'm sure was of great interest to the academic that wrote it, but isn't of much help to the bar.” No such article exists, of course -- until now. This short essay explains why, in all likelihood, Kant’s influence on evidentiary approaches in 18th-century Bulgaria was none.

Only three (short) pages, too.
 

ivysaur12

Banned
This is pretty funny:



Only three (short) pages, too.

loooooool

In today's edition of amazing lawsuits:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_ex_rel._Gerald_Mayo_v._Satan_and_His_Staff

Gerald Mayo filed a claim before the United States District Court for the Western District of Pennsylvania in which Mayo alleged that "Satan has on numerous occasions caused plaintiff misery and unwarranted threats, against the will of plaintiff, that Satan has placed deliberate obstacles in his path and has caused plaintiff's downfall" and had therefore "deprived him of his constitutional rights". This is prohibited under several sections of the United States Code. Mayo filed in forma pauperis - that is, he asserted that he would not be able to afford the costs associated with his lawsuit and that they therefore should be waived.

In his decision, U.S. District Court Judge Gerald J. Weber first noted that the jurisdictional situation was unclear. While no previous cases had been brought by or against Satan and so no official precedent existed, there was an "unofficial account of a trial in New Hampshire where this defendant filed an action of mortgage foreclosure as plaintiff", a reference to the short story "The Devil and Daniel Webster". Judge Weber suggested that the defendant (who had claimed in that story to be an American), should he appear, might have been therefore estopped from arguing a lack of personal jurisdiction. In this context, the Court noted that Satan was a foreign prince, but did not have occasion to address whether, if sued as a defendant, he would be able to claim sovereign immunity from suit.

Judge Weber also noted that the case was certainly appropriate for class action status, and that Mayo had met three of the four required elements for a class action (commonality, numerosity, and typicality), but it was not then clear that Mayo could properly represent the interests of the entire (immense) class (the adequacy element).

Ultimately, though, the Court refused the request to proceed in forma pauperis because the plaintiff had not included instructions for how the U.S. Marshal could serve process on Satan.

Also:

http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/I_Am_The_Beast_etc._v._Michigan_State_Police

I AM THE BEAST SIX SIX SIX OF THE LORD OF HOSTS IN EDMOND FRANK MACGILLIVRAY JR NOW. I AM THE BEAST SIX SIX SIX OF THE LORD OF HOSTS IEFMJN. I AM THE BEAST SIX SIX SIX OF THE LORD OF HOSTS. I AM THE BEAST SIX SIX SIX OTLOHIEFMJN. I AM THE BEAST SSSOTLOHIEFMJN. I AM THE BEAST SIX SIX SIX. BEAST SIX SIX SIX LORD, Plaintiff, v. MICHIGAN STATE POLICE; CITY POLICE OF LANSING; STATE OF MICHIGAN; INGHAM COUNTY 54A DISTRICT COURT; and INGHAM COUNTY JAIL, Defendants
 

Crisco

Banned
It's a bit piling on at this point, but not really since they haven't stopped saying ridiculously stupid shit about Obamacare.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/30/opinion/paul-krugman-imaginary-health-care-horrors.html?ref=todayspaper

Before the law went into effect, opponents predicted disaster on all levels. What has happened instead is that the law is working pretty well. So how have the prophets of disaster responded? By pretending that the bad things they said would happen have, in fact, happened.

In reality, the only people hurt by health reform are Americans with very high incomes, who have seen their taxes go up, and a relatively small number of people who have seen their premiums rise because they’re young and healthy (so insurers previously saw them as good risks) and affluent (so they don’t qualify for subsidies). Neither group supplies suitable victims for attack ads.

So really, take it as a compliment if you paid more for insurance after Obamacare. It means you're winning!
 
Cruz has some executive level experience in terms of having responsibilities over a team, which is important. Obama didn't have any experience in that, and it shows to this day. Still Cruz is a fool.

Ultimately I'm not sure anyone is 100% ready to be president. Eisenhower might be the only one in the last 60 years who was probably most ready, simply because his previous job had similar demands and consequences.
 

benjipwns

Banned
Ultimately I'm not sure anyone is 100% ready to be president. Eisenhower might be the only one in the last 60 years who was probably most ready, simply because his previous job had similar demands and consequences.
H.W. Bush is next just because of all the posts he held, like the CIA.

Of course, if Eisenhower was a 100, Bush was like a 45.

As much as I like him, Carter is closest to a zero. Being his own chief of staff lol
 
Ultimately I'm not sure anyone is 100% ready to be president. Eisenhower might be the only one in the last 60 years who was probably most ready, simply because his previous job had similar demands and consequences.

Which is cool because they have a giant staff, built it bureaucracy and institutional constraints.

The only real requirement is that they are ready for the commander in chief part of the job. That's why I think people like cain, bachman and carson are so underqualified. As much as I dislike Cruz, Bush and Rubio I think they are somewhat aware of what that entails. Its also why I think warren is pretty under qualified. She has no desire to do half the job.
 

benjipwns

Banned
smh, Herman Cain ran Godfather's Pizza. What more could prepare you for commander in chief?

In general I lean towards governors because of that similar dealing with administration experience vs. legislators.

One advantage the younger legislators like Obama, Rubio, Cruz, Paul, etc. have is they haven't yet been sucked into that legislator speak vortex that Kerry, Gore, McCain, etc. all have that leads you to say things like "I took the lead in the...", "I chaired the Sub-Committee of the Committee on Commissions to determine Committee Appointments" or "I actually voted for the $85 billion before I voted against it." Some of that hurt Hillary I think.
 
smh, Herman Cain ran Godfather's Pizza. What more could prepare you for commander in chief?

In general I lean towards governors because of that similar dealing with administration experience vs. legislators.

One advantage the younger legislators like Obama, Rubio, Cruz, Paul, etc. have is they haven't yet been sucked into that legislator speak vortex that Kerry, Gore, McCain, etc. all have that leads you to say things like "I took the lead in the...", "I chaired the Sub-Committee of the Committee on Commissions to determine Committee Appointments" or "I actually voted for the $85 billion before I voted against it." Some of that hurt Hillary I think.

at the same time I hate the fact that it limits who you can choose. People like lincoln and lbj were never gov but others like FDR were. I really don't think either really is better. Its all a matter of optics and is relatively meaningless, the office shapes the man/women, they're all politicians and are adaptable.
 
Was toying with a concept that would create a previous experience requirement in order to determine eligibility. Dude would need to be a mayor before guvna, guv before prez. Same deal for legislators and no interbranch swapping cuz fuck if knowing how to craft laws (which, in candid theory despite all evidence to the contrary, legislators do) teaches you anything about how to run a county.

Also no reelections, ever. Only way to climb is up and then you're done.

Would never happen, obv. Not even sure if the branch blocking makes a whole lotta sense.

at the same time I hate the fact that it limits who you can choose. People like lincoln and lbj were never gov but others like FDR were. I really don't think either really is better. Its all a matter of optics and is relatively meaningless, the office shapes the man/women, they're all politicians and are adaptable.

The focus on blocking reelection being also because it would increase the available pool.

The end of that particular logic train of yours results in elections being irrelevant, btw.
 

Chichikov

Member
H.W. Bush is next just because of all the posts he held, like the CIA.

Of course, if Eisenhower was a 100, Bush was like a 45.

As much as I like him, Carter is closest to a zero. Being his own chief of staff lol
I think Truman still wins the unpreparedness crown, at least Carter was a governor and at least he was running for president thinking he'll probably win, so he had time to make plans and think about what he's going to do.
Also, LBJ needs to get a nod as the president who was the most prepared to deal with DC and politics in general, it's not everything in being a POTUS (and the mistakes he made reflect that) but it's an important part.
I agree with you on Eisenhower and Bush (and generally about Carter btw, I just don't think he get the number one spot).
 
The focus on blocking reelection being also because it would increase the available pool.

The end of that particular logic train of yours results in elections being irrelevant, btw.

How? that's not to say they aren't subject to different pressures, bring different things to the table, react and choose differently.

I'm just saying differences between legislature and executive are meaningless between the same person. The person adapts to the role. Not that everybody is the same and becomes the same president.
 

benjipwns

Banned
Truman wasn't in the last 60 years tee hee

LBJ is an interesting case, there's no way a Speaker or Majority/Minority Leader gets through the primaries today. LBJ was in that position to become VP simply because of the hold he had on Democrats throughout the country, he didn't even run in the few primaries because he didn't have a shot. (And ran proxies in '64 to stop any Wallace boomlet from forming.) And the VP offer was out of courtesy to the second place guy, RFK never expected him to actually take it considering his Senate power. Of course all that arm-twisting and stuff he did back then in the Senate was a lot more powerful than it is today.

Some of those traits came back to bite him on Vietnam though. It was hard to give The Johnson Treatment to people 3000 miles away he'd never meet.

Carter threw away half his term and alienated a friendly Congress by trying to run everything through himself, especially when he had no lay of the land. Kennedy blundered by helping him turn it around and then trying to primary him lol
 
The fact that Republicans are writing off Kasich (and I'm starting to reconsider my initial stance that he will enter the race) is exactly why they're going to lose again next year.

If you're going to pick a governor, pick a governor who puts governance in front of boneheaded political grandstanding.

Kasich appeared to view the remark as a jab at Medicaid recipients. “Maybe you think we should put them in prison. I don’t,” he told Roy. “I don’t think that’s a conservative position. Because the reality is, if you don’t treat the drug addicted and the mentally ill and the working poor, you’re gonna have them and they’re gonna be a big cost to society.”

“When you die and get to the meeting with St. Peter, he’s probably not going to ask you much about what you did about keeping government small. But he is going to ask you what you did for the poor,” Kasich said at the time. “You better have a good answer.”

I wish there were more republicans like this (not that I don't think he's done other things that have had an adverse affect on people)
 
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