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PoliGAF 2017 |OT1| From Russia with Love

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P

Pixieking

Banned
Tall4Life said:
The Nazis weren't anti-Semitic, they targeted homosexuals and other undesirables too!
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I mean, to be fair, the first undesirables locked in the first camp (Sachsenhausen) were criminals, political adversaries and troublemakers, in the early 30s.

(Seriously not wanting to start anything here, just noting it. :) )

Also, anyone who gets the chance when they're in Berlin, go on the tour of Sachsenhausen - it's very informative.
 
I

ItWasMeantToBe19

Banned
Russian trolls are terrified of Macron (who isn't even that anti-Putin!) and are now pushing the idea that Macron is owned by the Jews.

https://twitter.com/b_judah/status/828195784394993664

(((Macron))) is something I didn't expect to happen this year?

Bernie >_>

Sanders says of McConnell: "I disagree with him on everything" -- but says he is a "decent guy" and hopes McConnell will stand up to Trump.
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Mitch McConnell destroyed the United States government and massively harmed the U.S. economy just to gain more power.

https://twitter.com/CNNSotu/status/828248193565605888
 
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ItWasMeantToBe19

Banned
Okay, so here's the thing, there are no good Republicans. The strategy for 2018 shouldn't be to flip Republicans but to make them too ashamed to come out to vote.

C37YYhqXAAYTQgi.jpg
 
S

SexyFish

Banned
@realDonaldTrump said:
Just cannot believe a judge would put our country in such peril. If something happens blame him and court system. People pouring in. Bad!
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Fuck off.

@realDonaldTrump said:
I have instructed Homeland Security to check people coming into our country VERY CAREFULLY. The courts are making the job very difficult!
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Fuck off more.
 
B

BadenBadenLily

Banned
ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
Okay, so here's the thing, there are no good Republicans. The strategy for 2018 shouldn't be to flip Republicans but to make them too ashamed to come out to vote.

C37YYhqXAAYTQgi.jpg
Click to expand...

I'm not sure the strategy was ever to flip Republicans as much as it was "flip conservative suburban independents", aka the people who hate public sector unions, taxes, and government spending, but who would be embarrassed reading the average Breitbart headline.

But as someone who's parents are government workers, and who also wants to work in the public sector someday I don't think I want those people in the Democratic coalition either.
 
K

kirblar

Member
BadenBadenLily said:
I'm not sure the strategy was ever to flip Republicans as much as it was "flip conservative suburban independents", aka the people who hate public sector unions, taxes, and government spending, but who would be embarrassed reading the average Breitbart headline.

But as someone who's parents are government workers, and who also wants to work in the public sector someday I don't think I want those people in the Democratic coalition either.
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It was both. And it actually worked- winning college educated white women? That's a win. That wasn't the problem with Clinton's campaign strategy.
 
I

ItWasMeantToBe19

Banned
The past couple weeks have been comforting because Trump's admin is so disloyal and leak-prone that if Trump tried to burn the Reichstag, it would be leaked weeks ahead of time.
 
A

aspiegamer

Member
Does this mean Trump is going to try to force Kinect on everyone? Because that would be raw evil. It did have that weird passive listening/surveillance mode originally, if I recall, before they added the option to let you unplug the thing. Trump to distribute surplus Kinect supply for surveillance confirmed? Cboat, we need more info here. Please help.
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/11/08/us/politics/election-exit-polls.html

- Republicans shifted 4 points toward Hillary. Democrats shifted 5 points toward Trump. Independents shifted 1 point toward Trump

- Whites shifted 1 point toward Trump. Blacks, Hispanics, and Asians shifted 7 or more points toward Trump.

- 65 and older shifted 4 points toward Hillary. 18-29 year olds shifted 5 points toward Trump.

- People making $100,000 or more shifted 9 points toward Hillary. People making $30,000 or less shifted 16 points toward Trump.


Seems to me that Hillary was slightly successful in chipping away and holding back traditionally conservative blocks outside of males and evangelicals, but for every gain there was a worse loss on democrat strongholds.
 
O

Oblivion

Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
thepotatoman said:
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/11/08/us/politics/election-exit-polls.html

- Republicans shifted 4 points toward Hillary. Democrats shifted 5 points toward Trump. Independents shifted 1 point toward Trump

- Whites shifted 1 point toward Trump. Blacks, Hispanics, and Asians shifted 7 or more points toward Trump.

- 65 and older shifted 4 points toward Hillary. 18-29 year olds shifted 5 points toward Trump.

- People making $100,000 or more shifted 9 points toward Hillary. People making $30,000 or less shifted 16 points toward Trump.


Seems to me that Hillary was slightly successful in chipping away and holding back traditionally conservative blocks outside of males and evangelicals, but for every gain there was a worse loss on democrat strongholds.
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Every single statistic on there makes me furious.
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
Zach said:
I think the challenge is helping these people understand why this is a bad idea for them, without coming off as condescending.
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Remember, this is comparing to Romney vs Obama. As a whole they still went to Hillary. We just needed to convince them that Trump is as bad as Romney and that Hillary is as good as Obama.
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Zach said:
I think the challenge is helping these people understand why this is a bad idea for them, without coming off as condescending.
Click to expand...


Almost impossible.
 
K

kirblar

Member
Zach said:
I think the challenge is helping these people understand why this is a bad idea for them, without coming off as condescending.
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It's not possible. Opposing education is a form of social control for them, ans thus any type of "smart talk" is immediately shit on.
 
K

kirblar

Member
ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
They literally just voted for Obama four years ago.

The minority and millennial numbers are mostly caused by young people of color thinking Hillary was racist and then they didn't vote.
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They didn't have an active racist pandering to them four years ago.

Trump turned out a lot of previously inactive voters in addition to the rural flips.
 
K

kirblar

Member
ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
The entire RNC autopsy was that Romney was too racist and homophobic.

Trump didn't activate any new voters other than in Florida.
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That's because the RNC understood the long-term consequences of going full Trump because of what happened to California.

Their white nationalist base doesn't.
 
B

Bonen no Max'd

Banned
BadenBadenLily said:
I'm not sure the strategy was ever to flip Republicans as much as it was "flip conservative suburban independents", aka the people who hate public sector unions, taxes, and government spending, but who would be embarrassed reading the average Breitbart headline.

But as someone who's parents are government workers, and who also wants to work in the public sector someday I don't think I want those people in the Democratic coalition either.
Click to expand...
*high five*
 
C

Crocodile

Member
kirblar said:
That's because the RNC understood the long-term consequences of going full Trump because of what happened to California.

Their white nationalist base doesn't.
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Going all in on the racism won them the WH (granted there were like a billion other factors that influenced the 2016 elections but still). There's also the concern of what happens if someone in the future runs Trump's playbook while not being a moron or actually charismatic? The hope is that 2016 was the last year something like that will pay off.
 
S

shinra-bansho

Member
You omitted "white people" from before the under $30000.

Also, it's one exit. Taking that exit to indicate shifts in minority subsets just isn't that sound.
 
K

kirblar

Member
Crocodile said:
Going all in on the racism won them the WH (granted there were like a billion other factors that influenced the 2016 elections but still). There's also the concern of what happens if someone in the future runs Trump's playbook while not being a moron or actually charismatic? The hope is that 2016 was the last year something like that will pay off.
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Yes, it did.

It also did in California in the '90s. What happened next was the problem: https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2016/07/the-white-strategy/485612/
The reference to free room service was a nod to Proposition 187, a California ballot initiative Wilson had successfully championed the year before, which denied undocumented immigrants public education, nonemergency health care, and other government services. It was the beginning of a ferocious reaction to Latino immigration in the Golden State. In 1995, Elton Gallegly, a Republican congressman from California and the chair of a House task force on immigration reform, recommended an amendment to the U.S. Constitution to deny automatic citizenship to the children of undocumented immigrants. In 1996, California voters passed Proposition 209, which prohibited public universities and other state institutions from giving preference to racial and ethnic minorities. In 1998, Californians passed Proposition 227, which curtailed bilingual education.
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But all of that changed after the GOP began targeting Latino immigrants. Feeling themselves under assault, California Latinos registered to vote in epic numbers. From 1994 to 2004, according to Latino America, by Segura and Matt A. Barreto, the voter-registration rate among California Latinos grew 69 percent—more than twice as fast as the state's Latino population. Latino voters also swung sharply against the GOP. Republicans, who had lost the Latino vote by six points in the 1990 gubernatorial race, lost it by 46 points in 1994, then by 61 points in 1998. Before the passage of Proposition 187 in 1994, California Latinos were four points more likely to identify as Democrats than as Republicans. After Proposition 227 passed in 1998, the margin reached 51 points. The GOP's anti-immigrant efforts appear to have alienated young white voters, too. (Throughout this essay, I will consider Latinos as a distinct racial group separate from whites, as a majority of Latinos now consider themselves, even though the census does not.)

Almost two decades later, the California Republican Party still has not recovered. Latinos—who now constitute almost 40 percent of California's population and more than a quarter of its eligible voters—have voted Democratic in every presidential election since 1996 by at least 40 points. Democrats today control every statewide elected office, and make up close to two-thirds of the state Senate and assembly, along with almost three-quarters of California's delegation to the U.S. House of Representatives.
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Apparently, and unfortunately, the kiddiots (18-25yos) need to get their teeth kicked in by a Republican to actually vote against them.
 
M

mo60

Member
Crocodile said:
Going all in on the racism won them the WH (granted there were like a billion other factors that influenced the 2016 elections but still). There's also the concern of what happens if someone in the future runs Trump's playbook while not being a moron or actually charismatic? The hope is that 2016 was the last year something like that will pay off.
Click to expand...

Trump did singificantly worse then reagan despite exclusively appealing to WWC. It's very possible in a decade or two it's impossible for republicans to win an election if they mostly only appeal to the WWC
 
N

NeoXChaos

Member
mo60 said:
Trump did singificantly worse then reagan despite exclusively appealing to WWC. It's very possible in a decade or two it's impossible for republicans to win an election if they mostly only appeal to the WWC
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but a great chance of holding on to the senate for years to come.
 
C

Crocodile

Member
mo60 said:
Trump did singificantly worse then reagan despite exclusively appealing to WWC. It's very possible in a decade or two it's impossible for republicans to win an election if they mostly only appeal to the WWC
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A decade or two is a long time and a lot of damage can be done in the interm. We can't wait that long. I don't wait to be middle-aged/old before we can start making progress again.

NeoXChaos said:
but a great chance of holding on to the senate for years to come.
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As soon as we get a trifecta again we have turn Puerto Rico and DC into states (even aside from it being something those places want and probably a morally good thing).
 
K

KingK

Member
Zach said:
I think the challenge is helping these people understand why this is a bad idea for them, without coming off as condescending.
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Put up a candidate who isn't scandal ridden, under investigation by the FBI, and doesn't come across as the democrats version of Romney when it comes to being out of touch and uncaring towards the lower class.

Those that switched don't know or care about any actual policy. There's no consistent ideological, right-left spectrum logic to them switching. Hillary just came across as being out of touch and insincere on class issues, and whether or not that perception was fair, her campaign didn't care to try and correct that because they thought they could make up the difference with wealthy and middle class republicans. So a lot of those people switched to Trump or stayed home.
 
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