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PoliGAF Interim Thread of USA General Elections (DAWN OF THE VEEP)

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R

reilo

learning some important life lessons from magical Negroes
XCell9200 said:
*Sigh* all revisionist history. From the LA Times, a well known conservative rag of course.

http://www.infowars.com/saved pages/Prior_Knowledge/Clinton_let_bin_laden.htm

"President Clinton and his national security team ignored several opportunities to capture Osama bin Laden and his terrorist associates, including one as late as last year.

I know because I negotiated more than one of the opportunities.

From 1996 to 1998, I opened unofficial channels between Sudan and the Clinton administration. I met with officials in both countries, including Clinton, U.S. National Security Advisor Samuel R. "Sandy" Berger and Sudan's president and intelligence chief. President Omar Hassan Ahmed Bashir, who wanted terrorism sanctions against Sudan lifted, offered the arrest and extradition of Bin Laden and detailed intelligence data about the global networks constructed by Egypt's Islamic Jihad, Iran's Hezbollah and the Palestinian Hamas."
Click to expand...

80601pdb1.jpg


August 6th, 2001
 
C

cjdunn

Member
XCell9200 said:
Right. Give me that so I can easily shoot it down. Nixon negotiated the end of the war in Vietnam, Reagan, according to Gorbachev was "Instrumental in bringing about the end of the cold war" and also had one of the highest approval ratings in history, and Bush began his presidency with the first foreign attack on US soil since pearl harbor (and the first non wartime attack ever), which happened in large part because Clinton (who had a pretty comfortable presidency as I recall) was too busy getting blown by his fat secretary to bother taking down Osama bin Laden, who was handed to him on a silver plate.

Don't use political cartoons to make points. Governments spend money during wartime and arms races. But thanks for the enlightenment.
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Hiw lovely, a right-wing talking point and myth. Look up one Mansoor Ijaz who was the originator of this bogus offer:
The 9/11 Commission found that although "former Sudanese officials claim that Sudan offered to expel Bin Laden to the United States", "we have not found any reliable evidence to support the Sudanese claim."
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S

soul creator

Member
XCell9200 said:
At the very end, I said "governments spend money during wartime and during an arms race". Bush had Katrina, 9/11, and the wars in iraq and afghanistan keeping him busy. Did he handle them well? Nope. But it explains the debt. What comparable obstacles did clinton face?
Click to expand...

So according to you, world instability increases once Republicans are in power and actually have the ability to push forth their policies of military aggression and excessive deregulation and a pro-corporate agenda. Glad you've finally seen the light!
 
R

reilo

learning some important life lessons from magical Negroes
cjdunn said:
Hiw lovely, a right-wing talking point and myth. Look up one Mansoor Ijaz who was the originator of this bogus offer:
Click to expand...

I forgot all about that. I knew when I read that statement that there was something wrong with it. I think during ABC's "Path to 9/11" bullshit, that point was brought up quite a few times.
 
mckmas8808

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
XCell9200 said:
At the very end, I said "governments spend money during wartime and during an arms race". Bush had Katrina, 9/11, and the wars in iraq and afghanistan keeping him busy. Did he handle them well? Nope. But it explains the debt. What comparable obstacles did clinton face?
Click to expand...

1st of all Bush started the Iraq war for NO reason. 2nd Bush knew what Bin Laden was possibly going to do one month before he did it.

And Clinton had similar problems with Saddam Hussein, but the man didn't want to take over the country. And Clinton helped in the acts that left Iraq WMD free!

And Clinton had the Battle in Mogadisha Somalia. But he didn't decide to fight there for years like other presidents.

Clinton had that mini fight in Bosnia too.
 
J

Jason's Ultimatum

Member
XCell9200 said:
*Sigh* all revisionist history. From the LA Times, a well known conservative rag of course.

http://www.infowars.com/saved pages/Prior_Knowledge/Clinton_let_bin_laden.htm

"President Clinton and his national security team ignored several opportunities to capture Osama bin Laden and his terrorist associates, including one as late as last year.

I know because I negotiated more than one of the opportunities.

From 1996 to 1998, I opened unofficial channels between Sudan and the Clinton administration. I met with officials in both countries, including Clinton, U.S. National Security Advisor Samuel R. "Sandy" Berger and Sudan's president and intelligence chief. President Omar Hassan Ahmed Bashir, who wanted terrorism sanctions against Sudan lifted, offered the arrest and extradition of Bin Laden and detailed intelligence data about the global networks constructed by Egypt's Islamic Jihad, Iran's Hezbollah and the Palestinian Hamas."
Click to expand...

Clinton didn't want OBL to be extradited because he felt the U.S. wouldn't have enough evidence in court to convict him.
 
R

reilo

learning some important life lessons from magical Negroes
Jason's Ultimatum said:
Clinton didn't want OBL to be extradited because he felt the U.S. wouldn't have enough evidence in court to convict him.
Click to expand...

If he only had the Patriot Act, he could have held him indefinitely!
 
Amory

Amory

Member
The fact that Bush failed which, I don't know how many times I have to say I know he has for people to stop acting like I love the guy, doesn't excuse the fact that Clinton also did. August 6. Yes. Where would bin Laden have been if Clinton had done his job and had him arrested? Not in a position to plan the September 11th attacks.

At least I'm saying they both failed. People who won't admit Clinton did anything wrong are in denial. In any case, it's irrelevant to the thread.
 
R

reilo

learning some important life lessons from magical Negroes
XCell9200 said:
The fact that Bush failed which, I don't know how many times I have to say I know he has for people to stop acting like I love the guy, doesn't excuse the fact that Clinton also did. August 6. Yes. Where would bin Laden have been if Clinton had done his job and had him arrested? Not in a position to plan the September 11th attacks.

At least I'm saying they both failed. People who won't admit Clinton did anything wrong are in denial. In any case, it's irrelevant to the thread.
Click to expand...

You can't just arrest people without enough supporting evidence, regardless of what this current administration would like to have you believe!

Besides, I'd love you to find us a country in the middle east that would help the US extradite one of their own. Pakistan is supposed to be an ally, and they wouldn't budge.

Let me ask you this: If Timothy McVeigh had went to a Middle Eastern country and bombed one of their prestigious buildings there, and managed to get back to the United States, would the US allow foreign nationals and help extradite him to said country if there was ample evidence against him?
 
S

soul creator

Member
XCell9200 said:
The fact that Bush failed which, I don't know how many times I have to say I know he has for people to stop acting like I love the guy, doesn't excuse the fact that Clinton also did. August 6. Yes. Where would bin Laden have been if Clinton had done his job and had him arrested? Not in a position to plan the September 11th attacks.

At least I'm saying they both failed. People who won't admit Clinton did anything wrong are in denial. In any case, it's irrelevant to the thread.
Click to expand...

My primary point (as I'm not really some hardcore Clinton apologist either) is that Bush's "failures" aren't just because "Bush was bad". Instability in Iraq, Katrina, high gas prices, housing market failures, etc. are a direct result of these "new conservative" policies such as excessive deregulation, "free" trade, privatizing traditional government functions, and so on. For certain groups of people, things have worked out very well over the past 8 years (and to some extent, the past 30 or so years). The problem is much bigger than just "Bush was incompetent". Bush and his administration did exactly what they wanted to do. Only problem is that what they wanted to accomplish doesn't really benefit the average citizen. But you probably won't realize that if you continue to assume that the Republican candidate must always mean small government and fiscal responsibility, and the Democratic candidate means the opposite. You have to question the underlying philosophies and not just one individual.

McCain seems to want continue these policies, so switching Bush with McCain won't do anything to reverse this. Obama isn't perfect either, but he'd do far more to push forth a progressive agenda that actually works for regular folks (or at the very least, won't stand in the way of it), than McCain would.
 
R

reilo

learning some important life lessons from magical Negroes
DarkMage619 said:
Say it ain't so John! He should have stuck to talking about mills.

The Dark One
Click to expand...


In an interview for broadcast tonight on Nightline, Edwards told ABC News correspondent Bob Woodruff he did have an affair with 42-year old Rielle Hunter, but said that he did not love her.

Edwards also denied he was the father of Hunter's baby girl, Frances Quinn, although the one-time Democratic Presidential candidate said he has not taken a paternity test.
Click to expand...

omg :eek:
 
S

soul creator

Member
DarkMage619 said:
Say it ain't so John! He should have stuck to talking about mills.

The Dark One
Click to expand...

In an interview for broadcast tonight on Nightline, Edwards told ABC News correspondent Bob Woodruff he did have an affair with 42-year old Rielle Hunter, but said that he did not love her.
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spoken like a true man who's in trouble

"Baby, she was just something on the side. You're the one I love"

Actually, I'd love to see the day when a political couple admits to having an open relationship, and when something like this comes out, they both say "so?".
 
S

SouthernDragon

Member
I'd like to point out a few things.

Firstly, welcome to the thread, Xcell! As long as you can argue and make valid points, you are most welcome.

Secondly, the cartoon was addressing the economic side of the issues, and the contradiction we face with conservative/liberal labels. No doubt those Republican presidents were successful at other things, but they promised financial restraint and balance; something they did not deliver on.

Thirdly, while I can understand, and even support, the ideals of limited government and tight budgeting, the current, and possible future Republican government, promise anything but.
 
R

reilo

learning some important life lessons from magical Negroes
Well, if he doesn't like cartoons, here is a more official graph that says the same thing!

National-Debt-GDP.gif
 
C

Cheebs

Member
reilo said:
Well, if he doesn't like cartoons, here is a more official graph that says the same thing!

National-Debt-GDP.gif
Click to expand...
And he cant use the Bu...bu..bu WAR! excuse either since based on that debt went DOWN during Vietnam.
 
J

Jason's Ultimatum

Member
reilo said:
Well, if he doesn't like cartoons, here is a more official graph that says the same thing!

National-Debt-GDP.gif
Click to expand...

I keep telling this guy at the gym who hates Clinton and all he brings up is the best way to balance the budget is to raise taxes. He also says Clinton did a lot of short term borrowing.
 
I

Incognito

Troll
Imagine if John Edwards had won the nomination. What the hell was this idiot thinking? Did he really believe he could win the nomination and just push the affair under the rug? Thank god he didn't win --otherwise we'd be looking at 4 years of McCain.
 
G

gkryhewy

Member
reilo said:
Drudge image:

[IMGhttp://d.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/afp/20080808/capt.cps.nfq57.080808182806.photo00.photo.default-512x349.jpg/IMG]

Accidental or intentional?
Click to expand...

I don't get it. Lou Dobbs Red China(tm)?
 
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