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PoliGAF 2016 |OT5| Archdemon Hillary Clinton vs. Lice Traffic Jam

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S

Sibylus

Banned
brainchild said:
This shouldn't be happening with ANY race. It shouldn't be 'their turn' to be mocked.

Being white does not grant you impunity from making racist remarks against your own race.
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So long as we systematically and institutionally disenfranchise other ethnic groups, you betcha I'm going to mock us and applaud others doing the same. God forbid fragile white egos be hurt at people calling the world what it is. Apparently that's racist.
 
H

Hazmat

Member
The real thing is, I still can't see anyone talking bad about white people in this thread today except for someone taking that kid in the gif to task for his sick-ass dance moves.
 
R

RustyNails

Member
Hazmat said:
The real thing is, I still can't see anyone talking bad about white people in this thread today except for someone taking that kid in the gif to task for his sick-ass dance moves.
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That move is pretty slick tho. Adding "virgin" to it adds a whole new meaning.
 
O

Orbis Tabula

Member
I don't think that "haha, Bernie sure has trouble getting demographics outside of white people" is racist. I'm white, though. Can't say I have a lot of personal experience with racism.
 
I

ItWasMeantToBe19

Banned
The Republican Party is dead and no longer exists as a functioning institution.

Curly Haugland, a longstanding RNC official and an unbound delegate from North Dakota who will be on the convention rules committee in July, told CNBC that attaining 1,237 during the primaries does not secure the nomination.

"Even if Trump reaches the magic number of 1,237 the media and RNC are touting, that does not mean Trump is automatically the nominee," Haugland said. "The votes earned during the primary process are only estimates and are not legal convention votes. The only official votes to nominate a candidate are those that are cast from the convention floor."
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http://www.cnbc.com/2016/04/22/go-ahead-donald-get-1237-it-wont-matter-rnc-delegate.html

Okay, let's look at this.

-Iraq War lead to the Democrats getting a huge majority in Congress and Obama elected president.
-Obama and a huge Democrat majority in Congress lead to the biggest liberal agenda since LBJ being passed.
-A black man being president and black people getting health care caused the Republican base to meltdown and the Tea Party to arise.
-The Tea Party destroyed the GOP.

So overall, we have the Iraq War destroyed the Republican Party.

And who voted for the Iraq War?

Hillary Rodman Clinton.

Her detractors are all accelerationists, but HRC is actually the greatest accelerationist of all time.
 
F

FloydtheFathead

Member
ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
The Republican Party is dead and no longer exists as a functioning institution.



http://www.cnbc.com/2016/04/22/go-ahead-donald-get-1237-it-wont-matter-rnc-delegate.html

Okay, let's look at this.

-Iraq War lead to the Democrats getting a huge majority in Congress and Obama elected president.
-Obama and a huge Democrat majority in Congress lead to the biggest liberal agenda since LBJ being passed.
-A black man being president and black people getting health care caused the Republican base to meltdown and the Tea Party to arise.
-The Tea Party destroyed the GOP.

So overall, we have the Iraq War destroyed the Republican Party.

And who voted for the Iraq War?

Hillary Rodman Clinton.

Her detractors are all accelerationists, but HRC is actually the greatest accelerationist of all time.
Click to expand...
Mindblown.gif
 
P

Plumbob

Member
This white people debate is nonsense. The photo wasn't denigrating white people, it was making fun of Bernie's campaign for drawing white crowds when he desperately needs diversity to win.
 
A

AntraxSuicide

Banned
dramatis said:
I don't think it's necessarily cockiness.

Like if you read a lot even around GAF, beyond the number of delegates or something they don't do any more research than that. Not knowing registration deadlines, not looking up distributions, not looking into the history and demographics of a state, and so on. They're "engaged" in the sense that they were hooked into a candidate and follow said candidate thoroughly, but don't engage on the details of the system, opting instead to be "morally superior" and deride and complain about the system rather than understanding.

It's not cockiness, it's ignorance. I think one can only call it cockiness if the people who perpetrate these memes and statements have been informed of the actual state of affairs and still insist on being silly.

I don't expect people to view the election the way I do (as a war), so I don't always expect them to necessarily be knowledgeable about the particulars, such as why Bernie won't be a VP pick. I guess what can be irksome is how judgmental people get about a particular issue before even doing some rudimentary research and discussion on what stances or situations are good/bad for said issue.
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Re: Bolded.

I most definitely do! We even call them campaigns! You have to have strategy, and tactics; you have to know your opponent, while being unknown to them; you must think 3 steps ahead, but never forget past battles; you must never stop fighting until the war is over, and this isn't a war that ever ends. To this last point, it's why I'm vehemently supportive of moderate candidates that can siege Republican strongholds. Don't worry about Vermont, fight for Georgia. Eventually, if the Texan castle ever falls, then the GOP will literally never sniff the White House. Then you redirect the assault, change the battlefield. Take them on in state races while they fight for national scraps. Flip a few where policy is sure to take off, then watch as people in those flipped states come around to your way of thinking.

To be honest, the Dems are on a roll, but the only thing I wonder about is what the GOP will pull next. What's their long-term strategy when white voters aren't enough? I suspect they won't chip into that for decades, but they may shift gears and try to locally win races in whiter states. Basically forego a few swing states with higher minority groups, and instead just hope for moderation or more regional parties to do their work for them. But honestly, it's looking bad for them nationally, and that only trickles down. Huh. Fitting.
 
B

brainchild

Banned
pigeon said:
Mockery isn't racism.
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The term racism is pretty broad these days, and mocking a person's race does count as racism.

bananas said:
How do you know I'm white?
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I don't, and probably shouldn't have grouped you into that multiquote. However, regardless of your race, we shouldn't be making fun of white people for their whiteness.

Sibylus said:
So long as we systematically and institutionally disenfranchise other ethnic groups, you betcha I'm going to mock us and applaud others doing the same. God forbid fragile white egos be hurt at people calling the world what it is. Apparently that's racist.
Click to expand...

This helps no one. Not all white people are responsible for claims you're making, and at this point, it's systematic and institutional, so continuing to mock white people as a whole accomplishes nothing.

Butts-a-plenty said:
I feel like your definition of what is "Racism" is very broad in scope.
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It is. I'm not talking about superiority, but moreso the antagonistic nature of mocking a person's race, which is included under the broader umbrella of racism.


EDIT:


Plumbob said:
This white people debate is nonsense. The photo wasn't denigrating white people, it was making fun of Bernie's campaign for drawing white crowds when he desperately needs diversity to win.
Click to expand...

Well, when all you leave as a response is a photo and emoji, there's too much that's left open to interpretation.
 
B

Butts-a-plenty

Banned
brainchild said:
It is. I'm not talking about superiority, but moreso the antagonistic nature of mocking a person's race, which is included under the broader umbrella of racism.
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Okay, but your entire argument is predicated on the people you are arguing with having the same definition of Racism as you.

Oxford defines Racism as:

1.1 The belief that all members of each race possess characteristics, abilities, or qualities specific to that race, especially so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races.


It lessens the concept and the power of the concept to broaden it as much as you are. In my opinion.

Once we reach the point where a term is so broad that an entire spectrum of actions can be grouped under that term, the term is no longer useful for attempting a discourse. For example, let's argue over what the word Epic actually means now. It has lost all significance as a term due to being constantly diluted of its meaning.
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Just saw what the Maine delegates did. I mean, come on. Priebus and Cruz are such scumbags. I really hope Trump runs third party and destroys him.
 
I

ItWasMeantToBe19

Banned
The centrist media refusing to cover how Ted Cruz is basically running a 100% hate campaign at this point (with all of his attention going towards transgender women and how much he hates them) is getting weird. Would it kill Nate Silver to write an article about how Cruz is a terrible human being?
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
The centrist media refusing to cover how Ted Cruz is basically running a 100% hate campaign at this point (with all of his attention going towards transgender women and how much he hates them) is getting weird. Would it kill Nate Silver to write an article about how Cruz is a terrible human being?
Click to expand...

I have no problem with them saving it all for the general election.

Suikoguy said:
Wait, how did they manage that?

Link for those not in the know.

It was 12C/9T/2K
Now it's 19C/1T
Click to expand...

Because they are scumbags and backed out on their agreement for how it would work. They basically changed the rules after the vote--just like they'll do at the convention to hand it to Cruz. "Sorry, voters! Your opinions mean nothing!"
 
S

Sibylus

Banned
brainchild said:
This helps no one. Not all white people are responsible for claims you're making, and at this point, it's systematic and institutional, so continuing to mock white people as a whole accomplishes nothing.
Click to expand...
Show of solidarity for the oppressed, prods white people to think and argue about the system they often take for granted in their lives, keeps the topic of dismantling that system continually close in mind, serves as a healthy self-check on white privilege... nope, helps no one!

I've been shown the error of my ways. I'm off to be a part of the solution in a manner so quiet and so invisible that nobody will know anything is changing!
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Macho Madness said:
Here's the problem with the Maine situation: You're trying to get me to feel bad about someone screwing with Donald Trump and Paul LePage
Click to expand...

My problem is more with how they completely ignored the caucus results.
 
B

brainchild

Banned
Butts-a-plenty said:
Okay, but your entire argument is predicated on the people you are arguing with having the same definition of Racism as you.

Oxford defines Racism as:

1.1 The belief that all members of each race possess characteristics, abilities, or qualities specific to that race, especially so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races.


It lessens the concept and the power of the concept to broaden it as much as you are. In my opinion.

Once we reach the point where a term is so broad that an entire spectrum of actions can be grouped under that term, the term is no longer useful for attempting a discourse. For example, let's argue over what the word Epic actually means now. It has lost all significance as a term due to being constantly diluted of its meaning.
Click to expand...

Let's not go that far. Racism isn't anywhere near as broad as a term like 'epic', and almost always has a negative connotation. No form of racism, in all of its broadness, should be tolerated, if it can be helped.


bananas said:
I wasn't. I was making fun of you.
Click to expand...

That's funny, considering that I'm black.

Anyway, your intention isn't what's important here; it's how you use the language, and that kind of language does nothing but divide races, not bring them together.
 
S

shinra-bansho

Member
I don't mean to burst all of your bubbles but the (self-perceived) downtrodden whites are probably voting Trump. Because they're being oppressed by affirmative action and immigrants and China China China.
 
B

brainchild

Banned
Sibylus said:
Show of solidarity for the oppressed, prods white people to think and argue about the system they often take for granted in their lives, keeps the topic of dismantling that system continually close in mind, serves as a healthy self-check on white privilege... nope, helps no one!

I've been shown the error of my ways. I'm off to be a part of the solution in a manner so quiet and so invisible that nobody will know anything is changing!
Click to expand...

Quite the opposite actually. You can't show solidarity by drawing a line in the sand.
 
M

Macho Madness

Member
Suikoguy said:
How did the rules allow this?
Click to expand...

There are technically multiple rounds of caucuses. All you have to do is get more of your people to show up at the county conventions and you can flip the delegate count because they're not bound.

Maine is also a state that Ron Paul flipped in 2012 so Maine is also super weird
 
S

Suikoguy

I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
Macho Madness said:
There are technically multiple rounds of caucuses. All you have to do is get more of your people to show up at the county conventions and you can flip the delegate count because they're not bound.

Maine is also a state that Ron Paul flipped in 2012 so Maine is also super weird
Click to expand...

Oh, so Maine's even more fucked up then the average caucus.

I hate caucuses.
 
I

ItWasMeantToBe19

Banned
Honestly, this is the dumbest plan of all time by the RNC. Cruz starting to win delegates because of organizational superiority and backing of the RNC is going to backfire so hard in the polls and will Cruz too much power later on.

The GOP is dead in part because it's led by truly stupid people.
 
A

ampere

Member
brainchild said:
The term racism is pretty broad these days, and mocking a person's race does count as racism.
Click to expand...

I think you're missing the point of the "Bernie's rallies are very white" comment. It's a comment about how Bernie isn't wooing (or even trying to woo) the Obama coalition and not placing high value on intersectional politics, thus the majority of people of color support other candidates.

The derision and mockery is generally towards Bernie in this regard, not the folks at his rally. It's not racism, it's about how foolish it is to try to win an election without intersectionality.
 
B

Butts-a-plenty

Banned
brainchild said:
Let's not go that far. Racism isn't anywhere near as broad as a term like 'epic', and almost always has a negative connotation. No form of racism, in all of its broadness, should be tolerated, if it can be helped.
Click to expand...

No form of prejudice, in all of its broadness, should be tolerated. Racism falls under the umbrella of prejudice, but it is, in my opinion of course, a very pointed and specific form of prejudice. Calling a white person a "cracker" lacks the power of terms going in the other direction. The term in no way impacts white privilege, it doesn't harken back to a time period when white people were subjugated and it in no way lessens the status of white people in general. White people aren't being reduced by it.

The difference between calling a white person a "cracker" and an "asshole" is indistinguishable in its effect. Without historical perspective and significance something that you are calling racist doesn't have the same power as something that I consider racist. I think it diminishes the value of the terminology to broadly define it as you are. We may have to agree to disagree, but precise terminology is in my view extremely important for constructive discourse.
 
S

shinra-bansho

Member
Here I'll illustrate in pictures.

The downtrodden.
20160423_USP001_0.jpg


The not-downtrodden.
tumblr_li09ppSCc61qa366t.gif
 
H

Hazmat

Member
I don't fully understand the way that Ted Cruz stole almost every delegate in Maine, but holy crap LePage sucks at everything. I mean, I want him gone, but I wish every piece of shit could be as incompetent as he is.
 
B

brainchild

Banned
ciaossu said:
I think you're missing the point of the "Bernie's rallies are very white" comment. It's a comment about how Bernie isn't wooing (or even trying to woo) the Obama coalition and not placing high value on intersectional politics, thus the majority of people of color support other candidates.

The derision and mockery is generally towards Bernie in this regard, not the folks at his rally. It's not racism, it's about how foolish it is to try to win an election without intersectionality.
Click to expand...

I understand this point just fine, and it's a valid point. However, if that is indeed the point, make that point clear, not ambiguously with pictures and emojis that can easily be interpreted as something patently offensive.

Butts-a-plenty said:
No form of prejudice, in all of its broadness, should be tolerated. Racism falls under the umbrella of prejudice, but it is, in my opinion of course, a very pointed and specific form of prejudice. Calling a white person a "cracker" lacks the power of terms going in the other direction. The term in no way impacts white privilege, it doesn't harken back to a time period when white people were subjugated and it in no way lessens the status of white people in general. White people aren't being reduced by it.

The difference between calling a white person a "cracker" and an "asshole" is indistinguishable in its effect. Without historical perspective and significance something that you are calling racist doesn't have the same power as something that I consider racist. I think it diminishes the value of the terminology to broadly define it as you are. We may have to agree to disagree, but precise terminology is in my view extremely important for constructive discourse.
Click to expand...

What's more important, IMO, is establishing mutually agreed upon definitions of words. After all, words are just sounds until you give them meaning.

Anyway, you're right, we'll have to agree to disagree.
 
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