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[B-Dubs]

So apparently Bernie's now blaming all his losses on the idea that poor people do not vote.

Sen. Bernie Sanders, I-Vt, has built his campaign on a message of combating income inequality, but that message doesn't seem to be resonating in many of the states with the highest levels of income inequality in the country. In fact, of the 25 states with the highest levels of income inequality, 17 have held primaries so far, and Clinton has won 16 of those contests.

When asked why he thinks he's losing in those states, Sanders responded, "Well, because poor people don't vote. I mean, that's just a fact."

In an interview airing on NBC's "Meet the Press" this Sunday, Sanders described the voter turnout among low-income Americans as "a sad reality of American society, and that's what we have to transform." He credited his campaign with working to bring more young people into the voting process. He explained that they have "had some success with lower income people. But in America today, in the last election in 2014, 80% of poor people did not vote." NBC News has reached out to the Sanders campaign for clarification on this statistic.

Politifact has previously examined Sen. Sanders' claim that "75% of low-income workers chose not to vote" and characterized his comments as "a bit off."

It could just be they don't agree with him on the solutions...

 

[ivysaur12]

Ehh, from what I know about them I'd say no.

(I was mocking people who think Hillary is a secret Republican)

 

[blackaroni]

So Obama spoke at a youth townhall and this happened:



What do you guys think?

I am late on this, but I agree with him 100%. A BLM group in Philly was invited to a Clinton event with Eric Holder and local leaders but turned it down and opted to protest instead. They showed up with a list of demands and the first one was about releasing everyone in federal prison or something. I didn't even read the rest. Why would you ever turn down an opportunity to meet with someone who wants to help you? A protest can get you a headline, but a meeting may have gotten you results.

 

[Azzanadra]

So apparently Bernie's now blaming all his losses on the idea that poor people do not vote.



It could just be they don't agree with him on the solutions...

I think it just harkons back to the old class theory. The Middle want to exchange places with the high, and the low are too involved/concerned in their own world that they lack care for external affairs. But then again, this idea was proposed in 1984 by George Orwell, another socialist so I guess both he and his book are wrong.

In short, Bernie's not wrong entirely.

 

[dramatis]

Hey, even Obama (who seems to be loved around here) considers The Wire an important artistic work in relaying the realistic of inner city life, so much so that its considered political commentary and Obama actually had a sit down with David Simon.

Also, Bill Clinton said House of Cards is real. This one I'm more iffy on...

It might be a very good artistic work, but it doesn't mean that it's reality.

 

[Azzanadra]

It might be a very good artistic work, but it doesn't mean that it's reality.

Erm, The Wire is very much a reality for many people. I've been to Baltimore, its an absolute shithole (the "bad areas is what I mean, not the whole city). Police cases on the show were pulled from real life, as were characters. Don't you think its kind of disingenuous to say that considering this is a horrible reality many people live through every day?

 

[Iolo]

So apparently Bernie's now blaming all his losses on the idea that poor people do not vote.

It could just be they don't agree with him on the solutions...

Now even poor people are part of the establishment!

 

[Armaros]

Erm, The Wire is very much a reality for many people. I've been to Baltimore, its an absolute shit show. Police cases on the show were pulled from real life, as were characters.

I live in Maryland, those stories are massive exaggerations of what actually happens.

Stop believing TV dramas as reality. You know when directors and writers say they use real life stuff to make their stories, they mean they take real life stories as a blueprint to create the narrative, not that they transplant stuff 1:1 from reality into the TV.

 

[Azzanadra]

I live in Maryland, those stories are massive exaggerations of what actually happens.

Stop believing TV dramas as reality.

You are literally the first person I have ever heard calling it a "massive exaggeration", Even Obama think its a reality, and he has the most vested interest in proving it a farce.

 

[B-Dubs]

I think it just harkons back to the old class theory. The Middle want to exchange places with the high, and the low are too involved/concerned in their own world that they lack care for external affairs.

In short, he's not wrong entirely.

Only when we look at exit polls he's wrong. For example, from NY. Then there's Illinois, which was incredibly close. Then there's Michigan, which Bernie actually won and yet still lost among the poorest voters. He's not winning the poorest Americans outright whenever it's a close race, so there's no reason to think poor people not voting is what's causing him to lose.

In short, he kinda is wrong. If he were winning that demo outright by a large margin in every contest he might have a point, but he hasn't been.

 

[dramatis]

Erm, The Wire is very much a reality for many people. I've been to Baltimore, its an absolute shithole (the "bad areas is what I mean, not the whole city). Police cases on the show were pulled from real life, as were characters. Don't you think its kind of disingenuous to say that considering this is a horrible reality many people live through every day?

There is nothing disingenuous about calling fiction fiction. Even if it's based on real life stories and settings, that doesn't mean The Wire isn't fiction.

If you can't divorce fiction from reality you run the risk of not being able to assess reality properly and being unable make the right decisions. It will be a parade of "this happened like this in a fictional story, so it's definitely going to play out the same way in real life"—is that not absurd?

You are literally the first person I have ever heard calling it a "massive exaggeration", Even Obama think its a reality, and he has the most vested interest in proving it a farce.

"Been to Baltimore" vs someone who lives in the actual reality of Maryland, who is likely to be a more reliable source? The one basing his perception of Baltimore off of fiction?

Moreover, it appears you have become Hillary, given your insistent hugging of Obama on his opinion of The Wire.

 

[ampere]

So apparently Bernie's now blaming all his losses on the idea that poor people do not vote.

It could just be they don't agree with him on the solutions...

South doesn't matter and poor people don't vote. Bernie has the inside scoop

 

[Azzanadra]

There is nothing disingenuous about calling fiction fiction. Even if it's based on real life stories and settings, that doesn't mean The Wire isn't fiction.

If you can't divorce fiction from reality you run the risk of not being able to assess reality properly and being unable make the right decisions. It will be a parade of "this happened like this in a fictional story, so it's definitely going to play out the same way in real life"—is that not absurd?

I never said "this is exactly how it played out in real life." I am saying the conditions of the poor, the relationship between face and class, the corruption in politics and the dangers of the street as observed in that show is a reality experienced by many people.

Moreover, it appears you have become Hillary, given your insistent hugging of Obama on his opinion of The Wire.

Okay, so agreeing/admiring with one thing Obama said makes me Hillary. You do realize that as individuals, we can pick and choose the qualities and things we like, right? Im sure you don't like everything about Hillary, just as I don't like everything about Bernie...

 

[Sibylus]

A lot of his beliefs (like Harper's) are built on the legacy of what Canada is, so that automatically makes even some Conservatives more liberal than Hillary. Yes, harper tried to emulate the GOP near the end of his tenure, but his first four years were pretty decent. I would have voted for Layton, but the Liberals deserved whatever happened during 2011.

Hwhat?

Harper opposed abortion rights, opposed equal marriage rights, opposed doing anything substantial about climate change, opposed the legacy Trudeau Sr. helped cement, weakened public healthcare, turned a blind eye to the plight of minorities be they first nations or otherwise, pet love for the Monarchy, intimately involved in the corrupt placement and bribery of a Senator...

What Canada have you been living in the past decade?

 

[Armaros]

Hwhat?

Harper opposed abortion rights, opposed equal marriage rights, opposed doing anything substantial about climate change, opposed the legacy Trudeau Sr. helped cement, weakened public healthcare, turned a blind eye to the plight of minorities be they first nations or otherwise, pet love for the Monarchy, intimately involved in the corrupt placement and bribery of a Senator...

What Canada have you been living in the past decade?

I think I can figure out the political math.

People believe Canada is more liberal then the US
Thus Harper is more liberal then his US counterpart, the GOP.
Some people still believe Hillary is closer to Republicans (or is a republican) then progressive democrats.
Thus Harper = Hillary.

 

[brainchild]

Azzanadra sees the real world in terms of fictional television shows.



So you can probably see why he is divorced from reality.

Didn't know PoliGAF had its very own Abed.

AWESOME!

 

[OrangeGrayBlue]

I live in Maryland, those stories are massive exaggerations of what actually happens.

Stop believing TV dramas as reality. You know when directors and writers say they use real life stuff to make their stories, they mean they take real life stories as a blueprint to create the narrative, not that they transplant stuff 1:1 from reality into the TV.

I lived in Frederick for a bit, that doesn't mean I'm all that familiar with the rougher parts of Baltimore.

Also, I worked in Compton, CA for a while. Crazy stuff definitely happens.

 

[ampere]

Harper was so bad even my conservative uncle voted Trudeau this past election.

Funny to learn that he is apparently more liberal than Hillary! lol

 

[Azzanadra]

Hwhat?

Harper opposed abortion rights, opposed equal marriage rights, opposed doing anything substantial about climate change, opposed the legacy Trudeau Sr. helped cement, weakened public healthcare, turned a blind eye to the plight of minorities be they first nations or otherwise, pet love for the Monarchy, intimately involved in the corrupt placement and bribery of a Senator...

What Canada have you been living in the past decade?

Yet despite all of that, we still have free health care, a lower crime rate, and overall I felt more comfortable and safe as a minority in Harper's Canada than America under any President.

 

[Armaros]

Yet despite all of that, we still have free health care, a lower crime rate, and overall I felt more comfortable and safe as a minority in Harper's Canada than America under any President.

And Harper is the person that implemented all of that under his governing?

OR was it a history of liberal government before Harper was elected into office.

 

[Orbis Tabula]

Obama likes Game of Thrones, guys. Therefore, every Game of Thrones metaphor I make should be considered valid.

Hillary Clinton is Jaqen H'ghar, amirite?

 

[Azzanadra]

And Harper is the person that implemented all of that under his governing?

OR was it a history of liberal government before Harper was elected into office.

Remember when I said its part of Canada's legacy? This is exactly what I meant, Harper is a conservative in the context of our pedigree, its not like he just abolished all those things. P.S, the NDP also helped with those things, especially healthcare.

Obama likes Game of Thrones, guys. Therefore, every Game of Thrones metaphor I make should be considered valid.

Hillary Clinton is Jaqen H'ghar, amirite?

Its not because he likes it, its because he quite literally said it. He had a sit down with David Simon, for example and they talked about the issues discussed in the show.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xWY79JCfhjw

 

[dramatis]

I never said "this is exactly how it played out in real life." I am saying the conditions of the poor, the relationship between face and class, the corruption in politics and the dangers of the street as observed in that show is a reality experienced by many people.

Okay, so agreeing/admiring with one thing Obama said makes me Hillary. You do realize that as individuals, we can pick and choose the qualities and things we like, right? Im sure you don't like everything about Hillary, just as I don't like everything about Bernie...

Did you not just equate Hillary to Claire Underwood earlier in the thread? I'm sure you don't know anything about Hillary, but yet here we are, you're insulted that I compared you to Hillary, while you yourself engaged in such behavior by equating Hillary (who you probably know very little about) to a fictional character.

You were the one who argued, "Erm, The Wire is very much a reality for many people", but it's a fictional show. You cannot call it a reality because it is not. There is nothing disingenuous about calling fiction fiction.

 

[royalan]

So apparently Bernie's now blaming all his losses on the idea that poor people do not vote.



It could just be they don't agree with him on the solutions...

...but doesn't he lose low income voters in most states that Hillary has won? So if more poor people voted, wouldn't that just make her margins larger?

Then again, this is a Sanders excuse. Why am I looking for logic.

 

[Armaros]

Remember when I said its part of Canada's legacy? This is exactly what I meant, Harper is a conservative in the context of our pedigree, its not like he just abolished all those things. P.S, the NDP also helped with those things, especially healthcare.

And you think he had the votes to overturn a system as large as that by himself?

Its almost like most governments have a system of checks and balances.

 

[Orbis Tabula]

DAE think republicans are like lannisters? [SPOILERS]

 

[B-Dubs]

...but doesn't he lose low income voters in most states that Hillary has won? So if more poor people voted, wouldn't that just make her margins larger?

Then again, this is a Sanders excuse. Why am I looking for logic.

He also loses them in contests where it's a close race, win or lose.

 

[Sibylus]

Yet despite all of that, we still have free health care, a lower crime rate, and overall I felt more comfortable and safe as a minority in Harper's Canada than America under any President.

So inertia and the majority of Canadians preventing him from implementing more of his policies... makes him more liberal than Hillary Clinton?

Despite all that rationalization, you're still a salted pretzel.

 

[Slayven]

If next Tuesday goes against him, his excuses will be amazing

 

[Piecake]

Remember when I said its part of Canada's legacy? This is exactly what I meant, Harper is a conservative in the context of our pedigree, its not like he just abolished all those things. P.S, the NDP also helped with those things, especially healthcare.

So, Canada's legacy makes Harper more liberal than Clinton even though Clinton professes far more liberal ideas? Good god man, that makes no sense at all.

I also don't think you understand the limit of political and cultural structures that have enacting change. I would not be shocked at all If Harper wanted to get rid of Canada's healthcare system just like the Tories are doing now, but he couldn't do it because he would have been crushed in the next election. Just because the electoral climate and political structures are preventing a politician from doing something doesn't mean that those politicians then hold the beliefs of that electoral climate and political structures.

 

[Azzanadra]

So inertia and the majority of Canadians preventing him from implementing more of his policies... makes him more liberal than Hillary Clinton?

Despite all that rationalization, you're still a salted pretzel.

He had a majority if you remember, he could do whatever he wanted. But he didn't. If he's so evil as everybody is saying, why didn't he take away free health care? Why didn't he advocate violence against minorities ala Trump? Why did defend Muslims every time a terrorist attack happened? Why was the the first prime minster to issue an official apology for residential schools?

Last I checked, Harper didn't declare war on Iraq either despite his initial eagerness... whereas Hillary literally voted for it.

 

[Piecake]

He had a majority if you remember, he could do whatever he wanted. But he didn't. If he's so evil as everybody is saying, why didn't he take away free health care? Why didn't he advocate violence against minorities ala Trump? Why did defend Muslims every time a terrorist attack happened? Why was the the first prime minster to issue an official apology for residential schools?

Because he wanted himself and his party to stay in power?

 

[hiryu2015]

Also, Bill Clinton said House of Cards is real. This one I'm more iffy on...

Washington Post reporter Chris Cuh-leez-a (pronunciation courtesy of James Carville) said on radio yesterday that Veep is probably the most realistic representation of Beltway politics in that everyone has "petty grievances and weird staff". Cuh-leez-a (and other current and former journalists on the Tony Kornheiser radio show) find HoC to be complete junk.

 

[Orbis Tabula]

Washington Post reporter Chris Cuh-leez-a (pronunciation courtesy of James Carville) said on radio yesterday that Veep is probably the most realistic representation of Beltway politics in that everyone has "petty grievances and weird staff". Cuh-leez-a (and other current and former journalists on the Tony Kornheiser radio show) find HoC to be complete junk.

Seriously. Every person should watch Veep. Every. Person.

 

[Armaros]

Washington Post reporter Chris Cuh-leez-a (pronunciation courtesy of James Carville) said on radio yesterday that Veep is probably the most realistic representation of Beltway politics in that everyone has "petty grievances and weird staff". Cuh-leez-a (and other current and former journalists on the Tony Kornheiser radio show) find HoC to be complete junk.

The very politics of HoC makes it garbage. Like completely would never happen. Much less the mechanisms they showed in the background.

 

[dramatis]

Seriously. Every person should watch Veep. Every. Person.

I bet adam's mom would love Veep.

Also lol at petty grievances and weird staff

 

[gutter_trash]

Anything is better than the real-life Tommy Carcetti.

Except maybe the real-life Claire Underwood, which is what we are getting...

How would Hillary supporters vote in say Canada or the UK though? Even Cameron and Harper would be too liberal, let alone people like Trudeau/Mulcair/Corbyn...

Canadian here, 41 year old Canadian here.

Stephen Harper is a real Conservative and is the most Social Conservative Prime Minister Canada has ever had since WW2

The only reason why the Harper government wasn't able to push his most social conservative policies is because the Canadian people would have revolted. The country on average is very Centrist, very very Centrist.
+ Harper was also a vote panderer; he did not want to lose votes by being too "Far Right" so he played the Regional Game, pandering to regional interests.
Harper was not stupid, he knew how to play politics. He is a true Conservative at heart but never dared to pushed the envelope too far while in Government. Power was more important to him.

If Harper had his way and was a dictator, he would have scrapped lots of things put in place by past Governments.

I know you are not a Canadian and I know that you are "European" but the thing you must know about Canada is that is is an extremely Centrist countriy that sometimes it goes Centre-Left then sometimes it goes Center-Right but in rarely rarely ever accepts anything more far than that.

Harper's victories last decade where part of
a) 12 year Liberal rule fatigue,
b) the Sponsorship Scandal hurt the Liberals in Quebec for over a decade.
c) The 12 year reign of the Liberal Party left them complacent, arrogant and oblivious
d) Stephane Dion and Michael Ignatieff were two weak leaders, really weak.
c) Vote splitting among the Center-Left and Left among voters with the rise of Popularity of the late Jack Layton of the NPD. Jack Layton was mega charismatic and popular where Dion and Iggy were not.


Justin Trudeau played Thomass Mulcair's bluff.

Tom-ass wanted to move the NDP towards to Center and eliminate the Liberals from existing. (Tom-ass is a fake Social-Democrat, mind you)

Justin turned that table on Tom-ass and campaigned from the Center-Left moving away from the 1990s Clintonian-Chretien era of budget surplusses.

Tom-ass was campaigning on balanced budgets. Justin campaign on spending and investing on infrastructure.

Justin Trudeau's liberal called Tom-ass' bluff and flanked from the Center-Left and won a big. Bringing the Liberals back to Pearson era Liberals or St-Laurent era Liberals to the Center-Left

 

[Sibylus]

He had a majority if you remember, he could do whatever he wanted. But he didn't. If he's so evil as everybody is saying, why didn't he take away free health care? Why didn't he advocate violence against minorities ala Trump? Why did defend Muslims every time a terrorist attack happened? Why was the the first prime minster to issue an official apology for residential schools?

Last I checked, Harper didn't declare war on Iraq either despite his initial eagerness... whereas Hillary literally voted for it.

Because his name would have been mud.

I'm not going to revise his history for possessing the barest modicum of awareness that demolishing public healthcare and Trudeau Sr's bequeath of the Charter and full-throated multiculturalism would turn him and the party juggernaut he built into political poison.

And get real with regards to the apology. He apologized for crimes deep in the past and turned his back on the crimes being committed against first nations people right now. Words are wind, Azzanadra.

 

[brainchild]

If next Tuesday goes against him, his excuses will be amazing

What do you mean 'if'? He's going to get his ass kicked on Tuesday, no doubt about it. I love the man, but them's the breaks.

Seriously. Every person should watch Veep. Every. Person.

Truth

 

[Hazmat]

Washington Post reporter Chris Cuh-leez-a (pronunciation courtesy of James Carville) said on radio yesterday that Veep is probably the most realistic representation of Beltway politics in that everyone has "petty grievances and weird staff". Cuh-leez-a (and other current and former journalists on the Tony Kornheiser radio show) find HoC to be complete junk.

The only thing HoC has in common with our current political system is that the Vice President is fond of DC's trains.

 

[Bowdz]

Saw this on my voter guide and thought it was funny.


Context for it is on his site if anyone is interested.

Nice try evil AI. I SEE THROUGH YOUR PLOY

 

[B-Dubs]

The only thing HoC has in common with our current political system is that the Vice President is fond of DC's trains.

Joe Biden loves all trains.

 

[Azzanadra]

Canadian here, 41 year old Canadian here.

Stephen Harper is a real Conservative and is the most Social Conservative Prime Minister Canada has ever had since WW2

The only reason why the Harper government wasn't able to push his most social conservative policies is because the Canadian people would have revolted. The country on average is very Centrist, very very Centrist.
+ Harper was also a vote panderer; he did not want to lose votes by being too "Far Right" so he played the Regional Game, pandering to regional interests.
Harper was not stupid, he knew how to play politics. He is a true Conservative at heart but never dared to pushed the envelope too far while in Government. Power was more important to him.

If Harper had his way and was a dictator, he would have scrapped lots of things put in place by past Governments.

I know you are not a Canadian and I know that you are "European" but the thing you must know about Canada is that is is an extremely Centrist countriy that sometimes it goes Centre-Left then sometimes it goes Center-Right but in rarely rarely ever accepts anything more far than that.

Harper's victories last decade where part of
a) 12 year Liberal rule fatigue,
b) the Sponsorship Scandal hurt the Liberals in Quebec for over a decade.
c) The 12 year reign of the Liberal Party left them complacent, arrogant and oblivious
d) Stephane Dion and Michael Ignatieff were two weak leaders, really weak.
c) Vote splitting among the Center-Left and Left among voters with the rise of Popularity of the late Jack Layton of the NPD. Jack Layton was mega charismatic and popular where Dion and Iggy were not.


Justin Trudeau played Thomass Mulcair's bluff.

Tom-ass wanted to move the NDP towards to Center and eliminate the Liberals from existing. (Tom-ass is a fake Social-Democrat, mind you)

Justin turned that table on Tom-ass and campaigned from the Center-Left moving away from the 1990s Clintonian-Chretien era of budget surplusses.

Tom-ass was campaigning on balanced budgets. Justin campaign on spending and investing on infrastructure.

Justin Trudeau's liberal called Tom-ass' bluff and flanked from the Center-Left and won a big. Bringing the Liberals back to Pearson era Liberals or St-Laurent era Liberals to the Center-Left

First of of all, I am Canadian

Sheesh, why do you hate Mulcair so much? I remember from the pre-election Canada PoliGAF thread... I voted Trudeau too, but I would have taken either him or Trudeau and would have been fine. Also, the Liberals actually deserved to lose that 2011 election. I even had Iggy as a lecturer at my University and he pretty much left Canada the first chance he got, so Harper's "just visiting" smear campaign wasn't entirely untrue. Still, I would have preferred Layton.

 

[Makai]

time to modernize our outdated flag

 

[ampere]

time to modernize our outdated flag

Not enough stars

 

[gutter_trash]

Sheesh, why do you hate Mulcair so much? I remember from the pre-election Canada PoliGAF thread... I voted Trudeau too, but I would have taken either him or Trudeau and would have been fine. Also, the Liberals actually deserved to lose that 2011 election. I even had Iggy as a lecturer at my University and he pretty much left Canada the first chance he got, so Harper's "just visiting" smear campaign wasn't entirely untrue. Still, I would have preferred Layton.

Tom-Ass is the most fake politician EVER.

Harper at least is honnestly Conservative so you know that he is a Conservative.

Tom-Ass if full of shit.

Mulcair during his 50s was Center-Right and lauded Margret Thatcher and he bashed Left Wing European governments when he was Provincial Representative in Quebec.
Tom-Ass even toyed with the idea of exporting water in Bulk when he was sitting in the opposition bench going on with weekly spiel.

Mulcair had a failling out with the Leader of his own party (the Quebec Liberals) in Quebec shortly after forming government, he left Provincial politics. (either got kicked out or quit)

Then Mulcair went shopping for a political party, Federally.
He first knocked on the Consrvative's door looking for a job as a consultant.
Things did not work out since he did not agree with the Conservative environmental stances.

The Liberals snnubbed him, so he went knocking on the NDP's door and ask them if he could run in the Outremont bi-election when the riding, and won.

Mulcair is just a political opportunist, and full of crap.

PS: I loved Jack Layton by the way (RIP). Jack was a awesome. Tom not so much.

I voted NDP twice when Jack Layton was a leader while Liberals had those morons Dion then Iggy as leader.

Justin Trudeau saved the Liberals and I am proud of Justin

 

[User1608]

If next Tuesday goes against him, his excuses will be amazing

Those pesky establishment voters

 

[Makai]

Not enough stars

Just enough stars to represent Real America.

 

[Holmes]

Ah, Azzanadra is back and is making gutter_trash say problematic things.

 

[AntraxSuicide]

Not really arguing with your other points, but the republicans dont seem to be compromising on anything though right? They try to shut down anything Obama/democrats try to pass.

This isn't going to be true forever. I suspect the GOP will get the crap beat out of them at the ballot box, and a lot of the blame for that is going to the House Freedom Caucus. Ryan clearly doesn't want to go down in history like Boehner, where he had to obstruct or get booted. He'll put his foot down in December, and we'll get a group of anti-TP moderates on the right who'll compromise. If we have reasonable compromises ready to go, then it looks better for us. We on the left should never become radical idiots like half the right has become.

So apparently Bernie's now blaming all his losses on the idea that poor people do not vote.



It could just be they don't agree with him on the solutions...

Yeah, as a red state resident, I've got a lot more on the line if Sanders doesn't get what he wants. I don't get to go home to Burlington after a failed vote in the Senate where our state will probably already have that law in place.

You are literally the first person I have ever heard calling it a "massive exaggeration", Even Obama think its a reality, and he has the most vested interest in proving it a farce.

Obama is not the emperor of black people or city cultures. He's from Chicago, not Baltimore. I'll listen to a random Marylander before I listen to someone from almost 1000 miles away.

If next Tuesday goes against him, his excuses will be amazing

Retroactive secession.

And I expect he'll have to seriously consider dropping out then. He's not doing great in CA (the only good poll for him has him winning Latino voters by 19 points, which I believe Nate said would be a 40 point swing for him. This is definitely out there, so I think he'll lose CA). If he gets swept next week (especially in PA), then it'll be over for him. Devine seems to be hinting at that already.