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PoliGAF 2016 |OT5| Archdemon Hillary Clinton vs. Lice Traffic Jam

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Huelen, can't you just vote for Clinton? Please?
Nah man, Clinton's being Clinton.

I find it strange that people don't feel the need to substantiate assessments of the Clintons being super corrupt or dishonest, as if it's just some universal fact that everyone's already on the same page on.
 
Greenwald is too busy writing conspiracy theories about how Goldman Sachs is orchestrating a coup in Brazil.

https://theintercept.com/2016/04/22...ng-installed-as-president-and-finance-chiefs/

He's completely gone from reality.

So to summarize: Brazilian financial and media elites are pretending that corruption is the reason for removing the twice-elected president of the country as they conspire to install and empower the country’s most corrupted political figures. Brazilian oligarchs will have succeeded in removing from power a moderately left-wing government that won four straight elections in the name of representing the country’s poor, and are literally handing control over the Brazilian economy (the world’s seventh largest) to Goldman Sachs and bank industry lobbyists.

Uh huh

Oooh, yeah problematic if --

-- wait what
 

itschris

Member
I was curious if the Bernie Sanders campaign's FEC violations had any precedent, so I went searching on the FEC's site to compare with Obama's 2008 campaign (the most recent major campaign with a similar focus on small donors). If you want to have a look yourself, the right listing is Obama for America. You can find the relevant files under Filings; look for the ones named RFAI. For example, to compare with Bernie's recent report, you can see Obama's Amended April report here:

http://www.fec.gov/fecviewer/CandCm...y.fec.gov/pdf/259/28039813259/28039813259.pdf

Some problems, but only 27 pages long, compared to 639 pages for Bernie. Even the original unamended April report was only 58 pages. And Obama's 2008 campaign actually ended up getting fined $375,000 for their violations after an audit was completed. Perhaps the Sanders campaign could end up getting their own large fine at some point in the future.

Hillary's 2016 campaign is squeaky clean compared to either of them - they've only gotten one RFAI so far, and it's only two pages long.
 
I was curious if the Bernie Sanders campaign's FEC violations had any precedent, so I went searching on the FEC's site to compare with Obama's 2008 campaign (the most recent major campaign with a similar focus on small donors). If you want to have a look yourself, the right listing is Obama for America. You can find the relevant files under Filings; look for the ones named RFAI. For example, to compare with Bernie's recent report, you can see Obama's Amended April report here:

http://www.fec.gov/fecviewer/CandCm...y.fec.gov/pdf/259/28039813259/28039813259.pdf

Some problems, but only 27 pages long, compared to 639 pages for Bernie. Even the original unamended April report was only 58 pages. And Obama's 2008 campaign actually ended up getting fined $375,000 for their violations after an audit was completed. Perhaps the Sanders campaign could end up getting their own large fine at some point in the future.

If they do I wonder if he'll just claim it's part of the establishment conspiracy.
 
I have to think there's a really good campaign to be made against the GOP in general based on how the Republican Party has allowed its members to scam people for the last 20 or so years.

Newt Gingrich and Ben Carson ran for president just to steal money and they were extremely successful at stealing money and no one is calling this out on the right. It's got to matter to some people.
 
A little late to this but modern nuclear power is safer, more efficient, and cleaner than literally anything in its remote weight class, power production wise. I say "remote" because literally nothing is in nuclear power's weight class when it comes to power generation. More people have gotten cancer from coal plants than nuclear ones (probably, it's tough to measure). Solar, wind, these are nice, but ultimately not viable replacements for fossil fuels. Nuclear is the future, and the sooner the better.
 
On a conference call with the campaign’s National Prayer Team, Heidi Cruz portrayed Ted Cruz’s presidential campaign, which ended a week ago, as one part of a broader journey similar to the abolition of slavery.

“I don’t want you to feel like any of this was in vain,” Heidi Cruz said. “I believe in the power of prayer. This doesn’t always happen on the timing of man, and God does not work in four-year segments.”

“Be full of faith and so full of joy that this team was chosen to fight a long battle,” she continued. “Think that slavery — it took 25 years to defeat slavery. That is a lot longer than four years.”

Man, Cruz made his wife just as fucked up as he is.

http://www.rawstory.com/2016/05/hei...dential-campaign-to-the-fight-to-end-slavery/
 
It's a possibility she could die tomorrow.

Have you seen her coughing?

9Az0zCm.gif
 

pigeon

Banned
Christ. All I meant was that we are all entitled to our own analyses of situations, even if they are probably wrong.

I appreciate you making your argument more clear!

Sure, I agree with this, and I would add that your analysis should ideally make an effort to take into account the actions of third party actors who have more access to primary sources than you do and motivations that would affect their actions if certain theories are correct. I think that's how situational analysis works.

Like, when I say "why do you think the DNC is supporting her," that's a genuine question! I am happy to hear theories about that. But I think if your starting point is that this really is an obviously potentially criminal situation then you should probably have an answer to that question, because it's kind of important.

If there was such consensus among the DNC to run Hillary this year, Malley wouldn't have jumped in there (he WAS a successful and well liked governor/mayor) and Biden wouldn't have dick teased everyone. Just look at his comments this week! You know he wanted it.

It is not inconceivable or even unlikely that the former Secretary of State and former President had such a huge influence in the party that there was a lot of pressure to not consider or worry about the effect of the email investigation on her chances.

Sure, I think there's some truth to this. I think that Biden's tentative run was largely about the possibility of the email scandal getting legs, and I said so at the time. But I think that the failure of that run says a lot about what the eventual decision of the DNC was.

My comparison to the Iraq War was the unwavering belief in the logical decision making of a political entity. That's it.

I'm not suggesting that the DNC is logical. I'm saying that it's self-interested, which is a little different. I don't think recognizing the self-interest inherent in the actions of political individuals would make you more likely to support the Iraq War in 2001 or so -- I think it would do the opposite, frankly. So I don't think the comparison is particularly apt. Most people who argued for the war did so because they thought that, in one way or another, they'd get what they wanted out of it. The DNC doesn't get anything they want if Hillary gets put in jail.
 
The conservative pile-on of Facebook has been hilarious. As if EVERY other aggregate news listing on the planet doesn't curate their stories in SOME way. Facebook isn't some Government agency with a mission statement of political and ideological balances. What do they expect? A list of all stories published in chronological order like the AP has for their twitter feed, entirely out of context? Even without any possible direct story curation it already (and still) offered stories based on your data-mined profile. It was never "raw" content.

Poster child of popular right-wing news sources that are known for super-mega 100% curation being Drudge, of course, who publishes zero stories of their own and only offers external links of whatever-the-hell-they-feel-like.I'm up to 292, buahahaha. But no you may not see my tax returns.

It speaks to the lack of good conservative media sites that function as news. I'm trying to think of what sites they would actually link.

WSJ - decent, but behind a paywall, op-ed section is bigoted garbage a lot of the time
National Review - regularly full of racism, LGBT-phobia, and the majority of the content only exists to bash liberals
RedState - racism, conspiracy theories, and bigotry galore
New York Post - fucking LOL
Breitbart - sometimes decent, runs more actual "news" than most others.
The Blaze - fucking LOL
The Federalist - mostly exists to bash liberals or do pep rallies for the hard right.
Fox News - sometimes a good choice, but is literally part of the Republican establishment

Conservatives just don't have many news sites that actually focus on telling the news as their primary objective. The majority of it is about how Obama and liberals are dead wrong about some issue, are evil, or are working on some kind of conspiracy.

The best "conservative news" is found on regular news sites from writers who happen to be conservative.
 
It speaks to the lack of good conservative media sites that function as news. I'm trying to think of what sites they would actually link.

WSJ - decent, but behind a paywall, op-ed section is bigoted garbage a lot of the time
National Review - regularly full of racism, LGBT-phobia, and the majority of the content only exists to bash liberals
RedState - racism, conspiracy theories, and bigotry galore
New York Post - fucking LOL
Breitbart - sometimes decent, runs more actual "news" than most others.
The Blaze - fucking LOL
The Federalist - mostly exists to bash liberals or do pep rallies for the hard right.
Fox News - sometimes a good choice, but is literally part of the Republican establishment

Conservatives just don't have many news sites that actually focus on telling the news as their primary objective. The majority of it is about how Obama and liberals are dead wrong about some issue, are evil, or are working on some kind of conspiracy.

The best "conservative news" is found on regular news sites from writers who happen to be conservative.

Yup, I think it's clarifying that for instance, Robert Costa, who everybody in DC respected as a hard news reporter for the National Review jumped over to the Post as soon as he possibly could.

Plus, the center-left has stole all their good policy - ObamaCare is the Heritage Foundation plan plus actual good things, Obama's for expanding EITC, cap 'n' trade has become socialism, and so on, and so forth. Hell, the Obama White House has even hopped on the loosening licensing requirements for various jobs train.

I mean, I have one right-leaning but sane and elections based site I visit to keep myself honest about the elections, but I look at the conservative sites more to know what weird arguments I'll see on Reddit or Facebook than for actual news.
 

CCS

Banned
It speaks to the lack of good conservative media sites that function as news. I'm trying to think of what sites they would actually link.

WSJ - decent, but behind a paywall, op-ed section is bigoted garbage a lot of the time
National Review - regularly full of racism, LGBT-phobia, and the majority of the content only exists to bash liberals
RedState - racism, conspiracy theories, and bigotry galore
New York Post - fucking LOL
Breitbart - sometimes decent, runs more actual "news" than most others.
The Blaze - fucking LOL
The Federalist - mostly exists to bash liberals or do pep rallies for the hard right.
Fox News - sometimes a good choice, but is literally part of the Republican establishment

Conservatives just don't have many news sites that actually focus on telling the news as their primary objective. The majority of it is about how Obama and liberals are dead wrong about some issue, are evil, or are working on some kind of conspiracy.

The best "conservative news" is found on regular news sites from writers who happen to be conservative.

Same problem in the UK. The only conservative newspapers who aren't completely insane are the Telegraph, which isn't great and is behind a soft paywall, and the Times, which is behind a hard paywall. Couple that with the fact that the BBC are impartial and that Sky are worse than the BBC in every way and there aren't a whole lot of decent sharable conservative news sites.
 

HK-47

Oh, bitch bitch bitch.
I too think nuclear power is a good source of energy. However it's something that can't be taken lightly and demands continuous care and utmost attention. Also as you said, Chernobyl was a human error. The lead scientist who was a Politburo member wanted to do tests despite warned by his workers and an ongoing fluctuation test in power from the central grid. But how many similar pig headed managers have caused deaths of mine workers? Coal plants? Asbestos poisoning? Out of 4 decades of nuclear power we can only list 3 major incidents, one of which was caused by a natural disaster. That tells me it's still the safest method of extracting energy. Yes, disaster results are horrific and go beyond a simple localized disaster site. Again, asbestos, cancer, etc. I don't know if regulations can solve every problem either but I guess we also need a better whistleblower laws to help concerned workers in conjunction (I guess a pipedream in places like Russia and China).

As for nuclear waste, it's no worse than carbon monoxide. At least the waste here can be kept in check. My dream answer to this problem is to shoot nuclear waste into space. If we can carry giant ass space shuttle into space, we sure can lug a few tons of Toxic sludge!

Why shoot it into space when we can make reactors that are powered by it instead?
 

Oblivion

Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
That's the post that makes Huelen start to reconsider Trump

That same thing has been said a million times

I don't even

Stump said:
I unpermed Huelen (*ducks shoes being thrown from crowd*) and dog$ 5 or 6 years after they were permed.

Huelen's a goober, but dog$ was an asshole. The latter was way less deserving of coming back. I've seen him post the other day. Hopefully he mellowed out a bit at least.
 
Greenwald is too busy writing conspiracy theories about how Goldman Sachs is orchestrating a coup in Brazil.

https://theintercept.com/2016/04/22...ng-installed-as-president-and-finance-chiefs/

He's completely gone from reality.

I mean, the thing is, I think it's highly probable that yes, the PT was insanely corrupt as a party in Brazil (like every other party in Brazil - it's like if a whole nation only had New York, Louisiana, and Illinois political parties to choose from), but also the conservative elites are using this as an opportunity to reverse or severely cutback the various good policies Lula and his successor instituted.
 
My friend who works as a civil engineer got a notice from caltrans of an organized hacking campaign of electronic signs to display anti-Trump messages.
 

Tubie

Member
That Trump rally video in the OT, my god. I know that people shouldn't vote on the crowd, or the look, or the race or the personality or any of that shit, jut the issues that matter, but damned if those idiots in that Trump rally don't make anyone who might consider voting for him on policy alone an nothing more associated with them.

Who would want to be confused and bunched up with people like that?

It's... crazy.

Not necessarily. Besides, can anyone honestly say they agree with all policies of a particular considered candidate? If so, that number must be very small. It's just, conceding you know. I expect educated people not to lump people together, but the masses aren't educated. If I publicly stated I am currently considering Sanders and Trump, the mention alone might get me stares or worse. I don't want that.

It's almost like bullshit guilt by association. Obviously not fair, but sadly the world doesn't always play fair.

I respectfully disagree, yet at the same time understand your point, now with an additional point of view as I've now realized. Maybe, even though I agree on some points of an individual, it's the wrapper itself that can be toxic. Maybe I'm too particular and open-minded of a voter that I've failed to realize the importance of the person behind the policy to an extent. Maybe this guy doesn't deserve my vote.

Maybe, he doesn't. I have to think about this. You most certainly do bring up valid concern.


You can wriggle all you want, but if you vote for Trump that means you ARE racist.
 

pigeon

Banned
What would need to happen for DC statehood to happen? I read that Muriel Bowser wants to make it a ballot initiative. What would happen after that? Would Congress need to approve it?

Depends on the implementation.

The US Constitution is the ultimate provision for Washington DC as it explicitly gives Congress complete legislative control over the federal district. So actually just taking all of Washington DC as it is now and declaring it a state would require an amendment.

But although the district can't be larger than 10 square miles, there's no limit to how small it can be. It would be fine to reduce the official District of Columbia to contain just, like, the Mall and the White House and a couple other important federal buildings, and push the rest of the district out into either its own state or back into Maryland.

It would also probably (though debatably) be legal to just pass a law saying that the District isn't a state but gets representatives and senators as if it were a state, and it would certainly be fine for Congress to create a municipal government with lawmaking authority (in fact they had one before and they got rid of it). So DC could also pretty easily be made a state in all but name.

Either way it's a solvable problem and there's periodically some energy in Congress to deal with it, but never enough to actually solve it.

They should have done this in 2009. If Democrats do manage to get the House this fall, they should make this a priority next year.

They actually tried. https://www.congress.gov/bill/111th-congress/house-bill/157

The Senate put an amendment on it banning DC from ever restricting gun rights, and the bill died in the House as a result.
 

itschris

Member
What would need to happen for DC statehood to happen? I read that Muriel Bowser wants to make it a ballot initiative. What would happen after that? Would Congress need to approve it?

Edit: yes.
http://www.vox.com/2014/11/12/7173895/new-columbia-congress-marijuana-legalization

They should have done this in 2009. If Democrats do manage to get the House this fall, they should make this a priority next year.

Yeah, the constitution says:

New States may be admitted by the Congress into this Union; but no new State shall be formed or erected within the Jurisdiction of any other State; nor any State be formed by the Junction of two or more States, or Parts of States, without the Consent of the Legislatures of the States concerned as well as of the Congress.

Practically, since it would give Democrats a boost, especially in the Senate, it would require a solid Democratic majority in the House and at least 60 Democratic Senators (unless they eliminate the filibuster). I bet the Republicans would attempt to stop it in the courts, too. They'd probably argue that it violates the constitution to make the capital district a state, though I think the plan in the link you gave should easily pass muster:

A popular plan embraced by advocates for statehood, called New Columbia, would leave the US Capitol, White House, Supreme Court, National Mall, and nearby national parks and monuments as the federal District of Columbia. The rest of the current district would be fashioned as a new state, known as New Columbia.
 
I kind of fantasize about a Fuck You tour early next year.

Get rid of the filibuster
Confirm Garland immediately
Have RBG and Breyer retire, replace them with Goodwin Liu and another leftist, preferably a woman and a minority
Fill every single lower court vacancy in one day
Admit DC to the Union
Admit Puerto Rico too if they want it
Do immigration reform with the path to citizenship

It would be like Operation Bagration for liberals.
 

Maledict

Member
Why is everyone so sure that RBG will retire if a democrat gets elected president?

This is her life's work, she's done amazingly well at it but clearly has a lot of fight left in her. Is it normal for judges to retire from the Supreme Court?
 
Why is everyone so sure that RBG will retire if a democrat gets elected president?

This is her life's work, she's done amazingly well at it but clearly has a lot of fight left in her. Is it normal for judges to retire from the Supreme Court?

She pretty much has to. Clinton could lose reelection, and we could have a Republican in the White House until 2028, at which point she'd be 95.
 

Y2Kev

TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
I think people look at this the wrong way. You just need someone more liberal than the median on the court to keep decisions swinging 5-4. You don't need to replace Scalia with RBG 2.0, you just need to replace him with someone left of Kennedy.

My problem with Garland, for example, is not ideology...it's age. Weird pick.
 
I think people look at this the wrong way. You just need someone more liberal than the median on the court to keep decisions swinging 5-4. You don't need to replace Scalia with RBG 2.0, you just need to replace him with someone left of Kennedy.

My problem with Garland, for example, is not ideology...it's age. Weird pick.

For Obama it is picking someone that has a chance to get a hearing and get approved. He is not playing the game with the Garland pick.

Hillary will hopefully tell Garland bye bye and pick Loretta Lynch
 

PBY

Banned
I think people look at this the wrong way. You just need someone more liberal than the median on the court to keep decisions swinging 5-4. You don't need to replace Scalia with RBG 2.0, you just need to replace him with someone left of Kennedy.

My problem with Garland, for example, is not ideology...it's age. Weird pick.
I don't care what people say.

I hate the pick.
 

User 406

Banned
So, let's not pretend nuclear is a solved problem.

I don't think anyone's saying that.

What people are saying is that coal and oil cause problems that are an immediate threat to the future habitability of the planet that seriously outweigh the problems with nuclear.

And as other people have pointed out, the tech has greatly improved. Along with improved safety, we now have reactor designs that can run on current nuclear waste, which considering that the whole point of nuclear power is to generate electricity from radioactivity is a pretty obvious efficiency move.


I'm up to 292, buahahaha. But no you may not see my tax returns.

Well fuck, I need to do a reset soon then! >:|


She pretty much has to. Clinton could lose reelection, and we could have a Republican in the White House until 2028, at which point she'd be 95.

That's the thing about lifetime appointments, she pretty much doesn't have to. She'll leave when she wants to leave.


Some asshole has put out a meme aimed at Bernie Sanders supporters that supposedly shows how to make DIY glowsticks.

It actually shows how to make a chlorine gas bomb.

Please let your Bernie friends know. Pool cleaning tablet + isopropyl alcohol = disaster.

http://mic.com/articles/143020/bernie-sanders-glowsticks-chlorine-and-isopropyl-alcohol?utm_source=policymicFB&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=WHFacebook&utm_content=inf_10_285_2&tse_id=INF_d852bfaaa4b5402dba260c9ef3c124df#.xEcAUbM0N

Quoted for the new page, if you're one of those people with a lot of Bernie people on your Facebook, pass this around to make sure people are aware.
 

Rebel Leader

THE POWER OF BUTTERSCOTCH BOTTOMS
How convenient that a new person is speaking about dr. Ben ghazi.

I'm tired of hearing about this but I'm in a republican controlled town :/
 
If Hillary has a 639 page report from FEC for campaign finance violations we would have had a 50 page OT thread already.

someone make one for Bernie please.

The only way that thread would be any good is if you substituted Bernie's name for Hillary's in the title and text, just to trick people in to reacting badly because they hate her. But, obviously, mods probably wouldn't be too happy with that kind of petty trickery. For good reason.
 

Emarv

Member
I know it's way too far to speculate, but does anybody believe Hillary could get 2 terms?

I feel like if the GOP gets their house even somewhat in order, she's fairly defeatable in 2020. Then again, I thought the GOP would have had their shit together by now after 2012.
 
I know it's way too far to speculate, but does anybody believe Hillary could get 2 terms?

I feel like if the GOP gets their house even somewhat in order, she's fairly defeatable in 2020. Then again, I thought the GOP would have had their shit together by now after 2012.

Very rarely do presidents not win re-elections.

And 4 years isn't really enough time for the GOP to re-organize itself. They're at the tipping point of a re-alignment, and that doesn't really get resolved in just four years.
 

bananas

Banned
Very rarely do presidents not win re-elections.

And 4 years isn't really enough time for the GOP to re-organize itself. They're at the tipping point of a re-alignment, and that doesn't really get resolved in just four years.
You're gonna see for the Democrats what the Republicans had in the second half of the 19th century.

Outside of Grover Cleveland (and Andrew Johnson, but he wasn't elected), every president was a Repulbican until Woodrow Wilson.
 

HylianTom

Banned
I know it's way too far to speculate, but does anybody believe Hillary could get 2 terms?

I feel like if the GOP gets their house even somewhat in order, she's fairly defeatable in 2020. Then again, I thought the GOP would have had their shit together by now after 2012.
I think her fate lies with not only the GOP's sanity, but also with the economy. If we see a downturn, things could get dicey.

That said, the demographic clock keeps on ticking, making the path for almost any GOP nominee incrementally steeper. Without some sort of change in how each demographic segment of the population votes, we're approaching a point where backlash to recessions, etc isn't enough to deny a Democrat a win.
 
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