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PoliGAF Interim Thread of Tears/Lapel Pins (ScratchingHisCheek-Gate)

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scorcho

testicles on a cold fall morning
DarkMage619 said:
You ALWAYS have to be careful about tooting your own horn. Obviously some who like Obama won't see any issue but others who may be on the fence will take these comments as arrogant. He might be not be an elitest but he does come accross as arrogant that is an issue as well.
if that's the metric you're using, simply running for office is a sign of pretension and arrogance because it directly implies that the candidate believes themselves good enough to handle the job/duty/power.

i think someone's a tad too sensitive now that the elitist media is weaving this elitist candidate narrative. thank god Clinton is running as the republican here!
 
I hope Hillary tries some more unjust/worthless attacks at the debate and Obama just owns her with a good line about how the American people don't want the national enquirer, they want to know who to make the next President of the United States.
 
Are we doing an official thread for this? I mean this thread is the Interim Thread.

We need a new thread since shit's getting serious again.

We need a thread titled PoliGAF Official Pennsylvania ABC Democratic Debate Thread of Bitter Tears in Hillary's Beers
 

grandjedi6

Master of the Google Search
aztrex said:
Are we doing an official thread for this? I mean this thread is the Interim Thread.

We need a new thread since shit's getting serious again.

We need a thread titled PoliGAF Official Pennsylvania ABC Democratic Debate Thread of Bitter Tears in Hillary's Beers

Good news everybody! There already is one
 

Bowser

Member
aztrex said:
Are we doing an official thread for this? I mean this thread is the Interim Thread.

We need a new thread since shit's getting serious again.

We need a thread titled PoliGAF Official Pennsylvania ABC Democratic Debate Thread of Bitter Tears in Hillary's Beers

:lol :lol
 

maynerd

Banned
chris_avatar.jpg
grandjedi6 said:
Good news everybody! There already is one
 

Insertia

Member
3rdman said:
Annie Oakley embarrasses herself again...




In January 1995, as the Clintons were licking their wounds from the 1994 congressional elections, a debate emerged at a retreat at Camp David. Should the administration make overtures to working class white southerners who had all but forsaken the Democratic Party? The then-first lady took a less than inclusive approach.

"Screw 'em," she told her husband. "You don't owe them a thing, Bill. They're doing nothing for you; you don't have to do anything for them."

Okay, Bittergate was dumb and something the MSM wanted to turn into a huge deal and backfired. Want something that'll get your chops going? This should be on every news outlet this evening.
 

Clevinger

Member
Insertia said:
Okay, Bittergate was dumb and something the MSM wanted to turn into a huge deal and backfired. Want something that'll get your chops going? This should be on every news outlet this evening.


Should it? There's no way to know if the guy's telling the truth.
 
3rdman said:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/04/16/hillary-clinton-on-workin_n_97017.html

In January 1995, as the Clintons were licking their wounds from the 1994 congressional elections, a debate emerged at a retreat at Camp David. Should the administration make overtures to working class white southerners who had all but forsaken the Democratic Party? The then-first lady took a less than inclusive approach.

"Screw 'em," she told her husband. "You don't owe them a thing, Bill. They're doing nothing for you; you don't have to do anything for them."

The statement -- which author Benjamin Barber witnessed and wrote about in his book, "The Truth of Power: Intellectual Affairs in the Clinton White House" -- was prompted by another speaker raising the difficulties of reaching "Reagan Democrats." It stands in stark contrast to the attitude the New York Democrat has recently taken on the campaign trail, in which she has presented herself as the one who candidate who understands the working-class needs.

I promise you this: Hillary is somewhere trying her damndest to make sure this story doesn't get *any* traction at all. But if Fox News or some anti-Hillary show host like Olbermann get hold of it? Look out.
 

Ripclawe

Banned
http://cameron.blogs.foxnews.com/2008/04/16/a-hamas-problem-for-obama/

While Sen. Barack Obama sought to improve his relationship with the Jewish community today by meeting with leaders Philadelphia, comments by a Hamas political adviser this weekend could potentially hurt the Democratic presidential candidate.

During an interview on WABC radio Sunday, top Hamas political adviser Ahmed Yousef said the terrorist group supports Obama’s foreign policy vision.

“We don’t mind–actually we like Mr. Obama. We hope he will (win) the election and I do believe he is like John Kennedy, great man with great principle, and he has a vision to change America to make it in a position to lead the world community but not with domination and arrogance,” Yousef said in response to a question about the group’s willingness to meet with either of the Democratic presidential candidates.

For his part, Obama criticized former President Jimmy Carter’s decision to meet with Hamas, telling Jewish leaders Wednesday that “Hamas is not a state, Hamas is a terrorist organization.”

“We must not negotiate with a terrorist group intent on Israel’s destruction,” Obama said. “We should only sit down with Hamas if they renounce terrorism, recognize Israel’s right to exist, and abide by past agreements.”

While the IL Democrat has condemned Hamas, an endorsement from a top leader in the group is probably the last thing Obama needs right now.
 

APF

Member
Who has Obama's ear?

Earlier this month, Democratic presidential contender Barack Obama was forced to distance himself from the coordinator of his own campaign’s working group on Iraq policy. As The New York Sun reported, Colin Kahl, a fellow with the Center for a New American Security, recently wrote a paper for that organization suggesting that anywhere from 60,000 to 80,000 American troops should stay in Iraq until the end of 2010.

Such forecasting is starkly at odds with the anti-war rhetoric Obama has been using on the campaign trail. Indeed, Obama promises to remove every last American combat brigade from Iraq within 16 months of taking office, come hell or high water.

[...]

The views of Obama’s top Iraq adviser are more significant than the unsought endorsement of a bigoted Nation of Islam preacher, however, at least given the emphasis that the junior senator from Illinois has bestowed upon his “judgment” to oppose the war in a speech delivered six years ago. Yet the nonchalance with which the Obama campaign handled the Kahl revelation suggests that either the campaign’s advisers are of little significance in the candidate’s decision-making process or that Obama does not really have a well-thought-out position on the subject of extricating us from Iraq.

Negating the words of his advisers has become a frequent task in Obama’s campaign — and a telling one, at that. In February, Obama’s senior economics adviser Austan Goolsbee had a meeting with the Canadian consul in Chicago to reassure the worried diplomat that the likely Democratic presidential nominee’s promises to renegotiate the 1993 NAFTA trade agreement were insincere.

[...]

Just a few days later, another Obama foreign policy adviser had to be corrected by campaign headquarters. Samantha Power, a Pulitzer Prize-winning expert on the history of genocide, told the BBC that Obama “will, of course, not rely on some plan that he’s crafted as a presidential candidate or a U.S. senator” with regard to Iraq strategy. Power was ultimately let go for telling a Scottish interviewer that Hillary Rodham Clinton was a “monster,” yet it was the former comment that did more substantive harm to the Obama campaign, illustrative as it is of the widening gap between Obama’s rhetoric and what he plans to do as president.

[...]

After all, to divine what a candidate thinks about the issues of the day by taking stock of the people who are writing his position papers and whispering in his ear is hardly an unreasonable venture. Obama’s followers appear to dispute this notion, arguing that their man is a special case, untouched by the advice or influence of others.

And while many of Giuliani’s advisers certainly held opinions with which he did not agree, none of them were telling the media or foreign governments that what he was saying on the campaign trail and what he actually planned to do as president were at cross-purposes. It is to be expected that a presidential candidate — as well as a president — would surround himself with people who disagree with him (and each other) on issues. What is so unusual about Obama’s candidacy is that there are repeated instances of his telling the public one thing and his advisers’ quietly (and not so quietly) reassuring that such promises mean nothing.

Obama is, in his own words, something of a Rorschach test. In his latest book, “The Audacity of Hope,” he writes, “I am new enough on the national political scene that I serve as a blank screen on which people of vastly different political stripes project their own views.” That has been confirmed thus far during this campaign, and come November, Americans will have to decide if they want a Rorschach test for president.

Full article: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0408/9631.html
 
as off topic, fighting debating, yelling, banning, tit for tat shit this post has, i am glad to retreat back here from the disaster that was the ABC debate (first 45 minutes, anyways). This thread is abc-debate free, right?
 

APF

Member
"And while many of Giuliani’s advisers certainly held opinions with which he did not agree, none of them were telling the media or foreign governments that what he was saying on the campaign trail and what he actually planned to do as president were at cross-purposes. It is to be expected that a presidential candidate — as well as a president — would surround himself with people who disagree with him (and each other) on issues. What is so unusual about Obama’s candidacy is that there are repeated instances of his telling the public one thing and his advisers’ quietly (and not so quietly) reassuring that such promises mean nothing."
 
In tax returns the campaign released Wednesday, the Obamas reported a significant jump in their income from the previous year as profits from the books "Dreams From My Father" and "The Audacity of Hope" accounted for some $4 million. The Obamas paid federal taxes of $1.4 million and donated $240,370 to charity.

For part of 2007, Michelle Obama collected a salary for serving on the board of Westchester, Ill.-based TreeHouse Foods Inc., which produces pickles, nondairy powdered creamer and other products. She resigned in May after two years on the board.

The position had generated some complaints because TreeHouse is a supplier to Wal-Mart, and Barack Obama has criticized some of Wal-Mart's policies and treatment of employees.

The Obamas reported $29,443 from Treehouse Foods.

Among the charitable donations in 2007 was $26,270 to Trinity United Church of Christ, where the incendiary sermons of Obama's former pastor have created problems for the candidate. The Obamas' largest charitable donation was $50,000 to the United Negro College Fund. They also gave $35,000 to CARE.


LINK


Only 5.7% to charity...
 

mashoutposse

Ante Up
APF said:
"And while many of Giuliani’s advisers certainly held opinions with which he did not agree, none of them were telling the media or foreign governments that what he was saying on the campaign trail and what he actually planned to do as president were at cross-purposes. It is to be expected that a presidential candidate — as well as a president — would surround himself with people who disagree with him (and each other) on issues. What is so unusual about Obama’s candidacy is that there are repeated instances of his telling the public one thing and his advisers’ quietly (and not so quietly) reassuring that such promises mean nothing."

"Repeated" instances? One was determined to have not happened and the other was an advisor expressing common sense.

And what Penn did is arguably worse than anything that's occurred within Obama's campaign.
 

scorcho

testicles on a cold fall morning
how much did mccain donate? oh, wait. he gets a free pass because he actually doesn't care about helping people.
 

reilo

learning some important life lessons from magical Negroes
siamesedreamer said:
LINK


Only 5.7% to charity...

As opposed to the 3% Hillary donated? To her own charity nonetheless?

Or in 2002 when they donated $115K from the $9.5mil they've made?

The pace of the Clintons’ own charitable giving, which peaked last year at $3 million, has not always kept up with their income, and by at least one measure, has sometimes fallen short of the spirit of the 5 percent goal, which is to get money into the hands of charities that do good works.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/05/us/politics/05clintons.html?pagewanted=print
 

Zen

Banned
siamesedreamer said:
Who gives a fuck about McCain?

You can't critizes one Candidate for the sum they give but than act indignant when comparisons to the other candidates are made. Be prepared to condem every candidate for how 'little' they contribute, or for goodness sake don't just call out the one who contributes the most and expect to get a free pass.

That is if you were being serious. :\
 

scorcho

testicles on a cold fall morning
SD and i have fallen into niches - he will throw up any link against Obama, and i will do likewise against McCain.

thankfully i have more to work with.

siamesedreamer said:
What percentage did McCain donate?
considering most of the money is tied to Cindy McCain we may never know.
 

mashoutposse

Ante Up
siamesedreamer said:
LINK


Only 5.7% to charity...

He made just under a million the year before -- it is understandable that charitable giving won't be in perfect lockstep with earnings during a period when income is uncharacteristically high.
 

reilo

learning some important life lessons from magical Negroes
scorcho said:
SD and i have fallen into niches - he will throw up any link against Obama, and i will do likewise against McCain.

thankfully i have more to work with.

considering most of the money is tied to Cindy McCain we may never know.

I don't know. You kind of have an unfair advantage.
 

Odrion

Banned
scorcho said:
i do. who gives a fuck about how much Obama donates?
These arguments we see aren't really about Obama vs. McCain or Hillary, these arguments are really about challenging the NeoGAF hivemind.
 

scorcho

testicles on a cold fall morning
Odrion said:
This thread isn't really about Obama vs. McCain or Hillary vs. McCain, but a few diligent people willing to challenge the NeoGAF hive mind.
substantive attacks on policy are A-OK with me. regurgitating silly death-by-association attacks or other GOP talking points is just, well, silly.
 

scorcho

testicles on a cold fall morning
there's civilian leadership of the military for a reason. the military is a tool of our policy objectives, not the other way around.
 

grandjedi6

Master of the Google Search
Tamanon said:
Hell, Bush got rid of a General because he disagreed with him. Or maybe he was an Admiral, whoever Fallon was.

Admiral. And Bush has never listened to any of his military leaders or technical staff. That is why our foreign policy has gone horrid and the war on terror failed
 

xbhaskarx

Member
Hamas Endorses Obama?

Ahmed Yousef, chief political adviser to the Prime Minister of Hamas said, "We like Mr. Obama and we hope he will win the election." Why? "He has a vision to change America."

Yousef also described Jimmy Carter, who was about to pay a call on Hamas when the interview was taped, as "this noble man" who "did an excellent job as President."

Yousef was asked about Obama's condemnation of Carter's visit with Hamas, but didn't seem troubled by it. Hamas, he says, understands American politics; this is the election season, and everyone wants to sound like a friend of Israel. Nevertheless, he hopes that the Democrats will change American policies when they take office.

audio
 
grandjedi6 said:
Admiral. And Bush has never listened to any of his military leaders or technical staff. That is why our foreign policy has gone horrid and the war on terror failed

maybe my memory is off...but weren't military commanders basically telling the administration that the real enemy was in afghanistan instead of Iraq back when the war on terrorism was about 9/11 terrorists?
 

Tamanon

Banned
xbhaskarx said:
Hamas Endorses Obama?

Ahmed Yousef, chief political adviser to the Prime Minister of Hamas said, "We like Mr. Obama and we hope he will win the election." Why? "He has a vision to change America."

Yousef also described Jimmy Carter, who was about to pay a call on Hamas when the interview was taped, as "this noble man" who "did an excellent job as President."

Yousef was asked about Obama's condemnation of Carter's visit with Hamas, but didn't seem troubled by it. Hamas, he says, understands American politics; this is the election season, and everyone wants to sound like a friend of Israel. Nevertheless, he hopes that the Democrats will change American policies when they take office.

audio

Yes, Ripclawe made sure to inform us of that as soon as it happened:p He's got the whole Muslim RSS feed.
 

masud

Banned
Deus Ex Machina said:
I promise you this: Hillary is somewhere trying her damndest to make sure this story doesn't get *any* traction at all. But if Fox News or some anti-Hillary show host like Olbermann get hold of it? Look out.
Oh no, she might lose! Also fox wouldn't break this now, goes against their agenda.
 

grandjedi6

Master of the Google Search
monchi-kun said:
maybe my memory is off...but weren't military commanders basically telling the administration that the real enemy was in afghanistan instead of Iraq back when the war on terrorism was about 9/11 terrorists?

Yep, Military commanders were against an Iraq invasion and the Terrorist prevention staff were saying Afghanistan was the real target. But the administration ignored their advice and almost immediatly tried to use 9-11 as an excuse to invade Iraq.
 
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