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PoliGAF Interim Thread of Tears/Lapel Pins (ScratchingHisCheek-Gate)

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M

monchi-kun

Member
grandjedi6 said:
Yep, Military commanders were against an Iraq invasion and the Terrorist prevention staff were saying Afghanistan was the real target. But the administration ignored their advice and almost immediatly tried to use 9-11 as an excuse to invade Iraq.
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so, this is one of the privileges of being Commander-In-Chief then
 
U

User 10639

Member
Cheebs said:
Michael Dukakis (Obama supporter) today said he helping to construct a "super delegate convention" in June. George McGovern is also on board apparently.
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AHHHHHHHHHH GO AWAY MCGOVERN NOBODY F'N LIKES YOU!!!
 
J

Justin Timberlake

Member
icarus-daedelus said:
AHHHHHHHHHH GO AWAY MCGOVERN NOBODY F'N LIKES YOU!!!
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I feel so sorry for those two. Nearly every Democratic candidate has to go through unflattering comparisons with McGovern and Dukakis, painting those two as the ultimate political failures. I have a feeling Kerry will be lumped with them in the years to come.
 
G

grandjedi6

Master of the Google Search
The Crimson Blur said:
I feel so sorry for those two. Nearly every Democratic candidate has to go through unflattering comparisons with McGovern and Dukakis, painting those two as the ultimate political failures. I have a feeling Kerry will be lumped with them in the years to come.
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Kerry was actually close to Bush in the election. Dukakis and McGovern though....
 
M

monchi-kun

Member
The Crimson Blur said:
A douche? That guy is worried that he will get fired! After this interview, I am sure he has been! I feel sorry for him and his career.
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yeah, poor guy...probably got fired because he couldn't spin the interview back to Fox's favor
 
U

User 10639

Member
grandjedi6 said:
Kerry was actually close to Bush in the election. Dukakis and McGovern though....
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Well Dukakis is lame, but the loss wasn't that huge (10 points or so.)

But McGovern? Poor guy only carried a single state and lost by more than 20 points. I'm pretty sure it was one of the biggest election margins in history. And we ended up with more Nixon as a result. :lol
 
S

siamesedreamer

Banned
grandjedi6 said:
Yep, Military commanders were against an Iraq invasion and the Terrorist prevention staff were saying Afghanistan was the real target. But the administration ignored their advice and almost immediatly tried to use 9-11 as an excuse to invade Iraq.
Click to expand...

So, doesn't that make a good argument that dismissing the recommendations of your commanders like H&O want to do is pretty stoopit?
 
K

kkaabboomm

Member
interestingly about the DC-super Thomas -- he cited the 100 phone calls from his constituents as a reason for him switching from his personal/internal initial support of hillary to his districts support of obama. Obama's campaign has said to not harass the supers, but this is one case where constituents, not random joe blow from new mexico, contacts their super and gets a change to occur.
 
S

scorcho

testicles on a cold fall morning
siamesedreamer said:
So, doesn't that make a good argument that dismissing the recommendations of your commanders like H&O want to do is pretty stoopit?
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what Petraeus is asking for is a continuation of the means as an end unto itself. it has zero bearing on the original goals behind the surge and there is zero definition on what 'victory' even means. there's zero end strategy, zero concept of what we want other than utopian musings. also, if both H&O feel that an open commitment in Iraq is NOT in our national interests then they have every right to dismiss Petraeus' statements. he's a tactician, not the policy maker.

the military doesn't drive policy, they give tactical recommendations insofar as they are capable to for the civilian leadership to consider. that's it.
 
C

Clipjoint

Member
Has Edwards officially stated which candidate he supports, yet? I was at an event last night where he and Fred Thompson were speaking, and Edwards didn't seem to leave any room for doubt that he supports Obama. None at all. He specifically said at one point "We need a visionary as president, and Barack Obama is a visionary." As far as I've been following he's been sitting on the fence - I wonder if Obama promised him a significant position?
 
ToyMachine228

ToyMachine228

Member
Clipjoint said:
Has Edwards officially stated which candidate he supports, yet?
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Edwards hasn't endorsed anyone yet, but he has stated that he will not accept the Vice President slot from any candidate this time around.
 
C

Clipjoint

Member
ToyMachine228 said:
Edwards hasn't endorsed anyone yet, but he has stated that he will not accept the Vice President slot from any candidate this time around.
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That's what I thought, but he was really talking up Obama last night. I was actually pretty shocked to hear him support a candidate so strongly and openly, I imagine it won't be long before he endorses him publicly.
 
S

scorcho

testicles on a cold fall morning
Edwards is waiting for someone in the media to crown him a kingmaker again, then he'll step down from his lofty thrown and anoint Clinton or Obama without anyone in America caring.
 
ToyMachine228

ToyMachine228

Member
Clipjoint said:
That's what I thought, but he was really talking up Obama last night. I was actually pretty shocked to hear him support a candidate so strongly and openly, I imagine it won't be long before he endorses him publicly.
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The insiders say he isn't going to make an endorsement, but if he does with North Carolina approaching that'd be the perfect time for it. If he doesn't make an endorsement before North Carolina, I imagine he'll go without making one at all. But the fact is, he has to vote for one of them in his home state so he definitely does favor one over the other. It's just a matter of if he makes it public or not.
 
B

bob_arctor

Tough_Smooth
siamesedreamer said:
So, doesn't that make a good argument that dismissing the recommendations of your commanders like H&O want to do is pretty stoopit?
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Why would it be stupid to end the Iraq War again? Also, I'd like to see the long list of military commanders that have recommended ending a war they are engaged in. Who ended the Vietnam War? Commander Watergate?
 
A

artredis1980

Banned
Zogby PA poll


http://www.zogby.com/news/ReadNews.dbm?ID=1481

Pennsylvania


Clinton


45%

Obama


44%

Someone else


3%

Not sure


9%


Pollster John Zogby—"This is not a year for negative campaigning and Clinton's pounding of Obama on his controversial description of small town voters in Pennsylvania does not seem to be working. Obama leads in the Philadelphia and eastern part of the Commonwealth, among African Americans, and Very Liberal Pennsylvanians. He also has a slight lead among voters in union households and has an 18 point margin over those who have lost a job. Clinton maintains her lead among whites, Catholics, Liberals, and Hispanics.

"The gender gap is huge with Obama leading among men by 15 and Clinton leading among women by 15. But Clinton holds a wide advantage on the question of understanding Pennsylvania (58%-27%) and handling the economy of the country (47%-38%). She also is ahead in understanding the personal financial situation of individuals (41%-35%).

"On the other hand, Pennsylvanians by a two to one margin (60% to 29%) are more likely to agree with supporters of Obama that voters in Pennsylvania are bitter about their economic situation than with Clinton and critics of Obama that he is an elitist who does not understand working people.

"On the key questions of who they would rather have a beer with: Clinton 38%, Obama 39%—with 15% undecided.

A key demographic group that has changed its mind in the last week is Democratic voters age 35 to 54, who just one week ago favored Clinton by a 45% to 40% margin. Now, Obama leads among those voters by a 47% to 41% edge. Clinton leads among voters older than age 54, while Obama leads among the younger set.

Among men, Obama holds what has come to be a predictable advantage, leading with 50% support, compared to 35% for Clinton. But Clinton makes up for it among women—also a predictable support group for her—leading by a 53% to 38% margin.

Among the very liberal Democratic Party voters, Obama leads, while Clinton leads among mainline liberals. Among moderates, the two are deadlocked, while Clinton has an edge among conservative Democratic voters.

Among whites and Hispanics, Clinton holds double-digit leads, while Obama holds a huge lead among African Americans, winning 82% support.

Two issues were dominant in the minds of these voters—with the economy far and away the most important to voters in deciding whom to support—54% said it was at the top of their list. The Iraq war was a distant second, with all other issues winning just a passing notice from the likely voters.

Asked which candidate was most likely to improve the respondent's personal financial situation, Clinton won 41%, compared to 35% who said Obama would be tops. Six percent identified someone else, while 19% said they were unsure.

Asked which candidate would be most likely to improve the U.S. economy, Clinton also held an advantage, winning 47% support to 38% who said Obama was most likely. Men favored Obama, while women favored Clinton.

Voters Believe Clinton Understands Pennsylvania Better

The Newsmax/Zogby survey asked likely Democratic primary voters which candidate they believed understands Pennsylvania better, and Clinton was seen to be far more understanding of the state. While 58% said she better understood the Keystone State, just 27% said Obama had a better grip on it. This comes nearly a week after Obama, speaking to an audience in San Francisco, said that Pennsylvanians cling to their religion and to guns out of bitterness over bad economic times. The comment has drawn a significant backlash, and Obama has been explaining his comments ever since.

But the issue has apparently had little impact on the broader head-to-head contest, as Obama has closed the lead Clinton has enjoyed for some time.

The survey also asked specifically about the controversy, asking likely voters whether they agreed with the Obama critics who have said the comments show he is an elitist who does not understand working people and their problems—29% agreed. But 60% said they agreed with Obama supporters who have said he is simply telling the truth about these people who are suffering from the results of economic policies in Washington.
Click to expand...
 
B

Bowser

Member
Triumph said:
High five! I'm gonna hit it up tomorrow myself, didn't want to deal with potential first day crowds.
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I go to UNC-CH and the voting site was pretty much right on campus...pretty steady stream of students voting today, and I got a cookie and balloon out of it. I know, I'd be jealous too.
 
C

Cheebs

Member
Triumph said:
lol @ zogby poll. I'd take that with a mountain sized grain of salt after his disaster out in CA.
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And Ohio he had him up big before the primary.

Zogby's own brother is an Obama Super delegate too. :lol
 
T

Triumph

Banned
Bowser said:
I go to UNC-CH and the voting site was pretty much right on campus...pretty steady stream of students voting today, and I got a cookie and balloon out of it. I know, I'd be jealous too.
Click to expand...
Eh, the one stop voting sites in Wilmington are the Library, Board of Elections and Senior Center. I doubt I'm getting a cookie. :(
 
C

Cheebs

Member
gkrykewy said:
Cheebs - are you really suggesting that Zogby would compromise a longstanding polling career simply because his brother has endorsed Obama? Really?
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He had Obama up by 10 in CA. No one had him at numbers like that. No one.
 
B

Bowser

Member
Triumph said:
Eh, the one stop voting sites in Wilmington are the Library, Board of Elections and Senior Center. I doubt I'm getting a cookie. :(
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:( The cookie I had was damn good too, decorated with red, white, and blue frosting. The UNC for Obama people have totally crushed the Heels for Hillary contingent here; they've been more vocal, helped get lots of students registered and have been selling Obama '08 shirts. There was a bigger UNC for Obama presence outside of the voting site. The few Heels for Hillary students stood off to the side with glum looks on their faces that clearly said, "I want a cookie and balloon too :(", not speaking to anyone and just holding up "Hillary for President" signs.
 
S

schuelma

Wastes hours checking old Famitsu software data, but that's why we love him.
I'm sorry, but Zogby's been horrible for a while. He was really bad calling the 04 election.
 
A

artredis1980

Banned
Deus Ex Machina said:
This isn't the year for negative campaigning.

Now where's my Gallup? :D
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041708DailyUpdateGraph1_nmjkou5.gif
 
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