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PoliGAF Interim Thread of USA General Elections (DAWN OF THE VEEP)

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W

worldrunover

Member
speculawyer said:
Guiliani to give GOP Keynote address . . .

OK, no "9/11" drinking games . . . we don't want any deaths from alcohol poisoning.
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If you're going to form your campaign about national security it makes sense to have a keynote speaker who made his name off of 9/11.
 
T

Tamanon

Banned
http://yglesias.thinkprogress.org/archives/2008/08/the_hysteria_based_foreign_policy.php

Matt Welch has an excellent little reason article putting John McCain’s heated Georgia rhetoric in the context of McCain’s larger record of overreacting to every international event. He wasn’t just worried by North Korea’s nuclear program in 1994, he called it “the most dangerous and immediate expression” of “the greatest challenge to U.S. security and world stability today.” He didn’t just favor military action over Kosovo, he wanted “infantry and armored divisions for a possible ground war” thrown into the mix as part of “an immediate and manifold increase in the violence against Serbia proper and Serbian forces in Kosovo.” But he also thinks that Islamic radicalism is “the transcendent issue of our time” and also that the standoff with Russia is the first “serious crisis internationally” since the end of the Cold War, since Russia is aiming “to restore the old Russian Empire.”

In short, not only is Russia on the march beyond Tbilisi to Ukraine, Finland, and substantial swathes of Poland but that’s not even the transcendent issue of our time. And North Korea’s nuclear program is “the greatest challenge to U.S. security and world stability today” but that’s not the transcendent issue of our time. And Islamism is the transcendent issue of our time, but not a serious international crisis or an especially great challenge to U.S. security and world stability. Now of course there’s no way to make sense of that, because it’s not supposed to make any kind of sense. McCain just thinks that overreacting is the right reaction to everything. It’s a hysteria-based foreign policy.
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WE STAND ON THE PRECIPICE OF HISTORY!
 
M

maynerd

Banned
080820DailyUpdateGraph1_yuhjnmb.gif
 
T

Tamanon

Banned
http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/08/obama_campaign_mccain_is_a_rec.php

Awesome.

In an apparent effort to regain the offensive, the Obama campaign launched a broad attack on McCain today, portraying him as reckless on foreign policy, a hot-head who's too willing to use force and not willing enough to apprise himself of facts on the ground before urging military action.

On a conference call with reporters just now, senior Obama foreign policy adviser Susan Rice argued that there is "a pattern here of recklessness" when it comes to McCain's approach to various national security issues. She pointed out that McCain reacted too quickly with "aggressive and bellicose" rhetoric on the Russia-Georgia crisis, and contrasted that with Obama's measured response to the dust-up.

"There's something to be said for letting facts drive judgment," Rice said, also referring to McCain's desire to target Iraq right after 9/11.

The key here is that this is actually a character attack on McCain, something the Obama campaign has been reluctant to undertake at a time when McCain has shown no such reticence with regard to "celeb" Obama.

Will painting McCain as a hair-trigger hothead who's catastrophically overeager to support the use of military force, and not willing enough to apprise himself of the facts before acting, prove effective in the face of a withering assault on Obama as weak and indecisive?

In one sense, the grand experiment at the heart of the Obama campaign is an effort to win the election by speaking to the voters like adults.


Late Update: Furthering the hothead meme, Richard Clarke was also on the call, and he described the Republican as "quick draw McCain" and "trigger-happy."
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Glad to see they're ramping it up, and also glad to see Richard Clarke on board.
 
P

pxleyes

Banned
Tamanon said:
http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/08/obama_campaign_mccain_is_a_rec.php

Awesome.



Glad to see they're ramping it up, and also glad to see Richard Clarke on board.
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It's almost time to go full force. Enough of the soft tactics, hit them where it hurts.

Dax01 said:
Isn't this going against Obama's promise of avoiding personal attacks?
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I've given up on that. If McCain is going to go this personal this early, Obama needs to trash him.
 
T

Tamanon

Banned
Dax01 said:
Isn't this going against Obama's promise of avoiding personal attacks?
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Huh? It's not a personal attack, it's attacking his rhetoric and actions, things McCain actually did, not his personal life.
 
T

TDG

Banned
Dax01 said:
Isn't this going against Obama's promise of avoiding personal attacks?
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Questioning McCain's judgement is not a personal attack. "McCain likes to call his wife a c**t" is a personal attack.
 
T

The Librarian

Banned
the disgruntled gamer said:
Questioning McCain's judgement is not a personal attack. "McCain likes to call his wife a cunt" is a personal attack.
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Tamanon said:
Huh? It's not a personal attack, it's attacking his rhetoric and actions, things McCain actually did, not his personal life.
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Oh, okay.
 
S

Steve Youngblood

Member
Tamanon said:
Huh? It's not a personal attack, it's attacking his rhetoric and actions, things McCain actually did, not his personal life.
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Yeah, questioning his rhetoric and actions on foreign policy! How dare the Obama campaign. Did Obama spend time as a POW? I didn't think so. Ergo, he has no grounds to stand on when questioning his judgment of judicious use of military action.

Now can we please get back to having a clean campaign here? You know, the one where we paint Obama as an elitist pop star?
 
S

schuelma

Wastes hours checking old Famitsu software data, but that's why we love him.
Ehh..I'm not convinced that's the way to go. I don't know how portraying McCain has impulsive, hair triggered on national security will really affect the dynamics of the race.


They need to hit McCain on the economy 10 times a day every day. That's how they'll win the election- it won't be by attacking McCain on national security, which despite all the blunders of the Bush admin is still where McCain holds an edge.
 
Xisiqomelir

Xisiqomelir

Member
the disgruntled gamer said:
Questioning McCain's judgement is not a personal attack. "McCain likes to call his wife a c**t" is a personal attack.
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But I mean....he actually did say that. Lots of people were there and heard it.
 
T

Tyrone Slothrop

Banned
i would think being a republican candidate in 2008 would be enough to paint you as unelectable. i mean, those last eight years weren't so hot.

but people are idiots - hence the polls. so, who knows.
 
B

Bulla564

Banned
schuelma said:
They need to hit McCain on the economy 10 times a day every day. That's how they'll win the election- it won't be by attacking McCain on national security, which despite all the blunders of the Bush admin is still where McCain holds an edge.
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Russia is going to be in the news A LOT between now and the elections. Obama needs to scare the American people with the TRUTH that McCain is a loose-cannon-gungho-Bush and has poor judgement when it comes to foreign policy.

This and the economy will be central. Obama has not attacked ENOUGH.
 
S

schuelma

Wastes hours checking old Famitsu software data, but that's why we love him.
Agent Icebeezy said:
The hothead attack sounds like it could work.
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I really don't know about that. For *some* voters, that's not even necessarly a negative. Paint McCain as clueles and out of touch on the economy, every single day. That's where the dems can win, especially now.
 
F

Father_Brain

Banned
schuelma said:
They need to hit McCain on the economy 10 times a day every day. That's how they'll win the election- it won't be by attacking McCain on national security, which despite all the blunders of the Bush admin is still where McCain holds an edge.
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Well, that might be because he hasn't been attacked much on national security.
 
S

schuelma

Wastes hours checking old Famitsu software data, but that's why we love him.
Bulla564 said:
Russia is going to be in the news A LOT between now and the elections. Obama needs to scare the American people with the TRUTH that McCain is a loose-cannon-gungho-Bush and has poor judgement when it comes to foreign policy.

.
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Fine, but I'm telling you that is going to be a difficult sell given McCain's bio and Obama's relative inexperience.
 
A

Agent Icebeezy

Welcome beautful toddler, Madison Elizabeth, to the horde!
schuelma said:
I really don't know about that. For *some* voters, that's not even necessarly a negative. Paint McCain as clueles and out of touch on the economy, every single day. That's where the dems can win, especially now.
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No one wants to leave the football in the hands of an impulse action president. That SHOULD give people pause.
 
S

schuelma

Wastes hours checking old Famitsu software data, but that's why we love him.
Father_Brain said:
Well, that might be because he hasn't been attacked much on national security.
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He hasn't attacked on much at all. I'm just repeating myself here, but hammering him on the economy seems like a much better proposition.
 
T

TDG

Banned
schuelma said:
He hasn't attacked on much at all. I'm just repeating myself here, but hammering him on the economy seems like a much better proposition.
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I agree. However, I'm thinking: hammer McCain on the economy in the debates, where McCain will be on the spot and the whole nation will see how clueless he is, then keep going with that line of attack in the weeks following the debates.
 
Keylime

Keylime

ÏÎ¯Î»Ï á¼Î¾ÎµÏÎγλοÏÏον καί ÏεÏδολÏγον οá½Îº εἰÏÏν
GhaleonEB said:
I'm not clear what he's showing. Are those all confirmed campaign stops between now and the convention?
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That's my take. If so... then :D
 
F

Frank the Great

Banned
Yeah, it's Nate predicting how a midwest tour would play out, starting in Illinios, where the VP will be announced.

Only problem is, I don't see how it applies to Sebelius only. He could do the exact same tour with Bayh or Biden. Maybe Nate just wanted an excuse to use the term "SebeliBus"?
 
C

Cheebs

Member
RubxQub said:
That's my take. If so... then :D
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Uh...Nate made those up himself. There is NO campaign stops announced after Springfield.

Again that is what Nate *thinks* should be the path *if* Selebius got it.
 
Keylime

Keylime

ÏÎ¯Î»Ï á¼Î¾ÎµÏÎγλοÏÏον καί ÏεÏδολÏγον οá½Îº εἰÏÏν
Cheebs said:
Uh...Nate made those up himself. There is NO campaign stops announced after Springfield.

Again that is what Nate *thinks* should be the path *if* Selebius got it.
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Don't care!

Anything that hints at it being real = good.

Anything Cheebs hints at being real = bad.
 
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