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[mckmas8808]

I'd say the floor is closer to 125.

So much will depend on the tail and how willing Sony is to drop the price and by how much Sony is willing to drop the price.

I think what's actually more interesting is what the ceiling is.

If Sony can get a PS5 Digital down to 300, I think it'll sell really well, but we could be looking at PS2 type numbers if they can get it down 250 by doing a PS5 Super Slim, which I think would be in Sony's best interests if they plan they keep the PS5 alive through out much of the PS6 generation.

I think a PS5 Digital at 250 with the Switch 2 at 400 would make the Switch 2 look a bit silly.

A PS5 Handheld could push them to over 140 million in my opinion.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

A PS5 Handheld could push them to over 140 million in my opinion.

A proper PS5 handheld that gets counted as a PS5 and not its own thing, would easily push them into the 200 million territory.

 

[mckmas8808]

A proper PS5 handheld that gets counted as a PS5 and not its own thing, would easily push them into the 200 million territory.

BRO.................LOL! What you smoking?! You think a PS5 handheld on its own could sell over 70 million units? No way. The price would be the biggest barrier of entry for numbers that high.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

BRO.................LOL! What you smoking?! You think a PS5 handheld on its own could sell over 70 million units? No way. The price would be the biggest barrier of entry for numbers that high.

...A PS5 handheld means a much longer shelf life for the base PS5, well beyond the cross gen life cycle. We would be talking about probably 10 years of additional support from the time the PS5 handheld launched, it also would almost certainly mean a re-designed PS5 i.e. a PS5 super slim and a price reduction to boot.

A PS5 that's as low as 250 with an extra 7 years or so of support would probably hit 150-160 million. A PS5 handheld, even one that launched for say 500 dollars, would eventually come down in price, and I think it would be safe to say could sell 40-60 million units over the course of its lifetime globally.

The Vita sold nearly 20 million units with no support to speak of.

 

[apple_of_enlightenment]

So much of the PS5's ceiling is going to be determined by GTA6 and its long term price points. For all we know this could end up being Sony's biggest year despite the previous peak. It's impossible to accurately assess how many units of PS5s will sell due to GTA6 alone.

Since GTA6 will be on all platforms, not sure it's really a system seller. It's probably coming to Switch 2

 

[HeWhoWalks]

Since GTA6 will be on all platforms, not sure it's really a system seller. It's probably coming to Switch 2

It will definitely be a system seller for PS5.

 

[sachos]

I also think the PS5 will be sold alongside the PS6, beyond 2030, as a cheaper alternative, during a very long cross-gen period

For sure, cross gen periods are here to stay. We used to marvel at how long was the PS2 supported but the PS4 is about to reach its 12th birthday with many important games still coming out on it.

 

[m14]

BRO.................LOL! What you smoking?! You think a PS5 handheld on its own could sell over 70 million units? No way. The price would be the biggest barrier of entry for numbers that high.

Clearly he's not coping well with the prospect of the Switch inevitably surpassing the PS2's sales numbers.

 

[jm89]

Since GTA6 will be on all platforms, not sure it's really a system seller. It's probably coming to Switch 2

Is it coming day one? No.

So yes it will be a system seller.

 

[Vroadstar]

Xbox....

 

[Mibu no ookami]

For sure, cross gen periods are here to stay. We used to marvel at how long was the PS2 supported but the PS4 is about to reach its 12th birthday with many important games still coming out on it.

Cross-gen is going to be on steroids moving forward. Same games, just without the upscaled graphics, instantaneous loading times.

Clearly he's not coping well with the prospect of the Switch inevitably surpassing the PS2's sales numbers.

What are you talking about? LOL, why would I care, and what does this have to do with PS2?

I replied to a comment about how many units a combined PS5 and PS5 handheld would sell. If you think it's less than the PS2 or Switch, good luck with that, but of course you're a rabid fanboy.

 

[DeltaPolarBear]

A PS5 Handheld could push them to over 140 million in my opinion.

We need a LOT of tech advancements for that. The issue is that modern console had been drawing MORE power and not less. The screen displays are fine, good enough for gaming. But consider the loud fans we use to stop modern consoles from melting, it just isn't very possible to squeeze a PS5 into a handheld without at least TWO generations of advancements.

In the 1990's, tech was moving so fast that you could squeeze a console into a handheld 1 generation after. But that was a crazy time that would likely never be repeated. We are talking about computers getting obsolete 2 years after launch.

Tech had slowed down since then. Handhelds, with their infamous lack of cooling and need to consume battery power, is getting further and further away from home consoles.

Eventually the final form of a PlayStation would become a handheld. But i don't know when that would be. Maybe that PlayStation 9 advert might come true after all. Then again, 2078 is quite a while away.

 

[onQ123]

Since GTA6 will be on all platforms, not sure it's really a system seller. It's probably coming to Switch 2

Every big release is a system seller for PS5 right now & GTA vI is a really big release.

 

[onQ123]

We need a LOT of tech advancements for that. The issue is that modern console had been drawing MORE power and not less. The screen displays are fine, good enough for gaming. But consider the loud fans we use to stop modern consoles from melting, it just isn't very possible to squeeze a PS5 into a handheld without at least TWO generations of advancements.

In the 1990's, tech was moving so fast that you could squeeze a console into a handheld 1 generation after. But that was a crazy time that would likely never be repeated. We are talking about computers getting obsolete 2 years after launch.

Tech had slowed down since then. Handhelds, with their infamous lack of cooling and need to consume battery power, is getting further and further away from home consoles.

Eventually the final form of a PlayStation would become a handheld. But i don't know when that would be. Maybe that PlayStation 9 advert might come true after all. Then again, 2078 is quite a while away.

The smartest thing to do is break it down to 2 parts have a Portal like device that connects directly to the main unit through Wifi or another technology. Then the mini PS5 that can be powered by USB-C power packs or V-Mount Batteries.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Every big release is a system seller for PS5 right now & GTA vI is a really big release.

Not sure why that is at all in dispute other than fanboys still being upset about reality.

By the time GTA6 comes out, which won't be until Fall at the earliest, I doubt there's going to be that many Xbox Series units in circulation at retail. There barely is now.

 

[yogaflame]

Just imagine if price cut happens especially Ps5 pro. Wow everybody will, or actually, want a ps5 pro, including me.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Just imagine if price cut happens especially Ps5 pro. Wow everybody will want a ps5 pro, including me.

The most interesting question is whether we see price cuts before or after GTA6 releases, to include GTA6 being in a bundle.

 

[DeltaPolarBear]

The most interesting question is whether we see price cuts before or after GTA6 releases, to include GTA6 being in a bundle.

But what is the price cut for? There is no marketing pressure to do it.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

But what is the price cut for? There is no marketing pressure to do it.

I personally wouldn't bet on a price cut happening before GTA6 comes out but I don't think it's impossible.

Sony may see it as an opportunity to generate more immediate buzz around the PlayStation brand and have PlayStation 5s selling out as a hot ticket item with many people electing to buy the Pro if that's the only thing available in stock, which might make up for lower price points (even if they sell the PS5 Pro for 600).

Like I said, I don't think it's likely, but it is possible and I could see the reasons for it. Being the big ticket item for the holidays rather than say the Switch 2 could also make it easier for them to sell a PlayStation handheld next year.

Again, largely playing devil's advocate. I think this is about as likely as a price increase.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

The smartest thing to do is break it down to 2 parts have a Portal like device that connects directly to the main unit through Wifi or another technology. Then the mini PS5 that can be powered by USB-C power packs or V-Mount Batteries.

I think it'll probably be smarter to just focus on Portal. Just release a Pro version with better screen that's comparable to the rumored Switch 2 screen.

Portal will automatically be compatible with PS6 and whatever follows, as it only needs a Remote Play connection (maybe add direct connection to a Portal Pro as well).

Portal will also support cloud-streaming, so it might boost PS+ Premium membership as well.

But I think a dedicated handheld of any kind will really struggle and get crushed by Nintendo.
It would also create issues irt support, because it'll effectively create a similar situation for Sony as we see with MS and Series S/X.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

I think it'll probably be smarter to just focus on Portal. Just release a Pro version with better screen that's comparable to the rumored Switch 2 screen.

Portal will automatically be compatible with PS6 and whatever follows, as it only needs a Remote Play connection (maybe add direct connection to a Portal Pro as well).

Portal will also support cloud-streaming, so it might boost PS+ Premium membership as well.

But I think a dedicated handheld of any kind will really struggle and get crushed by Nintendo.
It would also create issues irt support, because it'll effectively create a similar situation for Sony as we see with MS and Series S/X.

Don't think we'll see a Portal 2 or Portal Pro until we see a PS6 and a Dual Sense 2.

That being said while I can see major improvements to the Portal, I think we're reaching diminishing returns. While Dual Sense is my favorite controller of all time, it's not that big of a leap compared to the Dual Shock 4 which was previously my favorite controller of all time. I think they have their work cut out for them with PS6.

Of course they could go the hall effect route, but I doubt they will. Controllers are getting too expensive as it is.

 

[yogaflame]

But what is the price cut for? There is no marketing pressure to do it.

Switch 2?

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Don't think we'll see a Portal 2 or Portal Pro until we see a PS6 and a Dual Sense 2.

That being said while I can see major improvements to the Portal, I think we're reaching diminishing returns. While Dual Sense is my favorite controller of all time, it's not that big of a leap compared to the Dual Shock 4 which was previously my favorite controller of all time. I think they have their work cut out for them with PS6.

Of course they could go the hall effect route, but I doubt they will. Controllers are getting too expensive as it is.

True, but the thing about Portal is that it doesn't need improvement at all, apart from maybe a better screen.

Not really following you irt DualSense vs DualShock in relation to Portal/handheld though.
A dedicated handheld would have the same results, realistically speaking.

And like I said, unless they come up with completely different controller-functions for PS6, there is zero need for any changes to Portal for it to work with PS6.

A dedicated handheld would create a lot of unnecessary risk and obstacles when you have a product like the Portal.
At least for Sony, that is.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

True, but the thing about Portal is that it doesn't need improvement at all, apart from maybe a better screen.

That's a major element of the product....

120hz, VRR, HDR... you absolutely can improve the Portal. Better audio wouldn't hurt either.

Not really following you irt DualSense vs DualShock in relation to Portal/handheld though.
A dedicated handheld would have the same results, realistically speaking.

My point is that while the Portal can be improved, I don't see much improvement for the Dual Sense moving forward. As much as people hail the haptics and triggers, theyre not widespread features and many people even turn them off. There just isn't a lot you can do with a controller that hasn't been done.

I presume the Dual Sense is named based on the 5 senses. Obviously sight, smell, and taste aren't elements of the controller. So the dual sense focuses on touch and sound. Those will probably be the elements sony tries to augment with a Dual Sense 2, but not really sure there's value in that.

And like I said, unless they come up with completely different controller-functions for PS6, there is zero need for any changes to Portal for it to work with PS6.

See above. The portal will work with PS6, but only for PS5 games most likely. The Portal 2 will probably be 120hz, OLED, VRR, and support HDR.

A dedicated handheld would create a lot of unnecessary risk and obstacles when you have a product like the Portal.
At least for Sony, that is.

Not at all. Opens new markets and allows for increased engagement and retention.

 

[RetroGamingUK]

Clearly he's not coping well with the prospect of the Switch inevitably surpassing the PS2's sales numbers.

Either way, both Nintendo and Sony put Microsoft to shame

 

[Killjoy-NL]

That's a major element of the product....

120hz, VRR, HDR... you absolutely can improve the Portal. Better audio wouldn't hurt either.

Sure, but I didn't say there isn't room for improvement.
It is perfectly fine as it is, as it does exactly what it needs to do.

And again, I'm rooting for a Pro version that adds all the stuff you said, of which the screen is the one that easily stands out. The rest would be just icing on the cake.

My point is that while the Portal can be improved, I don't see much improvement for the Dual Sense moving forward. As much as people hail the haptics and triggers, theyre not widespread features and many people even turn them off. There just isn't a lot you can do with a controller that hasn't been done.

Yes, that's kind of my point.

Portal is literally just a DualSense with a screen slapped onto it for Remote Play.

See above. The portal will work with PS6, but only for PS5 games most likely. The Portal 2 will probably be 120hz, OLED, VRR, and support HDR.

Unless PS6 controller will have drastically different controller-functions and PS6 games would require those exclusive controller-features, current Portal on PS6 will work exactly like Portal on PS5.

But as you said, there is very little to improve on irt DualSense, so there is little reason to believe PS6 controllers will be drastically different and not ve able to work with the current Portal.

Portal itself just streams a video to your screen. Nothing more, nothing less.
There are no hardware requirements, other than owning the system that streams it's content via Remote Play (like PS5 rn).

*Cloud-streaming through PS+ Premium doesn't even require additional hardware.

Not at all. Opens new markets and allows for increased engagement and retention.

Sure, the question would be if it's worth it.

But that's up to Sony.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Sure, but I didn't say there isn't room for improvement.
It is perfectly fine as it is, as it does exactly what it needs to do.

And again, I'm rooting for a Pro version that adds all the stuff you said, of which the screen is the one that easily stands out. The rest would be just icing on the cake.

I'd say the list is evidence that not only is there room for improvement but that it really needs it.

I think decreased latency is also a major need. Was really surprised when they didn't implement any wifi latency reduction like Amazon did. Almost all tests I've seen is that it has the same latency of an iPhone running remote play.

Yes, that's kind of my point.

Portal is literally just a DualSense with a screen slapped onto it for Remote Play.

Unless PS6 controller will have drastically different controller-functions and PS6 games would require those exclusive controller-features, current Portal on PS6 will work exactly like Portal on PS5.

But as you said, there is very little to improve on irt DualSense, so there is little reason to believe PS6 controllers will be drastically different and not ve able to work with the current Portal.

Portal itself just streams a video to your screen. Nothing more, nothing less.
There are no hardware requirements, other than owning the system that streams it's content via Remote Play (like PS5 rn).

*Cloud-streaming through PS+ Premium doesn't even require additional hardware.

There is very little reason for the Dual Shock 4 not to be operational for PS5 games, but here we are.

Sure, the question would be if it's worth it.

But that's up to Sony.

We know that it is, because we know they're working on it with AMD.

 

[apple_of_enlightenment]

Yes agree GTAVI will surely sell systems but it's more like a staple -- it's hard to call it a 'killer app' in the conventional sense as it'll be on other platforms. It should be at least equivalently good or even more invigorating for Xbox hardware sales.

 

[jm89]

In the UK atleast series x is nearly non existent from alot of major retailers.

GAME which is a gaming focused retailer doesn't have either series consoles in stock.

What a time for the UK and European sales reports to disappear. Cause the headlines would be something.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

I'd say the list is evidence that not only is there room for improvement but that it really needs it.

I think decreased latency is also a major need. Was really surprised when they didn't implement any wifi latency reduction like Amazon did. Almost all tests I've seen is that it has the same latency of an iPhone running remote play.



There is very little reason for the Dual Shock 4 not to be operational for PS5 games, but here we are.



We know that it is, because we know they're working on it with AMD.

Read what I said again. I don't contradict anything you say.

 

[gimmmick]

Not since the ps1 era have we had back to back generation dominance from one company ? (I’m not counting the switch because Nintendo is only competing against itself with the switch at this point).

 

[HeWhoWalks]

Not since the ps1 era have we had back to back generation dominance from one company ? (I’m not counting the switch because Nintendo is only competing against itself with the switch at this point).

So, Nintendo and Sony are only competing with themselves then. You have to apply it to both in this case.

To me, things have just come back to what they would have been if no Xbox ever existed - Nintendo and PlayStation competing in the market, slicing out their own successful piece of it with lots of exclusives everywhere!

 

[SweetTooth]

Not since the ps1 era have we had back to back generation dominance from one company ? (I’m not counting the switch because Nintendo is only competing against itself with the switch at this point).

Sony does it regularly actually. Only outlier was PS3 gen (which isn't bad sales wise)

Come to think of it ... Sony worst selling "console" has sold better than:

ALL MS consoles
ALL Sega consoles
77% of ALL Nintendo consoles

Damn .. thats domination

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

Since GTA6 will be on all platforms, not sure it's really a system seller. It's probably coming to Switch 2

All platforms? The game is releasing day one only on PS5 and Xbox Series...considering how much Monster Hunter did for Xbox (nothing) it's gonna work mostly as a PS5 exclusive.

We have no idea how long it will be until the game gets released anywhere else. Of course it's gonna move units.

 

[memoryman3]

All platforms? The game is releasing day one only on PS5 and Xbox Series...considering how much Monster Hunter did for Xbox (nothing) it's gonna work mostly as a PS5 exclusive.

We have no idea how long it will be until the game gets released anywhere else. Of course it's gonna move units.

Are you claiming that Japan is representative of the entire gaming industry and that Wilds performance there is going to indicate GTA’s performance on Xbox’s most popular regions? I have a bridge to sell you…

 

[enigmatic enthusiast]

They’re both very different devices, you may as well be comparing a fridge vs freezer.

Eg. Most people aren’t even buying PC’s to play games.

Only signed in to commend you on such an apt comparison. Like the freezer the ps5 is a all in one entertainment device while the pc can be an all in one entertainment device but is designed to do so much more.

PS clearly doesn't see PC as competition or else they wouldn't be releasing their games on the system; whether this is the right stance only time will tell. PS does however need to force all PC players to sign into their network; they should no longer acquiesce on this stance.

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

Are you claiming that Japan is representative of the entire gaming industry and that Wilds performance there is going to indicate GTA’s performance on Xbox’s most popular regions? I have a bridge to sell you…

Japan? Did you see USA sales for February? Monster Hunter did nothing for the platform. Xbox was barely able to outsell the Switch on Monster Hunter month...and PS5 sold more than Xbox and Switch together.

• PS5: ~300K
• XBS: ~155K
• NSW: ~135K

Japan wasn't on my mind.

 

[Sooner]

The Vita sold nearly 20 million units with no support to speak of.

Maybe after the first year, but it had arguably one of the best launch window lineups of any console.

Uncharted
Gravity Rush
Ninja Gaiden
Persona 4 Golden
Wipeout 2042
Rayman
ModNation Racers
Little Big Planet
Marvel vs Capcom 3
Hot Shots Golf

 

[enigmatic enthusiast]

Sony does it regularly actually. Only outlier was PS3 gen (which isn't bad sales wise)

Come to think of it ... Sony worst selling "console" has sold better than:

ALL MS consoles
ALL Sega consoles
77% of ALL Nintendo consoles

Damn .. thats domination

sssshhhh your facts have no place in this discussion. LOL

 

[mckmas8808]

...A PS5 handheld means a much longer shelf life for the base PS5, well beyond the cross gen life cycle. We would be talking about probably 10 years of additional support from the time the PS5 handheld launched, it also would almost certainly mean a re-designed PS5 i.e. a PS5 super slim and a price reduction to boot.

A PS5 that's as low as 250 with an extra 7 years or so of support would probably hit 150-160 million. A PS5 handheld, even one that launched for say 500 dollars, would eventually come down in price, and I think it would be safe to say could sell 40-60 million units over the course of its lifetime globally.

The Vita sold nearly 20 million units with no support to speak of.

I never considered the bolded. "IF" they make a PS5 handheld, then that also means they'll make a PS5 Super Slim. You're right. And probably sell it for $299 with a free game (AND still profit).

 

[mckmas8808]

We need a LOT of tech advancements for that. The issue is that modern console had been drawing MORE power and not less. The screen displays are fine, good enough for gaming. But consider the loud fans we use to stop modern consoles from melting, it just isn't very possible to squeeze a PS5 into a handheld without at least TWO generations of advancements.

In the 1990's, tech was moving so fast that you could squeeze a console into a handheld 1 generation after. But that was a crazy time that would likely never be repeated. We are talking about computers getting obsolete 2 years after launch.

Tech had slowed down since then. Handhelds, with their infamous lack of cooling and need to consume battery power, is getting further and further away from home consoles.

Eventually the final form of a PlayStation would become a handheld. But i don't know when that would be. Maybe that PlayStation 9 advert might come true after all. Then again, 2078 is quite a while away.

So how is Microsoft going to release a next-gen handheld in 2027 with their next-gen console if the bolded is true?

 

[XXL]

I never considered the bolded. "IF" they make a PS5 handheld, then that also means they'll make a PS5 Super Slim. You're right. And probably sell it for $299 with a free game (AND still profit).

I don't think Playstation is making a dedicated handheld. I think it'll be a better Portal with the PS6.

 

[mckmas8808]

I don't think Playstation is making a dedicated handheld. I think it'll be a better Portal with the PS6.

You think they'll call it a Portal Pro? Or a Portal 2?

 

[Sooner]

You think they'll call it a Portal Pro? Or a Portal 2?

 

[FrankWza]

You think they'll call it a Portal Pro? Or a Portal 2

They'll probably stay away from numbers so there's no confusion with PlayStation console compatibility.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

I never considered the bolded. "IF" they make a PS5 handheld, then that also means they'll make a PS5 Super Slim. You're right. And probably sell it for $299 with a free game (AND still profit).

They're already selling the PS5 for as low as 375 at discount. I don't think we're unable to a 300 base price and a $250 discounted price, perhaps $275.

At that price point, the PS5 essentially become ubiquitous as a gaming option. It's why we see the Switch selling so well, at that point, why not buy it.

The handheld would be significantly more expensive, but fueled by continuous support for the console as well as cross-gen gaming with the PS6.

Even when they release the next iteration of PS handheld after the upcoming one, there is going to be a cross generation period with the previous handheld... We're talking about beyond Game Boy lengths of support here, not to mention cross platform with Switch 2. Would probably stabilize development costs for quite some time or at least returns.

 

[XXL]

You think they'll call it a Portal Pro? Or a Portal 2?

No clue. Probably just a name instead of number, so people don't get confused.

 

[m14]

What are you talking about? LOL, why would I care, and what does this have to do with PS2?

I replied to a comment about how many units a combined PS5 and PS5 handheld would sell. If you think it's less than the PS2 or Switch, good luck with that, but of course you're a rabid fanboy.

My bad- I forgot that you are a beacon of objectivity on all Sony related topics.
Breathlessly proclaiming the next Sony handheld would move 60 million units when the Vita sold less than 15 million and then accusing someone else of being a "rabid fanboy"? The lack of self awareness is amusing if nothing else.

 

[m14]

Either way, both Nintendo and Sony put Microsoft to shame

RG, your obsession with Xbox is very endearing.

 

[mckmas8808]

They'll probably stay away from numbers so there's no confusion with PlayStation console compatibility.

Hmmm....that's not a bad point.