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PoliGAF 2017 |OT1| From Russia with Love

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F

Future Foundation

Member
Valhelm said:
16779912_1051508551620903_1887200876_n.png


No words.
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It's been said before, but the lack of self-awareness is STUNNING.
 
C

Cesare Borgia

Banned
studyguy said:
DNC chair is purely organizational w/e just pick a butt to fill the seat and lets move.
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Exactly. I don't understand why this has become an ideological battle over political topics, and a redux of the 2016 primary. The DNC chairman is an organizational job. Perez actually has organizing experience, a lot of it in fact. He's also been in charge of things before and done well.

I am not opposed to Ellison. I think he'd be a good pick too. But I don't see any argument for Ellison over Perez outside of political views, which frankly I'm not concerned about in a DNC chair.
 
R

RastaMentality

Banned
Carpe Libertatem said:
If he only had support in DC, then he wouldn't get anywhere in the DNC election

(I'd argue it's Ellison who has the "DC support" either way, except for Obama+Biden)
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No, i mean who really cares about Perez losing besides people heavily involved with washington. he doesn't have a following on the internet besides a select very few and the general population doesn't give a shit about the DNC chair. Ellison makes the least people upset. They should just do it and move on.
 
C

Carpe Libertatem

Member
Cesare Borgia said:
Exactly. I don't understand why this has become an ideological battle over political topics, and a redux of the 2016 primary. The DNC chairman is an organizational job. Perez actually has organizing experience, a lot of it in fact. He's also been in charge of things before and done well.

I am not opposed to Ellison. I think he'd be a good pick too. But I don't see any argument for Ellison over Perez outside of political views, which frankly I'm not concerned about in a DNC chair.
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I mean, it's easy to see why it's become a battle. Bernie endorsed Ellison immediately and Ellison became "Bernie's candidate."
 
S

soundahfekz

Member
Iron Badger said:
YIkYVkx.jpg
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Bernie wouldn't have won.

And marching Tim kaine out there because of Virginia and being fluent in Spanish, thinking that would sway Hispanic voters was laughable

The future of the Democratic Party is squarely in the hands of minority representation in the highest office in the land. Quote me up, whatever you wanna do. If dems want a guaranteed victory in 2020, there better be a viable minority candidate securing the nomination
 
A

Aaronology

Member
soundahfekz said:
Bernie wouldn't have won.

And marching Tim kaine out there because of Virginia and being fluent in Spanish, thinking that would sway Hispanic voters was laughable

The future of the Democratic Party is squarely in the hands of minority representation in the highest office in the land. Quote me up, whatever you wanna do. If dems want a guaranteed victory in 2020, there better be a viable minority candidate securing the nomination
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Why so?
 
K

KingK

Member
kirblar said:
You use Ellison here because it a) doesn't alienate the Bernie wing and b) the other 2 are better served running for office.
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The problem is, what higher office could Pete get in Indiana? The state has only been getting redder. I think he's great and has a lot of talent, I just don't think he could win anything else in this state. It's partly why I hope he does win the DNC position.
 
K

kirblar

Member
soundahfekz said:
Bernie wouldn't have won.

And marching Tim kaine out there because of Virginia and being fluent in Spanish, thinking that would sway Hispanic voters was laughable

The future of the Democratic Party is squarely in the hands of minority representation in the highest office in the land. Quote me up, whatever you wanna do. If dems want a guaranteed victory in 2020, there better be a viable minority candidate securing the nomination
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Al Franken would be a minority candidate.
 
S

soundahfekz

Member
Aaronology said:
Why so?
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Because democratic values and principles are drastically aligning with the plight of oppressed groups in unprecedented fashion. While white people can empathize they'll never experience what minorities go through. BLM, standing rock, dreamers, etc are fed up with empty gestures from people who have traditionally embraced their platform, only to shed it order to be seen in a more centrist light. If that experience isn't inherently within you, then it's a trust issue for us.
 
C

Cesare Borgia

Banned
soundahfekz said:
Bernie wouldn't have won.

And marching Tim kaine out there because of Virginia and being fluent in Spanish, thinking that would sway Hispanic voters was laughable

The future of the Democratic Party is squarely in the hands of minority representation in the highest office in the land. Quote me up, whatever you wanna do. If dems want a guaranteed victory in 2020, there better be a viable minority candidate securing the nomination
Click to expand...

The race of the candidate is not the key. The issue is having a candidate who inspires the base, a trait that no one ethnicity has a monopoly on. Democrats nominated a candidate with decades of baggage who is generally unlikable (or likable enough). That won't be an issue in 2020. And she still received 65 million+ votes and almost won.

In my personal opinion the best politician available in 2020 will be black (Kamala Harris) but I'm not even sure she's a good fit against Trump. We'll see. Then again, Trump is clearly doing his best to lose to anyone who is decent/rallies the base.

I have a mixture of fear and interest in Booker. He can sweep the south if he plays his cards right. He also has a lot of flaws and is basically a democrat Rubio in terms of great demographics/story, unimpressive record and red flags.

I want someone who can win, the end, and I'm not writing anyone off except for the worst options (Cuomo, Warren, Sanders).
 
C

Carpe Libertatem

Member
KingK said:
The problem is, what higher office could Pete get in Indiana? The state has only been getting redder. I think he's great and has a lot of talent, I just don't think he could win anything else in this state. It's partly why I hope he does win the DNC position.
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I don't think it'd be out of the question for him to win statewide in a wave election.

I've said it before - would not be shocked to see both Kander and Pete run for Governor in MO and IN in 2020. And both win.
 
M

Manmademan

Member
soundahfekz said:
Because democratic values and principles are drastically aligning with the plight of oppressed groups in unprecedented fashion. While white people can empathize they'll never experience what minorities go through. BLM, standing rock, dreamers, etc are fed up with empty gestures from people who have traditionally embraced their platform, only to shed it order to be seen in a more centrist light. If that experience isn't inherently within you, then it's a trust issue for us.
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oh, are we posting from a reality where Obama wasn't centrist, despite his race?

And Clarence Thomas and Ben Carson aren't right wing lunatics, despite being black men that should be intimately familiar with the struggles of the civil rights era?

Race is absolutely not a guarantee that you'll get someone that is going to embrace the platform you want them to, and it's not a guarantee that they won't, either. As someone else pointed out, Franken is jewish. Empathy isn't tied to skin color, and it isn't tied to ancestry. You don't know what someone's personal story is.

The reality is that getting anything done politically in this country demands a centrist position, because the damned near 50% of the country that sympathizes with conservatives isn't just going to "go away."
 
C

Crocodile

Member
Aaronology said:
Why so?
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The argument has been made that a minority who can speak to white people well can do a lot to appeal to the widest swath of voters. Obama didn't have to spend a lot of time "proving his cred" or "be exciting" to Black people or other minorities once it was clear he was viable since it could be assumed he understood and would appreciate the minority experience (he also wasn't saying or doing stupid "I don't see color shit" either even if his race wasn't something he played up as much as one would normally expect). He could spend more of this time "working" white voters. We also know even speaking about minority issues seems to trigger some white voters but those are probably the white voters who wouldn't vote for a minority anyway?

There is some logic to this train of thought but it is admittedly super cynical.
 
K

kirblar

Member
When you look at the 5 (virtual) candidates for 2020 we have- Harrez, Cortez-Masto, Gillibrand, Duckworth, Franken- Centrist is not a word that comes to mind.
 
M

Manmademan

Member
Crocodile said:
The argument has been made that a minority who can speak to white people well can do a lot to appeal to the widest swath of voters. Obama didn't have to spend a lot of time "proving his cred" or "be exciting" to Black people or other minorities once it was clear he was viable since it could be assumed he understood and would appreciate the minority experience (he also wasn't saying or doing stupid "I don't see color shit" either even if his race wasn't something he played up as much as one would normally expect). He could spend more of this time "working" white voters. We also know even speaking about minority issues seems to trigger some white voters but those are probably the white voters who wouldn't vote for a minority anyway?

There is some logic to this train of thought but it is admittedly super cynical.
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It's a terrible argument, because B.Clinton, Gore, and Kerry all had stratospheric approval ratings from black voters across the board. (Latinos are a different story, their political reality has changed quite a bit since GWB.)

Hillary had severe problems with young black voters, not older ones- and a lot of the reason why wasn't "street cred", it was successfully being branded a liar over the email scandal from the right, and "stealing" the nomination from bernie supporters on the left.
 
C

Carpe Libertatem

Member
Bonen no Max'd said:
I mean, Ellison already placed himself with Bernie in the primary and speaks to a lot of the same populist sentiment when I hear him, it's not like Bernie just selected him at random.
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He's still the "Bernie candidate." That's the problem.

Like, suddenly Tom Perez is an establishment shill. Not because he actually is one, but because he dares to challenge Bernie's guy.

Bernie shouldn't have endorsed anyone, period. Him doing so was only going to relitigate the primary.
 
G

GAF A60-Rim A

Banned
NullPointer said:
If this ends up being something real the NY Times will have themselves a new subscriber.
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At least subscribe to the Washington Post in the meantime, if you haven't already.

I've been furiously reading their coverage in the last week or so... and to me it's insta-subscription-worthy. They are being really rather heroic, to be honest, regarding their incessant thorough journalism efforts.
 
N

nature boy

Member
Fenderputty said:
I guess it didn't include today's news but that's depressingly high considering all the crazy that's been going down.
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This is crazier:

Forty-two percent of Iowans approve of the job the newly inaugurated Republican is doing as president, while 49 percent disapprove, according to the latest Des Moines Register/Mediacom Iowa Poll.
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Edit: beaten. SAD!
 
B

Bonen no Max'd

Banned
ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
Trump is -7 approval in Iowa.

http://www.desmoinesregister.com/st.../?hootPostID=b017386f47989abfb7aa1f921afefe73

Farmers finally realized that free trade is good.

Hopefully we can win back some ground in Iowa in the next few years before the super racist millennials in Iowa start voting.
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Well for farmers it's more like "free trade is good when the government massively subsidizes your industry so you can crush non-subsidized foreign markets", which isn't really free trade to begin with.

It probably has more to do with incompetence and the Muslim ban than trade.
 
E

Extollere

Sucks at poetry
Don't worry! These ties to Russia, all this infighting, finger pointing, and staff firing is just Trump SHAKIN up those politicians, MAGA!

JESUS... this is so sad

SAD!

fuck I need a break I'm losing my goddamn mind - sorry for the double post
 
N

NullPointer

Member
GAF A60-Rim A said:
At least subscribe to the Washington Post in the meantime, if you haven't already.

I've been furiously reading their coverage in the last week or so... and to me it's insta-subscription-worthy. They are being really rather heroic, to be honest, regarding their incessant thorough journalism efforts.
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I did recently and it's been worth every penny. NY Times is pricier tho.
 
K

KingK

Member
Carpe Libertatem said:
I don't think it'd be out of the question for him to win statewide in a wave election.

I've said it before - would not be shocked to see both Kander and Pete run for Governor in MO and IN in 2020. And both win.
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I don't know, it'd be a massive uphill battle.

If he did run and if I still live in Indiana by 2020 (which hopefully isn't the case), I would spend like all my free time volunteering for him.
 
T

TiredofWinning

Member
If you want to get away from the nonsense of today but not stray too far away into escapism I'd recommend you watch Moonlight which came out today for digital dl.

Truly a remarkable film in every sense, I've never seen a film be able to articulate themes of homosexuality and race in such a perfect way.
 
B

bgbball31

Member
Infinite Stars said:
Holy shit Jeffrey Lord just got schooled on CNN.

"Leaks are bad"
"The only reason why Trump is president is because of leaks! "
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Seriously. I was watching Fox News earlier today and they were talking to a democratic congressman, asking about how bad the leaks have been and whether the leakers should be prosecuted. If I were that congressman, I would just have looked at the interviewer and asked, "Were leaks bad during the campaign?" and let her flounder for an answer.
 
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